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EloraWood's Replies
I also assumed this whole time that she climed on the roof and the wall surrounding the woods/garden as she was on a upper level with Melisandre and the hound. I never thought that she had to pass the dragon.
Also, the WW seemed to be on “NK: nobody move, this guy is mine” mode. They and the wights seemed to all always get the same command. Either: do nothing and just stand there or attack anyone at will.
So since they where all just standing there...and the NK obviously knowing that she jumped him; probably wanted to deal with her himself as well...
I was ok with the way it went down.
The desperation of so many dead and dying, the guy who we where supposed to think should kill the NK feeling desperate and frustrated enough that he just gave into his emotions because he couldn’t get past the dragon...the short lived panic of the NK catching Arya and choking her and then relief that it’s over. I thought it was intense enough.
In the books the prophesy is a little different depending on where ‘you’ are. In association to the prophesy of the ruler who is promised, there also is the three headed dragon one, meaning that the promised one who will defeat the WWs/NK is not one, but three people. So the theory always was Jon (getting the wildlings together with the northerners to fight, and recruiting Dany to this cause), Dany (dragons and her army) and ? for the books. So maybe in the show it’s like that and the third person needed to defeat the undead was Arya.
If you are ok with Arya killing the NK but would like to have seen Jon and the NK fighting... well, that would have meant that Arya would have had to safe Jon... I‘m sure that people would have complained about that as well.
Well, I don’t find it strange that he sold the rights and worked on the show with them. It’s a lot of money and pretty exciting to see your books on the screen.
I think he might have had the intention to finish the next book in the 5 years it needed for the show to catch up. But we’ve always had to wait a long time and he pretty much always said that THIS time it probably would be faster until it isn’t :p
It never really bothered me. I really like the books a lot (eventhough admittedly the last two didn’t ‘flow’ as good as the rest, splitting them was a mistake I think) - he puts so much thought and details into this world...I can understand it taking time - and that he gets sidetracked with other projects...if your creativity takes you somewhere else, gotta listen.
He told the show creators how he will end it. So, while the details and some characters fates might be different, I guess the ending will ruffly be the same.
I learned to view them separately, the show is just based on the books and took many liberties on changing things, I personally am ok with everything the way it is.
While understanding that things sometimes just take as long as they take...I do hope that we’ll see the books soon though 😅 I’ll have to re-read them again too...been too long; 8 years so far...I think it was a 6 years for the one before that...
Well...to be fair, they didn’t go into detail about the Azor Ahai prophecy in the show. Nothing about that it’s someone from Rhaygars line, or that the term is gender nutral etc - I think the only thing mentioned in the show was that “he was born in a night full of ashes and salt” or something like that. And I don’t remember them saying anything specific about the night Arya was born 🤷♀️
Also, at least in the book, there is the prophecy about the three headed dragon and Arya killing the NK could fall into that one.
My thoughts exactly. He’s practically another wight - not the Hounds brother anymore...just a shell. At least for us much as we know. Not sure if the Hound should/would get any satisfaction out of killing him...basically just another fight if it happens.
There was nothing to hate about the Night King just to fear. He reanimated the dead after all - no plotting against, reasoning with him or anything- you’d just want to survive.
Cercei - uff - while you probably couldn’t reason with her either, there definitely is a lot of plotting...
I’m looking forward to see her get more of what she deserves, but I also at times feel sorry for her. That’s actually one of the things I really like about the show. The good are not always good and the bad not always bad (some rare serial killer like exceptions). They all have a narrow minded point of view at times, they all have emotional and cold moments, they all make dumb and smart decisions. Like we all do.
Just reading the comments it shows that in the show as with real life it depends on the point of view of a person.
Some see Dany as a savior others think she’s a tyrant. Jon a hero or a dolt. Some found Tywins cruelty justified others didn’t etc
Can’t win them all...
I agree with you. Except for I really didn’t mind how they did the battle - I prefer it being flawed and with some stupid decisions (but which where pretty in character for the ones who made them and the situation).It’s more realistic that way. I used to have a lot of conversations with my great-grandpa who was in two wars and my uncle who was in a couple and from what they said, in all the training, planning etc there are always mistakes, things that could have been better...unless you complete a mission and nobody gets hurt... there is no perfect execution. It’s not a video game but a terrifying war with real people and real emotions. So yes, I’d rather have them portray it that way.
I think people complained a lot about that it all ended “so fast”. But what they forget is: 1) this war against the dead has been going on for many years for the wildlings, then for 4-6 years for the crows and then for a bit south of the wall.
2) once south of the wall the deads army grew very rapidly because unlike the wildlings, who fought this for years, had traditions for hundreds of years to ensure reduced threats (like burning the dead) the northerners just got steam rolled, adding to the army.
3) the dead don’t need sleep or food and don’t fear death, don’t want to protect their fellow fighters etc - they just plow through everything without rest
4) the walkers and NK could just keep raising the new dead until nobody is left
So how this show down fight could have been drawn out? I have no idea.
There where just two endings: everyone alive dies or the whole of thems life force depends on the existence of the NK (which was long established).
Yes, and the book series might end completely different than the show.
But other than killing everyone in the north, I‘m not sure how they could have ended it differently or draw it out. I mean, sure, if you have humans fight each other you can have battles and sieges for month - but with the undead? They don’t fear getting killed. Don’t need sleep or food, don’t suffer from PTSD. Even if the living would have killed every wight, the white walkers or night king would just raise the new dead over and over until nobody was left. It would, realistically, be only a matter of hours. Can’t draw that out. And the only way to give the living any chance is to attach the deads „life force“ to a walker and all of them to the original, the night king.
But I‘m sure that if we would be actually in the story, not just viewing it, having felt the fear, desperation, in the days before and during the battle; having lost many many thousands of family, friends, neighbors, fellow wildlings and northerners...I‘m sure that we‘d then say that it was enough. And technically, this last battle was where it all ended. The war against the dead was fought for years by wildlings and then in the last what? 6 years by the man of the nights watch and lately by people south of the wall as well.
This was the show down.
You are correct about Jon 🤦♀️ And I just recently re-watched that particular episode as well 🤦♀️ 😅
Also correct about the Arya stabbing episode...that also bugged me.
I mean, without a question, the quality of the show has declined since they ran out of the source material.
But, I don’t know, I still believe that the show writers actually care about the story and characters and try their best. So some things I find I can overlook - even the little things do pull me out while I’m watching, but I usually get sucked in again pretty fast, so I try to, afterwards, just look at the bigger picture.
I mean, I always prefer reading books, because they always tell more- make more sense etc - but as far as shows go - they did a pretty good job.
But this is a discussion board, so constructive criticism should definitely be heard 😉
I mean, sure, since the source material ran out the show episodes have not been as good as before.
But I don’t think that the show intended to make it all about the WW, W and the NK. It’s called “Game of Thrones” not “The Night King takes them all”.
I always viewed it as a fantasy realm where they tell us a story of x amount of flawed characters, fighting to win the Iron Throne or aiding those they are loyal too, or just fighting for survival, whatever motivation they might have; with many side stories as we start to care about characters, and steppingstones and complications along the way. But the Titel gives away what it’s about. Would have liked the NK to kill everyone? Well that’s not where it went. Just as many others will be disappointed when their favorite doesn’t end up on it. Heck maybe they’ll all fight each other and in the end the Blackfyres (Golden Company) will take it for themselves as they fought for it in the Blackfyr Rebellion against the Targaryans 🤷♀️ But no matter what...someone will always be disappointed.
About the death...there is more than half (time wise, not episodes) left for many A listers to die.
That was one of the few things that kind of threw me off. Unless he is like Dany and does not get burned by fire (but then the clothe should get fried at least). I just rewatched Season 2 - and there is this whole conversation between Tywin and Arya about how the Dragons melted Harrenhall.
But then again, I appreciate all the work and thought that must have gone into this episode, so I don’t nitpick too much 😬
As others already wrote, I don’t think he knew about Arya. He just wanted to get to the Night King and the Dragon kept blocking him.
I don’t think he tried to sacrifice himself or had any noble notions at all in the end when he screamed at the Dragon. I think it was out of frustration, being mentally and physically tired and having walked past his friends (for all he knew) getting butchered for a goal that he can’t reach. Same as the Theon situation- he was at a hopeless point where he wanted to scream and meet his enemy head-on... lucky for him that Arya had such good timing.
Oh, and the question about where Arya came from - she was on a upper level, so she probably climbed out of a window and used the roof and wall that surrounded the garden.
Yup, I did too. I thought it was a very intense episode. Honestly, I don’t understand why people cry for characters to be perfect, logical, all knowing in a show that has portrayed since episode one how flawed and stupid humans (and non humans) are and how dumb their plans can be when scared and mentally and physically drained 🤷♀️ If every plan would be great and nobody flawed it would have been boring, unrealistic and over after the first couple of episodes 😆
🤣🤣🤣 This is a very funny trolling post - good job. And the reactions to it are just as entertaining. 😂 👍
Come on people- at least this guy put some effort and humor into it instead of just winding people up and trying to get them mad.
Well, if they all died, what would happen in the next three episodes? Cercei partying for two episodes and in the last one a repeat of the Night Kings army killing everyone? That would be kind of boring. I’d rather have them go back to plotting.
And the season is less than half over (time wise, not episodes), so there is plenty of time for those who want to see more people die to see more people die...
Personally I was saddened by those deaths- they might have been B-characters in your eyes, but they where not to those close to them. And Jora snd Theon at least where pretty much just as important as Bryanne, Jamie, Sam etc ... 🤷♀️
Not just what dmac8 said, but I think he had to run to the Night King (I know you are talking about logic and how it was shot...maybe we misunderstood you, but here was my understanding of the situation).
- Bran stoped him apologizing and told him that all of it led him to be where he needed to be, right there in this moment
- everything he went through made him feel like he, as others pointed out, could go out on his own terms
- doing that he gave Arya the chance to kill the Night King... because if he had waited, or fought (pointless anyway) the Night King would have not stood where he did when Arya launched herself from wherever she did... he bought time - so I guess that was needed.
About camera shots, music, lighting etc - well that’s out for whatever someone prefers. You didn’t like it, fair enough - others did. Doesn’t mean anyone is wrong. You have a right not to like it, but calling people “Fanboys” just because they did doesn’t make you sound particularly “logical” or smart either - so what’s the point.
This is a discussion board - so let people discuss 😉
😂 😂 😂 Ahhh I didn't even notice 🤦♀️ No excuses there (except that English is not my first language- but that is a pretty stupid mistake to make 😂 so I shouldn't even get off for that 😂)
GRRM stated before that Targaryens are not immune to getting burned and that Dani is a miracle in her own right when it comes to that.
First off let me start by saying that I don't mind the wait - I like details and quality and if he needs more time to deliver- so be it.
However, I think he might be waiting for the show to be over to release the new book because it might go in a totally different direction than the show. I think that some characters are not who they are on the show and that GRRM actually has other plans for some of the storys (a lot where not even mentioned in the show).
Which is great for the show, because the fans will get what they theorized to be true - and the bookreaders will be happy when they get a different story and can still be surprised even though they've seen the show.