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No, I'm not. This is fairly well-known history. He wasn't going to be a bit player, but not a lead. In fact, the studio wanted him gone or highly diminished because he was so satanic in appearance.
As for DeForest Kelley, I think you mean given a featured credit only after the first season.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
Spock in Star Trek. He was supposed to be a minor character. Kirk was supposed to be the stars. Nimoy's fan mail soon eclipsed every other actor's mail combined.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
Yes, so unclear. A term that is unfindable on any search, but I am unclear about the meaning? Honestly, do you think anyone would create a term which is a homonym of an existing term to define a closely related concept?
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
Actually, they don't. From the information I can find, Kensey's novel was published in 1964 and Wakanda in the comics was first used in 1966. However, see my comments on the identical post in the Black Panther thread.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
The novel came out in 1964. Wakanda in the comics first appears in 1966. Stolen? Questionable. That close in time, either could have been thought of first.
It is possible Marvel comics used the name from the novel. It is also possible that one of the other theories of the origin of the name is correct. Its possible Ken Kensey was inspired by the same sources.
Name borrowing is a time honored tradition with many writers. It is often intended as an homage to the source.
Legally, you cannot copyright a name. Even a trademark would require more than just the duplication of a name. For instance it is unlikely that a case for could be made against, say, an ice cream shop calling a sundae an Iceberg Supreme filed by a pain creme company who make a product called Iceberg Supreme. Confusion between the two would be unlikely.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
Despite popular belief, energy swords/spears etc, mecha tanks, and pretty much everything seen in Rebel Moon, and in Star Wars, are much older than either of those franchises. So are galactic empires, usurping regents, and rebels. They are basic, easy concepts, and it would be difficult, if not impossible, to prove, legally or morally, that they are rip offs of Star Wars; since they proceed Star Wars.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
And no gibbons. Either bonobos and gibbons didn't develop intelligence, became extinct for one reason or another, or none of them lived in that particular village.
I believe some of the comic adaptations depicted gibbons. I don't recall if bonobos ever made an appearance.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
What I am trying to get through everyone's perception here is that the term "plot whole" does not exist. It is not used by anyone in the business of story creation (books, films, etc.) I can say that with confidence since, as I've said several times, if you use a search engine looking for "plot whole" you will ONLY get references to "plot hole."
I've searched on the terms "plot whole," "plot whole definition," "plot whole vs plot hole," and "plot hole vs plot whole." So far all the other commenters here keep saying is that I'm mistaking one term for the other. Yet I cannot find that term anywhere except on these boards on occasion.
I have asked several times for those disagreeing with me to find and post a reference from outside these boards and I will look at it. I may, after examining such a reference, withdraw my point.
This is a debate. I've provided my evidence. Claims that I'm wrong or mistaken are not evidence, they are merely declarations. When someone supplies actual evidence, I will return to this discussion. Until then there is no point in debating declarations.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
Prove it. Find me a reference to plot whole. I've tried. I cannot find one. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of definitions for plot hole. I cannot find one for plot whole.
And I might add, what makes a plot not whole? The meaning of plot hole is, in general, a gap or inconsistency in the story.
Example: At the beginning of the story it is established that the protagonist is allergic to peanuts. Later in the story the protagonist is eating peanuts without an issue.
Example: At the beginning of the film is a scene which establishes character A cannot swim. Later in the film character A swims across a channel to rescue the hostage.
Example: A ship is sinking at sea. The captain dives into the water and tows the ship to safety. This hole is dependent on the story being set in the real world.
Often a plot hole can be fixed with a simple line of dialog or a scene. A mircale drug that cures allergies. A montage showing the character learning to swim.
Sometimes the problem is so egregious that it cannot be solved.
I should note, that fantasy, horror, and sf do not have plot holes due to depicting things which cannot happen in real life. In the sinking ship example above, if the film is a story set in a world with super powers, the hole does not exist. (unless it was established the captain does not have super powers.)
Show me a reference which defines plot whole. Not your personal belief, but evidence of its use. (Other than this thread) I will examine it.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
Ok, you realize that a reference to this discussion thread is meaningless, right? i would need a reference from outside this discussion. As I mentioned earlier if you google (or use duck duck go, which is my choice), the engines will not return a mention, definition, or acknowledgement of "plot whole." Thus my contention that the term used by DemBonesThemBone is incorrect and that there is not a term called "plot whole."
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
I cannot find a single reference to "plot whole" anywhere. Can you. As I said above, if you can, and direct me to it, I will read it. Until then, since I see no evidence of the term actually being used anywhere, I will maintain my stance.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
You could ask, but the answer is clearly different. The Death Star was a military vessel intended to sow fear and terror. It is clearly a military target. And I doubt that there were many, if any, civilian personnel on board. How many civilians would you find on an air craft carrier? The few who might be trusted to be on a military vessel on a military (if unjustified) mission would be well versed in the mission and just as legitimately targetable.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
While I agree with some of your comments, liscarkat, please don't disparage those of us in our 7th decade (or more) who do believe in an immortal soul. Personally, I think belief that death is the end is naive. No, I don't wish to debate it. Just keep in mind that people analyze things differently and we should all respect them, regardless of our own beliefs.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
Even the greatest saints suffered temptations. And sometimes even succumbed to them. Saints (whether you define them in religious terms or humanistic terms) are human beings.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
He did not demote himself. He was demoted for his actions by a review board. They showed the board in action. Afterwards, Burnham requested he serve as her first officer.
Author of the Sodality Universe
The Road from Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater at Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World begins in 2025
I suggest you do a google or similar search. The term is "plot hole." The term plot whole will return definitions for "plot hole." This is a common error.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
The term is "plot hole," that is a hole or error in the plot.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
No.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
Officially, the Atreides house was gone; destroyed by the Harkonnen. War between houses were allowed, though hedged in with a lot of rules and regulations; which were sidestepped by the Emperor lending Sardakar troops, which the Landsraad was unaware of. Once he officially reappeared and claimed his title, he could be recognized as the new Duke of the Atreides, though there would be legal wrangling about that.
Technically, Paul was the son of the Duke of Arrakis, and he was the grandson of the Baron of the Harkonnens. Both lines were equally direct. However, Rabban and Feyd were legitimate, though nephews, not sons. Jessica was Harknnen's daughter by way of Reverend Mother Helena Mohiam. As such she would not be legitimate, so neither would Paul (though he was the legitimate heir of Arrakis since Jessica was an official concubine and Leto recognized him as his heir.). Both Rabban and Feyd would inherit first since they were recognized, legitimate heirs. Since they were both dead, the inheritance would fall to Paul, even though he wasn't legitimate in the line of Harkonnen.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.
Well, a couple of things. .
The government depends on a balance between the Emperor and the Landsraad (the noble Houses.), and ultimately to the Spacing Guild. Luring the Emperor, and his entourage to Arrakis is to force marriage to Irulan, which gave him the path to the Throne.
The Emperor wanted the Atreides eliminated because too many Houses in the Landsraad were lining up behind Duke Leto. That was a challenge to his power and they had to be eliminated.
The spice production was in danger because the Fremen were sabotaging facilities all over the northern hemisphere. Spice production was down and the Guild was putting pressure on the Emperor to restore it.
Yes, this is a culture which uses dueling as part of its structure. Part of Paul's motivation in fighting Feyd Ruatha was, of course, because he hated the Harkonnens. It also finalized the destruction of the Harkonnen's as a House; with the Baren, Rabban, and Feyd Ruatha dead, there wasn't anyone else, other than Paul, to rule the House.
Author of the Sodality Universe:
The Road fro Antioch
In the Markets of Tyre
Flight to Lystra
The Theater of Ephesus
The Council on Jerusalem (coming real soon now. In final edits.)
The Shattered World Series begins in 2025.