MovieChat Forums > Leviathan (2015) Discussion > Is the Russian system really this corrup...

Is the Russian system really this corrupt?


It's a film, yes, so it may be prone to exaggeration, but how truthful is its portrayal of corruption within Russia? Are mayors basically local mafia bosses? Is the Russian Orthodox Church another facet of this corruption? I enjoyed the movie but at times it seemed completely unrealistic considering Russia is a developed nation.

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its same as everywhere so as in USA as well, its just that in russia even simple man can have access to the corruption while in USA its reserved for the highest profile players , no country in the world is so professionally corrupted as USA

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It`s a Movie. With it`s themes. Not a Documentary.

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Yes, it is.

Local mayors are mostly focused on how to spend 50% of the budget on the city itself and to cash out another 50% for themselves,
also to create (or assist in creating) monopolies and local contraction, service works and trading.

Only official statistics of criminal cases against mayors includes dozens of them
(https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A1%D0%BF%D0%B8%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%BA_%D1%87%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%B8_%C2%AB%D0%95%D0%B4%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%8F_%D0%A0%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%8F%C2%BB_%E2%80%94_%D1%84%D0%B8%D0%B3%D1%83%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2_%D1%83%D0%B3%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BD%D1%8B%D1%85_%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BB - sorry, I can give only links to russian articles right now),
but many more ain`t investigated since its virtually one gang.

"One gang" is not abstract, over 70 of 86 russian regions are ruled by governors - members of the "United Russia" party (https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%94%D0%B5%D0%B9%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B2%D1%83%D1%8E%D1%89%D0%B8%D0%B5_%D0%B3%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%B2%D1%8B_%D1%81%D1%83%D0%B1%D1%8A%D0%B5%D0%BA%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2_%D0%A0%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B9%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B9_%D0%A4%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%86%D0%B8%D0%B8).

Meanwhile, by Russian laws greated by Putin, the governors are assigned by the president (=Putin), and city mayors in almost all towns are also not elected but assigned by local city council (also dominated by United Russia, always elected under control of the United Russia`s governor), or the governor himself.

And Putin, the head of Russia, was an FSB chief, and also the head of the United Russia party (2008-2011), while before and after it was headed by Boris Gryzlov, ex-minister of Internal Affairs (MVD, https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Грызлов,_Борис_Вячеславович), and obviously the current heads of FSB and MVD are assigned by Putin, the head of United Russia party, which in turn assigns all the governors and mayors...


Speaking about the Church in Russia, it`ll give just two examples about the head of the Church, patriarch Kirill Gundyaev.

1) He owns a huge 144-meter (1500 sq ft) apartment right in front of the Kremlin, which by itself isn`t alowed by the Church. Still, in late 2011 he tried to TAKE another flat of his wall neighbour, a cardiac surgion. He claimed that the neighbour performed some contraction works which resulted in extensive "nanodust" in his flat.
He got court decision confirming that the neighbour now owns him 20 mln rubles (almost $1 million) as a compensation for "cleaning the flat and his library", got the neighbour`s flat and bank accounts arrested, and the neighbour wouldn`t find the money to pay, his flat would be sold out.
The neighbor has paid out, appealed, but got all his appeals rejected, and went to european human right court
(https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A1%D0%BA%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B4%D0%B0%D0%BB_%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%BA%D1%80%D1%83%D0%B3_%D0%BA%D0%B2%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%82%D0%B8%D1%80%D1%8B_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%85%D0%B0_%D0%9A%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%BB%D0%B0#.D0.A1.D1.83.D0.B4.D0.B5.D0.B1.D0.BD.D1.8B.D0.B5_.D1.80.D0.B5.D1.88.D0.B5.D0.BD.D0.B8.D1.8F)

2) Also there was a funny story that first Kirill-the-patriarch was accused of owning expensive watch (like $30+K Breguet). He denied, but then there was a photo of a meeting with those watch on his wrist. Then he was accused again, and the photo was replaced with photoshoped one with no watch on his wrist, but...with them still seen in the reflection of the table:) http://news.bigmir.net/ukraine/686771-Oligarhi-v-rjasah--TOP--roskoshnyh--skandalov-iz-cerkvi

So yes, Russian Church chiefs are just as rich and influential as top gov officials.

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and no, Russia is not developed at all.

The salaries are still low (now just $500/month http://person-agency.ru/salary.html)

The prices are high: the cars have been almost twice as expensive compared to the US (might become cheaper now),
interest rates are very high (20+%, sometimes upto 80% against 3-4% average in the US - http://www.sravni.ru/novost/2014/10/27/srednjaja-stavka-po-kreditam-v-top-30-bankakh-sostavila-2287/, http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/consumer-interest-rates/),

and the roads, thanks to curruption, are the most expensive to build in the world
http://rbth.com/articles/2010/10/20/what_drives_russias_astronomical_road_costs05041.html

The average salary of a doctor is just about $350 ( http://zpmedika.ru/ ), about twice as high for a cardiac surgeon ($700/month now http://www.trud.com/salary/692/3905.html), though it can be 3 times higher in major cities. Still uncomparable to US doctor`s salaries (over $10,000/month http://www1.salary.com/Surgeon-Salary.html).

And average pention in Russia is just about $200, about 10 times less than in the US
http://ruxpert.ru/%D0%9F%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B8_%D0%B2_%D0%A0%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B8

And as a characterictic of development of markets and private business, one can mention that over 50% of oil companies and banks in Russia belong to government, plus 70% of transport services - http://www.vedomosti.ru/politics/news/5739621/esche_odin_byudzhet. And in 2013 alone the number of small business has decreased by almost 20% (http://www.vestifinance.ru/articles/38459, and that is official government stats)

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Thanks to alex-cardo and the guy below. Brave & nicely researched posts. Very useful links.

I had lots to do with Russians (in east Europe) while with the development arm of the UN at the (actually exciting) tail end of glasnot & perestroika.

Still many good guys, it seems, wondering how to turn this around. Any obvious ways?

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It is that corrupt. To the point that "compensation" part is a positive exaggeration. Mayors may not be local mob bosses, but they most certainly represent them quite well.

It has gotten worse now... because in the 90-ies your bribe was directed at getting over bumps, inaccuracies and getting things done faster; while now it got to the point that you have to give a bribe to get anything done.

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If anyone doubts the depths to which Russia has sunk, I urge you to watch a recent episode of the PBS show Frontline. Putin's Way details how the former KGB, er, operative, came to be elevated to replace Boris Yeltsin. And why he insists on remaining "president". Hint: might have something to do with avoiding prison himself.

I have seen enough to know I have seen too much. -- ALOTO

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The legal system: Well, consider the Magnitsky case. They tortured the man to death for uncovering corruption, then put him on trial AFTER he was dead. And convicted him, of course, but that goes without saying. You tell me.

The Church: Steeped in medieval ethos and authoritarianism, the Russian Orthodox Church has grown extremely powerful in the last decade or so, as well as deeply enmeshed with the State. Russian priests live ostentatiously and enjoy endless perks from those in power.

Local authorities: Yes and no. I am sure there are some mayors and other local officials who are actually well-meaning and relatively honest. But the Russian system is so thoroughly corrupt, that you simply cannot participate in the power process without getting at least somewhat dirty. That would involve, at the very least, doing some favors at the expense of the vulnerable and abusing the power of law enforcement. I would say yes, all Russian public officials are corrupt to some degree, though how much, that varies widely from individual to individual.

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I think both America & Russia are equally corrupt just that in America it's covered up a ton better whereas in Russia it's blatant. I mean, they don't try to hide it as much. As well in Russia they'll go more extreme with murder whereas in America it's enough to financially cripple and discredit enemies of politicians.

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