I gave 'Megamind' a 4 out of 5 instead of 5 out of 5 because of 'Titan' - Megamind (2010) Discussion

[–] 13 years ago

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

Before Megamind's mischief, Hal was like many other geeky guys who simply hadn't discovered the right way to charm women. Remember it was Roxanne herself who confronted Titan and reminded him that he was not such a bad guy after all BEFORE he was transformed. This is what Roxanne says to Titan right before he ties her up on the tower: "I want to talk to the real Hal...I want to talk to the guy who liked being a cameraman, and eating dip and being a nerd and being not as scary as the Titan Hal." In Roxanne's view, before the injection, Hal may have been "self-absorbed" and perhaps a little "selfish", but certainly not in her eyes, "a little creep", as you put it. He had his "issues" just like Megamind and Metroman, but they were all multi-dimensional characters.

Only Titan is a one-note character. He has no charm and my point is that he doesn't really fit in the Megamind universe due to his unpleasant attitude and non-stop nastiness. When he actually tries to kill Roxanne by lobbing the bus at her, the movie suddenly turns in a rather sour, unfunny direction. Not only that, since Hal was under the influence of a foreign substance, he cannot be held morally or criminally responsible for his actions. Imagine forcing someone to drink 10 beers and putting him in a car and after he gets in an accident, you charge him with DWI. The law recognizes that if someone is coerced into a criminal act, they cannot be held responsible. Therefore, it's ironic that Megamind should be hailed as a hero for stopping Titan, since Titan was his creation!!!!

My main point is that the film could have gone two ways. They could have made Titan a charming character (just like Megamind) and preserved the comic tone of the film. On the other hand, they needed to provide a better explanation for the way they ended up portraying Titan--his transformation as a cardboard, evil psychopath turns the film into a standard, predictable clash between good vs evil (no longer a comedy!).

Your explanation for Hal's transformation--that he "wasn't such a nice guy after all", doesn't cut it. Hal's pathetic come-ons to Roxanne are kind of funny--people can recognize something of themselves in Hal before he becomes Titan the monster. But once Hal is transformed, he's no longer Hal. He becomes exactly what you say he was all along: not a nice guy (in other words an *beep* Do you take great enjoyment in seeing the *beep* get his comeuppance? In other words, the 'Megamind' climax is a little too pat and predictable.

I don't believe allowing Hal's dark side to take full bloom inside Titan was the way to go, mainly because Hal was not as creepy as you make him out to be (there are a lot more Hals walking around this world than you think!). But with the screenwriters committing themselves in such a way, they could have come up with some kind of excuse for Titan's behavior, which would have provided an explanation for the ugliness of Titan's actions (again, trying to kill Roxanne for real, does not belong in a comedy!). Titan, in effect, is a murderer--if you really want a murderer in a humorous movie such as 'Megamind', provide us with a good explanation (not guilty by reason of insanity could be a good place to start). Now just provide us with the reason for the insanity!

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[–] 13 years ago

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

>>At that point Roxanne was desperately hoping their was some good in Hal,'the guy who liked being a cameraman, and eating dip and being a nerd," never really existed, that's what everyone, including Roxanne THOUGHT Hal was, but deep down he was never that guy!

Hal was a guy who was totally clueless. There are plenty of guys like Hal in the real world who simply don't have insight into themselves and don't know how to charm women. Roxanne not only rejected Hal but also rejected Megamind, Metroman and Bernard. They also tried too hard to please her, to no avail. It was only after Megamind found the right formula (spontaneity), that he won Roxanne over. The fun of the movie was we get a chance to see how clueless men can be in trying to win over women. Except Titan didn't fit into that picture at all!

>>He fits in perfectly with the story! Remember I said that one of the messages of the film is to not judge people based on what they SEEM to be. Everyone assumes Hal is a nice guy...if a few bricks shy of a load. Nobody guessed he had that much rage bottled up inside him until it was too late.

I don't understand how you can say "everyone assumes Hal is a nice guy". Quite the opposite--people know from the beginning that he's pathetic! As for the rage--that was the worst part of the movie!

>>I'm sorry but you can't compare Hal getting superpowers with drinking beers and getting drunk. For one thing Hal wasn't intoxicated, he wasn't coerced into a criminal act!

>>As I stated in my previous post, Megamind tried to teach Hal to be a HERO, to use his powers for good it was Hal alone who chose to go bad. Think of a parent trying to teach their kid to be good, but when they grow up they do something bad, that's not the parents fault. If I steal a car...would that be my Mother's fault? NO!

>>Hal was a grown man responsible for his own actions, regardless of whether he gained super powers or not!

Hal was worse than intoxicated. His DNA was altered. He was NOT the same person. In his altered state, yes he chose to go bad. But without the injection, Hal would NOT have turned into a murderer! He would have gone back trying to convince Roxanne to join him at his "party for two"!!!!

>In my opinion Hal's interactions with Roxanne before he became Titan are creepy as hell. They might seem funny but they are red flags of Hal's true personality and just how much of a jerk he really is, I'm thinking of when Roxanne called 'Bernard' her partner and Hal got all defensive and jealous.

>>To me that was the moment where Hal crossed the line of being just weird and geeky, to being possesive and creepy.

>>Hal was never a nice guy we just don't see all of his true personality until he got his powers. How many times have you thought someone was nice...until you get to know them and see how they REALLY are?

Your point about the red flags is a good one. At what point does someone who's 'clueless', cross the line? Again, there are plenty of guys who become jealous when they're rejected but that doesn't mean that jealousy translates into murderous impulses. That's why I think once Hal becomes too creepy, the story veers into the land of abject unpleasantness! And I'm totally lost when Titan tells Roxanne that he's "over her" and is ready to do her in. At that point, 'Megamind' becomes a different movie.

>>If the screen writers would have come up with a explination for Hal's actions then we would have had to go into Hal's history and the movie isn't about Hal it's about Megamind.

>>Hal is the real villian of the film, and the movie may be a comedy BUT it is also an affectionate play on Superhero films.

>>And popular villians like Lex Luthor, Joker all have murderous intentions.

>>Hal is no different and in traditional Superhero fashion Megamind comes in at the end to save the day. Megamind wouldn't be much of a hero if he had a weak villian to fight now would he?

>>Their has to be real danger for the hero to make his victory all the greater.

If I wanted to see a Superhero film, then I would have rented The Dark Knight. There's nothing "affectionate" about these trite Superhero films. Most of them have villains who are completely one-dimensional (Titan is no different). If you do have to have a comic book villain with murderous intentions, then let the genie out of the bottle and have him act with some charming aplomb! If you need to be so heavy-handed (as the way Titan is depicted here), then at least provide an explanation. One or two lines would have sufficed to soften the blow! Without the explanation, Titan just becomes another predictable stereotypical villain who injects decided 'bad vibes' into an otherwise charming comedy!

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[–] 13 years ago

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

I didn't say Megamind was one dimensional. Quite the contrary, I think he's a wonderful, multi-dimensional character. Titan, on the other hand, was a one-note character throughout. Space Dad was funny I agree but is separate from Titan.

I really think we're talking about apples and oranges here. I think we both liked the movie but you're more willing to accept the conventional ending. I just thought Titan was a villain without any charm and hence turned the whole thing into a simplistic good vs. evil affair.

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[–] karsultimate 13 years ago

"Tighten" was probably pissed about having his world turned upside down. And not just about being played for a fool in those scenes. He might be a crappy speller (and possibly lost some intelligence), but I'm sure he put two and two together and figured out Megamind had been psyching him out even before the transmogrification. Back when he copied Bernard's form. Not to mention it was a total fluke--he wasn't chosen.

There's also a parallel to Metro Man although almost from the outset he didn't like the gig.

Of course, speaking of Metro Man, he must also bear some responsibility if Megamind is to blame (since that was said earlier).

I also agree with you about the ending, but more that Megamind just had to end up like that, which admittedly wasn't so bad with the girl (I didn't like her so much, but whatever).

<i>There's a slogan written here. 'Happiness Will Walk Away'...</i>

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[–] wight1984 12 years ago

I don't understand how you can say "everyone assumes Hal is a nice guy". Quite the opposite--people know from the beginning that he's pathetic!

Those things are not mutually exclusive.

How socially confident and charismatic someone is does not indicate their moral character.

Hal was worse than intoxicated. His DNA was altered. He was NOT the same person. In his altered state, yes he chose to go bad.

He was merely given Metro Man's powers. Those are not intoxicating because Metro Man had them and was a good person. The difference between Metro Man and Titan was of character, not physiology.

At what point does someone who's 'clueless', cross the line? Again, there are plenty of guys who become jealous when they're rejected but that doesn't mean that jealousy translates into murderous impulses.

Most grown guys don't act that creepy. That's part of Hal's problem; he wasn't a mature adult capable of dealing with his feelings in an adult and responsible way. It doesn't necessarily follow that he'd handle having super powers in a juvenile manner but it's certainly not hard to believe.

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[–] jakubmike 9 years ago

Hal was a guy who was totally clueless. There are plenty of guys like Hal in the real world who simply don't have insight into themselves and don't know how to charm women.

Not really, Hal acted like he did because he was powerless, once he gained power all that resentment toward the world surfaced, he believed he was ENTITLED to a girl, he was angry, bitter men, you simply did not saw that in him because he kept it bottled up. It's like winning a lottery, money does not make you a jerk, but they allow you to BE a jerk if you want to. That is why people say "money changed him" no, they did not, he was always like that

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] wight1984 12 years ago

Hal was like many other geeky guys who simply hadn't discovered the right way to charm women.

A lot, although not all, of those geeky guys are creeps.

There's no get out of jail free card for being socially inept.

The fact is that if you take a lot of normal people and give them lots of power then that will not be good for their character development.

people can recognize something of themselves in Hal before he becomes Titan the monster.

Again, social ineptitude is not a sign of morality. It's a morally neutral characteristic.

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[–] Skaven252 11 years ago

it's pretty solid that all calories you intake are either consumed or conserved

The "all nice guys are actually secretly evil" trope has more to do with currently trendy gender politics than about plot devices. It's a powerful shaming message. It may even render the actual nice guys resentful, or at least paralyze them into inactivity out of fear of being labeled as a creep.

And that's exactly the way they want it to be.

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[–] Angerlab 13 years ago

I would bet money that you're a female.

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[–] ctnoles71 13 years ago

Couldn't have said it better myself.

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[–] puschit-1 13 years ago

I just think it was necessary to have a real antagonist here. Personally I could have lived with lesser violent Titan and the movie ending with Titan/Hal achnowledging his wrongs but you know how the greater part of the audience is: They want their good gus good and heir bad guys bad so they can have a "proper" showdown where at least one person has to suffer for his deeds. Vindicitve little bastards most of us are. And since Megamind was sortof good with a loving heart and loveable antics, the writers made Titan turning into a real threat. And while I could have lived with a lesser violent and more docile Titan/Hal it's not unrealistic what ahppened to him. Yes, his spite and anger might be enhanced by the drugs but there is a bad person in all of us and we should never underestimate what love and constantly being rejected can do to us.

Also, Titan wasn't the only one that did a big change in character in the last third of the movie, and I am not talking of Megamind: Metroman! Until his fake death he was an arrogant, attention seeking douchebag that does his heroic deeds just for the fame and to please his ego. But when they meet him again, we get to learn that he really did everything for good and just made a big show out of it because the people liked the big show (americans^^) and that he would have retired way earlier if it wasn't for Megamind threatening the people again.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

I just think it was necessary to have a real antagonist here. Personally I could have lived with lesser violent Titan and the movie ending with Titan/Hal acknowledging his wrongs but you know how the greater part of the audience is: They want their good guys good and their bad guys bad so they can have a "proper" showdown where at least one person has to suffer for his deeds.

>>Of course you need an antagonist. And when Megamind and Metroman were facing off, that was a battle between a flawed villain and a flawed good-guy (just as you point out!). But when Megamind faces off against Titan, it's not an equal partnership. The conflict devolves into a strictly 'good vs. evil' face-off. There no longer is any ambiguity. Titan is such a boring character. Everything he does is predictable. Worse than that, he's an unpleasant villain. All the fun has been sucked out of the clueless Hal and he's transformed into the slimy Titan. For example, if you took all the charm out of a Tony Soprano, then no one would be attracted to a Mafia guy who's totally bad. My main point is that evil must have a HUMAN face. Titan does not and it kills the charm of the film. Now if Titan had some kind of excuse for his outrageous behavior...if the films' scenarists put some kind of explanation for the cruelty (his DNA was altered, etc.), then you could have your "proper showdown" but at least the onus would be taken off the one-note Titan who could now be excused for his outrageous behavior.

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[–] Kuato_and_George 13 years ago

There needed to be an explanation in the script as to WHY Titan became a psychopath.

There was and I think you may have missed it.

Hal showed his true colors. When he was able to do anything and everything he wanted, he became a rather ugly person.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

There needed to be an explanation in the script as to WHY Titan became a psychopath.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There was and I think you may have missed it.

Hal showed his true colors. When he was able to do anything and everything he wanted, he became a rather ugly person.

>>I didn't miss it. You're making the same point that the other poster here was making--that Hal was INHERENTLY BAD. The super powers just magnified his badness. My point was that kind of charcter is one-dimensional. It's one note. Compare Hal with the charming Megamind. Guess what? There's no comparison. Hal is just a STOCK figure--the typical villain you would find in comic books. He has no nuances and it gets to the point that he's so unlikeable, that it ruins the whole neat comic tone of the movie (in contrast, compare all those amusing battles between Megamind and Metroman!). My other point was that if you're going to use such a stock, distasteful, one-dimensional character, at least provide us with an explanation for the meanness. Inherently bad characters don't make for good drama. The great villains of drama are always complex. But if you must use such a simplistic character, without any charm, then soften him up because this is a really a comedy. If Hal insists on trying to kill Roxie, at least suggest it was because of the reality (of perhaps) altered DNA. Otherwise, such a mean character has no place in the comic world of a Megamind.

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[–] Kuato_and_George 13 years ago

I didn't miss it.

Yes you did. You know how I know? Because you keep saying things like this:

My other point was that if you're going to use such a stock, distasteful, one-dimensional character, at least provide us with an explanation for the meanness.

The explanations are given in the movie, myself, and other posters in this thread. They just went right over your head.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

If you really read my post, you would have realized that I acknowledged your point--that Hal was INNATELY a bad guy. His transformation magnified all his deficits. My problem is that the screenwriters conjured up a totally vulgar adversary for Megamind, which is not in keeping with the overall witty tone of the film. You just don't have a character like Titan trying to kill the main love object of the film by throwing a bus at her. Hal starts off as somewhat likeable. But by the time he's transformed as Titan, he's become truly sadistic. There's a way to mitigate that sadism--by perhaps suggesting that he's "not guilty by reason of (some kind of) insanity". Otherwise, he's a stock villain.

It would be nice if you attempted to criticize the SUBSTANCE of my argument instead of childishly appealing to the "other posters in this thread". Insults such as "the explanations...just went right over your head", without addressing any of my points, shows you to be a weak debater.

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[–] Kuato_and_George 13 years ago

I wouldn't be calling anyone childish if I were you. It's already been proven that the movie - at least this part of it - went right over your head. Not only that, you are adamantly fighting over that fact. And you're calling me a weak debater? You're the only clinging to this clearly incorrect belief. People have explained to you over and over again why you're wrong.

And now you're lashing out at others. You look bad from every angle. I didn't have a problem with you when you were simply dumb and missed a plot point, but now that you're a d!ck you're a little annoying.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

I'm not "lashing" out at anybody. I'm calling you a weak debater because you're ignoring just about everything I'm saying. But let me clarify--you're saying that Hal is still a good character after he's transformed into Titan? Just answer me that.

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[–] Kuato_and_George 13 years ago

I'm not ignoring it, it's just that it's been responded to time-and-time again.

This part of the movie went way over your head, so you've created this whole other argument which has no legs to stand on. Here you've got several people telling you that you "may have" missed something and you insist that you did not; but rather than the movie was wrong in the way it handled the character.

That takes a bit of an ego.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

No there were not "several" people who pointed out that the movie went way over my head or people responded to me "time-and-time again." Only the first poster (Weber) and yourself decided to make childish, pejorative comments, about my point of view. There was one poster who speculated if I was "male" and the rest simply disagreed with me and presented their arguments in a civil, mature fashion (which I believe is how posters should conduct themselves here). We'll wait awhile and see if "several" more posters show up here to slam me, as you have done here.

I did go to your website--I'm assuming your review is the "he said" and not the "she said". Awaiting your clarification.

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[–] george-fletcher 13 years ago

There is a basic old, worn-out saying to describe Hal and what happened.

'Give a small man power, and he will show you just how small he truly is'

In Movies, the speed of sound is 930,000 times that in real life.

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[–] wight1984 12 years ago

that Hal was INNATELY a bad guy. His transformation magnified all his deficits.

I don't think this is what anyone is saying.

I know some creepy dorky guys who can't speak to women and they are not the sort of people I would trust with super powers, even though they may be mostly harmless without them.

Hal didn't really transform nor is he 'evil incarnate', he was just a not good person, like many -real people- are.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

If you really read my post, you would have realized that I acknowledged your point--that Hal was INNATELY a bad guy. His transformation magnified all his deficits. My problem is that the screenwriters conjured up a totally vulgar adversary for Megamind, which is not in keeping with the overall witty tone of the film. You just don't have a character like Titan trying to kill the main love object of the film by throwing a bus at her. Hal starts off as somewhat likeable. But by the time he's transformed as Titan, he's become truly sadistic. There's a way to mitigate that sadism--by perhaps suggesting that he's "not guilty by reason of (some kind of) insanity". Otherwise, he's a stock villain.

It would be nice if you attempted to criticize the SUBSTANCE of my argument instead of childishly appealing to the "other posters in this thread". Insults such as "the explanations...just went right over your head", without addressing any of my points, shows you to be a weak debater.

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[–] elsietheangel 13 years ago

I don't know whether I'm bumping here but after watching this movie lately and reading through all the posts on this topic, I just feel compelled to give my opinion (in a respectable fashion, haha). I'm just about to go to sleep and feel like voicing thoughts on something.

First off I totally understand what you're saying about how he kind of seemingly randomly goes from just being a possessive creepy nerd about his crush to a genuinely scary psychopathic cliche villain that makes one feel really uncomfortable from the fact that he suddenly wants Roxanne dead, but the way I feel about this movie I think it actually benefits from this character.

For starters, when I first started watching this movie I had NO IDEA that it would take on a character like this and take this turn. The trailers made it seem really goofy and I was expecting a colourful and quirky kids romp. Hal brings a certain sense of maturity and complexity to the film I think. When he suddenly started being all possessive and creepy it was like wow, this is serious business. I mean lets face it, jealousy and possessiveness over someone you like isn't a kids subject, and because of that it took this film way over children's level for me and I actually started to enjoy it properly. I really was NOT expecting it. He started off as such a seemingly minor character and then it's like like wow, DreamWorks, you're taking this character I was just about to overlook and turn him into the MAIN VILLAIN. When you think about it, (I think) that's a pretty awesome step, because it shows that the people we brush aside in our daily lives could potentially be someone dangerous, creepy, and surprisingly complex if given the power.

The fact that he suddenly got murderous towards Roxie, though it's uncomfortable and really surprising, you can kind of understand why. Hal gets screwed over pretty bad by Megamind, and it's actually at this point Megamind is doing the only really evil thing he ever does in my opinion. I mean how would any of us feel if we were in this situation? Hal is totally unintentionally suddenly given awesome powers which he truly believes (because he's crazy yeah) would give him a good shot at being with the one he liked (after being conditioned to think that this was true after being told it/seeing it constantly)and then Roxie rejects him(for good reason yes but still), then he finds out that not only is Megamind getting cosy with the one he likes, but is also the one giving him faith in the whole thing in the first place, and at the same time surprises Hal by rejecting his offer for an evil team-up when Hal genuinely thought he'd be delighted at the prospect of something "evil" seeing as that's what Megamind is 'supposed' to be.

So yeah, for someone as unsettled as Hal, I can see why that would set him off to act the way he does, on top of being given enormous power that, really, he doesn't know how to handle or what to do with. He doesn't randomly go off the rails regarding Roxie, he was prepared to do anything for her (albeit in a creepy way), and was pretty much motivated into being angry. Being such a crazy bastard he just wanted her GONE towards the end because she would never be with him and being so destructive and one track minded it would be easier for him if she were just out of the picture.

Sorry for rambling but my conclusion is, although I see what you're saying (and I'm not arguing I'm merely just voicing an opinion), he doesn't take a random turn just simply because he's the movies villain, he had a lot of motives. I've seen you saying that Titan is very one dimensional and boring as a character and that's all I'm disagreeing with. I think he was a valuable asset to this movie which, is AWESOME.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

I really appreciate your comments. At least you've taken the effort to appreciate what I'm trying to say, even though you disagree with me. I think you hit the nail on the head when you describe Titan as making us "uncomfortable". We're uncomfortable because Titan has both no charm and is sadistic. Take a character like Tony Soprano. He was very sadistic but had loads of charm. That's why he was such an endearing character. Some time ago there was a TV movie about Adolph Hitler that was a complete failure. Hitler was depicted as angry and sadistic and had no charm. But in reality, Hitler had to have some human qualities or else he wouldn't have seduced millions of Germans. To my mind, it's irrelevant what Titan's motives are for becoming who he is. Megamind starts off as a charming villain. He wavers between good and bad. He's multi-dimensional. Not so for Titan. So what I'm saying is that if you want to take Megamind in this 'serious' direction (as you put it), and you are insistent on introducing this sadistic sociopath as your main antagnonist, at least soften the blow by providing some kind of excuse for his unsavory behavior. Otherwise, we're stuck with this creepy character who is a caricature WITHOUT complexity. Let me illustrate my argument in another way. I'll give you the perfect villain who was a sociopath with charm: BIFF from Back to the Future. What they really needed in Megamind was a 'Biff' type character--he was the perfect foil for Marty McFly. Titan doesn't even come close to Biff. Still, I did give 'Megamind' a 4 out of 5; I don't agree with you that it was "awesome" but rather "highly entertaining".

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[–] puschit-1 13 years ago

You are still fighting over this? Hal isn't a one-dimensional character and he has very good reasons for the things he did, as pointed out by elsietheangel and others. Living a low life, getting rejected constantly, becoming socially arkward, not getting any love, attention and recognition ... that's a vicious circle and all of that wears down the soul of anyone unhappy enough to receive such a treatment. The only difference IRL is that nobody gets superpowers. But put someone like HAL into a position of power, and the result will most likely be similar to Hal/Titan's behaviour. That's not one-dimensional, that's just human. The typical comic book villain has much less background story that explain his motif, if any at all. This isn't the case here. Whereas Biff from Back to the Future is a generic bully and we do NOT know why he is like that. He is just a douchy bully. He had charm? Charm is a subjective thing, I found Hal more charming when he was still just a nerd, but that's personal preferrance.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

I agree with you that Hal had some charm when he was still just a nerd but the film scenarists were already taking him in a bad direction even before he's transformed into Titan. The Titan character is one-dimensional because he's so unlikeable. If you like the creepy misogyny and all the one-note comic book machinations, then you're content to have 'Megamind' devolve into a simple tale of a psychopath getting his comeuppance at the hands of a lovable rogue. What happens to all the 'fun' of 'Megamind' when we're introduced to Titan? All the other characters manage to have their good points as well as their imperfections. To my mind, not so with Titan. But perhaps you're seeing something that I don't see.

As for Biff, if he was a 'generic' bully as you assert, I hardly think that the Back to the Future films, would have such a great following, over the past 25 years.

Finally, the fact that my initial post is still getting comments (including from luminaries such as yourself), that suggests to me, that it was worthwhile posting in the first place.

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[–] 13 years ago

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[–] Desperado19 13 years ago

There's an old saying, not sure where it's from originally but I've heard it plenty of times; "Absolute power corrupts absolutely."

If you became near godlike can you honestly say you wouldn't at least be tempted to use it for personal gain? And Hal didn't seem the most well adjusted person in the first place so it doesn't seem that unlikely that he would go that extra step, especially after having his heart broken.

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[–] blacknyellowsquid 13 years ago

Thank you, haha! ^ I was thinking about the absolute power corrupting, too. He wasn't necessarily an evil psychopath to begin with...just that kind of invisible annoying geek that people don't pay much attention to. (however, who's to know what's really in his head, right? no one really cared before.) but once he realized he could do whatever he wanted and had absolute power over everyone, he used it for his own selfish gain and probably suddenly realized he was resentful too. That's why Megamind and Minion were purposefully seeking out someone that had a strong, noble heart and core to give the super powers to...they knew he'd be able to handle it for good...they needed to go to a special kind of person who WOULDN'T get corrupted by such power. Buuuut it accidently went to Hal....a more average and weak person. And Megamind just ran with it since it'd already happened, not thinking ahead.

It was an odd mixed bag. It was hard to know what to feel about Hal/Titan, which I like actually. I ... kind of... felt sorry for him? At the same time recognizing that Roxie didn't do anything that warranted that kind of vengeful murderous reaction. I would not have wanted to hang out with him, either. (sorry.) But...he did kind of have a point when he was all bitter later, like "oh NOW you want to talk to me, you never did before" etc. lol. It was a weird/interesting element to me, that both the villians..pseudo-villain and actually destructive villain... both had spurned feelings that led to them wanting to be more bad (one obviously worse than the other). Yet we were supposed to sympathize/root for Megamind and not Titan so much, even though, in some ways, they both were dealing with rejection. I guess the difference is that Megamind had more innate good in him than Hal had.

Anyway. I thought this movie looked SO. SO. stupid from the trailers. Yet I caught the end of it on HBO the other night and, in spite of myself, liked it so much enough and was intrigued enough that I actually got up early the next day to see the first half that I had missed, and now kinda want to watch again start to finish. I quite liked it, I'm surprised with myself lol!

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[–] MurasakiYugata 13 years ago

I wouldn't consider Hal's transformation inconsistent at all. Power doesn't always corrupt, but it certainly can. And it's not exactly like Hal is a particularly benevolent person to begin with. Hal shows no concern about the well-being of the city when Megamind takes over (smiling and chewing gum at the press conference), he shows no sympathy toward Roxanne when she's mourning Metroman's death, and when he thinks he's being robbed he tries to redirect the robbers to the lady across the hall. In terms of foreshadowing, he even has a book on the bed in his apartment titled BEST COMIC BOOK VILLAINS EVER. So while it wasn't obvious he would become a villain, it's not exactly a surprise either.

As far as the contrast between the light-hearted tone of the film and the arguably darker portrayal of Titan, I actually think that's part of what made his character so good. Megamind is evil, but he's a very cartoony sort of evil. And, as such, he adheres to a rather strict set of self-imposed rules. He's also so obsessed with the idea of "destiny" he acts not out of inherent maliciousness, but because he's decided that how he's supposed to act. Hal, on the other hand, is a very stark contrast to this. He doesn't play by any rules and acts without regard for others. His actions are not cartoony, but genuinely violent and intimidating. I like that we get to see these different types of evil. If Hal had just become another over-the-top cartoony villain like Megamind, Megamind wouldn't have had to change his game. But since the stakes were raised, Megamind had to throw aside his preconceptions of his own destiny and fight for something that mattered even more.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

What is a "genuinely violent and intimidating" character doing in a hip, satirical comedy such as 'Megamind'? If I wanted to see such a character, I would have rented any action/adventure movie that's come out in the last few years. Titan reduces 'Megamind' (at least in its last third), to precisely the kind of typical action adventure film that has been the staple of Hollywood entertainment for years.

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[–] wight1984 12 years ago

The fact that this film breaks expectations is part of what makes it great.

If this film hadn't bothered to look into any interesting and fairly adult themes, I would never have watched it more than once.

If that wasn't the kind of film you wanted then fair enough, but that isn't a fault with the film, it just means you need to go watch something else.

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[–] pjmooch 13 years ago

Oh my god, I can't believe you didn't get the point. I have not read all of the posts, so i don't think anyone has corrected you yet. Hal had a CRUSH on Roxie. Therefore, Hal was jealous of anyone whom anyone he figured Roxie was going out with. So then, when Hal got his powers, and Roxie still rejected him for having to prove his powers by putting her life in danger himself(and being a dick), even though unaware, Hal snapped. Hal, because of this, became someone else, and he would never take on the agenda of Metro Man because he hated Metro Man for having the woman that he so called loved even though they were never together.
It was even shown in the movie, Megamind even thought Roxie and Metro Man were going out. So, though having all the powers of the classic superhero, such as superman, Hal follows the classic arc of a supervillain.
The whole point was Metro Man was never the hero. As Megamind's father said in the beginning of the movie, "You are destined for greatness". Megamind was always suppose to be the hero. Metro Man tapped out emotionally.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

I got all that bro. You even admit that you didn't read all the posts. You're completely right. You hit the nail on the head. "HE FOLLOWS THE ARC OF A SUPERVILLAIN". And that's exactly my problem with it. By turning him into an ordinary "supervillain", the story becomes a typical good vs. evil clash between guys with super powers. Titan has no charm. He's obnoxious. If you have a charming comedy-satire like Megamind, you don't throw a bus at the girl you're in love with. That was the moment that Hal/Titan became the complete, unsavory supervillain and the moment he negated whatever little charm he had in the first place.

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[–] meiliken 13 years ago

Here's a dose of reality for all parties concerned about this. Hal was indeed a victim, as was Megamind. Both were made by the society they grew up in to become what they were. You take any baby, and raise them with complete evil and abuse, and by the time they are an adult, they will despise all life, fact. That was the semi story of Megamind, though he did get some positive feedback from criminals, hence why he became a criminal but with a heart of gold. Hal was probably ridiculed his entire life from birth. There are only 2 ways one can become from that kind of treatment. Become withdrawn and evil, or become completely dependant on the acceptance of others(i.e. not believing in themselves). That was Hal. He needed real acceptance from Roxie, she refused to give him the time of day. After a life of being downtrodden, she was the last straw, and he finally broke. In other words, Hal was a victim.

If you want to see parallels, look at any highschool shooting. The victims are the ones that picked on the shooter until he broke and killed them. There is a difference between being a violent person, and being driven to violence.

Another parallel, people who harrass wild animals, and the animal mauls them.

The fact of the matter is, you humans are your own nightmare. You create your own criminals, and you have no one to blame but yourselves.

I'm actually surprised no one saw this in the movie since they spelled it out with Megaminds back story. Just like Titan says, "This is the real world, you need to wake up!"

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[–] DarthSimpson 12 years ago

The victims of mass shootings often had no contact with the shooter whatsoever.
Sure, maybe some other people made the shooter's life hell, but the victims have no responsibility for that. Humans are not interchangeable widgets.

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[–] angelxmoreta 13 years ago

I felt the same way about "Titan" but what really explains the psychopath part is the saying "With great power, comes with great responsibility." The kid was power hungry, and didn't really have any responsibility as you experienced the way he lives and carries himself around.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

Yes I got it that he was a psychopath. But couldn't they have made him a tad bit more likeable?

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[–] pure-Wasted 13 years ago

Lol, Turfseer. That's what you get for trying to do actual critical analysis on a public forum. Most people won't understand that they don't understand what you're talking about.

That said, I agree and (sort of) disagree with your points. You're right in that Hal's nature as a character takes some fun out of the movie. You're wrong, I think, in that this movie - the way it was structured from the ground up - simply allowed for no other conclusion. Hal couldn't have been made more likeable, that was never an option. Megamind HAD to become the good guy. For him to become the good guy, there HAD to be a bad guy who was GENUINELY bad. If Hal was anything short of a raving, murderous psychopath, if he was affable like Megamind, Megamind wouldn't feel so pressured to undergo this transformation, and the movie would have become incoherent, or it would have stretched on for another hour to explain itself. Megamind, and to a lesser degree, Metro Man, were characters. Hal was a plot device. And, ultimately, you're right that that's a conceptual flaw and some point on some arbitrary scale ought to be docked for that.

As it is, the movie makes perfect thematic and dramatic sense, but it feels ever so slightly "off." Not everything that it could have been in a perfect universe. I think that's all you were trying to say - you didn't give the movie 1/5, after all, you gave it 4/5 (which might even be too high, but never mind) - and there's nothing at all unreasonable about that, or condescending about the way you tried to say it.

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[–] Turfseer 13 years ago

I appreciate your comments. At least there are some intelligent people out there trying to understand what I was trying to say. You might be right that Hal was a plot device and that's the only way they could go. I'll stand by my '4 out of 5' as I found the movie to be pretty clever and entertaining, despite some of the distasteful 'Hal/Titan' stuff'.

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