Tolkien HIMSELF mentioned BLACK ''Hobbits'' - get over it, Americans.
God help Murrr-ikka.
https://bleedingcool.com/tv/sir-lenny-henry-on-being-a-black-hobbit-in-the-lord-of-the-rings/
They were called 'Harfoot' or 'Harfeet'.
They were called 'Harfoot' or 'Harfeet'.
This is the quote about (cough cough) "black" hobbits: Β«Hobbits had already become divided into three somewhat different breeds: Harfoots, Stoors, and Fallohides. The Harfoots were browner of skin, smaller, and shorter, and they were beardless and bootless; their hands and feet were neat and nimble; and they preferred highlands and hillsides. The Stoors were broader, heavier in build; their feet and hands were larger, and they preferred flat lands and riversides. The Fallohides were fairer of skin and also of hair, and they were taller and slimmer than the others; they were lovers of trees and of woodlandsΒ».
You had different populations in a zone, not all of them have exactly the same skin tone. But for some reason a group being "browner" than other one has suddenly gone into "Tolkien mentioned black hobbits!!!" πππ share
It's been about 35 years since I first read the hobbit, and this is the first time in my life I am hearing people claim that the Harfoots were black.
Poor Tolkien, if only he had known that almost a century later everything that he did NOT explicitly state would be exploited and used to pervert his work, he would have been more careful. But of course no one could have foreseen the current madness that we find ourselves living in.
Of course Lenny Henry is all about Lenny Henry, and he doesn't give a shit about the source material or the fans who care about it.
he did NOT explicitly state
I dont think he'd give a shit, any more than he'd be bothered if Bilbos socks were black instead of the gree nhe'd imagined.
I see, so we can put makeup on the black actors to make them look white, and it doesn't matter, because it's just like changing sock color. I am also looking forward to the next sequel to black panther featuring white actors in blackface, because it doesn't matter, it's just like changing sock colour.
shareoh i see dragging out the old
"how would you like it if we painted Malcolm X white" trope ?
The difference is Th Black Panthers story is explicitly about the struggles of being black.
To paint them white is obviously taking the piss.
Refusal to see facts like that is why this debate will never end.
A better example would be to name some black characters who are not all about being black , and ideally are fictional.
I'll start: "Fresh Prince of Bel Air"
Could he have a remake in white ? hell yeah why not.
I am not sure you know what the word trope means. Either it is a trivial detail or it isn't. But you flip flop depending on what argument you are trying to defend. People with good arguments don't need to be dishonest to make their case.
Lord of the Rings was written as a mythology for England. Tolkein explicit about that. It is a miythologized version of medieval Europe. I don't know how many times I need to explain this self evident fact. The reason that different ethnicities mix today is because of technology. It allows people to travel from one side of the earth to the other in one day. Such kind of transport doesn't exist in Middle Earth, so it would make no sense for black people to be living alongside white people for example..
No one complained about black characters in the Final Fantasy series. Since in that world both magic and technology exist. So it fits right in with the world.
On the one hand you say that skin color is a trivial detail, but on the other hand you absolutely insist that there must be black hobbits. Your duplicity is transparent.
finally, someone who gets it
shareI dont think he'd give a shit, any more than he'd be bothered if Bilbos socks were black instead of the gree nhe'd imagined.
Tolkien was one of the most anal authors there were, and was extremely picky about how his works were treated. Illustrations, translations, interpretations... he insisted on being consulted (he rarely got his way), and had very strong opinions on illustrations and translations which he felt didn't hit the mark.
Christopher Tolkien was very much his father's son, neither less or more strict than J.R.R. had been. And Christopher did not like Peter Jackson's trilogy. He said, among other things, that "the commercialization has reduced the aesthetic and philosophical impact of the creation to nothing".
So I think it is more than fair to say that J.R.R. Tolkien would very much have cared, and very much objected, to this series - and also this particular aspect of the series. share
. But for some reason a group being "browner" than other one has suddenly gone into "Tolkien mentioned black hobbits!!!"
you're splitting hairs now .
He said some were darker and some were fairer, what fucking more could you ask for?
Black people in real life arnt actually black you know .
And there not brown or swarthy either.
Yes my neighbour is darker than me, he isn't black, he is tanned but he is still darker. The shire is the english countryside, he was referring to tanned, dirty, leathery not black. The region is absed on english countryside but would be located to the equivalent of southern Europe like the mediterranean where not unsurprisingly white men have darker skin but are still white.
Harads are black why don't they use them. That would require qork to write something musch easier just to race swap someone.
No one is splitting hairs they are telling you what he wrote, you just don't want to listen.
I dont think he'd give a shit
You don't think he would give a shit about some american company bastardising his lifes work. Wow, just wow. share
He didnt mind that work was translated into hundreds of other languages.
Isnt that the same thing?
People reading his work in Turkey will be imagining Middle Earth differently .
He might have described it as gree nand leafy , but that could be anywhere in europe.
Nowhere did he say
"The shire was just like Dorset, England , and there were no darkies around"
He didnt mind that work was translated into hundreds of other languages.
The same words in a different language are still the same words, they don't change description because it is now in russian or hebrew. Odd example but ok.
People reading his work in Turkey will be imagining Middle Earth differently
Why would they. It is described in detail. Are you sugegsting an eskimo reading LOTR thinks they are all eskimos. What nonsense
He might have described it as gree nand leafy , but that could be anywhere in europe.
No he it is the parts he described it as and even when interviewed described them. The shire for example is the english countryside, not turkey or africa, the english countryside. Gondor is anglo saxon medieval England, not India or Turkey or any part of Europe. Watch his interviews you will learn something.
Nowhere did he say
"The shire was just like Dorset, England , and there were no darkies around"
Tolkiens own words is the shire is represent of 1950's english countryside or are you calling the great man a liar.
Also darkies, really. I haven't used any racist connotations, slurs or anything that could even be deemed racist but you think that is ok. You need to have a look at ourself first before projecting onto others
As stated many many many times there are black characters in LOTR, many of them but they are not elves, dwarves, hobbits or men. Whats wrong with that. Or do you have a problem with white people. share
He didnt mind that work was translated into hundreds of other languages.
He was extremely picky about how his works were to be translated, though, and insisted that he be consulted. He hated all translations where the translator hadn't consulted him, and the Swedish translation stands out as a particularly bad example. share