Female impersonators (men who dress and look like women but don't wanna sex change, picture big blonde wigs and too much make-up) are either confused if they should identify as a man or are getting pissed off with people assuming they're a transwoman.
shareYou're confused and this topic is getting tired. Move on.
shareNah, I saw "ticketsplease" and his feeble homophobic attempt to address the issue. As a queer man I will to get to the core of the problem. We do get a little a tired of heterosexuals trying to speak for us.
shareSo why the hell are you trolling too? Seriously? There is no issue to get to the core of other than people not wanting to understand anything that is different from themselves. That's not going to happen with a post like this.
shareI am not trolling. This is a real issue for me. There is much confusion among our queer youth over gender choice and sexual orientation. I went through it myself when I was 10 or 11.
Once my older sister informed me that a homosexual was a man who dressed in women's clothes. I was aghast. I knew I was gay and I knew I was quite happy to be male and act like a man. This is an issue.
Like I said, you are confused.
Drag is when a person, gay or straight, dresses in as the opposite gender, usually as a form of entertainment.
A crossdresser is someone who dresses as the opposite gender, but are not trans, and it's more of a personal issue.
A trans person is someone who identifies with a gender they were not assigned at birth.
See my response below about how we view Drag Queens in the UK.
shareWe have straight Drag Queens here to. There's a local theatre group that has been around here for almost 30 years, that is all guys in drag. Over the years there have been quite a few straight guys who have participated.
shareThe UK has a long tradition of men dressing up as women from Shakespearean times, to Vaudeville, to Pantomime, through to Monty Python and beyond, which have nothing to do with being gay
shareHere we have it. A straight person trying to tell me about my own community.
Real drag queens are almost always gay. I'm not talking about Robin Williams in "Mrs Doubtfire" or Jamie Foxx as Wanda on "In Living Color". Those men are not actually drag queens. And yes, it's a form of entertainment. But if you are gay as I am, and have been in enough gay bars, you'd know that there is always a drag queen or two, not transgender, who likes a night to "perform". It's a queer art form so to speak and has been for centuries.
Transvestites don't hang out with gays. They're straight men with a sexual fetish.
When you say "cross dressers" you're conflating transvestites with drag queen, since they're both men who identify as men. But transvestites and drag queens are very different.
And trans is as you described it.
And yes, that's what I'm saying in my OP.
But if you are gay as I am, and have been in enough gay bars,
I started posting on IMDb 20 years ago as Gameboy. I was a strident unapologetic queer supremacist then as I still am now.
I was the Admin Platonic Caveman on filmboards for 4 years.
I left FB and I've been posting on MovieChat for about 7 months.
People know me. I am who I say I am. Get used to it.
Also, the term transvestite is outdated, and also somewhat offensive.
shareWhatever you want to call it. They're straight men with a sexual fetish. Cross dressers is too broad a term.
shareThere isn't always a sexual component to it. Sure, sometimes it's sexual, sometimes it's not. Perhaps you should educate yourself a little bit about these topics before making blanket statements about them. I'm sure you could find a psychology class that might help.
shareI don't completely understand it. I just know it's a fetish which I don't take seriously. It's not the same as gay drag. And it's not transgender.
I don't see it as political like LGBT.
And it's very different than gay men who dress in drag.
I found a rather woke source which backs me up.
Here's exactly why the word 'transvestite' is offensiveshare
'Transvestite' has largely been replaced by the term 'cross-dresser' which can apply to a person of any gender but typically refers to a heterosexual man who wears clothing traditionally associated with women.
https://www.sbs.com.au/topics/voices/article/2016/07/29/heres-exactly-why-word-transvestite-offensive
I don't want a "woke" source. I want accurate and factual.
You said :
Whatever you want to call it. They're straight men with a sexual fetish.
Ms Johnson adds that the portion of people who do derive sexual pleasure from cross-dressing do not represent the majority of cross-dressers.
I really don't care about these heterosexual males who dress in women's clothes. It's not a human rights issue and has nothing to do with the LGBT struggle for equality.
My point in this thread is to draw a distinction between the majority of gay males who love being men and don't cross dress; the minority of gay males who dress in drag for fun and entertainment; and transgender women who were born male and now live as women.
That's all.
I'm not sure why you're so hostile.
I'm not actually hostile. I just haven't seen anyone on here posting about not understanding the difference between a transperson and a drag queen, so I don't see where you feel that you need draw a distinction, other than to generate a post with a ton of replies. Which you have been successful doing. But to what end? Also, for someone who doesn't care about a group of people, you sure are spending a lot of time arguing about them. I just listed them in my post describing the differences, because they are a group that gets tossed in the mix. You could have just passed on by, but no, you chose to continue to argue about something you just don't care about.
Posts about trans people are divisive. This board has enough hate and bullshit on it already. You came over from filmboards, so maybe you are used to hate, but leave it over there.
Nah, heterosexuals get this stuff mixed up all the time. This "ticketsplease" lame thread was up for days. We've clarified some things here.
shareYes, we've clarified that you are a troll.
shareI'll await your answer. Where did I troll on this thread?
This was a good thread which explored many terms. I make no apologies.
I would imagine that the posting style over on Filmboards is far more combative than over here. Some of the regulars are a little more laid back in GD (not all by any means; Ticketsplease is troll central) .
shareOkay, thanks. I respect your input. And the OP is trolling because it was a parody of a troll.
But nothing I've said in my own words in the body of this thread is trolling.
Thanks for taking my response in the spirit that it was intended.
I think that many of the regulars are sick and tired of the contentious threads that our resident socks and trolls constantly post, which is why you perhaps received a more defensive response than you anticipated.
Most of us are a nice bunch and I like to think that hanging out here is the equivalent of going to your local, having a few beers, telling a few jokes and shooting the breeze with the locals.
I hope you get used to us 🍻
🍻 👍
shareHere's exactly why the word 'transvestite' is offensive
'Transvestite' has largely been replaced by the term 'cross-dresser' which can apply to a person of any gender but typically refers to a heterosexual man who wears clothing traditionally associated with women.
How does that clear anything up ? it explained nothing!
Can anyone actually explain why the word 'transvestite' is offensive?
I’m not sure, but it sounds very clinical and old-fashioned to me, like something you’d hear in a 1960s educational film.
Everyone knows in its shortened form “tranny” it’s used as a slur. Go over to the politics section and you’ll hear them throwing it around like it’s a hot potato.
sounds very clinical and old-fashioned
admittedly it does yeah , "lesbian" sounds a bit funny to me , but i'm not in charge of what people find offensive.
I missed the meeting where we went from "Colored" to "People of Color".
Only found out recently . I'm not sure why the change.
Yeah it’s interesting how rearranging a few words can totally change the impact of the description, right? For me “colored” harkens back to images of southern plantation owners describing their slaves, as I assume it does for many. At the end of the day I suppose it’s up to the people who the term describes to decide what is or isn’t an offensive way to define them. If black people feel less offended by “people of color” it’s no skin off my ass to use that term and acknowledge their right to decide what is an acceptable way to be defined. It’s really not that difficult to keep up with evolving semantics and to be respectful, unless of course you feel you have the God-given right to use a term that is going to make another human feel like shit.
shareWhen enough people become comfortable with the term "people of color" then it will change again.
shareWhen you say "cross dressers" you're conflating transvestites with drag queen, since they're both men who identify as men. But transvestites and drag queens are very different.
Thank you and the reason I posted this parody is to explain the differences to people, which you have done quite clearly.
shareAlso.....
Here we have it. A straight person trying to tell me about my own community.
Well then come out of the closet, sweetheart.
Kukuzu's post affirms everything I've been trying to tell you.
I am out of the closet, ass. I have been for years.
What are you fucking to tell me?
The only thing that I have contradicted is that it's not always straight men, and it's not always sexual. Oooohhhhhhh.
Okay, you're out. Sorry.
But this is what I've been saying (from kukuxu's list above):
Drag Queens are usually gay people who dress as women as an artistic performance they enjoy, but have no gender issues at all.
Transvestites are usually straight people, often narcissist/exhibitionist, with a sexual fetish that can drive them to transition.
Yeah, and I am free to make a point myself. I made the point, you say you don't care, great. FUCKING DROP IT THEN.
shareRoe V Wade reversed
posted 3 hours ago by CowherPower4Ever (91)
48 replies | jump to latest
Now a state issue.
[–] OvertonPendulum (3405) a few seconds ago
Let's just pray gay marriage and affirmative action are next :)
I don't know if overtonpendulum and Onanthebarbarian are the same people different socks, but Onan is the one who said
[–] OnanTheBarbarian (1683) a month agoshare
If it's to that point, you're talking about an abusive relationship. If they keep doing it, over and over, I would suspect they are violent in other ways. That's a whole other issue. That's domestic violence. You call the police.
But if we're just talking about one time in a sex act, when it starts out consensual, and in the heat of passion one partner is thinking "oh just let me finish". And lets be honest, moans and "no's" during sex are often signs that the "protesting" partner enjoys it. My thinking here is if the man finishes he may have been inconsiderate. But I can't see it as rape. That's an issue for the couple to resolve as a couple, without calling in the gendarmes.
YOU SEEM TO BE A TROLL... STRAIGHT TOO.
share“ Once my older sister informed me that a homosexual was a man who dressed in women's clothes. I was aghast. I knew I was gay and I knew I was quite happy to be male and act like a man. This is an issue.”
Well you didn’t have a very strong sense of your own identity or the common sense to understand that only some gay men like to perform in drag, did you? I myself never felt any inclination to dress in women’s clothing or confusion about my gender. It wasn’t at all difficult for me to understand the difference between drag performance and gender confusion. For the record all the drag queens I’ve ever known are not confused either. They are acutely aware of the difference between performance and the condition of feeling you were born in the wrong body.
I was 10 years old, oh self-appointed spokesman for the community.
I had no clue what was a homosexual. I had heard the word occasionally and somehow knew it applied to me. I was sexually attracted to boys but had no idea what that was called. I just knew I had to keep it secret. I didn't need to hear straight fools tell me that all gay men dress in women's clothes. Even on this forum I've seen straight fools insist that all gay men like to dress in drag.
So what 10-year-old gay child knows anything about this stuff?
Did you when you were 10-years-old? I doubt it.
No, the only drag performer I knew about when I was 10 was Dame Edna Everage.
And I didn’t know who I was attracted to at 10, I honestly don’t think I was attracted to either sex, I just played out the girlfriend/boyfriend thing that most pre-adolescents do.
Of course, coming to terms with your sexuality is not easy for any gay kid. I would assume that coming to terms with gender dysphoria is just as hard, if not more difficult. My question to you is how do you think discussions like this promote more understanding and empathy rather than less division. You’re just surreptitiously laying the boot in to trans people like prejudiced straight people have been doing to us for years. Gay and trans is not the same thing, anyone with a brain knows this, but we both share the experience of being outsiders.
And I’m not speaking for anyone but myself, thanks very much.
I'm not trying to disparage trans people here. But you did get rather insulting. I'm trying to use this thread to discuss the differences with straight people.
From what I read here many of them are very confused, just as my sister was when I was a kid and she told me a homosexual was a man who wanted to be a woman.
I DO NOT BELIEVE YOU ARE GAY AND I DO NOT BELIEVE YOU ARE VERY LIKABLE EITHER.
shareYou could be right, but I would be surprised if the current transgender mania is confusing transvestites.
shareWell my understanding is that transvestites are just heterosexual males who get a sexual thrill from dressing in women clothes, especially their panties. But drag queens are always gay men who dress in women's clothes for show.
share“drag queens are always gay men who dress in women's clothes for show”.
This is not true globally. In the UK there is a long tradition of Drag Queens being entertainers; a bit of stand up, singing, dancing, Caberet if you like. Often played by straight men.
Did not know that. Still, I don't see either being confused by the prominence of so-called transgenderism.
shareTransvestite = Crossdresser, regularly. Not necessarily men. Not necessarily for sexual thrill.
Drag queen = Male crossdresser who crossdresses specifically for entertainment. Not necessarily gay. Not necessarily a transvestite. I don't think the modern trans movement is confusing anyone who performs as a drag queen, but it's certainly possible.
You’re as bad as the trolls who start these bullshit threads that only cause division. You say you’re tired of heterosexuals speaking for you, I’d like it noted you DEFINITELY don’t speak for me.
shareAnd you don't speak for me or all gay people. You're the clone whose voice is always heard. I'm giving the alternative which is drowned out by the chorus.
shareI’m a clone because I don’t believe what you’re saying is true and that this thread is only going to get the usual suspects to spout more prejudiced bullshit?
I think you need to back up bitch.
I'm not trying to silence you, bitch. Don't dare try and silence me.
shareI’m disagreeing with you and questioning your motives, that’s not the same thing as silencing you. You honestly think you’re challenging the views of people like Ticketsplease? I think you’re just providing more fuel for his fire.
shareQuite honestly, it's a legitimate topic. Ticketsplease only provided me with a chance to do a parody which addressed the issue I want to discuss. Everyone has seen drag performers, RuPaul, et al.
I want everyone to understand the difference between drag and trans. I also think there are children confused that their homosexuality might make them trans.
Bro, my topic is coming from a genuine place.
It's not about them thinking they're women. They just like dressing up that way, that's all.
shareAppaprently there's a bit of a feud between transgender women and drag queens, the transgender women are on the attack and saying drag is "offensive".
Some of us suspect that they hate the fact that sometimes a man in a dress... is just a man in a dress.
I don't dislike either drag queens or trans people. The only issue I have is when people say trans women are real women and trans men are real men. That's when I draw the line.
shareI support anyone's right to live their life the way they want to live, as long as they're not hurting anyone.
However, biological sex can't be changed, only disguised. It's one of those things that doesn't go away just because you don't like it.
I agree 100%. I actually don't see why there are people who are against gay marriage or trans people getting married. I mean, who cares? I think claiming trans women are real women is entering dangerous waters (ie use of bathrooms, competing in sports)
shareI see why hate anyone LGBT and want to deny them real life - they're assholes! Petty, small-minded, cruel, hypocritical assholes.
And agree that the Trans Activists want things that aren't good ideas, such putting biologically male transwomen in women's prisons, and starting medical transitions on minors. Don't get me started on the latter.
The confusion probably stems from the use of "trans" to denote "trangender" while there are also the same "trans" in "transexual" and "transvestites."
People should just spell out the whole word to reduce confusions. Stop using "trans." Always use the word "transgender" to say "transgender," and use the complete form for all other "trans-" words, including but not limited to "transexual," "transvestite," "transport," "transfer," "transition," "transmigration," "transparent," "transducer," "transaction," "transnational," "transformers," etc.
The other problem is that now the politically correct term for "transvestite" is cross dresser. But drag queens also cross dress but are not transvestites.
But also transgender is such a long word. And trannie is a fun word because my car has a trannie too.
It's fine. Drag queens are not actually queens. White people are not actually white. That's how language works.
"Transgender" is not a long word. It's shorter than "Drag queens." Yet I don't see you complaining on typing "drag queens" multiple times in your posts.
Lets not confuse Drag Queens with Cross dressers either, a different kettle of fish altogether.
shareWow. I feel sorry for you, Onan. You probably didn't even know that you were a troll.
Oh wait ... is everyone a troll now? Maybe I'm getting too old to keep up.
Troll!
shareTROLLS ARE COOL!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLfva0HQsN4
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shareI just love how the divide and conquer thing has reached the LGBTIQxyz community. As if they weren't divided enough already.
shareI agree with you there. This endless division and the jumbled alphabet soup is not a positive.
As a queer man I really take offense when sexual dysfunctions like asexuality are equated with my right to love my partner. They are actually adding an 'A' now!
In Australia there is an "I" for Intersex and I think the "A" now as well!
Pretty soon they will start adding kinks whether they are homosexual related or not. And doesn't the "B" for Bisexual in LGBTIQ imply there are only two genders which in turn renders the "Intersex" and "Transsexual" redundant?
When you make something about everything than it loses it's meaning and purpose. Although I get that all they want is as large a group as possible for political lobbying reasons.
Good point. Since the fools now insist there are 100 genders, what does that do to bisexuality, make them cissexist* pigs?
*Sorry if you're not familiar with "cissexuals". That's what they call us 99.7% of the population who know which sex we are.
But I think they have an out for that. They've invented a term "pansexual" which means you'll fuck anything regardless of gender. Lol.
But yeah, if bisexuals only like males and females, what about the other 98 genders?
I've said it before on this thread. But I believe the leadership of the LGBTQIA+ movement needs to step aside and let some more responsible folks take over.
I like to say that Pansexual is an attraction to frying pans. I like hearing it being said in a Rodney Dangerfield or Don Rickles manner.
It also seems to me that the Alphabet leaders like the image that all Alphabet people are Left wing when in fact there are conservatives and shock horror, even religious Alphabets out there.
I just see it as such a stupid war, in line with the battle of the sexes. In the end if society crumbled or was taken over by a nation that is not caring for the Alphabet types than the Alphabets are going to be looking to us Straight folk for support and we will be reminding them of how much division and bullshit they brought us.
There are just bigger things in the world than who you prefer to fuck is what I am saying.
Do you know the words homosexual and heterosexual were only invented in the 19th century? Before that people were just people, not defined by a sex act.
Yeah, sex is an act, not an identity.
That being said, as long as there are Christian wackos out there trying to take away our rights, we need to be vigilante and organized.
But we need an all encompassing term. Many of us prefer just the word "queer" to describe folks who are not your average straight folks. That works for me.
The alphabet soup has to go!
I didn't know that about the words homo and heterosexual.
I agree, there is too much emphasis on Identity now, "I'm a Vegan/Homosexual/Drinker/Non Drinker" whatever. Same with all the people who still use the nationality of their former nation or ancestral nation "I'm African Australian/Italian Australian" whatever the fuck. Decide where you want to live and embrace the place.
There was an article in the paper recently from an African woman who was complaining about how she is having trouble dating in Australia and she claims it's because she's black. Umm yeah, so it's not that she preaches her Woke politics or isn't that attractive or is combative etc
It's because she's black and men don't approach her..
Ummm... what happened to independent strong women, why is she waiting for them to approach her?
I have broadened the discussion a bit but the point is like what you are making, people seize one aspect of their personality and make it their identity. "Movie Go'er" Great... but is that all you do? Watch movies?