This could have easily been a disaster. - Terminator 2: Judgment Day (1991) Discussion

[–] Volley (3433) 4 years ago

Yep, it was done with extreme care and craftsmanship, and passion for consistency of the original lore generated from the first film. Sure, some parts are a little cheesy as time as gone by, but for the majority it's well done, and this is highly rewatchable.

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[–] Abed303 (282) 3 years ago

I agree this film is top-notch, but the first movie is a bootstrap paradox and the second completely upends that so I don't know how much respect went to the original lore. That can easily be dismissed though because of, well... everything else.

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[–] Interlepos (1807) 3 years ago

>> craftsmanship

Yup, that's Jim for ya.

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[–] Cognoscente (2648) 4 years ago

I wish the film was called Terminators (like how Aliens avoided being called Alien 2).

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[–] Ripkens25 (2016) 4 years ago

The parts where the Terminator DID behave like a pet ("Stand on one leg"..."Don't kill anyone") are the weakest part of the film. I still think the original movie is the best....(when Arnie had no problem being the bad guy). By T2, he went more Hollywood....wanted a more positive image and depiction....and wanted to start playing the good guy in movies.....that was the downfall of the Terminator films.

The Terminator (T-800) should be a dark, bad, awful, terrifying being, period. Arnie changed a lot between T1 and T2. He got kinder, gentler...and slimmer.

T2 is even kinda dated with the T-1000 liquid metal effects. Sure, they were cool at the time. But with the technology of today, a morphing of one image to another can be done 10x better than back then. Back then....you'd have a trophy-looking guy walking, and then Robert Patrick's face would just kinda...pop on there. Again, great at the time...but definitely dated. Heck, the morphing in the Michael Jackson (Black or White) video was maybe even a little better.

T2 was fun and exciting. T1 was better....darker.....and more revolutionary. (And darker). A Terminator shouldn't be family-friendly, Arnie. WTF. Thanks for wrecking the T-800.

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[–] Cognoscente (2648) 4 years ago

The trajectory of his career was weird around this period. He followed up Twins with his most violent film, Total Recall, then he did an about turn with Kindergarten Cop. Following the pattern, T2 should have been darker.

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[–] bozo_500 (13118) 3 years ago

it was Cameron who came up with the twist concept of a good terminator protector fighting the more advanced liquid metal prototype. Arnold was actually apprehensive about terminator not killing people in the film. fearing a repeat of Conan II/PG13 saying audiences expect the terminator to kill people!

If Cameron had made Arnold the villain again or gone with a Good t800 v Bad t800 I doubt Arnold would've been like 'nyah I can't be the baddie again after Twins/KCop and my political ambitions!'

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[–] scannerdarkly (1379) 3 years ago

Arnold: "I have to be True, Cameron, I cannot live in Lies".

Cameron:"That...THATS IT"! *begins scribbling in a journal*

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[–] Heisenberg (6730) 3 years ago

I have to say, all this argument that the terminator must be bad is bullshit.

I agree that the movies are better when it is bad. But as far as performance go, within its own lore, let's analyze things:
it is an INFILTRATION unit. He should act as normally and naturally as possible.
Him being a bit sympathetic and nice is more effective than him acting like he's a pissed off psychotic asshole on a bad day.
"Sarah Connor?"-even a one liner is suspicious of his nature. She should have said "nope!" or "who are you?" just because he delivered it in such a suspicious way.
So, the family friendly terminator in T2 is indeed a better terminator than the darker one in T1.

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[–] Ripkens25 (2016) 3 years ago

You make a fair (and logical) point in terms of the Terminator is more efficient the more he fits in as a regular Joe. I just think it was more fun watching the original movie, when he seemed like a cold, emotionless killing machine.

It kinda...added something, that he didn’t fully blend in to 1984 society because he WAS so cold and raw. Contrast that to Reese, who blended right in.

The more humanized the T-800 became, the less scary or awe-inspiring he was. I actually liked the cold, canned, awkward responses he had in the original. Punk: “Nice night for a walk.” T-800: (Repeats, in somewhat odd dialect): “Nice night for a walk”. Then he punches into the punk’s chest...and grabs his heart!

The last thing anyone wants to see...is a T-800 standing on one leg, being bossed around by some kid, smiling, saying one-liners and giving a thumbs-up sign.

People want the cold, awkward, robotic assassin. He was perfect in the original film. T2 was fun, but it lost that darkness.

The Terminator was like Alien...and T2 was like Aliens.

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[–] Otter (24464) 3 years ago

The film had a cold, awkward, robotic, extremely assassin... just not the one played by Arnold. Arnold was great in the role he was given, and I think it was decent of him to let the T-1000 be even scarier than he'd been in the original film.

This film may not work for people who are huge fans of Arnold's original Terminator, but the fact is it's a top-flight action film with terrific performances from the entire principal cast. Linda Hamilton actually dominates the film with her crazy/badass mother role, this is by far her best work, and Arnold's best film. Frankly, the fact that Arnold lets himself be part of an ensemble cast rather than the star is a huge plus for the film, Arnold should have done it more often.

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[–] Heisenberg (6730) 3 years ago

I get what you mean, but I hate this kind of movie incongruities that are there only for the benefit of the audience.

Also, I agree with what Otter said in his comment above this: that T2 had the cold assassin with the T1000, Arnold picked the role of the good guy this time.
(Talking about T1000 he also had his own share of incongruities, like screaming; or making a metallic noise when he was looking like metal, but NOT making any metallic noise when he was looking like a shoe or a shirt-yet he was still the same material; or looking like he was in pain when hit on a particular area like the head....all stuff that makes 0 sense from the narrative within the movie, like an infiltration unit that cannot speak nor act properly).

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[–] Karl Aksel (1487) 3 years ago

The parts where the Terminator DID behave like a pet ("Stand on one leg"..."Don't kill anyone") are the weakest part of the film. I still think the original movie is the best....(when Arnie had no problem being the bad guy). By T2, he went more Hollywood....wanted a more positive image and depiction....and wanted to start playing the good guy in movies.....that was the downfall of the Terminator films.

What are you talking about? Arnie was well established as a "good guy" before the first Terminator. In fact, Terminator was his first bad guy role! Unless you count that one episode in Streets of San Francisco. Prior to Terminator, he was mainly known as Conan, if you'll remember.

As for T2 being the downfall of the Terminator films - nonsense, since this was a tremendous success, both in terms of box office and enduring popularity. More so than its predecessor, which is unusual for a sequel. The fact that all subsequent sequels were retreading old ground is hardly the fault of Terminator 2.

T2 was fun and exciting. T1 was better....darker.....and more revolutionary. (And darker). A Terminator shouldn't be family-friendly, Arnie. WTF. Thanks for wrecking the T-800.

Arnie is just the actor. It was Cameron's idea to make him good, and it was a great idea. It's still a dark movie, it wasn't made "family friendly" just because there's now a kid and a friendly terminator. And blaming Arnie is just weird.

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[–] NGMI (1184) 3 years ago

Yet, it's one of the coolest movies ever made.

You're joking right? It's on Pluto right now and it's so fucking cringe.

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[–] NGMI (1184) 3 years ago

god, I couldnt even make it through. So much better shit on right now. Its astounding anyone thinks this movie is good.

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[–] Egon1982 (57) 3 years ago

It's a classic sequel

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[–] NGMI (1184) 3 years ago

A cheesy sequel. It's really bad. The lows are so low, that there's not enough action in the world to save it. Plus all the acting is awful. Did they purposely hire the worst actors ever to make Arnold seem passable?

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[–] Egon1982 (57) 3 years ago

i hate the word cheesy, the performances are great and i think it's a fantastic sequel

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[–] GetWokeGoBroke (753) 3 years ago

NGMI ok, then what movies do you consider not cheesy or bad?

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[–] acidraindrop (3055) 3 years ago

Never thought of it that way. Yeah, this could have absolutely been terrible.

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[–] TroyB (164) 3 years ago

People are seriously trolling in here.

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[–] Castortroy82 (70) 3 years ago

Yeah seriously have to be trolls here, no way anyone could be this legitimately brain dead. Arnie as the bad guy was his most memorable performance, but what sense would it make to repeat the same film and have him the bad guy again. What sense would it have made to have the good guy be an advanced T-1000. You people are so freaking stupid or I hope for humanity's sake you are just trolling. My advice don't ever consider directing films you will never succeed with your logic.

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[–] Leodicaprio (6426) 3 years ago

While certainly having more comedic and lighthearted moments compared to the first which was a straight horror film, it still took itself very seriously and had extremely disturbing and horrific elements.

Maybe that is why the 3rd and on just dont have the impact. I am supposed to feel the tension of the main characters as feeling powerless and hunted. A breast increase joke in the first 3 minutes fo the film sort of ruins this... The movies shifted from this horror to more generic silly action.

I feel like a lot of the best films could have been executed horribly (worse than a more generic story) yet rose above the material

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[–] space1999 (725) 3 years ago

Could have under the Orion pictures going out of business sell.

But it didn't.

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