How badly does the plot hole of John announcing his presence to the robbers with the machine gun note for no reason
Bother you?
shareIt bothers me greatly
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MovieChat Forums > Die Hard (1988) Discussion > How badly does the plot hole of John ann...
not a plot hole... is the course of events that occurred in this fictional story per the script. it's what the character did.
why is that an issue?
It's not a plot hole. It's an intelligence maneuver. They already knew he was in the building but not who he was. He got them talking so he could find out what he might be facing and get that information to the authorities.
shareonly plot hole in film is how does john mclain know how to be so skill at fighting when he just nyc cop? he is like expert warrior in gorilla tactics and he know how to navigate through skyscraper under rader etc. how does he do all this for cop?
in under siege casey ryback is cook but ex-navy seal. same with harrison ford in air force one - ex-warrior. die hard would be more believable if john mclain be ex-delta force or something.
In the book the movie was based on, the character (named Joe Leland in the novel) was about two decades older, and a retired NYPD detective, who had become a recognized expert in anti-terrorist investigations, tactics, and intelligence gathering. In the book, there is explicit mention of how this makes him qualified to take the terrorists on and effectively fight them, whereas someone without his specialized training would just make the situation worse and recklessly endanger the hostages.
But Hollywood wanted a younger action hero, not a middle-aged one, and it does work for the film, it just requires more energetic use of one's suspension of disbelief.
thank you for reply, darren! that make sense.
would it kill the writer in this movie to put in one line of dialog that say "mclain is expert in anti terrorists train and tactic"? it would make more sense.
average cop is pragmatik. he would not want to go through vent or elevator shaft or bunjee jump off roofs. it is too dangerous for average man without elite train. bruce willis in very good shape so he believable as warrior, but mclane should at least be ex-us marines to give more gravity to situation.
Do you need everything told to you specifically?
shareyes.
they tell us he cop but he have capabilities way beyond cop.
film is more believable with mclane ex military!
People that lean on "does it need to be explained to you" mindset are easily entertained and simple minded who give sloppy writing a pass. I love this movie, but I'm with you. There should have been a little backstory to explain how badass he is. It could have easily been inserted when the FBI looked into him, just as a quick rundown of his military resume.
sharethank you burk.
i agreed when the fbi look into him they could say he is ex-military and everything make sense. average cops not so good at all the thing mclane do. it would make everything mclaine do in film to be believables.
mclane is very skilled in this movies and he even more skill in great sequel die hard 2 (which is best sequels by far) so i always wonder what mclane do to make him so good at capping bad peoples.
lol, yeah, I know a few cops and they would all be dead immediately in that situation.
sharehahaha yes i can imagine this.
many cops i notice are ex militarys but even most ex-military operatives would not be able to handle thing that mclane do in this movie
what im most impress with by mclane in die hard is his escape and evade technique - he can be on one floor and avoid terrorist through vent or shaft or under tables. all without detection. they can never catch this man. one man against 12 terrorist and he have them on string.
I think they want an average Joe people can relate, not some sort of super soldier.
It is a Christmas movie, about miracles.
ok fc31 no problem.
i would maybe just make mclane an ex-marine vietnam vets. that might work if he is more like regular soldiers and not superhuman commandos like arnie and rambo.
Personally, I think it could be too "convenient" that the terrorists take control of a building that just happens to have a counterterrorism expert visiting as the spouse of an executive.
The gimmick works in films like "Under Siege" or "Air Force One" or "Olympus Has Fallen" because, in each case, the presence of such an expert is logical and consistent with the setting.
Personally, I think a lot of McClane's appeal, same as Willis's own appeal at the time, is that he's NOT an expert in counterterrorism. He's got the above-average skills one might expect from a competent, experienced cop, but nothing more. McClane doesn't demonstrate any unusual proficiency beyond than his inhuman endurance.
This gives McClane an "everyman" appeal that I think this franchise lost track of over the years.
I think it could be too "convenient" that the terrorists take control of a building that just happens to have a counterterrorism expert visiting as the spouse of an executive.
Very true. share
Under Siege is not a good comparison. A lot of military protocol is thrown out the window to give the bad guys the chance to take the ship. It does not matter that the Missouri was heading to its final destination. Security would not be let down for a moment. A battleship is still a vital piece of war equipment and would be treated as such. Maybe the security lapses might happen aboard the Love Boat but not on a capital ship.
shareThe problem with that was that the XO was in on it and he was ordering men to the party creating the security deficiency. He actually went against the captain's orders to maintain security patrols.
shareMy understanding is that nobody but nobody can alter security for any reason. The matter would have been taken up with the captain immediately as when the matter was sorted out it could have been a court martial offense. Nobody is risking undergoing a court martial unless the highest authorities available signed off on it. Also, the Missouri is a big ship. Highly improbable a group of 30-35 mercs could effectively subdue a large part of the crew. Further, its surprising that the material brought on board by the mercs was not checked over.
shareTotally agree with you for the most part. But I know from experience that no sailor is going to question an order from the XO. They usually treat his orders as if they came from the Captain himself.
shareyes as paladin point out under siege have important exception - gary buzey character is high rank traiter and he can have power to undermines security on ship.
shareZero. 👌
shareNot much really. But then again I’ll give a pass to Die Hard until the day I die….hard.
shareThe only thing that bothers me is that you’re so fucking stupid that you don’t know what a plot hole is
shareWhen?
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