MovieChat Forums > The Full Monty (1997) Discussion > Why do the English worry about accents?

Why do the English worry about accents?


Can someone from England please explain why speech and accent are an issue in England? I am American who lived in the Midlands for three years in the late sixties. I heard it a number of times from different people that they were worried about their accent. Those folks indicated that they wish they could speak like the "news person on the TV. It seems like they were worried that they would be deemed as being "low" class.

As Americans, we have a lot of different accents. We may remark that a person has a Southern, New England, or maybe a Brooklyn accent, but we generally don't think any less of the person. I am not trying to insult anyone, but it was just something I noticed while living there.

Again, I am not trying to insult anyone and I am not trying to say Americans speak better.

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Its definitely to do with stereotypes...

IDK, I'm from Yorkshire, and so's my sister, right, and when she went to Uni there were loads of people from the South and they all treated her like she was a commoner.

I think it might be people in the South, thinking that up North we're all common? I think middle-class and up are down South, and then maybe working-class are up North... but I don't know, I know it's not all like that all over England.

Also, some accents are annoying. (:

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I have to disagree with you 'blytheberesford'.

I was born and brought up in rural Yorkshire on the South Yorkshire/North Yorkshire border and i speak with a broad Yorkshire accent, i am however well educated and come from a good Middle-Class family.

The idea that Southerners are more wealthy than Northerners is a myth, the wealth is more noticeable down South because Southerners insist on driving flash cars and buying the most expensive house they can find. They are constantly trying to outdo everybody else with varying displays of wealth.

This 'keeping up with the Joneses' mentality keeps them happy for a short while until they lose it all, they then cannot comprehend why or how this could have possibly happened. They are obviously not the smarter region otherwise they would not behave in this manner.

Northerners are much more sensible with their money, which is why there are more southerners hit by the recent financial crisis than there are Northerners. Just because they are not all driving Rolls Royces' and living in Mansions does not mean that they do not have as much money as people from the South.

I have friends who come from london and sometimes they cannot understand what i am saying, they keep telling me that i should speak properly, however what is to say that the way in which they speak is correct.

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The main reason why it is a big issue is that, prior to the First World War, there were still difficulties in communication between different areas of England. Received Pronunciation was adopted by the B.B.C. and the army as official pronunciations that everyone would come to understand.

To illustrate just how big the gap was, listen to some old recordings:

http://sounds.bl.uk/View.aspx?item=021M-C0908X0048XX-0200V0.xml This is how people from Sheffield used to sound.

http://sounds.bl.uk/View.aspx?item=021M-C0908X0061XX-0400V0.xml On the other hand, people from rural Suffolk sounded like this.
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http://sounds.bl.uk/View.aspx?item=021M-C0908X0046XX-0400V0.xml This one from the Yorkshire Dales is impregnable. I doubt that this dialect is still in use.

I have an urban Yorkshire accent. I can understand the Sheffield clip here but not the Suffolk one or the Yorkshire Dales one.

Can an American understand any of these three?

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I'm from New England and if I listen carefully I can understand most of the Sheffield and Suffolk clips, though nothing at all of the Yorkshire Dales one. Funny thing, as soon as I heard the Suffolk clip, it reminded me of the eastern-Massachusetts ("Boston") accent spoken by people whose family roots are old New England. Much of the emigration from England to New England came from East Anglia, so that would fit. It's really interesting to hear possible evidence of that connection.

So many people come from all over the US to the universities in Boston that most people here speak with the basic, mid-Atlantic, "newscaster" American accent. You might say that the people here who speak with the Boston accent are closer to the "town" side of the town-gown divide, and one might make some assumptions from that, but these people are so often your police officers, your Mayor, your banker, that you can't talk in terms of discrimination. The retired firefighter in this clip (http://link.brightcove.com/services/link/bcpid1185143625/bctid11812033001) speaks with a classic Boston accent. It's quite a lovely story, too.

The Boston accent is different from the Maine and Rhode Island accents, so there's as much regional difference here as other writers in this thread have said there is in Southern accents.

Thanks for posting the links--really interesting!

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There is still much stigma regarding regional accents. Sometimes we are pressured into speaking a stronger regional accent, it's a way of asserting our heritage, almost like bragging about being regional. But more often people try to lose their regional accents. I come from near Sheffield, Pontefract West Yorkshire. And I know that many people I know who have returned from university have different accents now! It used to be that everyone with a southern accent was a ponce, and everyone with a northern accent was a monkey... Well maybe the former is still true :p

If you are from Glasgow, Liverpool, Birmingham, Cornwall, etc there is still a good chance you will be discriminated against. But if you're accent is strong enough, you're f&%ked wherever you come from, mucka.

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I think that this is true for most of England, but it seems that the reverse is true in Scotland. People who speak like the Queen are more likely to get rejected from jobs in Scotland than anyone else, as Received Pronunciation is not popular. I am not sure what the situation is in Wales.

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The only accent I really hate in the UK is the type spoken by the local cop (and the townsfolk) in the movie Hot Fuzz. I'm not sure what you call this accent but I'd shoot myself if I ever spoke like that.

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XD XD XD @ the above poster...
before I even read your post (bzyk) I was about to start typing about how my Gloucester (Hot Fuzz) accent makes new friends think I grew up on a farm or own a cider factory.

Obviously speaking it myself, and people around me, I'm used to it, but there are nicer accents, I agree. I quite like scouse. And Scottish, I think sounds lovely on both sexes.

Every Jack has his Jill.

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i think the main reason there is still such stigma surrounding accents is the fact that accent is still, to some degree, an indicator of wealth and education. it's not a hard and fast rule, but privately-educated and middle-class people tend to speak RP or near-RP (RP = received pronunciation or "bbc english") no matter where they're from, because that is how they are taught speak. that means that RP is associated with the rich and the well-educated, and unfortunately a lot of people think that means people who speak with RP are smarter. that's completely ridiculous - the smartest person i know has a broad lincolnshire accent, and i've met a lot of toffs (posh people, for any non-brits) with less common sense than a five year old - but unfortunately that's what a lot of people think.

as for why we have so many accents in the first place, there are several factors involved. firstly, invasion and immigration have meant that different areas of britain have come into contact with different nationalities, and therefore different languges and accents, which have affected british accents in different ways (the main reason for the north/south divide is the fact that the vikings settled mainly in the north, so that old norse affected old english more there than in the south). secondly, there are environmental factors - for example, brummies speak very loudly, which i believe has something to do with the fact that the city was so industrial in the 19th century that people had to shout to be heard over the machines, and that habit has been passed down over the years; and the dust from the coal mines in the north of england affected the vocal chords and therefore the accents of northerners. it also has to be remembered that, until relatively recently, communication and transport were very poor, restricting contact between different regions. this allowed accents to develop almost in isolation, keeping each one distinctive.

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I think that the main thing about different accents is people notice when other people are different from them, whether its clothing, skin color, accent, etc. If we are unfamiliar with something, we tend to be wary of it. I don't think that necessarily is prejudice, but obviously it affects how people make decisions.

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I myself was born in Florida and raised in N.J. I love my N.J. accent and so do others...I also love all accents from the UK whether it be from England, Wales, Scotland or Ireland!! I love watching movies from those countries as well as Asian, European, South American, Afican, etc-what I'm trying to say is what I love about the different movies is the different accents and the different cultures. People shouldn't feel ashamed of where they are from or how they sound to others. It's who they are and they should be proud of that!!
Cheers!

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[deleted]

"As Americans, we have a lot of different accents. We may remark that a person has a Southern, New England, or maybe a Brooklyn accent, but we generally don't think any less of the person."

Excuse me but I have to disagree. People with Southern, New England or Brooklyn accents may not get discriminated against, but people who speak with Spanish accent, Asian accent or Middle Eastern accent face discrimination and even rediculed for their "poor" English especially in the media on a daily basis.

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^ Ever occured to you the reason why such people are ridiculed is because they don't even try to improve their english to start with? In my opinion it's called for.

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Can we please not act like ugly Americans in front of the British? Where are our manners?

BTW it's absolutely true that people are profiled in the US based on their accents. Southern accents indicate laziness and stupidity. New York accents (and there are many) tend to range from haughty & arrogant to hostile & slow witted. Californian accents tend to be more laid back. Midwestern accents indicate you're merely average. New Englanders sound pompous & smug. Chicagoan accents sound kinda dangerous. I'm from the Northwest and we're kinda... plain. No accent to be had. If anything we speak in a dull, nasal, monotone. Nothing special about us at all. I suppose our accents indicate we're boring. Still I suppose I'd rather be regarded as boring than stupid or hostile.

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Don't assume it's laziness; not everyone has the facility for learning a foreign language perfectly. My brother-in-law is japanese and came to the US when he was 12. After 20+ years, he still has a definite accent. He has a college degree, speaks English fluently, works with medical terminology and deals with the public on a regular basis, but he just can't shake the accent. He's done a far sight better than I could do if I had to learn japanese. So kindly toss your assumptions about "lazy foreigners" as they're largely unfounded.

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