Worst to First: Ranking the Alien movies - Alien: Covenant (2017) Discussion

[–] crc32 (2584) 7 years ago

Worst to first(AVP movies are so bad I didn't include them in my list)

Alien Resurection
Promethous
Alien Covenant
Alien 3
Aliens
Alien

Keep in mind that Alien Covenant is significantly better then promethous

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[–] NotASpeckOfCereal (302) 7 years ago

Keep in mind that Alien Covenant is significantly better then promethous

I feel exactly the opposite.

5) Alien Resurrection
4) Alien 3

Everything above was not much of a building on the story, in fact none at all -- just more Ripley vs Xenomorphs horror, at it again for another box-office Kaching (though still loads better AvP films).

3) Alien Covenant
2) Prometheus
1) Alien | Aliens (tie for first place)

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[–] MovieManCin2 (26342) 7 years ago

I think you nailed it, crc.

😎

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

Resurection
Aliens
Covenant
Alien 3
Prometheus
Alien

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[–] FordFairlane (299) 7 years ago

Thats a troll if ever there was one.

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

How would you rank them differently?

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[–] crc32 (2584) 7 years ago

We just find it suspect that you ranked Aliens 2nd worst. With prometheus comming in 2nd best.

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

Aliens is a glorified family action movie... Prometheus elevates the series philosophically and like most good art leaves us with more interesting questions than answers...

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

Prometheus elevates the series philosophically and like most good art leaves us with more interesting questions than answers...

Such as?

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

As to questions raised by Prometheus:

- Why did the so-called engineers seed life on earth? Did they seek to destory humans? How does the creator relate to his creation? Do they consider humans the same way humans as consider androids like David? Are humans created in their image?
- Will we create our own distruction in the form of A.I.? How will we relate to an A.I. and it to us?
- What is that black goo? Is it a pathogen, a weapon or something else?
- What will come of shaw and david? Is david a risk to her or an aid? What purpose will David serve now that his master is gone?

All of this is besides the various themes and allegories relating to faith, creation and such... even allutions to frankenstien, to mans fall from heavan, e.g. miltons paradise, etc... even icarus applies..

Its still just a trashy sci-fi movie about descovering new life, but is elevated by these elements and expands the story of series in a huge way...

Why do you guys like Aliens so much? It's basically cameron's first try at avatar... GI Joe family in space...

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

"- Why did the so-called engineers seed life on earth? Did they seek to destory humans? How does the creator relate to his creation? Do they consider humans the same way humans as consider androids like David? Are humans created in their image?"

Not any questions worth considering as they are all MacGuffins to get the story moving along. Outside of the context of this movie they are all meaningless.

"- Will we create our own distruction in the form of A.I.? How will we relate to an A.I. and it to us?"

A reasonable question explored much better in almost every respect by other movies dealing with this concept.

"- What is that black goo? Is it a pathogen, a weapon or something else?"

See my first rebuttal and apply it here also.

"- What will come of shaw and david? Is david a risk to her or an aid? What purpose will David serve now that his master is gone?"

Again, see my first rebuttal.

In short your questions are - what will AI be like?

Already answered, and reanswered, in Alien and Aliens (And countless other movies before and since).

"All of this is besides the various themes and allegories relating to faith, creation and such... even allutions to frankenstien, to mans fall from heavan, e.g. miltons paradise, etc... even icarus applies.."

Details please or I could easily apply the emperor's clothing here as an analogy that you are seeing something here which isn't there.

"Its still just a trashy sci-fi movie about descovering new life, but is elevated by these elements and expands the story of series in a huge way..."

I agree it's a trashy sci-fi movie but I certainly wouldn't say it elevated anything - at all. if anything it harmed Scott's prior works by association.

"Why do you guys like Aliens so much? It's basically cameron's first try at avatar... GI Joe family in space..."

Why don't you? Avatar is childish rubbish in the same vein as Prometheus.

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

Avatar is so similar to Aliens its shocking... it's nothing like Prometheus

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

Please, elaborate :)

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

;)

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

Thanks for playing ;)

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[–] FordFairlane (299) 7 years ago

As I said, troll if there ever was one.

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[–] crc32 (2584) 7 years ago

Aliens was still a horror filmIt may have taken away the sense of danger the previous film had as the marines were not totally defenseless. But I still think it edged out Alien 3 entertainment wise. Alien 3 of course is a better horror film.

But the whole Enineers equal "our perception of God" was a really simple concept that got way too much screen time. It was pretty shallow philosophically speaking. I'm not sure why people thought these simple concepts where thought provoking. We should all be formiliar with ancient astronaughts by this point.

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[–] BrutaleBent (99) 7 years ago

Guessed you like Lost too...

"Random questions" != art. Either you present something, and walk the line, or you don't at all. It's a tease, with an otherwise stupid ass plot.

Only good stuff is David and Shaw.

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

No. Lost is mediocre, lacks coherence and clearly they were just making it up as it went on. The first season was ok (for TV), but i stopped watching during the second.

The questions in prometheus are not random at all... apart from being themes that have entertained man since classic literature and earlier, they also give context to the charcters behaviour and, in some cases, allow us to consider what they mean in our own lives...

If you're upset that [spoiler]shaw didnt make it [/spoiler], it might help you to consider that it shows us the indifference of the universe to our (her) need for answers and our (her) desires...

It's common in art that is made for an adult audience not to tie everything up in a nice little bow... to leave some loose ends, for the viewer to being their own interpretation to what the author/artist (i.e. the director) has presented.. this is what i mean when i say that ridley had elevated the series with Prometheus... he introduced classic sci-fi elements as well... Aliens had taken the series into the action hero movie realm... Prometheus is more compelling

Also, guess what? At some point Ridley will kill off David's character... So dont get too attached!

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[–] BrutaleBent (99) 7 years ago

First Alien movie was good; mystery, alien, horror, memorable characters/scenes. A well thought out horror flick, that introduced us to some of the Xenomorph and somwhat it's biology. Plus, stupidity is minimized and you don't hate most characters.

Second Aliens, great action/semi horror movie. A very solid movie alround, and iconic too. Solid characters, memorable moments/quiotes, nicely paced interesting story and even more in depth insight into the Xenomorphs. Plus, again, stupidity is minimized and you don't hate most characters.

Fast forward to present movies... Which you so claim to be elevated to... "art" (disgust). I call it being lazy, there's nothing much to interpret. Take "Nocturnal Animals", that's what I could be forced into calling art, at best (if having to interpret makes it art, that is) - as it takes some interpretation to get satisfaction from that movie.

No amount of "interpretation" will give any kind of satisfaction/closure/explanation. So no, Prometheus elevates jack shit. No art. Just empty unanswered premise, that's left in limbo, in line with lost, and not really open for interpretation, unless you like to grasp for straws.

Prometheus and Alien: Covenant, are shallow, shitty, PiS filled, idiotic, lazy movies, that tries to ride on the first two movies success. Both could have been great, both became shit - Ridley Scott can't tell good scripts from the bad anymore.

At this point, I'd rather James Cameron completely took over and turned this franchise into something watchable and cohesive again.

PS. "If you're upset that shaw didnt make it , it might help you to consider that it shows us the indifference of the universe to our (her) need for answers and our (her) desires...", this whole sentence oozes of wanting to impose meaning/purpose where there is none, funnily very "un-nihilistic", opposed to the sentence/point itself...

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

Interesting how we differ so much on these two films, Aliens and Prometheus...

I think Aliens answers too many questions... it explains away the horror of the alien and turns it into a basic bug species (big ants) to be cannon fodder to the oiled up GI Joe "likeable" action heroes... they even have a queen, haha...

And then, to add insult to injury, cameron gave ripley a daughter and army husband in the end, a happy family... everything tied up in a nice neat bow in the end...

I'm surprised they didnt give them a pet alien-dog as well... *eye roll*

It's simple pandering to a mass audience... instead of the first movie (and Prometheus), which was imparted with an authorial stamp, the audience gets a sense of te director's sensibility... whether they agree with his sensibility or not...

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[–] FordFairlane (299) 7 years ago

troll. You must be that terryg guy under a new name. Youre both utterly mad.

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[–] Renovatio (2990) 7 years ago

Did he like Prometheus too?

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[–] bobbynynex (1505) 7 years ago

Alien was a great horror movie, Aliens was a great war movie, Aliens 3 was just ok and so are the rest.

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[–] CraigJamesReview (1715) 7 years ago

Resurecction is pretty bad, but I agree the rest are just ok.

I'm trying to go for an engaging, funny youtube channel so, if you have the time, take a look. Hope you enjoy what you see. Thanks in advance. A review of the movie here-https://youtu.be/fyYgj2Fpur0

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[–] Volley (3433) 7 years ago

My Worst to First:

AvP R
AvP
Alien - Colonial Marines (video game)
Prometheus
Aliens vs Predator 2010 (video game)
Alien Resurrection
Alien Covenant
Aliens vs Predator Classic 2000 (video game)
Alien 3
Alien - Isolation (video game)
Aliens vs Predator 2 & expansion (video game)
Alien
Aliens

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[–] Banjo (63) 7 years ago

As an absolutely *huge* Alien franchise fan (from the classic movies to the comics and novels)... I just saw Covenant having been "burned" by Prometheus and skipped it in the cinema...

My personal rankings (worst to best):
Covenant (Just a mess, despite a promising start)
AvP 2 (Pointless and awful)
Prometheus (Should have been a standalone movie, terrible Alien movie but not awful)
AvP (The comics were better, but it could have been worse I guess)
Alien Resurrection (Aka Firefly: Dry Run... fun but shallow)
Alien 3 (Not the best of what we could have got, but pretty darn good in script/uncut form)
Alien (Just awesome; well made, well acted, great design, amazing Alien)
Aliens (I could watch this every day and not tire of it)

To be honest, the top two switch places daily. Aliens is in my top three favourite films of all time, but Alien is probably in my top five, and they are both so good yet different it really depends on my mood.

The rest keep their same ranking forever, for me.

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[–] TheBadgerMan (81) 7 years ago

I'm with you on Prometheus. But since I was never a huge fan of the franchise, I'm downgrading from seeing Prometheus when it was released on DVD to seeing Covenant when it finally makes it to cable or Netflix. I've enjoyed seeing it lampooned over and over (with reviews from critics, thoughts from friends, and YouTube videos) that I cannot possibly go in with an open mind.

AVPR
Alien^3
Prometheus
AVP
Resurrection
Aliens
Alien

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[–] Banjo (63) 7 years ago

I actually managed to see Covenant totally "blind"... Not just no spoilers or ideas about the story, but not knowing the critical mauling it seems to have gotten too.

In that sense, I feel I got to give it a fair shot rather than going in like, say, Batman vs Superman knowing "it's terrible" before seeing it.

On the other hand, not knowing almost made it worse as I enjoyed the first half until I realised it was all going down the toilet and was again casting off the Alien franchise in favour of what should be a standalone movie series about David the smug and crazy android and the Engineers retconning everything.

I hated Alien 3 the first time I saw it, but taken without the baggage of the (better) previous films, I now really like it. I bought the script not long after seeing it (pre online days) and it made me wish so much wasn't cut... Was so happy we finally got the workprint officially released, which IMO makes a bad film a good (but not great) one.

While I've come to appreciate Prometheus more since first viewing, I don't expect Covenant to get the same reappraisal!

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[–] TheBadgerMan (81) 7 years ago

Wait, you waited until it was out of theaters but still managed to see it blind? That takes some restraint. The moment ANY legitimate reviews are released, I'm all over them.

I think my only hope for enjoying Covenant is to watch it ironically. Ridley Scott is really "Lucasing" his own franchise.

I can't say that I've ever read a script, but if you think it's worth the time, I might give it a go. Alien^3 should have been great. To me, the collective works of Scott and James Cameron pale in comparison to Fincher's.

I hope you give Covenant a reevaluation. I cannot imagine it being worse than AVPR.

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[–] Banjo (63) 7 years ago

Yup, missed it in the cinema and avoided any reviews, info or spoilers. Tough to do these days, but possible, as I've done it a few times. Heck, I got through all the seasons of Game of Thrones without spoilers and there were book readers who actively *tried* to ruin the show for people at certain times!

I think Covenant just annoyed me as I was really, really sick of David by the end of Prometheus! Also, the few things I liked about Promethus were "ruined" as actively as Covenant does the original films, so even as a sequel to that (a film I still say shouldn't have been an Alien movie!) it failed.

Someone once said of the Star Wars prequel trilogy compared to Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull: Indy 4 is just a bad Indy movie, so it really doesn't matter, but the prequels damage the Star Wars universe hence why they are seen as unforgivable.

Covenant damages Alien, Aliens and the whole saga if you accept it as canon. AVPR is just a cheap trashy cash-in with no impact except "apparently they came to earth and nobody remembered". :)

As a positive for Covenant, I will say that it very strongly reminded me in tone and look to some of the better Dark Horse comics, particularly David's scenes and some of the action, and I did really love some of those comics and characters. On the downside, a movie based on those, or adapted from them would have IMO been better; replace David with a character based on Dr Church from Aliens:Labyrinth, for example.

The script of Alien 3 is pretty much what we finally got with the assembly edit. Before that, though, it and the novel were much better than the actual film, IMO.

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[–] Todge (23) 7 years ago

Alien: Resurrection - It started OK, but that hybrid was beyond stupid, and killed what started as a promising movie.

Aliens - This is a good action movie, but it is not an 'Alien' movie. Cameron had a dream of making a guerilla warfare film, and used 'Aliens' as that vehicle to seeing that dream.. In doing so he turned the xenomorph from a powerful, horrifying creature into a giant 'space ant', complete with queen, completely ignoring the original life-cycle of the alien.

The next three are difficult for me to put in order, as I like them all for differing reasons, so I'll list them in reverse order from when they where made....

Alien: Covenant - I feel a bit for Ridley Scott, as he was criticised over Prometheus, partly for a weak story, and partly because of not including the Alien, so he was almost pushed into skipping a movie and jumping straight to this one to keep the fans and Fox? happy. Now he is criticised for making a movie too close the original and for not continuing the story in a cohesive way? Hopefully the prequel to this will be made to fill in the gap, as well as the sequel(s) to tie it into Alien.

Prometheus - The story had to start somewhere, and cave drawings was as good as any. It was evident in the original film that Weyland-Yutani knew about the xenomorph before Ripley and co. found it, so they had to do something. I didn't find the story weak or confusing, though I do wish there was an 'uncut' version available.

continued below...

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[–] Todge (23) 7 years ago

continued from above...

Alien 3 - The Director's Cut - Fincher did his level best to return the Alien franchise back to the gritty horror format that it was originally, and undoing some of the stuff that Cameron did in his sequel, and I think he did a terrific job considering he was thrust into an almost unworkable situation, and fighting Fox all the way. Fox eventually got their way, and released a neutered version Fincher's film, which was OK.. The Director's Cut was much better.. It's just a pity that Fincher didn't get to see his full, original movie see the light of day.

Alien - What can I say? By far the best. It introduced an alien species that was truly horrific, with a life-cycle that was so disturbing it could have sparked a franchise that was second to none. Unfortunately it didn't come to pass, but, with a couple of hiccups, it has endured and will hopefully continue to.

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[–] [deleted] 7 years ago

This series is the epitome of worse sequels.

The first 3 are fantastic, the third obviously has flaws due to what I consider the process in which the Director was forced to work. I'm always still impressed he managed to make such a great film in Alien 3.

Then they go further and further downhill, Resurrection had its interesting moments and ideas, whilst obviously drawn back by its peculiar ending. The AVP films are all objectively poor films, whilst Prometheus and Covenant are simply a lot of ideas, some good, thrown together in what amounts to a convoluted mess that simply leaves a bad taste and a feeling of dissatisfaction.

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