MovieChat Forums > Greenleaf (2016) Discussion > Again with the biracials portraying full...

Again with the biracials portraying full black people?

posted 8 years ago by gaatka
42 replies | jump to latest

I just watched the first episode and the whole time I'm wondering is Grace the mother's daughter and not the father's... but then I see the dynamic between her and the father and I'm like okay... so maybe she's the father's daughter and not the mother's because clearly she's biracial. Towards the end of the episode I sadly realized that there probably is no backstory (someone please correct me if I'm wrong!!) and they just have this half-black half-asian woman portraying a racially black character.

This type of casting with biracial black people filling in for American black people (black people with, on average, about 80% African ancestry and 20% European ancestry) is confusing, annoying, and offensive. Merle Dandridge couldn't portray an Asian woman, but they're still going by the racist one drop rule to allow someone who looks like she has less than 50% African ancestry to portray a black women who's supposed to have about 80% African ancestry. She may be "black" ethnically, but she isn't black racially. She's biracial, and she looks it.

One incident is excusable but when it happens over and over again it's a problem. It's not good for black people's self esteem. Just the other day Simon Biles said she wanted Zendaya to portray her in a biopic - ZENDAYA.
Not Quvenzhane Wallis.
Not Keke Palmer.
Not Imani Hakim.
Not Rhyon Nicole Brown.
...I would be surprised if she even knew their names.

Look at this list of "Young Black Actors and Actresses" on imdb and look at who's at the very top of the list: Zendaya, Roshon Fegan, and Amandla Stenberg - all biracial and lighter than sand. http://www.imdb.com/list/ls055620113/

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

And please tell me they didn't do the same thing with the daughter.

[–] IceQueen22 8 years ago

Grace's daughter, Sophia is biracial on the show. There's lots of theories out there about Grace's paternity so her casting might be for story line purposes too. I don't believe she's Oprah and the Bishop's child but I think her maternal grandfather could turn out to be white. But I do find it interesting that both Merle and Lynn were handpicked by Oprah, somebody who comes across as color struck to me at times, so who knows.

Anyhow, I agree with your post above but good luck trying to open people's eyes to the threat of erasure. Until some white big whig flat out says that he or she doesn't view full blacks and a biracial person with a black parent the same then black people won't care or see the problem.

[–] riotgrrrl22 8 years ago

Why are you making a big deal about Merle Dandridge's ethic background? Merle is doing a great job playing Grace, who cares if she's half korean. It makes sense for the writers to cast an actress to resemble Lynn Whitfield since they're playing mother and daughter. The actress that plays Faith is light-skinned as well, are you going to make a big deal about that too? What's really annoying is when people like you love to start that "she isn't black enough or he isn't black enough" crap. Get a life!

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

I think I made it clear towards the bottom of my post why I'm making a big deal of her RACE (not ethnic background). Read it again or move along. Either way I'm blocking you.

[–] riotgrrrl22 8 years ago

block me for being honest?! really? if anyone needs to be blocked is you for writing such a stupid post.

[–] sleepingtiger (712) 8 years ago

gaatka:
Honestly, I'm getting tired of some people bringing up the "biracial people aren't full black" nonsense. Nobody died and gave you the authority to decide who's black enough and who's not. This is the 21st century---we need to start leaving some of that s*** behind,for real. Until recently biracial black folks were seen as black people, PERIOD. No one gave a damn what else they were mixed with. Just because biracial person dosen't fit your limited idea of what a black person should or should not look like, you claim they're not black? That's a bunch of BS and you know it. White people started this bull**** during slavery to keep us apart, and folks like you are still perpetuating it until this day. It's sickening. Who are you or anybody else to tell a biracial person they aren't black enough, just because they don't fit into your limited idea of what a black person is supposed to do or be. Enough of that s*** already, please.

[–] kinickibeck 8 years ago

Because it is not authentic realistic and plays into shadism/ white supremacy. If thats the case then they could get any non black actress to play the role of a black woman simply because she is talented.

[–] nina-oh-nina 8 years ago

she definitely is clearly mixed and looks nothing like her siblings which is why I'm tired of the "Oprah is her real mom" theory. it's very odd.

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

When I saw her alone, I didn't think about her being biracial. It was irrelevant. But when you see her interacting with and standing next to the other black people and her black so-called family members on the show, her look and temperament make it very obvious that she isn't like them... but then the show never clears it up and it's just the elephant in the room. All they have to do is just have a backstory where Lynn Whitfield had an affair with a white man and this nonsense will be cleared up.

She needs to get a tan, wear a weave, get her accent right, and then work on playing characters of different ethnicities because this woman's temperament is very... "Asian." The character is an African-American PASTOR from Memphis. She doesn't do a good job of faking it. Good actors will have you COMPLETELY fooled about their ethnicity and upbringing. These people need to step their game up.

[–] nina-oh-nina 8 years ago

I agree. as a southerner, I take issue with the fact that none of them really have southern accents but especially Gigi lol

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

Yes! This show is so crazy. I love how people from Memphis talk.

[–] Born_Tomorrow 8 years ago

Yes! This show is so crazy. I love how people from Memphis talk.

None of those people are actually from Memphis.

I woke up this way...

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

I know they aren't from Memphis. I like how Memphis people talk. I wish they attempted the accent on the show.

[–] riotgrrrl22 8 years ago

Your post is ridiculous. If you gave it another thought, you'd figure out why. But I'm here to help you.

Very few blacks born in America after 1632 are "full" black. And what the hell is a full black when most black Americans can't trace their ancestry?

THANK YOU!

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

How about you read my post first before you try to "help" me.

First, most African-Americans can't trace their "lineage", not their "ancestry." People can find out their ancestry by getting tested. Type "ancestry results" in youtube and there are tons of videos of people sharing their results.
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=ancestry+results

Now, see this part:

This type of casting with biracial black people filling in for American black people (black people with, on average, about 80% African ancestry and 20% European ancestry) is confusing, annoying, and offensive. Merle Dandridge couldn't portray an Asian woman, but they're still going by the racist one drop rule to allow someone who looks like she has less than 50% African ancestry to portray a black women who's supposed to have about 80% African ancestry. She may be "black" ethnically, but she isn't black racially. She's biracial, and she looks it.

What do you see there?

American black people (black people with, on average, about 80% African ancestry and 20% European ancestry)

In this case, I used the term "full black" to refer to African-Americans with at least 80% African ancestry since that is how much most of us have.

Now if I was talking about say West Africa, African-Americans (who on average have around 80% African ancestry) would be called "mixed blacks" and Africans with 90 - 100% African ancestry would be the "full blacks" but would be called "Africans" since they are near 100%.

Some African people don't like it when too many African-Americans are portraying their people in films for this same reason. We are more mixed than them and have a slightly different look. One instance doesn't stand out but too many instances becomes erasure and becomes a problem.

[–] 8 years ago

[deleted]

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

Ok then, so GOODBYE. Don't comment on things you know nothing about. BLOCKED.

[–] sleepingtiger (712) 8 years ago

gaatka:
Who the hell cares? Like I said nobody died and made you the authority on when a "real" black person is supposed to be like. Enough of this damn colorstruck nonsense.

[–] Born_Tomorrow 8 years ago

I've seen plenty of women that look like Grace as far as facial features, hair texture and skin color and are, as you put it "full black" so it's really not that big of a deal to me.

I woke up this way...

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

...As I put it, the way I define "full black" in this case is of having around 80% or more African ancestry. I'm sure these random women you've seen who look like Grace didn't mail you their African ancestry results so how exactly are you claiming that those women are "full black" according to my definition?

Are you referring to their ethnicity or their race? Because someone can ethnically be 100% black but be biracial. For example everyone thinks of Vanessa Williams as being full black but she's not. She's biracial. Ethnically her parents are both black and she's black, but she's 56% African and 44% European. That's why she looks like the way she does.

...Anyway this particular issue doesn't really have to be "that big of deal" to you, especially if you look like Merle Dandridge or Vanessa Williams.

This post is more so directed at people who are concerned with erasure - ie black people with around 80% + African ancestry... Or people who have loved ones or people they care about who have strong African ancestry. Those are the people who I would expect to see this as a "big deal."

But thank you for your input though.

[–] 8 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Born_Tomorrow 8 years ago

I'm sure these random women you've seen who look like Grace didn't mail you their African ancestry results so how exactly are you claiming that those women are "full black" according to my definition?

You could be asked the same thing. Did all of these women that you assume are biracial mail you their European DNA results?

Like I've stated, I know a few people that have similar features to the actress that plays Grace and both of their parents are black or what you would assume is "full black" according to your logic. I also know of several biracial women and men that look to be "full black". Although it's not very common, there's also a possibility that a person could have both white parents and several generations of white ancestors but develop features from a distanct black ancestor who may have lived hundreds of years before. Gens are funny that way. You never know which ancestor's features you could develop or have from birth, even if that ancestor lived several generations ago.

I woke up this way...

[–] 8 years ago

[deleted]

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

...No actually I can't be asked the same thing... Because there are people who post their ancestry results online and I did my research before I spoke whereas you claimed to know something you don't.

...I also know that biracial people can look "full black" (or at least higher up in the percentages). Tia, Tamera, and Tahj Mowry are a good example. They're 45% African but look more African than Vanessa Williams
However I don't know any "full black" people who look biracial (like an even mix of two races). I know "full black" people with very light skin color AND/OR light eyes that get passed down, but any black person I've known with straight or loose textured hair gets it from one or both of their parents and it's the same thing with facial structure. Facial structure stands out the most. I've never met a "full black" person with a facial structure like Merle Dandridge's. She really does look Japanese. Either way it's rare for people to come out with racial features drastically different from their parents. Lynn Whitfield's character clearly doesn't have any Asian ancestry so where is Grace getting it from?

...If they LOOK "full black," obviously there isn't a problem with them representing a "full black" person on screen. - I said it in another post that Merle Dandridge needs to get a tan and wear a weave or wig that mimics the texture of pressed/relaxed type 3 or type 4 hair. Wentworth Miller looks white and he plays white people on screen... But he keeps his hair shaved down. If he let his hair grow out, white people wouldn't be jumping through hoops talking about dna and genetics and how it's possible for two white people to have a white baby with kinky hair. It doesn't happen often enough for that to be a regular thing on television and in movies. It's not the norm and people can't relate to it.

If anything white people should be the ones changing what it means to be racially white. They're in a position to do so as they are represented diversely on screen. But instead everywhere you look they change the image of black people into that of biracial people when biracial people and "full black" people have a completely different experience in the United States. How can these people be storytellers and artists and not understand how doing something like this drastically changes the story they're trying to tell?

AGAIN, this is about people redefining the IMAGE of black people and how that can lead to ERASURE (and confusion) and negatively impact the self-esteem of black people and in particular negatively impact the self esteem of younger black children. That is my concern.

[–] Born_Tomorrow 8 years ago

It's funny how you claim to know things that are really just assumptions that you've pulled out of your ass. You have the nerve to say that I'm claiming to know something that I don't but the truth is, that is exactly what you're doing. You have no proof to support your claim because there is no proof that exist that says that a "full black" American person cannot develop feature from a white ancestor that lived several generations ago. In fact, there is plenty of proof that supports the opposite so please sit yo ass down somewhere because you sound dumb.

I woke up this way...

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

Claim to know? Pulled out my ass? Girl dna testing and ancestry testing isn't some made up thing... Are you confused?

Ima block your dumb ass after this because after reading this I really think you're just looking to pick fights and I don't have the time for it. You want to prove a point and convince people, do your research and post facts instead of talking out your ass. Otherwise say your piece and move the hell on.

[–] Born_Tomorrow 8 years ago

So that's your thing, huh? What am I...the second or third poster from this discussion that you've threatened to block for disagreeing with you? This seems to be a trend with you? Do you always go around making ignorant ass comments that you have no way of backing up and when someone disagrees, threaten to block them? Well, go ahead and knock yourself out. I'm sure I'll live, along with the other posters that you've threatened to ignore.

I woke up this way...

[–] Born_Tomorrow 8 years ago

Prime example to prove my point. Bianca Lawson's father is not even light skin and her mother is the niece of Berry Gordy, however, Bianca looks biracial. In fact, she has played a biracial character in at least one movie.

Another is Quincy Brown/Combs. His father, Al B. Sure is black, as well as his mother and father. Quincy's mother is also black, with dark skin. All of her other kids look, as you put it, "full black". However, most people would look at Quincy and assume he's biracial.

I woke up this way...

[–] redd4576 8 years ago

I had no idea Merle was half Asian (she doesn't look it to me) until I looked up her profile. I was shocked. I still don't really see it

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

Have you been around Asian people a lot? I had a few Asian friends as a child and also in college. It's in her way of being in addition to her features. It's just like the woman who plays Charley in Queen Sugar. I can tell they're Asian by their way of being. It's a way about them that is unique to Asian people. I could also tell that their mothers were the Asian ones because most of the time a biracial person will take after the parent of the same gender. If their mothers were black, they would both come off more like black women than biracials. Think about Jesse Williams, Tia and Tamera, Jordin Sparks, for example and you might see it.

[–] redd4576 8 years ago

No I haven't been around a lot of Asian people actually. I can see it a little in "Charley" on Queen Sugar though. Yeah some people can and can't tell! LOL!!

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] 8 years ago

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[–] kateybear 8 years ago

Thank you for this thread. I kept thinking something was "off" about GiGi. I am in no way race obsessed but I kept thinking are they applying makeup to make her look like that because its off putting if she's supposed to be black why are they making her up to look like that. She's like an Omarossa/late Michael Jackson mixture. I thought maybe she had a skin condition or a bad nose job. I just kept thinking why does she look like that. I know black siblings with the same parents can all look different but GiGi is a stretch.

[–] riotgrrrl22 8 years ago

Are you for real? "Bad nose job? Omarossa/late Michael Jackson mixture??" What the hell?! Just as i thought this thread was going to end with a poster who actually knows what they are talking about, here comes another person complaining about how Grace or should i say how the actress looks. It seems like some of you have a problem with how Merle Dandridge looks and that's sad. If i was Merle i would be very offended and had this thread removed because this full black/racial/ancestry crap has nothing to do with the show. I bet if Gabrielle Union or Taraji P. Henson was playing Grace, this wouldn't be a topic.

[–] gaatka 8 years ago

I definitely see the Omarossa/Michael Jackson resemblance.

Most of the black people I know and see don't look biracial and aren't biracial so it's really offensive and frustrating to see people who don't look like the vast majority of us representing us so-called "black people" on the big screen.

If they want to tell a story about a biracial person, they can. This is not a story about a biracial black woman with a Japanese/Korean parent. I don't even think such a person would be in Grace Greenleaf's position in real life. A woman pastor from a prominent church family in Memphis? It just doesn't make any sense.

"100 most beautiful black women": Most of the women on this list are biracial and - the women who are so-called "full black" - seems like most of their pictures are lightened.
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls008402206/

[–] sleepingtiger (712) 8 years ago

gaatka:

Oh,wow. I guess I'll just have to tell my biracial black sister--who's light-skinned but looks more black--that she's not "black enough" to act black, because she dosen't fit your limited definition of what a "full-black person" looks like. The funny thing is, you have some full black people who are mixed, but you can't always tell. Like,for example, GET OUT director Jordan Peele is biracial, and I never would have guessed because he dosen't look like he's mixed at all. Black people are just as diverse in their looks and heritage---we don't all look ONE way, or even exactly the same.