MovieChat Forums > Politics > Tim Walz = Stolen Valor?

Tim Walz = Stolen Valor?


https://youtu.be/rsOsmbFHUqc

According to records by the National Guard, the 1st Battalion of the 125th Field Artillery received an alert order on July 14, 2005, – two months after Walz retired. The mobilization order came in August and the unit mobilized in October.

Army Lieutenant Colonel Kristen Augé, the state public affairs officer for Minnesota National Guard, told Just the News on Wednesday that the governor did not retire as "Command Sergeant Major Walz" in 2005, as stated on Minnesota's official website, but as Master Sergeant "because he did not complete additional coursework at the U.S. Army Sergeants Major Academy." A soldier who does not complete the requisite coursework is automatically demoted, according to Army regulations.

Master Sergeant (MSG) is the eighth enlisted grade (E-8), ranking above Sergeant First Class and below Sergeant Major, Command Sergeant Major, Sergeant Major of the Army, and equal in grade but not authority to a First Sergeant.


So he stole 3 ranks higher and never held a gun in a war (deployed to active combat). I always thought Stolen Valor is using fake military credentials to defraud the government and/or gain veteran services from places. I guess a minor Stolen Valor? I mean he didn't use that rank to gain anything that I read of.

Update: Embellished 3 seniority ranks higher (Sgt Mjr and Cmd Sgt Mjr have same pay grade). He did obtain Cmd Sgt Mjr for only 8 months before retirement.

reply

"defraud the government and/or gain veteran services"
Nah , just bragging counts I think

reply

Either way he's a liar and a yellow striped coward. Along with a radical America-hating cunt.

reply

Walz enlisted at 17 (1981) and served 24 years in the National Guard.
Feb '05: Walz filed to run for Congress
May '05: Walz retired from Guard
July '05: Walz former unit ordered to deploy

He's not a coward & I appreciate his service as we all should.

reply

Yeah, the only thing that holds true is holding a rank he never obtained or completed the work for and probably that misinterpretation of him saying he carried a gun "in war". I don't get how you can get a rank that you didn't finish the paperwork/tests for anyway, just doesn't make sense. There are only two smears that hold true in all this other than his political career which was pretty progressive in nature.

reply

Walz served for 24 years, which was 24 more years than Little CraigyCunt served for.

reply

But the military service smears do not hold true Rorikon.

"By the time Walz left the military entirely, he had achieved the rank of command sergeant major, one of the top ranks for an enlisted soldier. But personnel files show that he was reduced in rank months after retiring, leaving him as a master sergeant for benefits purposes. Minnesota National Guard officials have said that Walz retired before completing coursework at the U.S. Army Sergeants Major Academy, along with other requirements associated with his promotion."

https://apnews.com/article/walz-national-guard-military-ae43d684bf1319e535f9f620552155d7

"and probably that misinterpretation of him saying he carried a gun "in war"."

See HarlemEagle42's comment below. And if you're calling it a "misinterpretation" than by your own words it does not hold true...

reply

LittleCraigyCunt, did you serve for 24 years?

reply

Achieved rank of Command Sergeant Major, but did not retire at that rank bc there was additional coursework he needed to do to retire at that rank. At worst it's an embellishment, but it's not bc he did achieve the rank. If he was drawing Command Sergeant Major benefits/pension then it would be a different story.

reply

"In early 2003 he was selected to attend the United States Army Sergeants Major Academy. The non-resident course consists of two years of correspondence coursework, followed by a two-week resident phase at Fort Bliss, Texas," Behrends and Herr recounted.

One of the stipulations that is part of enrolling in the academy is a requirement to serve two years following graduation or promotion to command sergeant major.

If soldiers fails to complete the school, they can be separated from the Army and will be reduced in rank to master sergeant, E8, unless the promotion board steps in.

"These stipulations are put in place because the academy is a college level school, the military invests a lot of taxpayer money in the student. The military needs to ensure they will get the return on investment that the taxpayers deserve," Behrends and Herr explained.

In September 2004, Walz was conditionally promoted to the position of command sergeant major of 1-125th Field Artillery Battalion.

Then in early 2005, a warning order was issued to the unit saying prepare to deploy to Iraq.

"On May 16th, 2005 he quit, leaving the 1-125th Field Artillery Battalion and its Soldiers hanging; without its senior Non-Commissioned Officer, as the battalion prepared for war. His excuse to other leaders was that he needed to retire in order to run for congress," Behrends and Herr wrote.

The veterans highlighted that this was false, because all Walz needed to do was seek permission from the secretary of defense to become a candidate, as many reservists have done.

Further, "If he had retired normally and respectfully, you would think he would have ensured his retirement documents were correctly filled out and signed, and that he would have ensured he was reduced to Master Sergeant for dropping out of the academy. Instead he waited for the paperwork to catch up to him. His official retirement document states, SOLDIER NOT AVAILABLE FOR SIGNATURE," Behrends and Herr wrote.

reply

He let the paperwork catch up to him. So what? Obviously it was not important to him to retire as a Command Sergeant Major. It does not mean he did not achieve that rank.

"Then in early 2005, a warning order was issued to the unit saying prepare to deploy to Iraq."

Look at my dates in the message above or HarlemEagle42's timeline (#3) below. He filed to run for Congress Feb '05, he retired from the National Guard in May '05 (which means he submitted that paperwork in Feb/March '05). In July '05 (which your quote referred to as "early 2005") his former unit was given orders to deploy to Iraq which it did in the fall of '05.
Whatever source you're quoting from seems to have an inherent bias.

I know there was one guy in his unit that spoke out against Walz for leaving when he did but everyone else said he served honorably.

It's not like he retired from the National Guard & effed off for 20 years. He served his country in Congress. He served his state as governor & accomplished a lot. I don't think Walz owes anyone anything.

The shameful attack made by Vance against him was despicable & stupid. You know the saying 'those who live in glass houses should not throw stones.' It's not surprising though seeing as how this was orchestrated by Chris LaCivita, the media advisor for the Swift Boat Veterans.

reply

Behrends & Herr have an obvious axe to grind against Walz and it's nothing new. There was another guy in the Guard that prefaced his statement saying he wouldn't vote for Walz but that his military service was as good as anyone's.

reply

Think you mean not bc he didn't achieve the rank. Apparently he did achieve it in '04 but only for 8 months before retirement but didn't complete the requirements to obtain it fully nor did he retire to be demoted properly, let the paperwork catch up to him.

reply

He did achieve it. I address it above.

reply

The swift boating has begun already?

*The timeline as it was:

“… service members need to submit papers several months before they can retire.

1) Walz retired in May 2005, pushing his submission back to February or March 2005

2) Walz filed paperwork with the Federal Election Commission as a candidate for Congress on February 10, 2005

3) His unit received alert orders to deploy to Iraq in July 2005, 4 to 5 months after Walz’s request for retirement.

4) The unit first mobilized in the fall of 2005 to Camp Shelby Mississippi to prepare for deployment

5) They were deployed in March 2006 for 22 months…..”


*As for the carrying a weapon, as one does in the military:

“…The senator actually misquoted Walz in his screed. In the clip Vance was referencing, Walz says that he “carried” weapons in war, not “used.” Given that Operation Enduring Freedom was a part of the post-9/11 War on Terror, and that Walz was deployed to Italy under it — and likely had a service weapon — the claim that he is engaging in “stolen valor” holds little water….”


reply

100% correct.

reply

The Walz quote I transcribed from the video:

"And we can make sure that those weapons of war that I carried in war is the only place where those weapons are at."

Initially I thought this was misleading & implied he was in a war meaning in combat (to be clear Walz was never in combat).

After reading your interpretation I now see that his statement was accurate. He was in a war, he carried a rifle, but never in combat in that war. It may have been a carefully worded, rhetorical statement spoken for effect, but a truthful statement none the less and all politicians engage in rhetoric.

This has been sticking in my mind bothering me HarlemEagle42 so thank you for providing clarity!

reply

"Carried weapons in war" is intended to create the impression that he was on the battlefield. Please don't pretend otherwise, it insults the intelligence of normal people.

reply

Okay, all those parts are fine. It's the ranking he's embellishing in, that still holds true. He claims he's Cmd Sgt Mjr when he isn't, a brief stint if you will. I was thinking they needed to update his Wikipedia page but then the wording corrected me in saying 'highest rank'.

reply

No, he was at the rank he claimed, he just wasn’t able to retire with that rank’s benefits due to not holding that rank long enough.

This whole talking point is biting Republicans in the tushy. There is no stolen valor anywhere in his story. Even the most basic, cursory fact check of it finds nothing.

Republicans are desperate.

reply

But it's stupid if you think about it. Who goes by highest rank obtained instead of current rank? If someone gets demoted via court marshal or other, you don't refer to your highest rank held.

reply

Check with "Cadet" Bonespurs on that.

reply

...he was never demoted or anything akin to that, what are you even saying? 😭 it's the rank he left with. it's actually very normal to identify with the highest rank achieved if you left with that highest-achieved rank? seems weird to go with anything else.

reply

Demented Donald claims that he (Donnie) was down at ground zero on 9/11 helping out:

"Everyone who helped clear the rubble, and I was there, and I watched, and I helped a little bit, but I want to tell you those people were amazing. Clearing the rubble, trying to find additional lives, you didn't know what was going to come down on all of us. . . ."

which has been proven to be total bullshit. Is that 'Stolen Valor'?
Or just ordinary dementia?

reply

Think that's just general BS. Stolen Valor resides mostly to military, there is even an Act for it.

reply

Not really. 9/11 was an act of war, and Donnie claims he was down there helping to recuse survivors of an act of war. If that was a lie, that meets the criteria of stolen valor.

reply

This is worst part of the whole Tim Walz debacle... Stolen Valor is fucked up.

He should resign immediately.

reply

In that case Demented Donald should have resigned years ago after that horrific lie about helping to rescue victims at ground zero on 9/11. That is a "literal" example of stolen valor compared to that little misquote by Governor Walz.

reply

So it sounds like he made it to E9 and retired, but is only getting retired pay as an E8 due to not doing some Admin shit. That is fairly common and nobody who served would in any way consider that stolen valor. Hell I'll be in the same boat when I retire soon, as I'm not doing the full number of years at E8 to get paid for it.

If he was frocked to E9 and didn't get busted down for some reason, then he's an E9. End of story!

reply