Is Kamala Khan actually a real Muslim?

You have an enormous amount of completely unearned arrogance and obnoxiousness. You’re not nearly as smart as you think you are and I’m not nearly as dumb as you think I am. I only asked you if you’re really stupid *in response to you asking the same question of me*! And that was a day after you said "fuck you" to me. *YOU* started the insults and I merely responded. *YOU’RE* the one who started with personal attacks so if your claim that someone attacks something else when they can’t win an argument is true then that means *YOU ALREADY LOST THE ARGUMENT* before I even had a chance to lose it. Do YOU know that?

And I pointed out your ungrammatical question because it’s called *PROOF READING*, you actual asshole. Why can’t you proof read your responses to me before posting them? I’m pointing out your incoherent question because I *DON’T EVEN KNOW WHAT IT MEANS*. How am I supposed to answer your question if I *DON’T EVEN KNOW WHAT IT MEANS*? I can neither win nor lose an argument if I don’t even understand a question you ask because it's completely incoherent. *Coherent language* is the very basis of successful written communication. And you still have not provided a coherent version of that question so I still can’t answer it.

Your question about why I brought up when Captain America saw Thor for the first time is a perfect example of you simply not following the conversation. PAY VERY CLOSE ATTENTION. I pointed out that the plane scene would at most prove that Rogers did not personally believe at that time that Thor was a god. You responded by asking how I knew that was the first time he heard of Thor, which I clearly did not assert. I responded to your false characterization of what I said by explaining to you that I actually said it was the first time Rogers *saw* Thor. That is the relevance of me pointing that out. I was pointing out YOUR mistake about what I said. A mistake you wouldn’t have made if you SLOWED DOWN and PAYED CAREFUL ATTENTION to what I’m actually saying. And regardless of whether Rogers already knew that Thor existed, what he said after seeing Thor for the first time would at most prove what his religious beliefs were prior to that moment.

It's not "common sense" that Rogers was briefed about Asgardians, you actual idiot. The fact that you think the plane scene proves that he was just proves that you didn’t actually pay attention to what happened in the scene. The movie shows him being briefed about the Tesseract and the Hulk but not Asgardians. You wrongly assume that Nick Fury believed it was necessary for Rogers to be briefed on Asgardians before the mission. You need to remember that no one at Shield knew *before the mission* that Rogers was going to be escorting any prisoners anywhere. He only happened to escort Loki on the plane during his first night in action because Loki *purposely allowed himself to be captured*. He didn’t need to be briefed on Asgardians in order to escort an already captured prisoner.

The fact that Black Widow already knew about Asgardians prior to that scene proves the opposite of what you think it does. Black Widow had already been working for Shield for several years prior to the events of this movie. She was already involved with Shield at the time Thor first came to Earth. That is the reason she already knew more by that point about Asgardians than Rogers did. And if Rogers had already been briefed about Asgardians *prior to that point* then why did Natasha *HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO ROGERS WHO THOR WAS* prior to him jumping out of the plane? CAN YOU EXPLAIN THAT TO ME, GENIUS? Are *YOU* really that dense? See how little common sense you actually have? Rogers seeing Thor fly into and out of the plane didn’t make him suddenly think that Thor was a god and I never claimed that it did. The idea that Thor was a god was first explained to him by Natasha after Thor left the plane.

You don’t always put someone on a pedestal and then get let down, actual asshole. Sometimes it’s the opposite. Sometimes you don’t think much of someone and then put them on a pedestal once you get to know them better because they impress you. This is a perfect example of that. Besides never denying that Thor was a god after that point, Rogers also never downgraded Thor’s abilities as a superhero. Rogers learned that Thor carried around a hammer that no one else was even capable of picking up off the ground. Rogers himself tried and completely failed to do it in Avengers: Age of Ultron. Surely this isn’t your idea of putting someone on a pedestal and then getting let down by the real thing.

I’m well aware that Rogers never made a single expression of religious faith prior to seeing Thor for the first time, you actual idiot. I’ve seen Captain America: The First Avenger and know he’s never shown going to church. But that movie never had a reason to show him going to church or expressing religious faith. What the MCU shows us of Captain America prior to The Avengers is irrelevant to this issue. All that matters is what it shows after he meets Thor. He didn’t even know before then that there was any life on other planets. Thor repeatedly referred to himself as the God of Thunder and Rogers NEVER denied that he was at any future point in the MCU and yet you ridiculously just assumed that he secretly believed Thor wasn’t an actual god. Why would he secretly do that? What sense does that make, you actual idiot?

It’s NOT a matter of humans "worshipping" gods, you actual idiot. Gods are not gods because people "worship" them. Gods are gods because of their *innate supernatural powers*. It’s simply a matter of gods in the MCU showing their supernatural powers. I am NOT saying that any humans in the MCU are worshipping Thor and they don’t need to worship him in order to prove my point. I am merely saying that they *realize* that Thor is a god. Mere realization that someone is a god is NOT the same thing as worshipping that being as a god. It is a simple matter of humans seeing Thor’s powers and merely *realizing* the fact that he is a god. If these humans in the Avengers who work together with Thor to defeat supervillains and respect him as a member of their team really didn’t believe that Thor was a god then they would explicitly say so to his face. They don’t lie to each other about what they think of each other, you actual mega idiot.

This movie was so fucking bad, I can't believe this has resulted in a conversation about this character being a legit Muslim?? 😂

You tell me that maybe the MCU's Islam is different from Islam in the real world and that concession speaks enormous volumes. If the MCU's "Islam" is different from the real world's Islam then it's not really Islam, is it? Islam is a real religion in the real world. Any religion that's different from that in any way, no matter what it calls itself, is clearly not Islam. If Kamala Khan follows this different version of Islam then she's not really a Muslim, is she?

My appeal to purity isn't a fallacy because it's a legitimate test of any religion. You referred to my argument as a No True Scotsman fallacy in your earlier comments. The whole idea of the concept of the No True Scotsman fallacy is that a true Scotsman can believe anything and still be a true Scotsman because a Scotsman is merely someone born in Scotland. Beliefs can't change that.

That doesn't apply to a religion because a religion is defined by the beliefs of its adherents. A supposed adherent of a particular religion is limited in what they can believe. It's the reason that a "Jew for Jesus" isn't really a Jew. It's the reason someone who believes in Buddha or Vishnu can't really be a Jew. You wouldn't deny a claim that such a person wasn't really a Jew so there's no reason you should do the same for my claim that Kamala Khan isn't really a Muslim. She's not a real Muslim because she's simply cosplaying as a Muslim. Without such limits on belief, the very concept of any religion is completely meaningless.

With religion, realness is defined by purity. With religion, purity of belief is the defining quality of the thing. With any religion, its basic beliefs can only change so much without that religion ceasing to actually be that religion instead of something completely different. You concede that this could have happened to Islam as a whole in the MCU yet you absurdly claim that if this happened to the MCU's version of "Islam" then it's still actually Islam. But that obviously wouldn't be true.

Islam has its own clear definition of what a Muslim is. Kamala Khan does not meet that definition. Therefore, she's not a real Muslim. That's not based on the beliefs of so-called fundamentalist extremist Islam. That's just based on the basic beliefs of ordinary Islam that it's always had since the time Islam started. Islam has never defined itself as simply an inherited trait passed down through the generations. Islam is defined by active beliefs. Mohammed gave a specific definition of what it means to be a Muslim and Kamala Khan doesn't meet that definition. At most, she would be a former Muslim.

But on top of that, your argument fails because you're forced to make a straw man of Kamala Khan's Islam. The Ms. Marvel show doesn't concede that she's a non-devout or non-pious Muslim. It doesn't concede that the Islam she practices in the MCU is somehow different from Islam in the real world. It presents her as an ordinary, devout Muslim practicing the exact same version of Islam practiced by real Muslims in the real world.

The fact that Kamala Khan doesn't cover her face doesn't change anything I said about the Ms. Marvel show presenting her as an observant Muslim. Most orthodox Muslims don't believe that Muslim women are required to cover their faces. The differences in beliefs among Muslims on the question of whether Muslim women should cover their faces is part of the legitimate diversity of opinions within Islam. It's not central to basic Muslim theology.

Pointing out that mutants and other super beings appear on a daily basis in the MCU still doesn't help your case. You pointed out that this was normal. But it didn't start out normal. It became normal over the course of time. And the very first instance of it would have caused an immediate crisis of faith for all monotheists. Religious faith in those circumstances couldn't be maintained without an intense spiritual struggle. Neither the Ms. Marvel show nor anything else in the MCU shows any such struggle of faith. The beginning of Avengers: Endgame shows Earth's society in crisis but there was absolutely no religious aspect to it that was shown. And that's completely separate from the issue of Thor's existence as a god.

You have absolutely no basis for concluding that Muslims in the MCU went through any kind of spiritual struggle. It's completely absurd for you to just assume that they did so. You can only assume they did so because their continued faith without it would be completely ridiculous. The fact that you need to assume that they did so merely proves that you recognize the utter absurdity of Muslims’ continued adherence to their religion in the MCU without an intense spiritual struggle. A better conclusion is simply that their continued faith, as portrayed in Ms. Marvel, is itself completely ridiculous. That you feel the need to suggest that maybe "Islam" in the MCU is somehow different than real Islam in the real world shows just how much you realize that continued Muslim faith in the MCU really is utterly absurd. Real Islam couldn't survive in the MCU.

In the first Thor movie, Thor didn't say that magic and technology are the same on Asgard. He told Jane Foster that magic and science were the same thing on Asgard. That just means that magic on Asgard has some sort of science explaining it. But Thor has certain powers possessed by no other Asgardians. Perhaps there is some sort of scientific explanation for that such as genetics. But that doesn't change the fact that Thor is able to do things such as creating lightning which, according to Islam, only Allah can do. So Thor's very existence still presents an unavoidable challenge to Islam's beliefs. Even if Thor and his powers can be completely explained by science and technology then that would still be a challenge to Islam's beliefs. If everything supernatural is just technology then that would make Allah and his powers nothing more than technology. It would mean that Allah wasn't really the one and only true 'god'. If there are no actual gods then there is no Allah.