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daveyh's Replies
Very interesting. I didn't know that. Well there we are, after my lame examples in an earlier post, Livia's arrest with the airline tickets in the S2 finale was as definite a set up for the next series as it gets!
Makes me wonder what they were originally planning with Jackie Jr in series 3 then, because they were clearly setting something up with his appearance at that sit-down. My guess would be he'd be one of the villains of the series, hell bent on avenging his Uncle Richie's death (not knowing the real reason he died).
The above answers. Plus he was there as a witness, and was only concerned with the 2 marines being found guilty - it may not even have occurred to him that if he got caught out during questioning, he'd be arrested himself.
Not out of dumbness, more because he'd have felt untouchable with that rule that if Kafee would be the one to be punished if he even directly accused Jessop of a crime. So when he says "tell me you have something more", i think he just means in terms of trying to get his clients (the 2 marines) off the hook.
It's kinda ironic that he's playing an "inside man" in this - i think alex kingston's character even refers to him as this at one point!
The mention of Kevin Spacey has not aged well!!
I actually started a thread about this that no-one replied to, so I'm glad someone else has picked up on this! It was titled "gotta listen to my instincts" - actually everything i said is covered more concisely by threadkiller above, but anyway, here it is......
so this isn't quite a plot-hole, I'd say it's more of an oversight on Carlito's part. When he's going to visit Kleinfeld in the hospital and he sees Vinny (I think that's his name) disguised as a policeman, the voiceover says "got to listen to my instincts, like the one telling me that face and that uniform don't go together". So he not only sees Vinny there, he also acknowledges that he looks out of place. Then, at most a couple of hours later at the club, he doesn't recognise Vinny and makes the "I haven't seen him lately" slip. Maybe he didn't recognise him out of uniform (including the hat which would have covered a lot of features), but I think it would have been easier to swallow if they'd just cut out that voiceover line at the hospital, or better still only shown Vinny when he came to "relieve" the officer outside Kleinfeld's room. And while they're at it they could have cut the bit when Saso tells Carlito that Pachenga's spying on them for Benny Blanco, which I know has already been discussed on other threads.
And maybe Richie let Jackie Jr tag along against Tony's wishes, causing yet more animosity between them.
The rules they set down regarding their kids can be quite contradictory anyway. The Sopranos always wanted to shield their own children from the mob life, yet during the last few episodes, Meadow's gonna marry an associates son and will likely join him in becoming a mob lawyer, and better still, Tony quite agressively encourages AJ to hang round with The Jasons, who in addition to being children of his fellow mobsters, Tony also knows that they're "majoring in cash" by collectong on their illegal sportsbook at college. Then in the finale his mob connections get AJ a job at Carmine Jr's very dubious sounding film company.
The series one trifecta of mikey palmice, chucky signori and jimmy altieri. All great characters, especially mikey and jimmy. I'd like to believe that if the writers/makers of the show had known there'd be more seasons, they'd have kept at least one of them around after One.
In the final series, maybe more screentime or even just a bit of background on the characters that end up becoming important, such as The Jasons and also Patsy's other son - it was difficult to care when Meadoe announced she was dating him because that was literally the first time he'd been mentioned.
or Little Women!
I've also recently learned that, in real life, Chaplin met one of his wives when she was just 12.
Only commenting on the first point here - it's not so much that Sonny revealed what he was thinking, it's more that he indicated an interest in the deal after Vito had made clear to Solozzo that he wasn't interested, that it would be bad for business etc
The family needed to present a united front here and Sonny's question about the Tattaglias guaranteeing security ruined it all, and, as others on this thread have already said, it proved to be a very bad move on Sonny's part because Solozzo's knowledge that Sonny was "hot for" the deal led to the attempt on Vito and the subsequent warring between the families.
There's a similar situation much later when Fredo fails to show solidarity with the new Don's stance against Moe Greene. Michael is a lot more direct and clear in his wording here though, so there's no confusion.
Put it another way - if Sonny had expressed a personal opinion against Solozzo - if he'd said something like "we dont give a rat's ass who's guaranteeing what, we're not interested", i doubt Vito would have minded
I only opened this thread because i thought it would be the revelation that the homeless man is played by the guy who'd go on to play Carcetti's running mate, Norman, in The Wire.
Which just shows what quality actors this movie had, even for the bit parts. No wonder it did so well and still holds up now
Rosie clearly didn't watch Baywatch!
Good spot - i remember one of Bodhi's gang saying it, but didn't realise it was Rosie. Interesting that it was him - like maybe he didn't trust Utah from the beginning, even while all his friends were warming to him
Oh yeah. Set in Spain? I could just google it!
Also Jordy going from fearsome prison guard who helped Carroll access the internet in prison to cultivate The Following, and later escape, and then successfully carry out and then get away from a killing spree of his own, to weak and inept liability to The Following in the space of a few minutes.
The way he's portrayed after this, it's a wonder he even became a prison guard, never mind one on death row
From the pilot (and seqsequent episides) alone, I'd say red flags not flying for any of the authorities about the fact that several military age men were making regular visits to a celebrity serial killer in prison, despite not being related to are having any other previous association with him. I guess they can't stop visitors from coming, but a quick background check would tell them that two of them are living next door to Carroll's last and only surviving victim, and another one is married to a wantes serial killer.
And if that's a realistic portrayal, then I'm calling the authorities boneheaded!
I've only watched the first few episodes and completely agree with this one. Especially after what happened at Sarah's house. To then have the same protection arrangement for claire in the next episode, and later, megan (when they thought she was innocent and that her husband might come back to kill her) was beyond dumb.
The cops and federal agents on this show were straight out of a lifetime movie
There was Miami, LA, then Hollywood 7? What was the 4th? Vaguely remember a back in time thing but after over 20 years it's kinda hazy!
From what i remember of his appearance near the end of season 2, he came across as a bad wannabe gangster then, speaking above his station - hence Tony's " those who want respect show respect".
So in that sense i wouldn't say he was retconned. In series 3, Ralph takes over Richie Aprile as his mentor. With male role models like that, the guy never stood a chance!
I always saw his appearance with near the end of season 2 as a window into season 3. They certainly set it up well.
They did similar at the end of 3, with Adrianna being befriended by "Danielle" and Paulie being tempted to Johnny Sack's side, both brilliantly setting up season 4.
There's probably other examples that i can't think of right now
The more of the recent episodes i watched, the more i wondered if they had different writers for different episodes, and if they didn't like what had occured in the previous one, they'd just undo it. Especially in the last one, in which - SPOILER - they contrived a way for Cobra Kai to be re-admitted, after it such a big deal that they were eliminated in the previous episode.
And all completely pointless because CK could have just been watching the finals with all the other dojos and just joined in the royal rumble at the end like everyone else.
I thought the writing had been getting progressively worse throughout and that really took the biscuit
Oh how dozy am i?! I always thought when Alec Baldwin says "2 weeks with pay" he's referring to taking a leave of absence. I didn't even think about it being for his notice period until i just read your reply. That does make more sense that way.
And technically he would be serving this notice period when Sullivan tells Costigan that Dignam's taken a leave of absence.
Thanks
Just to add to the earlier answer about insisting on a public place being a ruse for the gun to be planted in advance - asking for a reasonable condition like that (somewhere Michael would feel safe) also makes it more convincing that the Corleones were going along with the truce talks.
If they'd just agreed to the meeting without question, it might have made the enemy more suspicious that they were up to something or planning something.