MovieChat Forums > Shanghai Kiss (2007) Discussion > Message from the director

Message from the director

posted 17 years ago by David_Ren
53 replies | jump to latest

This is David Ren, writer/director of Shanghai Kiss. It's come to my attention that a DVD Screener copy has leaked onto the internet, which is unfortunate because we are still a month away from release. Since the leak just a few days ago, tens of thousands of people have already downloaded it, which is almost unheard of for a fairly small indie film. While I'm happy that so many people are seeking out the film and enjoying it, I'd like to share my thoughts on the situation.

Shanghai Kiss is an autobiographical story and a film that is very personal to me. Some of you have commented on the lack of Asian male leads in American films that are not in the action/martial arts genre. This is especially true for love stories. This is because Hollywood doesn't think America is ready to accept an Asian male as a romantic lead.

This film was not financed by a major studio. It wasn't even financed by an independent financing company. A large portion of the film was financed by a single investor, who put her life savings into the movie. She even sold her house, which she had owned for twenty years. This investor has never made more than five figures a year, but still put in in excess of seven figures. She did this because she felt that this was a story that had to be told and it would be a huge step forward in the way that Asian Americans are portrayed in the media.

Our deal is a royalties deal, meaning the investor gets a percentage of every DVD sold. If this film is a success, Hollywood will take notice and realize that a love story with an Asian male lead could be profitable. If it fails, we could see another twenty years without another film like this. So if you enjoyed it and want more films like it to be made, please support it by purchasing the DVD. You can preorder it here:

http://www.dvdempire.com/Exec/v4_item.asp?userid=99365913688966&item_id=1361580&searchID=3009588

Or you can preorder it at whatever retailer you'd like (Amazon, etc.).

This is not a film produced to make a lot of money. This is a passion project for, not just me, but everyone involved. The cast worked for almost nothing. Hayden Panettiere's fee was probably her lowest since she was four years old. She did it because she believed in the movie and knew it was time a story like this was told.

I want to make clear that I'm not asking people to support the film just because of the Asian American cause nor am I trying to guilt people into sales. I'm only asking the people who truly enjoyed it to show Hollywood their support. Movies are greenlit based on the kinds of movies that have been financially successful in the past. I also want them to understand that, in this case, when they are pirating or illegally downloading the movie, they are not taking money from a large faceless corporation, but from a middle class worker like many of us.

Respectfully,
David Ren

[–] angelempress722 17 years ago

By the way, I admire Hayden for her contributions to this film. I would love it if she continues helping out with Asian American causes and happenings!

[–] 17 years ago

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[–] maxe14777 17 years ago

I like the idea of what you're doing and the premise of this movie, even with the finite amount of resources at your disposal I doubt you could have done much more.

But if it was possible to have done so, I would have cast somebody like Daniel Henney (who is an ex-patriate asian-american actor in Korea for precisely the reason this movie was made). Something tells me even someone as famous as him would have seriously considered a role in a movie like this if and when the opportunity presents itself.

Imo this would not only initially appeal to the meager minority 3.6% of asians in the U.S but definitely gain the attention of a huge chunk of a much greater asian population in asia.

[–] zzbamzz 17 years ago

I honestly don't have the time to view it at the screening but my cousin and I will support it by buying two DVDs. This movie brings truth to the saying "if you want something done right, do it yourself."

[–] 17 years ago

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[–] hywellda 17 years ago

If you put your life savings on a casino table, into the stock market,
or in a producer's hands,
don't worry about your money afterward.

I sure won't.
YOU GAVE IT AWAY!

[–] johnnylee84 17 years ago

Wow, what an insensitive thing to say. Name another romantic comedy/drama starring an Asian American male? There isn't any, because to Hollywood, it's unmarketable. Obviously, the investors could care less about money. Otherwise, they would invest in a low budget action or horror film. Those films always make money on DVD no matter how crappy they are.

I loved this movie. Some people might not and that's fine. But regardless of whether they liked it or not, it's unacceptable that most people are stealing the film without any intention to pay for it when it's released. For a movie like Spider Man 3, I couldn't care less. Those movies are made purely for money.

To use your analogy, what if you put your life savings on a roulette table and people are stealing it from the table before the wheel stops spinning? That's what's happening here.

Why did Justin Lin put up his life savings for Better Luck Tomorrow? According to him, he had many offers from major studios to produce the film if he changed the characters to caucasian. If he only cared about money, he would've taken the offers, made a white film, and probably still have a career today. So, you still think it's about money? It was never about money!

The difference between Better Luck Tomorrow and Shanghai Kiss is:

1. Better Luck Tomorrow wasn't leaked on the internet more than a month before release. If it was, it wouldn't have lasted beyond its initial few theaters.

2. 5 years ago, internet piracy wasn't as rampant is it is now.

If tens of thousands of people were downloading Better Luck Tomorrow before release, Asian American cinema would be completely different today. There would probably be no Shanghai Kiss, no Saving Face, nor 90% of the Asian American films afterwards. But investors thoughts: If Better Luck Tomorrow could have an all Asian cast and still be moderately successful, maybe we can too.

[–] MosHr 17 years ago

I also want them to understand that, in this case, when they are pirating or illegally downloading the movie, they are not taking money from a large faceless corporation, but from a middle class worker like many of us.

I hate this kind of ass-backwards thinking. I would have never heard of your movie had it not been for the internet file sharing community. You should think of it as they doing free distribution and publicity for you. Most people who download would have never bought a DVD for a low-budget movie with very limited marketing called Shanghai Kiss in the first place. I'm sure some people who watch it will like the movie and buy the DVD or try and go watch it in the theater when it comes local (WINK, WINK: asian guys and white girl date movie) or recommend it to other people.

[–] johnnylee84 17 years ago

I hate this kind of ass-backwards thinking. I would have never heard of your movie had it not been for the internet file sharing community. You should think of it as they doing free distribution and publicity for you.
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There are many people, myself included, who have heard of the movie, and really wanted to see it. They can't, however, because it's not released yet so they end up downloading it. Many people don't watch movies more than once, so what's the point of buying it if they've seen it?

It's your ass-backwards thinking that makes independent movies harder to make. Ever since the "internet file-sharing community", studios have relied more on big opening weekends and marketing campaigns, with no chance for a film to expand based on word of mouth. More and more great indie films are going straight to DVD. Justify stealing all you want but there is a reason Hollywood is so concerned with internet piracy. You can come up with reasons why internet piracy is good or bad but the bottom line is, as of 2007, it is illegal. It is against the law. How can normally decent people break the law and think it's okay?

[–] David_Ren 17 years ago

The truth is, internet piracy does harm the film industry, especially independent films, whether you want to accept it or not. You argue it creates exposure for the film. You say that you would have never heard of the movie otherwise. The reality is, if a movie is of quality, it will always find its audience. More people will discover it every year. Sooner or later, you will hear of it regardless of the internet.

You can say that people who like it will end up buying the DVD. What about the people who don't like it? Whether they liked it or not, they still watched 105 minutes of entertainment for free. There are plenty of movies that I hated. I still paid to see them because the filmmakers worked hard and the studio spent millions of dollars just so I could have the privilege of hating the movie. Half the gross of any film is from people who didn't like it.

Internet piracy has completely destroyed the Asian film industry and Hollywood is next. Small independent films that, in the past, could've have time to build an audience, is rushed out of theaters after the first week. There is so much reliance on opening weekend because after opening weekend, everyone can download it online. Even films like Napoleon Dynamite, a $250k budget success story, had tens of millions in marketing behind it. Films these day need more marketing dollars to combat piracy, to convince people to actually pay to see it. Marketing has become so expensive that for most indie films, a theatrical release is financial suicide.

The result is: less daring films are being made.

Studies show that most people who download a movie, even if they love it, do not pay to see it or buy the DVD. Most people who like a movie do not tell their friends to see it. They just watch it, delete it, and never mention it again. Most people believe that an independent film is not worth buying after they've seen it, as opposed to Harry Potter, which had $100m worth of special effects, therefore justifying a purchase.

So what kind of publicity is this? If internet downloading were beneficial to independent filmmakers in anyway, why aren't any of them releasing their film for free on YouTube? By your logic, there would be a ton of exposure, everybody could watch it for free, and the ones who like it will buy it.

David Ren

[–] punisher_vcc 17 years ago

True.I just saw the DvDRiP is released today , and I WAS going to download it.
In respect to your wishes , I won't.
I was waiting for this movie , And I know that it is going to be a good one.
Ironically enough , I will be in China in a couple of months (and after that India) , so I hope I can buy the official DvD.

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VERITAS VOS LIBERABIT
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[–] David_Ren 17 years ago

The DVD will be out in all stores across North America on Tuesday. Send me a message and let me know what you think after you've watched it.

David Ren

[–] howardwan 17 years ago

Mr. Ren,

I found out about Shanghai Kiss from James Berardinelli's review on Reelviews.net; I'm a fan of Ken Leung and I'm planning to purchase a copy of your DVD to support your work and the Asian American cause, for whatever it's worth.

Best wishes~

PS. FYI, there is somebody on your IMDb page board (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1975630/board/thread/65026605) claiming to be you, under a different (former?) username.

[–] cinderblock 17 years ago

Hi David, my fiancee and I saw the movie tonight on DVD and we loved it. We felt it was a very realistic movie and had some of the more funny pieces of dialogue that we could remember.

We did feel the (SPOILER ALERT!!!) that giving the house to the Kelly Hu character was much too melodramatic and unrealistic. Before the scene occured my fiancee said to me "Do you think he'll give the house to Micki?" I said to her that it would kill the movie for me if it did. Well the scene happened, but it wasn't as bad as I thought. I then said to myself "watch Micki give the house to her gangster boyfriend as a con." That scene never happened, but it did in the deleted scene.

We thoroughly enjoyed the movie and hope you much success in the future.

[–] imhy200 17 years ago

Can i buy the DVD in Australia? When?
Thanks

[–] zhu_wei_li 17 years ago

Holy Crap I just watched my life retold (well not exactly but very very similar).

David Ren I loved the movie, it was one of those movies that was just about life that I like so much!

I of course I admit that I had watched a pirated version but just to let you know I support what I like and your film is something I really liked. I felt connected to the main character because he reminded me so much of myself...that and he did a really good job of acting, I seriously thought he had herpes hahaha!

Also I'd like to add that it is impossible to stop pirating, it will happen one way or the other, just have to figure out a good way to compete against them much like how the record labels had to cope with radio stations back in the day(Perhaps the video streaming business doesn't need to stick to one tactic HMMM) I definitely don't want to see artists like yourself to stop making the movies I like but the truth is the truth...

Anyways keep up the great work, I'm definitely getting a copy for myself and a few friends who I think would love this movie.

[–] ajmal-m 17 years ago

The unfortunate reality of the situation is that in these times of high-speed internet and a growing awareness of downloading, most if not all films are available for download before their DVD street date or intended release date.

For better or for worse, this is a reality that film makers from around the globe need to grasp.

Just as the music industry has slowly adapted to new models of music distribution (eg iTunes), the film industry may have to go through a similar restructure of its model at some time in the near future.

I'm not condoning or condemning such actions on the past of the downloaders but the quicker that film makers release that its not 'personal' but another factor of the development of the internet, the better off we'll all be.

[–] alfred-valrie 17 years ago

I just rented this movie from Blockbuster. I thought everyone did a good job. Hayden's part was cute. The main guy does great deadpan. Kelly Hu was unrecognizable from "The Scorpion King," which was also nice. Speaking of "The Scorpion King," how can a woman ride around naked on a horse and not get chaffed in certain key places? It's a mystery.

I recommend "Shanghai Kiss" to everyone.

[–] 17 years ago

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