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Neo-Nazis: did Breaking Bad almost jump the shark?


Having just watched the entire series for the first time, I now understand the raves I've heard about BB since 2008. Nevertheless, one of the quibbles I had with it was the emergence of The Brotherhood in season 5. Not a single one of "Uncle Jack"'s goons had the slightest bit of individuality and the writers refuse to do anything with them. They're just cartoonish stock villains who seem to exist so that we can take sadistic glee when Walt takes them out. Unstable and stupid, it's hard to believe that this gang of thugs would be able to hold on to their $70 million for very long. They probably would never take the trouble to launder it. Their wild cruelty and boorishness reminded me of the unstable Tuco. Indeed one of the things I had feared about BB was that it woukd be filled with such characters acting as a foil for the protagonist. Luckily, nothing could have prepared me for that superb dark drug lord Gus Fring, one of the best gangster creations I've ever seen and kudos to Giancarlo Esposito for his extraordinary work. When Gus commits an action, he's thinking in terms of long-term strategy. Even Walt expresses admiration for the deft way Gus rose to corner the Southwest market by cutting off the Mexican cartel (even though such a strategy left his brother-in-law almost dead). My suspicion was that season 5 would show Walt ascend his own drug empire and become the new Gus Fring--but that's not exactly how Vince Gillegan and his writers wanted it to end. The irritating neo-Nazis are not so intrusive that they mar the final episodes, but they just seemed like a manipulative ploy: we want to see them get it after watching them kill Hank against Walt's wishes (I would have preferred Hank die at Walt's hands because it would make more sense). We also see them torture and enslave Jesse, and murder his girlfriend (and by implication, Brock) and steal almost all of Walt's earnings: of course who doesn't want to see them massacred? But that's not exactly what this show has been about. Walt's killing of Krazy 8 in season 1 was extraordinarily powerful: we see the tortured reactions Walt has to it even though Walt was really in a position in which he had no choice. By the time we get to the finale "Felina", Walt is more like an action hero taking down names and kicking ass. It's pleasurable to see Walt take down these scumbags including the hyperneurotic snake-in-the-grass Lydia, but it also means BB is no longer dealing with the moral complexities involved with the life its cental character has chosen to pursue.

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Om not english or american, so I always wonder about this expression when reading it all over IMDB. What does "jump the shark" mean?

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Term comes from 70's sitcom HAPPY DAYS and refers to a moment in which one of its central characters is on water skis and does a stunt that involves jumping over dozens of barrels in shark-infested waters. The term refers to a moment of desperation in which showrunners try to revive interest in a series by adding outrageous material to beef up interest and ratings. In the US, the term refers to the moment a show begins its inevitable decline.

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Thank you :)

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You're welcome.

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Todd is a remarkable character. I'll make my case when I have time.

Forget it Jake. It's Chinatown.

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Yes, I did like Jesse Plemons in the role--the politest murderer you ever could meet.

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Todd and Jack were awesome.

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[deleted]

Except for Todd, I basically agree. There's nothing distinctive about Jack and co.

However, I don't think this is quite jumping the shark. The gang themselves aren't really outrageous; they're stock, as you say.

This weakness led to the anti-Breaking Bad finale.


"You must not judge what I know by what I find words for." - Marilynne Robinson

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I do remember Jack's right hand man with the mustache was named Kenny.

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I didn't find anything cartoonish about Jack and his gang. A group of amoral thugs who will betray and kill you in a heartbeat if it benefits them are totally realistic. They may have seemed one-note compared to Gus, but it would have been difficult for anyone to truly fill Gus' shoes as a villain. We also didn't get to see them for very long as they were introduced near the very end of the series. It's part of the reason why I think Season 5A and Season 5B should have actually been Season 5 and Season 6, 13 episodes each like a normal season.

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"Realistic."

Sorry, but that's a bad excuse.


"You must not judge what I know by what I find words for." - Marilynne Robinson

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I'm just disagreeing with the OP, since he thought they seemed cartoony.

Like I said though, you introduce some new villains that close to the end, you're not gonna have a whole lot of time to develop them and give certain members of the group distinct characterization. One extra season of the show would have accomplished that. Declan seemed like an interesting cat that I wished we could have seen more of as well.

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The problem wasn't the gang minions; the problem was Jack. Todd outshone him. The actor did what he could with the material, I think elevating it.

Distinct characterization can be done economically, in a single scene. Only modest development is necessary to make a character fascinating. They gave us distinct characterization with Walt, Skyler, Hank, Marie, Jr., all in the pilot, with only a scene or two. Had they given focus to Jack, well, he would have come into focus. There was enough time.


"You must not judge what I know by what I find words for." - Marilynne Robinson

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I don't think the show could have possibly jumped the shark with Jack's gang since the series was in it's final season anyway. The ratings were already high, so there was no need to write ludicrous story lines to pump life into it.

I do agree though that they were very one dimensional and typical of what you would see with criminals. What you saw was what you got, but I don't think the goal was to develop character since they were only around for seven episodes.

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A show can be on the top and still jump the shark. When HAPPY DAYS broadcast that particular episode ("called "Hollywood') in 1977, it was coming off a season in which it was the #1 show on television. Even by the end of the season that "Hollywood" was aired, it was still #2. HAPPY DAYS plugged along for another 7 years (each season worse than the last) until it was finally cancelled. There were so many different directions Breaking Bad could have gone in season 5 (when its ratings went up expoenentially), but Vince Gillegan and his writers decided to nix the idea of showing us the rise of Walter White's drug empire in favor of pitting him against these sadistic creeps. It was a bit of a letdown considering how strong much of the series is, but perhaps it was best Gillegan ended it where he did before the show truly started to degenerate much in the way HAPPY DAYS did.

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Todd outshone Jack because Todd was a part of Walt's crew, so he got more screen time to flesh his character out. As pointed out earlier, there wasn't enough episodes left to flesh out the characters of the gang, but it really wasn't necessary. They served their purpose as a generic small-time criminal gang.

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They were much more than "a generic small-time criminal gang". Don't forget about those prison assassinations that they masterminded. Walt only paid for it, but they were the ones that orchestrated it. So they were definitely not small-time. Small-time could not have accomplished that.

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Uncle Jack was much more honoarable then Gus.

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Everything would look silly in comparison to Gus Fring.

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I disagree, I think this was the natural end to Walt's psychological journey. He went from killing completely out of self defense in season one, To allowing a heroin addict to die for no good reason, to other justified killings of bad people, to ordering the deaths of 10 men. The only place to go from there is to personally killing a dozen or more people without a second thought and completing his journey from good guy with cancer to mass murderer, which we look at after the fact as being heroic because it frees Jesse and the men are evil neo-nazi hit men, but don't forget that until he saw him in chains, part of the plan was to kill Jesse.

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I liked Jack&Todd they were good villians wish we saw more of them

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"personally killing a dozen or more people without a second thought"
when was that?
and shouldnt that come before the "ordering" stage?

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They already 'almost' jumped the shark with the shenanigans early in season one with the guy they wanted to dissolve in acid. They definately jumped the shark at the end of season one when Walt threw his magic beans around, the building exploded and he was unharmed and won the instant respect of Tuco. That scene was both McGyver and A-team in one and tells you you're watching a kids-show.

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I disagree with you on the acid scenes. It made for a few amusing moments of black comedy between Walt and Jesse. I wholeheartedly agree with you on that explosion Walt uses at Tuco's. We see the effects of the explosion are HUGE and yet not a single person has been hurt. (You mention MacGyver--that's the exact same show I thought of when that scene played out). We can believe Walt may have superior understanding of chemistry and that he could anticipate the size of the explosion, but there's no way he could anticipate how the highly unstable Tuco and his crew would react. They could have easily started shooting as a reflex action. Tuco is a rather shallow foil to begin with. I thought the character was used much more effectively in Better Call Saul where there is more stress on character as opposed to "action."

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It’s a good point about Tuco’s possible reaction. I suppose he had nothing to lose at that point in some sense.

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the only shark jumping was when Walter indirectly caused the plane crash

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