MovieChat Forums > Saving Private Ryan (1998) Discussion > Upham was a traitor then?

Upham was a traitor then?

posted 3 years ago by Rolltide (964)
7 replies | jump to latest

I'm irritated by the roles assigned to the soldiers in this film. I do not care what your job is this is a real war and every man, every man should carry a gun! You should know how to use that gun and be willing to use it against the enemy.

It irks me that we have the contentious objector medic in Wade who does not have a gun but charges up a hill toward a MG nest. Then we have Upham sans helmet not carrying a gun much of the time.

No matter how you explain it to stand there and not help a brother in arms fighting for his life is being a traitor! Not being willing to fight the enemy is being a traitor.

Reiben was right when he said that Steamboat Willie would just get picked up by the German Wehrmacht and get the opportunity to kill allies again. He sure did. Not sure why Upham suddenly changed his tune about executing Steamboat Willie but that does not make up for the fact he stood and did nothing while his buddies were being killed.

[–] Roguemail (1614) 3 years ago

If you don't know the reason why Upham was reluctant to kill, them you were either asleep or drunk when you watched this movie.

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

Ok genius explain it then.

[–] Ranb (9597) 3 years ago

Upham said he had not fired his rifle since basic training. The captain only had him with because he spoke French and German; he made it clear early on that proficiency with a rifle was 2nd.

Treason is defined by federal law; Upham was not a traitor by as defined.

The Upham character was intended to represent what any barely trained soldier might do in that horrific circumstances. He obviously did not fight very well.

[–] TearofLys (2641) 3 years ago

But Upham had a character arc. By the end, he singlehandedly got a group of german soldiers to surrender and he unhesitatingly killed Steamboat Willie for his betrayal after he was recaptured.

[–] Karl Aksel (1487) 3 years ago

A traitor is someone who betrays his country, ie. who actively helps the enemy. There is no way you're going to make that label stick. Conscientious objectors (not "contentious") have been accused of many things, mainly of cowardice, or desertion at worst, but never of treason. And medics at the time weren't allowed to fight, except in self-defence. They wore clear markings on their field uniform to make it clear it was illegal to target them, and the trade-off was that they weren't allowed to target anyone in return. As per the Geneva Conventions.

As for Upham, while he would have been allowed to participate in fighting, that's not what he was there for. He was there as a cartographer and a translator - he was useful in a non-combat capacity, which meant he ought to be kept away from the fighting as much as possible.

Not sure why Upham suddenly changed his tune about executing Steamboat Willie

Because he had broken his promise to Upham. Upham had gone out of his way to save his life, and Steamboat Willie returned the favour by returning to the fighting, killing Upham's comrades.

but that does not make up for the fact he stood and did nothing while his buddies were being killed.

That's called fear. If you haven't been in that exact situation, you're in no position to judge.

[–] Rolltide (964) 3 years ago

We have executed men before for desertion. Whatever you call it standing and doing nothing while your comrade dies is wrong and should be punished.

If everybody was like Upham we would not have a country.

[–] [deleted] 3 years ago

Saving Private Ryan is a pro-war profiteering movie. Upham represents americans who do not want to fight in any war but americans have all the advanced military equipment. This is represented in the scene where upham is given much of the ammunition and he has to carry it around and give it to the US soldiers who need it.