Billy Eichner's "Bros" bombed in a spectacular fashion, failing to gross even 5 million in its domestic opening weekend. There is no coming back from that, anywhere.
In this postmortem then, @AndreEinherjar will go through the fairly obvious reasons why the movie failed, how the people involved reacted to it, and which lessons Hollywood should take away from this.
Gays, alongside trans, are the least liked from the alphabet soup train. People have very negative perceptions of gays, globally, for good reasons (i.e., health risks, high rates/associations with pedophilia, family disruption, lack of genetic legacy, etc.,).
Seeing a comedy about a man falling in love with another man is socially disruptive for obvious reasons. Most people like to come out of movies with some semblance of hope, with a few rare exceptions where movies pull the nihilistic-swerve, which can sometimes serve to hook viewers in to wondering about the ending, anticipating a sequel, or discussing its philosophical relevance.
But here, they're trying to shame normal people into accepting and supporting gay media. The only people who like gay media are gays, because sociologically the only outcome for two gay men is to have gay sex. That is the pinnacle of their relationship, since they can't procreate and have kids. And majority of people do not appreciate or want to think about gay sex, so the hook for the movie's climax is that audiences can look forward to gay sex, and who -- other than gays -- wants to anticipate and consume/ponder/ruminate/discuss that outcome with friends/family?
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Sex Education isn't solely about gay men, though, which was the broader point in my reply. I haven't combed through the viewership stats for Sex Education so I can't actually speak to its sustained success.
It also has extremely low engagement outside of Netflix, showing that -- as apropos to my point above -- only a small minority of individuals are actually engaged with the show.
>Sex Education isn't solely about gay men, though, which was the broader point in my reply. I haven't combed through the viewership stats for Sex Education so I can't actually speak to its sustained success.
But it is heavily LGBT influenced.
Why didn't The Last of Us drop off after the two LGBT themed episodes?
>But afterward, it petered out to the near 400th place in the top watch lists:
That's most shows though. They all drop hard when outside of new seasons or revivals. Look at the history of Heartstoppers popularity.
>It also has extremely low engagement outside of Netflix, showing that -- as apropos to my point above -- only a small minority of individuals are actually engaged with the show.
Heartstopper is literally a Netflix exclusive. As is Sex Education.
Why didn't The Last of Us drop off after the two LGBT themed episodes?
Because is the rest of the show about gay sex? And I would have to see check the viewership stats to see if they sustained viewership after those episodes.
That's most shows though. They all drop hard when outside of new seasons or revivals. Look at the history of Heartstoppers popularity.
The second season was more popular than the first season, and the second season petered out hard. Most popular shows do not drop that much, even Sex Education did not fall that hard after its premiere.
Heartstopper is literally a Netflix exclusive. As is Sex Education.
And you can see from the link above that Reddit chatter, Google searches, and YouTube content for Heartstopper does not show a lot of engagement, which is my point. Compared to Sex Education -- which again, is not solely themed on homosexuality only -- Heartstopper has a very small but dedicated community, like most heavily promoted gay content.
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>Because is the rest of the show about gay sex? And I would have to see check the viewership stats to see if they sustained viewership after those episodes.
>The second season was more popular than the first season, and the second season petered out hard. Most popular shows do not drop that much, even Sex Education did not fall that hard after its premiere.
Heartstopper is also a short show, by the way. It's not a huge surprise it would drop relatively quickly.
>And you can see from the link above that Reddit chatter, Google searches, and YouTube content for Heartstopper does not show a lot of engagement, which is my point. Compared to Sex Education -- which again, is not solely themed on homosexuality only -- Heartstopper has a very small but dedicated community, like most heavily promoted gay content.
And sure, Sex Education isn't /just/ about it, but it is heavily LGBT-adjacent in theme. Yet lots of people watched it. One of the most successful British shows in the last 3-4 years, if I recall.
And sure, Sex Education isn't /just/ about it, but it is heavily LGBT-adjacent in theme. Yet lots of people watched it. One of the most successful British shows in the last 3-4 years, if I recall.
Which is more indicative to the brainwashing effect of the overall LGBT content, rather than normal people tuning in for a show themed around gay sex, which was my original point.
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>Because we went from 2% to 4% to 20% of people identifying as LGBT within a 15 year period:
I asked you /HOW/ is LGBT content "brainwashing us". Changing in social trends could indicate a variety of things, and the 20% identifier includes all kinds of vague non-concepts like "demisexual" and "agender". It's genuinely a worthless number.
>This is in addition to Western nations having lowest birthrates in modern times:
No reason to think this is LGBT related. South Korea and Japan and China say hi. Global birthrates are declining everywhere, even in countries with high birthrates.
>If you're American, and you're okay with this, then it means you hold treasonous views. Why?
Okay with *what* exactly? What are you, specifically, calling treasonous, and what do you think should be done with people who hold said "treasonous views"?
I asked you /HOW/ is LGBT content "brainwashing us".
Over-saturation through overtly (and falsely) positive depictions, which even GLAAD has admitted to, as even with over-representation across every media segment, they're still calling for more, even in kids media (which shouldn't even have homosexual content in it yet it does): https://glaad.org/reference/entertainment/
They are successful, given that you don't see a problem with this, even though in polaces like the U.K., and America, there are more Asians than gays, yet they are vastly underrepresented by comparison throughout Western media.
No reason to think this is LGBT related. South Korea and Japan and China say hi. Global birthrates are declining everywhere, even in countries with high birthrates.
South Korea is in result of an overt feminisation of their culture due to unchecked feminism, unrealistic mate expectations from media, and impossible standards that many young males can't meet, and now they're suffering backlash for it: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/05/south-korea-gender-wars/
>Over-saturation through overtly (and falsely) positive depictions, which even GLAAD has admitted to, as even with over-representation across every media segment, they're still calling for more, even in kids media (which shouldn't even have homosexual content in it yet it does): https://glaad.org/reference/entertainment/
How is that "brainwashing" anymore than depicting anything else positively? Are you saying it should be illegal to depict homosexuality in a neutral or positive way?
And I note you've abandoned your original claim entirely that people avoid content with LGBT people in.
>China is a repercussion of their one-child policy where they killed millions of girls and now have a lopsided demographic
They also frankly just don't have enough women having children, like most nations. Birth rates are decliing everywhere. Highly catholic Poland in Europe has weak birth rates.
>South Korea is in result of an overt feminisation of their culture due to unchecked feminism, unrealistic mate expectations from media, and impossible standards that many young males can't meet, and now they're suffering backlash for it:
This is brainrot. South Korea has the same problems as Japan: horrific work culture. There's no reason whatsoever to believe that feminism, as we understand it, has anything to do with it.
How is that "brainwashing" anymore than depicting anything else positively?
Because heterosexuality is depicted negatively ALL the time. You would be hard pressed to find a mainstream TV series, movie, comic or game with a strictly positive depiction of a straight White couple. This is despite the fact that per capita, homosexuals have higher rates of domestic abuse... https://wentworthreport.com/2017/01/08/rate-of-domestic-violence-highest-in-lesbian-relationships/
Yet those topics actually never underpin the homosexual relationships depicted in today's media because -- as the GLAAD article I linked points out -- reality of homosexuality is a lot more negative than how it's depicted in media.
Hence, they are brainwashing people into thinking the lifestyle is more positive than what it is. It's precisely why anyone you know (and possibly you) didn't even know about the stats I posted above (and that's just the surface level stats, it gets much worse).
And I note you've abandoned your original claim entirely that people avoid content with LGBT people in.
Nope. I specifically said people avoid content specifically themed around gay content. As I said, they use lesbians/bi as a wedge to promote more LGBT content because it's more accepted.
They also frankly just don't have enough women having children, like most nations.
>Because heterosexuality is depicted negatively ALL the time. You would be hard pressed to find a mainstream TV series, movie, comic or game with a strictly positive depiction of a straight White couple. This is despite the fact that per capita, homosexuals have higher rates of domestic abuse...
This is literal and utter nonsense. Examples please. I don't really watch 'relationship' shows, but from my memory:
Normal People, A Discovery of Witches, Virgin River, Poldark, Scenes from a Marriage, Younger. Most sitcoms will depict a male-female relationship.
In shows I've watched that are not Romance *per se*, but have it in them:
Babylon Berlin, The Expanse, Severance, Battlestar Galactica, Silo, Shadow & Bone, See, Night Sky, The Walking Dead (multiple), Devs
>Yet those topics actually never underpin the homosexual relationships depicted in today's media because -- as the GLAAD article I linked points out -- reality of homosexuality is a lot more negative than how it's depicted in media.
I have seen plenty of LGBT cultural and social issues thrown under the microscope. I believe they are in both Euphoria and Sex Education, for starters.
>Hence, they are brainwashing people into thinking the lifestyle is more positive than what it is. It's precisely why anyone you know (and possibly you) didn't even know about the stats I posted above (and that's just the surface level stats, it gets much worse).
No, I am well aware of the stats. What of them? What should be done about that?
>Nope. I specifically said people avoid content specifically themed around gay content. As I said, they use lesbians/bi as a wedge to promote more LGBT content because it's more accepted.
They clearly don't. Otherwise people wouldn't have watched Sex Education, Euphoria and many other TV shows. Yes, a straight out 'boy love' or 'gay love' type setting is more niche (although Heartstopper wasn't) but there's no aversion inherent amongst people.
I also notice no comment from you about Poland having flagging birth rates too.
This is literal and utter nonsense. Examples please. I don't really watch 'relationship' shows, but from my memory:
You listed a lot of shows that kind of prove my point, though? For instance, Scenes from a Marriage is not a positive depiction of a straight White couple in modern media, it explicitly points out many of the ups and downs and inherent flaws, which goes back to my point.
I have seen plenty of LGBT cultural and social issues thrown under the microscope. I believe they are in both Euphoria and Sex Education, for starters.
"thrown under the microscope" or depicted as oppressed and undermined?
And how many of those instances in Euphoria/Sex Education highlight lesbian domestic violence? The acts that lead to gays contracting diseases? Or the overt celebration of hedonism within the community with complete disregard for their own health/safety (or that of others)?
No, I am well aware of the stats. What of them? What should be done about that?
As mentioned, majority of heterosexual relationships in media where the relationship is the centerpiece of the media, they are oftentimes depicted with a negative slant. The stats -- being very prominent in homosexual relationships -- rarely ever see the light of day in the media, despite the over-representation of those relationships appearing in media. Even -- as noted in the GLAAD piece -- they reproach the negative depiction of HIV and AIDS, despite the fact that they SHOULD be depicted negatively as a way to thwart behaviour that leads to contracting those outcomes.
The fact they don't condemn bug-chasers should be seen as frightening.
there's no aversion inherent amongst people.
There is, but it is lessening with it being promoted more aggressively in Western media. reply share
>You listed a lot of shows that kind of prove my point, though? For instance, Scenes from a Marriage is not a positive depiction of a straight White couple in modern media, it explicitly points out many of the ups and downs and inherent flaws, which goes back to my point.
You do realise that a TV show or film that depicts a relationship where NOTHING BAD HAPPENS is going to be pretty dull, right? All TV shows and films have strife in them - and the strife with those isn't due to them being straight as a way to somehow demean straight people, it's just because that makes good entertainment.
>"thrown under the microscope" or depicted as oppressed and undermined?
Some of the time. Not always.
>And how many of those instances in Euphoria/Sex Education highlight lesbian domestic violence? The acts that lead to gays contracting diseases? Or the overt celebration of hedonism within the community with complete disregard for their own health/safety (or that of others)?
No idea. Haven't watched it. Have you?
>As mentioned, majority of heterosexual relationships in media where the relationship is the centerpiece of the media, they are oftentimes depicted with a negative slant. The stats -- being very prominent in homosexual relationships -- rarely ever see the light of day in the media, despite the over-representation of those relationships appearing in media. Even -- as noted in the GLAAD piece -- they reproach the negative depiction of HIV and AIDS, despite the fact that they SHOULD be depicted negatively as a way to thwart behaviour that leads to contracting those outcomes.
How do you know that all TV shows that depict gay people don't show them having relationship struggles just like with straight people?
And are you essentially complaining that gay people aren't universally treated with disdain and contempt by media? Is that the essence of your complaint?
>There is, but it is lessening with it being promoted more aggressively in Western media.
No reason to believe that there is any specific natural disdain.
South Korea has the same problems as Japan: horrific work culture. There's no reason whatsoever to believe that feminism, as we understand it, has anything to do with it.
Actually it does. The former president was part of a feminist cult and was a bulwark for feminist agendas toward making life more difficult for men: https://archive.ph/82lck
>Actually it does. The former president was part of a feminist cult and was a bulwark for feminist agendas toward making life more difficult for men:
There is no reference whatsoever to feminism here at all in this article. And there's no reason to think that 'feminism' is specifically responsible for Koreas low birth rates. Since you're so against it though, can you tell me what rights you take specific umbrage with?
They don't mention feminism outright because it's a protected agenda. But their antics are covered more broadly here about how it impacts South Korean society (you'll find it more prevalent in South Korean forums, but I don't frequent SK news sites as much anymore): https://10mag.com/megalia-south-koreas-radical-feminism-community/
That's precisely why the new president -- who ran on an anti-feminist platform -- won with such overwhelming support.
And you didn't comment on the articles:
They kind of tie into what I mentioned about what's happened with China, only it's more directly associated with socioeconomic measures to weaken gender roles. In Japan this has resulted in VeggieBoys", or herbivore men, as explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbivore_men
South Korean men are going through the exact same thing, which is why their suicide rates are so high, twice as much as the women: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24843383/
>They kind of tie into what I mentioned about what's happened with China, only it's more directly associated with socioeconomic measures to weaken gender roles. In Japan this has resulted in VeggieBoys", or herbivore men, as explained here:
I think this is a unique phenomenon you'd be hard pressed to connect with feminism at all.
>Overwork + feminist culture = lower birthrates. The numbers shrink even more when you throw in overt promotion of LGBT agendas, which obviously do not help with birthrates (mostly prevalent in Western nations
You could have stopped at "overwork" (and possibly consumer culture).
It's not homophobic. The majority of people aren't gay so they aren't interested. A lot of people are not interested in auto racing so they don't watch it. That doesn't mean they're "carphobic".
Brokeback Mountain is called an exception to the rule -- at the time it was a novelty since that wasn't the sort of film that was typically in the mainstream.
As for your list... those are movies -- as per your own admission -- that contain homosexuality but aren't about male homosexuality. Most of those are biopics, with the exception of the Birdcage, Bruno and Brokeback Mountain.
Oh bullshit, if the film is well done, straight people will enjoy a drama or a comedy about gay men.
And there have been plenty of films about bank robbers, thieves, gangsters, prostitutes, crazy rich Asians and Amish farmers. People don't have to approve of the character's lifestyles to enjoy a film.
You're an idiot, I proved you wrong, now kindly Shut the Fuck Up and Sit the Fuck Down.
"if the film is well done, straight people will enjoy a drama or a comedy about gay men." For the most part that is accurate. Bros was not a well done film and it had bad marketing.
Oh bullshit, if the film is well done, straight people will enjoy a drama or a comedy about gay men.
Only as a novelty, which is why you had to reach back more than 20 years with Brokeback Mountain as the only movie about gay men that some straight people went to see... again, as a novelty.
And there have been plenty of films about bank robbers, thieves, gangsters, prostitutes, crazy rich Asians and Amish farmers. People don't have to approve of the character's lifestyles to enjoy a film.
No one said they did. But the gay lifestyle is about gay sex -- and it's not something majority of people like in the least bit.
You can have films about bank robbers who are doing it for a good cause, like Hell or High Water, which presents an amazing moral dilemma for the leads. Or you can have a film about bank robbers and the gritty consequences about their decisions, like the crime-thriller Heat.
The thing is, people can connect to these movies through their situational vices, but also hope for the better, or prepare for the worst. But different walks of life involving survival is something people can suspend their disbelief to view from a lens beyond their own, because some situations in some films hit close to home in terms of aspirations, family circumstances, or dire financial straits, all of which speak to higher causes and complex situations beyond gay sex.
You're an idiot, I proved you wrong, now kindly Shut the Fuck Up and Sit the Fuck Down.
The reason people despised this film is because it’s called ‘Bros’ and features a dude grabbing a dude’s ass, which subverts the wholesome idea of a ‘bro’ and turns it into a gay sex thing.
Also, given that ‘bro’ is short for ‘brother’ it even has gay incest connotations.
The whole thing is creepy and fucked up, and yet another unprovoked attack on straight white males, and people are sick of that woke shit.
The reason people despised this film is because it’s called ‘Bros’ and features a dude grabbing a dude’s ass, which subverts the wholesome idea of a ‘bro’ and turns it into a gay sex thing.
Also, given that ‘bro’ is short for ‘brother’ it even has gay incest connotations.
>The reason people despised this film is because it’s called ‘Bros’ and features a dude grabbing a dude’s ass, which subverts the wholesome idea of a ‘bro’ and turns it into a gay sex thing.
Are you that precious that the title upsets you because it uses "Bro" in a homoerotic sort of way?
That is truly laughable.
>Also, given that ‘bro’ is short for ‘brother’ it even has gay incest connotations.
This is some real snowflakey shit. "Bro" is also used by friends who aren't literally brothers.
"The film received generally positive reviews from critics, but it bombed at the box office, grossing $14.8 million worldwide against a production budget of $22 million."
So let's say that it needed to make 35 million to break even after marketing costs/movie theater take.
It lost 20 million.
The latest indiana jones has lost over 100 million.