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David1616's Replies
Seems to me you are deflecting. This is an extremely simple question and if "racism" is really as evil as the left makes it to be, there should be plenty of examples. Also you didn't answer my second question: You said one can still be a "racist" if one isn't unfair to Blacks. What is wrong with being a "racist" if one isn't unfair to Blacks?
We are talking about Blacks. You didn't answer the question. How are so called "racists" unfair to Blacks?
Now you answer my questions:
1. How am I (or Nick Fuentes) unfair to Blacks?
2. It it possible to be a "racist" without being unfair to Blacks, and if yes, what is wrong with being a "racist" if one isn't unfair to Blacks?
Of course it's possible that people who hold views about race outside of Overton window deny that they hold them because they don't want to be punished by society for holding them. Just like people in the Soviet Union denied being "counter revolutionaries" because they didn't want to be sent to the Gulag. What people think privately and say publicly are two different things (which is a good argument that our mainstream culture towards race is far from ideal). That does not prove their views are wrong any more than atheists in Muslim countries are being proven wrong for being called "infidels".
""Infidel" is a loaded term rooted in religious presuppositions about the world. Racism is not."
It is. The only difference is that different people are in power in America than in Muslim countries. People that tailor the window of acceptable positions. In Muslim countries, "infidel" is the same as "racist"
If I was an Islamic fundamentalist and accused you of being an "Infidel", would you be interested in debating me? Probably not. But if I sad, "Your views are unfair to Islam and Muslims" suddenly you would become curious and ask me "why?". The term "racist" does nothing but appeal to the Overton window which is a logical fallacy. Tell me how am I being unfair to Blacks.
The term racist is like a term "heretic". What you've said is "Do you think it's possible to be a heretic, but then deny that you're a heretic?". It's a totally irrelevant question, because people you are debating don't believe in the premises that a term like "heretic" or "racist" is even a legitimate thing. If you think I or someone else is being unfair to Blacks, say "You're being unfair to Blacks and here's why". Don't use thought stoppers like "racism".
Maybe ironically just as many gay men say they are f****ts. Society calls them that so they accept it. But I doubt they accept the moral premise that their views are immoral which this term implies.
A rightful reaction to unfairness to Whites in our society.
Nobody identifies as a "racist". The latter is a smear term just like "heretic" or "infidel". I am personally opposed to artificial favoritism to Whites and I've never heard any prominent figure in the identatarian movement advocate this despite being in the movement for a decade. You lose credibility in opposing Black favoritism this way. However I believe that every ethnic group has a right to intergroup preference and if Whites chose to favor their own they would have a right to provided they don't deny Blacks the right to secede and have their own communities/countries. But as long as Whites and Blacks live together, we shouldn't advocate any favoritism.
10 years? I'm talking historically dude. What was Black population in Canada compared to US from nation's birth to today?
Are you sure you didn't misunderstand what they meant? What is their reasoning? Also I asked from prominent White identatarians, not some losers on moviechat forum.
"Most slavers were "Christian". Most African-Americans have WASPy last names."
So do most Germans in America. Johann Schmidt became John Smith.
Canada used to be historically WAY Whiter than US particularly less Black. Only in recent years has it opened borders to other people and even today it's immigration policy is merit based meaning the minorities in Canada don't behave as Blacks and Hispanics do in the US.
Economists are Alberto Alesina, Edward Glaeser and Bruce Sacredote. The paper is called Why doesn't the US have a European style Welfare state. It is by Harvard institute of economic research. They conclude about half of the variable is due to ethnic makeup of the US, other half due to other factors.
I haven't seen that anywhere. Today in America it's illegal to discriminate against Blacks, but not against Whites (generally). I am a White identatarian and I believe as long as America is multiracial that hiring policy should be strictly merit based. If you have an example of some prominent "far right" figure saying Whites should be openly favored even controlling for merit, please list it.
Keelai didn't even attempt to argue these aren't double standards. He just attempted to justify them using his far left (and false) narrative and assumptions. He also didn't even give one example of a double standard by so called "White supremacists". I can debate his left wing narrative on race in America and why it's a lie, but this is waste of time as the debate will just drag on forever. For now I just wanted liberals to give me an example of a double standard by the far right. So what do you want to do? Debate weather or not these are indeed double standards, give me example of double standards on my side or debate the historical narrative on race?
9. Whites were first to come up the idea to end slavery. They banned slavery in all of Africa and the rest of the world which had to be ruled by Whites to end it which says a lot about non Whites. Arabs practiced worse slavery than Whites, yet there is no Arab slavery guilt today. Africa had slavery for centuries before Europeans arrived, Black Bantus in Africa nearly exterminated Pygmies and Bushmen and took their land and even today treat them like animals. No guilt. Whites are held to higher standards than non Whites when it comes to past behavior.
10. In America White is also an ethnic group since most Whites have MANY ethnic backgrounds. White is kind of a meta ethnicity just like Native American or Australian aborigines who also are divided into tribes and are seen as a people by the left. If you capitalize Slav or Arab who are also meta ethnicity, then you should capitalize White.
11. Whites did everything and more. Problems of Blacks today are not due to "racism" but due to Black culture, single motherhood if not Black genetics. Even if you believe toxic Black behavior today is due to past racism, it's still up to Blacks to fix it. Nobody else can make Blacks do their homework and stop having children out of wedlock.
12. Modern science came from Europe, industrial revolution came from Europe, technological revolution came from Europe, modern economy came from Europe, democracy came from Europe, women's rights came from Europe, worker's rights came from Europe. Look at Wikipedia article on White people. It just says they're a social construct that is unfairly privileged. Not a word about all these achievements. Meanwhile the article on Blacks if full of their minor achievements. Google search for White inventors gives images of Blacks.
1: White identity is suppressed, not reinforced. What planet do you live in?
2. No White identatarian has a problem with Blacks having their own institutions. White institutions are forbidden.
3. So What? How does that debunk the double standard of modern society that Whites safe spaces aren't allowed but Black one are?
4. Believe what you want about US. This argument isn't US specific, how about UK, Sweden or France? Liberia's constitution limits citizenship to only Blacks. Mexico had an explicit law aimed at preserving ethnic makeup until very recently. Liberals never complained about it. The same with Israel and Japan. But if Trump wants to stop illegal immigration he's the new Hitler. It's bad only when Whites do it. Insane double standards
5. Even if your narrative was true, history doesn't justify double standards today. Liberals literally made a movie about a Black Cleopatra even though she was Greek. Name me one right winger who wants Shaka Zulu or Munsa Musa to be portrayed as White.
6. Even if your one sided narrative was true (which it isn't since Blacks have always raped more White women than the other way around) it wouldn't debunk my argument about double standards. I see plenty of Black and Hispanic only dating sites and nobody complains, but if someone makes a White one, there's outrage.
7. Blacks don't do worse due to poor schools. Data debunks this and even if they did, it wouldn't debunk the argument that today liberals want less qualified Blacks to get ahead of more qualified Whites and Asians. No right winger proposes the opposite. The point stands.
8. Just because one ethnic group has more total power due to having larger numbers doesn't mean standards for what is considered bigotry should be different for different ethnic groups. Blacks have more power relative to their numbers and their merit.
No this has been debunked. How do we know that? By looking at Blacks who were freed before emancipation proclamation. After 2 generations, these two groups did not statistically differ in terms of educational and economic success. Also other studies show that the speed at which of Blacks fades though generations shows that it is extremely unlikely slavery still has effect after 160 years. Also data clearly shows that wealth gaps and unemployment gaps between Blacks and Whites haven't decreased, but actual increased over the last decades, the opposite you would expect if slavery was the cause of Black poverty.
No, White women don't benefit more from affirmative action. This has been debunked:
https://youtu.be/O-QFebX3uok
Trump was a backlash against demographic replacement/tolerance to illegal immigration and political correctness which mainly comes from race. If America was all White, this backlash never would have happened. Name a Western almost all White country with populist politicians winning elections that are called Hitler. Wonder why Canada and Uk, two other mainly Anglo countries have universal healthcare? Because they are less Black. And don't trust me, this is the opinion of top economists who analyzed the cause of difference between Europe and America in social safety nets. You lefties who complain about harsh capitalism in US but support diversity are hypocrites.
I am from Europe. I would have nothing against all White Americans returning to Europe provided brown people in Europe return to Morocco and Pakistan. If this happened, American Blacks and Hispanics would follow them just like they follow them now everywhere Whites go.