MovieChat Forums > Fresh (1994) Discussion > Did he HAVE to hang the dog?

Did he HAVE to hang the dog?


I mean, I understand him having to "put it out of its misery", but was it necessary to string it up by it's collar and shoot it while it was dangling?

That scene is difficult to watch.

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I could not watch that scene, in fact, I could not watch the film after that. Animals suffering at the hands of people break my heart.

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The scene where Jake shoots Curtis and the little girl was MUCH more
violent and shocking in my opinion.

However, I did not quite understand that dog execution scene either. Did somebody understand its meaning ?

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did he HAVE to? no
was it a part of the movie? yes
get over it. you know it isn't real. i remember reading a similar post about "The DanCer Upstairs" which is a movie about a detective's hunt for a Guerrilla terrorist who happens to live in the apartment below a dnacer who the detective falls for. anyway, there is a scene near the begining of the movie where there are a bunch of dogs hanging by their necks from street lights. it's disturbing, yes, but in a post on IMDb a woman said she was going to complain to some federal agency about animal cruelty. the fact that some people think stuff like this is real is just a sign of pure idiocy. i'm not saying any of you think the scene was actually done with a live dog but i mean take yourself out of the movie for a second and just realize that stuff like that is in the movie for effect. it is there to reel you in further.

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Hey KirbyCycle, no *beep* it isn't real, that wasn't the question nor was it the topic.

I'd like to know the answer to that too. I just watched the movie tonight on On Demand and hanging the dog up first was completely pointless. He had a gun, what does he need to hang it for? You aim and fire, the dog dies. It's not complicated. For being a smart kid in this movie that was the dumbest thing he did.

Does anyone know why he had to hang the dog before shooting it? I've looked on all the threads and no one has directly answered that.

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[deleted]

Remember, there are several things going on for this scene. Obviously it can be stated that he killed the dog because:

1. Seeing the dog living reminded him of his dead friend Chucky
2. The dog was now a killer, and he wanted to end the life of a killer
3. It was a symbol of his youth; that by 'killing the dog' he was killing his own innocence, letting that part of him die in a brutal way so that he could be free to do what he had to do.

All of those things COULD be right in the movie, or none of them, or only of them. I don't really know. I agree with you completely on that point, and wonder why people think there has to be a concrete answer in such a movie; where symbolism is such an important issue.

As for the hanging point? Let's be clear; it was the only way to be sure. Shooting the dog might wound it, and cause the dog to run or panic, etc. This way the dog was stationary and dead. But it also allowed Fresh the chance to look the dog in its eyes; to stare his innocence in the face, if you will, and end it. To let his childhood end, to kill his childhood, and move forward to take the steps he would need to end the other people's lives.

peace
joe

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I have to say I object to the use of the term 'brilliant'. What you probably don't see is that for a lot of people - I would guess the majority - the scene isn't brilliant because it completely fails to make its point by using overly graphic imagery for what is really an obvious metaphor. To me that's not brilliant - it's obnoxious.

Now it's all down to opinions, of course. But I have to say the dog scene really turned me off too. But overall I still like the movie. It's a little stilted at times but a good story.


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So a boy killing a dog really turned you off?

But seeing a man killing a boy and a girl in a previous scene did not turn you off?

You scare me.

An earlier post had it right; the dog had to die and Fresh had to kill him. Remember, it was Fresh who rescued that dog and it was Fresh who was against turning him into a killer. The movie might as well have been called, "How Fresh Became a Man", because that was the underlying thread throughout.

One of the steps in that process was putting the dog down; he had many other steps to cross in a short period of time. He needed to know that he could make all of the moves he had planned out.

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This scene was pretty easy for me to watch....you know why??

Ya, well, ummm, maybe it was the fact when it goes to showing the dogs face, you can CLEARLY see he's standing on a stool or somethin, smiling at the camera, and it is JUST a movie, but really, I don't know its messed up I guess.

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yeah i always thought it was funny how fake the dog looked hanging,
cuz it looked like a dumb, happy dog, and they just added the struggling sound
effects later

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Yup, just like the dogfight scene, where two unclipped pits are clearly seen wrasslin' with each other, while a room full of extras pretends they are at a dog fight. Pretty sure those dogs weren't even "professional" animal actors, just somebody's pets.

Those parts were almost as silly as the attack scenes in "Cujo."

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I agree with you completely. The scene would have lost its impact if he just shot the dog. There had to be a build-up.

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Killing the dog - the film is all a game of chess... he gave up a piece he loved, somethign that could be used as weakness in his game.

Sam had just explained about to fresh over a game of chess, peoples weakness about holding onto the pieces they like - his Knight on the board...

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Killing the dog - the film is all a game of chess... he gave up a piece he loved, somethign that could be used as weakness in his game...
Excellent observation/comparison.

And this thread wasn't meant to be about concern for the dog, as much as it was about hanging the dog before shooting it. I still don't really understand why he hung it first. It would have sat there, or he could have tied it to a fence, or even the ladder that was right there.

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I don't see why he had to kill the dog in the first place.

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I think Fresh felt the dog was a danger and had to get rid of him. As to why he felt the need to hang the dog and shoot the dog, I always intepreted that as something Fresh had read somewhere or had seen in a movie or something and believed it was the proper way to put a dog to sleep. I don't think he was going it just to be cruel or whatever.

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Fresh hung the dog before he shot it because he wanted to make sure that he killed it. There was no one there to hold the dog for him and common sense tells you that the dog would not have sat obediently still when Fresh went to get the gun out of it's hiding.

Sure, he could have tied the dog around a pole of some sort (which I also did NOT see any in the alley, but hey!) or just got the gun before he brought the dog to the alley, but that would have been too complicated and too risky just in case someone or the police stopped him.

I may be wrong, but it looks as though everyone is looking a little too deep into the concept of Fresh hanging the dog before shooting it.

Excellent movie!!!

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[deleted]

Yeah I hate that part too, and it was such a pretty dog. :(

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My take on the dog scene is this:

There are lots of scenes in lots of movies that aren't 100% clear, but people don't tend to question them until they're offended. For some reason a person being shot doesn't seem to shock many people, but an animal being killed ALWAYS shocks people.

The scene is meant to be difficult to watch. First off, they make it quite clear that the dog is a menace. Chucky trained the dog to be nasty, and without an owner it's just a stray who is bound to attack someone.

He's also testing himself. He's got to see if he really has the guts to do it, and like his dad explains to him, he's got to learn not to be afraid to sacrifice some small pieces in order to take the king.

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That scene was very difficult for me to watch but the entire movies was almost too difficult to watch. Especially when his little girlfriend laid there dying. Oh My God!

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This is a very tearjerking scene in the movie. As we all saw in previous scenes, Fresh had a best friend named Chuckie, a Puerto-Rican preteen. Chuckie's behavior best exemplifies an all-to-familiar beginning of some inner city drug dealers as they initiate this dangerous, illegal profession. Having watched several episodes of Animal Planet's "Animal Precinct and "Animal Cops: Detroit," it is a well-known fact that dogfighting is a cruel and illegal sport often held in inner-city areas. Drug dealers and gangs often stage these dogfights as a way to make extra money for drug supplies, as well as to provide a form of gaming and to boost morale.

Kids as young as nine or ten often start training either adopted dogs or strays to fight since this is one of the ways they could improve their "tough and featless" image that drug dealers often seek. Pitbulls are the most easily trained dogs for this sport, since this breed was conceived specifically for this purpose. Many inner city areas have large numbers of pitbulls that have either been abandoned because they cannot fight anymore due to injury or age, or are the result of strays that have reproduced. Therefore, it is very easy for these kids to get a hold of these dogs and train them to fight. In fact, dogfighters sometimes eject narcotics into these dogs before fights to make them impervious to pain, as well as to make them more aggressive. This is a very cruel sport indeed.

Back to the film, Chuckie has found a stray pitbull, and has trained it to fight with other neighborhood dogs in preparation for an illegal gambling fight in the neighborhood. We see the typical dogfight; people betting on each dog to win by taking down the other. This scene sometimes brings tears to my eyes: "Do people really do this to these poor animals?" Chuckie's dog wins the fight by killing the other dog in less than a minute, which shows the brutal nature of the sport. This victory provides a great emotional boost for Chuckie, which only results in him revealing more of his recent new job as a runner for Esteban's heroin gang. The cocaine dealer, Corky, gets wind of his plan and so greatly fears his enterprise is in jeopardy thanks to this kid revealing the secrets of a neighborhood competitor. After Fresh and he retrieve heroin hidden by Esteban, they are ambushed by some of Corky's thugs. Chuckie, still feeling a great emotional "kick" from the dogfight as well as his appointment by Esteban, brazenly draws a pistol and shoots at the dealers. Fresh drops his booty and runs, while Chuckie unfortunately meets his doom.

The next day, Fresh, deeply saddened by the loss of his friend, has figured out the dog, Roscoe, is the only remaining symbol of friendship between Chuckie and him. It appears to me that the dog is seen as an extension of Chuckie, just in a dog, rather than a human. There can be found a great amount of parallelism between Roscoe and Chuckie; for instance, both Chuckie and Roscoe were just beginning their tough lives: Chuckie a drug-runner, and Roscoe a fighting dog. In addition, Chuckie and Roscoe were seemingly lost in the ghetto world; Chuckie can be a really nice kid, but poverty has created hardship, and a desire for a better life has resulted in him conducting illegal activities. In Roscoe's case, he seems like a friendly dog, but yet is forced to fight the other dog because of training. Therefore, it can be noted that both Chuckie and Roscoe really did not want to be bad, they were caught up in the cultures of the ghetto.

To this end, Fresh, in my opinion, decides to shoot the dog for these reasons. First, Chuckie is dead now, and since the dog was a symbol of their friendship, he decided to drop all aspects of this friendship and put the past behind. Second, most urban animal shelters will not place pitbulls with a history of fighting up for adoption due to their aggressive tendencies; Roscoe would have been put to sleep anyway. Finally, it is quite possible that Fresh wanted to put Roscoe out of his misery, so that he would never have to fight again.

The dogfighting scene and the dog shooting scene are very sad scenes that bring tears to my eyes. However, they serve to juxtapose the nature of the ghetto and the illict culture that unfortuately makes these places seeminly inhospitable. I would find it hard to believe anyone not moved by these scenes.

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thats not why he did it at all. the dog was fed/housed by chuckie, and now that chuckie was dead, who was going to feed it? he couldnt keep it. and it would be a dangerous stray, as someone said before. but you're not supposed to think that far into it. you're supposed to understand he did it because he has to, and doesnt like doing it (in every killing, he looks sad).

why did fresh do all of it? to get rid of "the men", and ultimately free himself and his sister. he used all of the drug people as pawns.

but why did he hang it? theres no real reason, i guess. i agree with the guy above me a little bit, i think fresh thought it was the best/least painful way to end the dog's life.

but no, fresh isnt messed up. at least, not too much.

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[deleted]

Did anybody else notice that before Chucky was shot, he was pinned down helplessly with no way to run? The way that the dog dies (strapped with no ability to move) parallel's Chucky's death.

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[deleted]

Exactly. There's elements of Fresh learning to sacrifice his pieces, learning to become ruthless, etc.. Roscoe definitely symbolizes Chuckie, and they are Fresh's two knights. Like Chuckie said, "I got stupid moves," i.e. a knight in chess. Sam observed that Fresh liked his knights almost as much as his queen.

Anyways, Chuckie got pinned down (sometimes pieces get "pinned" in chess) and killed. Boaz demonstrated that Roscoe was the other knight by dispatching him in the same way.

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Your kidding yourself if you think Fresh wasn't messed up. He was a good kid for the most part, but that life he was living fuqqed with his head. Fresh definately didn't kill the dog to be cruel. I definately agree, he did it for the dogs best interest. He always seem concern for the dog, and didn't want it to fight. Those dog scene's were hard and disturbing to watch. Especially from someone who loves animals and has a dog themselves. If you like dogs, or not, it still had to be pretty disturbing not matter what. Were left to speculate, whether Fresh killed the dog because of Chuck, or for it's own good, because it became a killer, or because it had no place to go. I think it's a bit of all the above.

Also, no one said those kids getting shot wasn't disturbing. The topic was about the dog, so stop getting your panties in a knot. They were all disturbing.

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THe scene is one of those that film makers put in, intending it to be ambiguous and provoke a multitude of responses. The visual is specific and necessary, but the meaning is open. To me it was a symbolic extention of his involvement in the murder of his friend and his self imposed responsibility of that murder. Even if he didn't pull the trigger, even if he tried to save his friend, he killed him.

However from listening to the commentary, Boaz explains that it was Fresh's way to pushing himself over the edge, past the point of no return in preparation for what he was about to do (take out a boatload of gangsters). It was Fresh's way of graduating to a level of man that could follow through with what he needed to do. Though, that certainly doesn't mean that my or any other interpretation is any less 'right'.

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