Every black person I've talked to about this film hates it, I don't understand why.. this movie is anti-racist it shows the negative consequences of having hate towards other races, one of my black friends didn't seem to get it and says he hates the movie because it is "racist".
Has anyone else noticed this, or if you are black can you tell me what you thought of the film?
Thanks.
It can be viewed that all of the hatred was caused by the actions of the black performers in the movie. The black gang seemed to start the trouble in each instance.
With that being said - I still think this was a great movie
Yeah, I suppose that's why, they might feel that the film stereotypes young black men as thugs and gangsters. However, Sweeney doesn't fit this mold so they should look at both sides of the race issue addressed in the film, he managed to change as he got older, something Derek managed but it was sadly too late for Danny.
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they lost to ed norton and some unathletic lookin white dudes at hoops
shareMost interracial crime or 90% of it is by black people against white people. In that way the movie was 100% correct that its usually the black gangs that start violent *beep* and now the neo-nazi's are basically the victims, as are most other white people by black dominated neighbourhoods and cities. Made all the more worse by useless democratic policies that keep black people stuck on welfare depedence, crime and poverty.
share90% of statistics are made up on the spot. You sir get the moron of the day award for your narrow minded and downright racist post.
Always remember to read the small print, it helps avoid confusion.
I'm a black person and I love this film. But that's also because I'm a movie enthusiast. But I can see why black people hate this film.
It is very heavy-handed and realistic with the racism and because it deals with the microcosm of Los Angeles, from the viewpoint of white supremecists, many might struggle to relate to it or its characters.
As a black person, I always feels raw and uncomfortable when movies show the liberal use of *beep* and constant Nazi and racist images used by racists. This general feeling of bad humour might translate to overall hate for such a movie- so its likely other black people felt the same.
Also, the black characters (especially the Crip gang members) are never really fully developed. They are just portrayed as violent, aggressive and antagonists. As an outsider to that world, I am forced to dislike these characters. However, this isn't the case with the other two main black characters- the guy in the laundry (who almost feels a little bit like the Magical Negro and is there to spell it out for Derek) and Dr Sweeney. Dr Sweeney is especially great in providing introspective and to challenge the racist belief Derek has that all black people are troublemakers looking to take advantage of others.
Overall, this film is from Derek and Danny's viewpoints and the black people in the film are simply utilitarian, serving their development arcs. But that is also what I like about this film- because I see Derek and Danny as victims too and it is their story.
The film's message that hate in any direction is always going to be bad for everyone, especially the haters themselves, to be a universal message, which is why I love this film.
Well you pretty much summed it up there, I feel that I understand now. :)
shareAwesome post.
share^^ What he said.
I'm Mexican-American and I have many of the same thoughts as Deano about movies that portray any minority in the same light that this movie did. I guess from my viewpoint, it does get upsetting that most Latino and black characters tend to portray the same shady character over and over.
I do find this movie to be a great movie by itself. It shows hatred can flow from all directions. It shows the complexity of how people get where they are. However, it just another movie that contributes to the negative portrayal of minorities, even if Whites are also portrayed negatively.
Some will argue that this movie was meant to be seen from the viewpoint of the white characters (specifically the 2 main characters) but that argument is moot since just about every US movie appears to be from the viewpoint of whites. A more extreme example of what I am trying to explain is the portrayal of Indians (natives / indigenous people) in westerns movies back in the 30's to 50's. It seems like 9 out of 10 movies with Indians had them portrayed as the evil characters and of course it lead to some negative views towards Indians. Hollywood then did a complete 180 and by the 70's and later, it appeared 9 out of 10 movies with Indians had them portrayed as good guys. Right now, how blacks and latinos are portrayed is similar to the 30's to 50's portrayal of Indians.
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I'm a very white looking Mexican (guess the Spanish blood is heavy in me). But my older brother and several members of my extended family do have that middle eastern look but nothing overwhelming.
shareThe film's message that hate in any direction is always going to be bad for everyone, especially the haters themselves, to be a universal message, which is why I love this film.
What a brilliant comment, Thank you. And agree, one of my top 10 movies.
shareI thought Lamont's character was done well and he didn't seem to be shown in a bad light. To me we were seeing a guy who really wanted the hate to end and was doing something to make that happen. I think he felt that if he could get through to someone like Derek it would filter down to others in Derek's life and really make a difference.
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Interesting post-thanks for taking the time.
"Gentlemen you can't fight in here!" "This is the war room!" Dr. Strangelove
Good post. Too much in history and currently we look at certain groups and say "good guys" and "bad guys"
This movie is great because it shows that there are white people who are good guys and white people who are bad guys,
And it also shows that there are black people who are good guys and black people who are bad guys.
Liberalism is a mental illness, and it's the only one that's contagious.
Excellent post
shareBlack female here. This has always been one of my favorite films. Norton was absolutely amazing! Great story, well directed, etc. The racial stuff doesn't bother me because it's truth.
"Fate rarely calls upon us at a moment of our choosing."
Wow, that is an awesome post. It's hard not to get emotional about this film in general but your post has the same effect. With everything in the news today we'd all be wise to listen to the message that hate is always going to be bad for everyone.
shareI am a black woman and I loooove this movie! This is one of my most favorite movies of all time! In fact, this movie is so good, I feel that they should show it in high schools. Everyone that I know (black and white) really liked this movie.
I guess it could be somewhat uncomfortable for some people b/c it comes from the view of a white supremacist and they may struggle with empathizing with them. Perhaps...... I haven't met anyone that did not like it so I really can't say.
I grew up in a city that was 99% white, so I am used to the 'n' word... although I don't agree with it's usage ;-) . I remember always being told "you are not like other blacks".... from people that had NEVER met a black person in their life! Which is kind of like Derricks' (Ed Norton's) character. His point of view changed when he befriended a black man in prison AND when he learned that the other Skinheads were motivated by money, not the love of their race as he initially thought and taught. The irony is that his black friend protected him from the Skinheads when they turned on him, by having the other blacks act as Derricks bodyguards.
I trained a diversity course called 'Managing Inclusion'. It shows how we are more alike than different. How learning about others can change the way you think about them. I agree that it is a anti-racist movie. Like you, I can't imagine why a black person would not like it.
I really like this movie, and I think it would make a good instructional film (obv. that would never fly, due to any language, violence, sex/nudity .... which of course no teenager hasn't been exposed to a zillion times already ...) I think the violence in this movie is instrumental to the impact of the movie, because, even as a fairly desensitized and jaded fellow, the violent scenes made me feel ill.
HOWEVER, I did feel that it portrayed black boys as this constant, unsympathetic and unchanging source of hatred and violence -- essentially inhuman -- while the two white brothers were shown to be capable of redemption. We never got an insight as to why the black "thugs" came to be the way they are, nor do we really get any insight into their feelings and motivations, whereas these are all exposed for the brothers (the *literal* brothers ;) ).
The movie *does* have a bit of a black-and-white feel to it (no pun intended), and feels kind of predictable, maybe 1 dimensional in the storytelling (perhaps 2-dimensional in some spots). And sure, there was the one "token black friend" in prison, but frankly, it was hard to see how he had anything to do with the other "black thugs", as we never really see a dark side to him. The fact that this story was painted with easy brush strokes kind of leads to these impressions I got.
That being said, an excellent movie! The quote "has anything you done actually made your life better?" is something I try to ask myself every time I am mad at the world, myself, etc. It's really the central point of the movie (and life) - it doesn't really matter whether racism/hatred/resentment is "justified" or not, or what the differences/similarities between races/cultures are -- is discrimination and hatred actually going to make you a happier person?
" ... take it easy on the brothers, a'ight? The *brothers*! "
It was a pretty even-handed film in the way it portrayed hatred and ignorance.
It goes without saying that the skinheads were portrayed as violent, useless idiots. But it also showed that some were driven to join them for valid reasons, and that some had legitimate concerns. At which point they were just preyed upon by a twisted, manipulative man.
Also it showed that the black crowd was every bit as capable of senseless, cold-blooded premeditated murder as the Nazis.
I was rather surprised by this, as I was expecting yet another typical Hollywood story of "white guys bad, everyone else good." I can't be the only one who was surprised. I'm sure it ticked a lot of people off.
So the screenwriter gets points for that. And most of the acting was very good. But the story was very predictable, and it did not do a convincing job of portraying Derek's conversion to good guy. On balance, a decent flick, worth watching. It's a 6/10.
The thing about black culture that from the late 60s and on, despite civil rights, is it is stuck in a cult ghetto mindset. I'm not saying that there aren't black people what work hard and make it out or come from a background free of "The Hood". It's just that the damage has been done and their are legions of ghetto thinking and generation gangs much like some of the Hispanic/Latino communities that stuffer from this as well although, it might or might not be as a severe case. The damage done when the opportunities ceased to exist like they do today imprinted a devastating cult mindset hard to break away from if not addictive in state. So when you see white people saying well there's a black president, there's equal everything (most fail to acknowledge that institutional racism is still maintained), so why can't these people get their act together. There's a reason why.
share@Smokescreen
Excuse me, but you make it sound like "black culture" is concentrated only in the ghetto---it's not,because all black people don't live in the city,some of us actually live in rural areas too,you know or that all black folks are completely *beep* considering all the s*** we're been through in this country,we're already been as *beep* as you can get when it come to race.
Anyway, to make it short, I'm tired of people making blanket statements about "black culture" as if we're all one big,blank monolith with no distinguishing characteristics.
It's just that the damage has been done and their are legions of ghetto thinking and generation gangs much like some of the Hispanic/Latino communities that stuffer from this as well although, it might or might not be as a severe case. The damage done when the opportunities ceased to exist like they do today imprinted a devastating cult mindset hard to break away from if not addictive in state. So when you see white people saying well there's a black president, there's equal everything (most fail to acknowledge that institutional racism is still maintained), so why can't these people get their act together. There's a reason why.
No I never stated or was ever convinced that ghetto culture and black culture were synonymous. I'm talking about the specific people that are stuck in the ghetto, while there are many instances of people that live their for various reasons, that maintain ill lifestyles. I've seen it first hand as I have immediately family that lived in these conditions as a 1st generation immigrant myself. But shocking to you and whatever the media has made you to believe, there are still a more white (not necessarily white supremacist based) that actually live and perpetuate the ghetto moreso than all people of color combined. You see the media loves to deny the facts but if you look at the sheer numbers and drive around every city in America. Places in Massachusetts and Pennsylvania, you clearly see that there are more white people, in sheer numbers, that perpetuate a certain lifestyle. That's what makes the media and prison complex bias a big hypocrisy.
shareActually I'm black and I really enjoyed this movie. The acting was great. The issues discussed were great and could cause controversy but yeah it was a good movie. An excellent movie to be honest
shareI'm black and I love this movie. But I've loved Edward Norton and Edward Furlong for ages, so there's that. ;)
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"We're going to see the elves!"
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Because the movie is racist and completely unrealistic.
shareNope, you're the racist. An anti-interracial, insecure poor excuse for a human being. You're exactly just like the skinheads in this movie, just a different shade probably but poorly led and thoroughly misguided. You generalize every 'white' person as being part of some sort of massive conspiracy against black folks. You're only hurting yourself and perpetuating a constant distance between blacks and whites by spewing this BS rhetoric.
Watching this movie makes me feel more and more that we should all come together, every race, and squash this race based non-sense.
Go ahead keyboard warrior and bask in your one track racist mind, keep setting the clock back on race relations until you die, there's plenty of us who will keep going forward.
Try dating outside your race one day, you might learn something there al sharpton
Hear hear!
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Could you sound like more of a dumbass saying that?
shareIf that's your take then you missed the point of the movie. Sure, racism exists in this movie, but that's the point. There might be a little lack of realism in some of the smaller areas, but it certainly hit the spot as far as the idea of being the product of your upbringing. Case in point, the second time I watched this was with a large group of my friends back in 99, along with a guy who was a member of a large white supremacist family, yet he was the one who saw the folly in it and had done so by his teens. As we went along, he pointed out all the realism of it, not only in the way the organization worked, but all the subtle little things like rhetoric and paraphernalia. Afterwards we discussed how easy it is to fall into patterns laid out to you by your family, and how we're the products of our own upbringing, and unless we can consciously break free of the negative parts of it we can't break the circle. The main points in this movie are all based in realism, sorry you can't see that.
Always remember to read the small print, it helps avoid confusion.