Was Luke Gay? - The Thorn Birds (1983) Discussion

[–] Mrs-Misfit 17 years ago

POSSIBLE GRAPHIC TEXT BELOW:

No, I never got the feeling he was gay. I am not sure when he heavily hinted about having anal sex with her. Remember that Meggie was a virgin so this was her first time having sex. She asks if it always hurts so badly when they are in the room. As for her comment that the sex is "better that way" it is because she is on top (she tricks him into thinking she can't get pregnant that way due to gravity), which is why Ann gave her a book to read which explained that, in addition to his not wearing a condom. If you have ever read The Thorn Birds it goes into more detail about this. Hope this helps.

Certainty like this comes but once in a lifetime.

reply

[–] harlemsushi 17 years ago

Well it was actually in the scene you were talking about when they had sex for the first time coupled with Meggie awkwardly trying to explain what it was that she and Luke were doing and if they could concieve that way. Also when Luke is first seen shearing sheep he is staring at one of Meggie's brothers in an odd edit. Along with the other reasons I listed above. I'll tell you what, rewatch the series with this in mind and tell me what you think. I've never read the book, but they might have taken a bit of liberty with this in the mini-series. You said the book went into more detail about that could you explain what you meant?

reply

[–] kootiecat 17 years ago

lol luke did have a few gay tendencies but I think he was just a real typical a*hole. Reminded me of my ex boyfriend luke too funnily enough whow as exactly the same, cared more about his friends than the girl. I think Luke just wanted to be a mans man and yeah, he preferred his friends than Meggie..but I don't think he was gay, just a bastard.

reply

[–] dianeorbetty 17 years ago

I agree with you, and your points were well put. I believe the miniseries did take liberties that the book did not with Luke's character and I do also believe that the miniseries portrays him as being a homosexual character for the reasons that you stated. There's also the weird shower scenes when he's at work in the cane fields. Add that to the list and I don't know if it can be argued any differently.

reply

[–] lindawinnett 17 years ago

Hey Kstrunk!..I am beginning to think that harlemsushi[b] is a troll!..whatcha think?
I have never heard such observations! GEEEEZ it's crazy the way some people see things!...where are their minds?????

[b]"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

reply

[–] harlemsushi 17 years ago

It's nice to know that just because someone has a different point of view than you that you resort to childish name calling. And frankly you can think whatever you want of me, I'm trying to foster a discussion about something in the mini-series that I noticed. Are you that threatened by an opinion other than yours?

But nevertheless, that is what is there in my opinion. Why don't you watch the scenes (I used the word scenes but I think edits may be a better word) I am refering to in the original post and then comment as opposed to just not contributing anything to a discussion.

The scenes (edits) I am refering to are before the sheep shearing competiton and after the fire around when Luke is first approached to enter the competition. He repeated stares at Meggie's brother's back. It was a very deliberate edit and not an accident. If you don't think that it supports what I am saying then tell me why you think it is presented the way it is. Luke being gay explains a lot about his character and the way he behaved by constantly overcompensating and trying to prove his machimso. I would have happily married Meggie and given her lots of children and a home but Luke for some reason had other priorities.

If you think I'm wrong all I'm asking is that you cite some evidence to the contrary within the mini-series to support your POV. That should be simple enough for someone who believes I am incorrect in my assumptions and goes so far as to call me a troll for wishing to discuss it.

reply

[–] lindawinnett 17 years ago

I did not think that you were serious in your observations!...My apologies for calling you a troll...You are definately entitled to your opinions, whatever they may be...As anyone is...I have watched the Thornbirds for over 20 years now...I have never, not once, suspected Luke of being gay. Some men just refuse to to leave their bachelor ways behind even after marriage, either by choice, or simply because they don't know how, or were never taught to "be a married man". Luke was driven to own his own sheep station...but...he kept raising the bar on himself the closer he came to his goal...Meggie (and Justine)suffered because of this. Meggie was a prize that Luke won and he put her on the shelf an forgot about her. Luke just got along better with other men...and that was his comfort zone...IMHO...

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

reply

[–] harlemsushi 17 years ago

I understand your interpretation, but I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. With respect to the edits I spoke of did you watch them? I'm curious what you think of their context as they relate to Luke's character. Aslo do you think he ever intended to give Meggie a home and buy that sheep station in Queensland?

reply

[–] Mrs-Misfit 17 years ago

I watched the scenes again last night, harlemsushi. I did see Luke at Meggie's brother but I didn't see it in an erotic way. As for your question of his intention to buy the sheep station, good one! I really don't know. It seemed like that was what he was working for but then he obviously never achieved it. I agree with goddess that Luke probably didn't want to give up his bachelor ways. So, I guess my answer would be "No."

Certainty like this comes but once in a lifetime.

reply

[–] lindawinnett 17 years ago

I have watched the parts that you spoke of...I see Luke watching, and what I consider sizing up the other guy to see just how good he is...not looking at him in a sexual manner...I do think Lukes intention was to make a life and home with Meggie, but as I stated before...he kept raising the bar (possibly unintentionally), and set a goal that was simply unrealistic in reaching, and he didnt realize it until Meggie was gone.

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

reply

[–] harlemsushi 17 years ago

Well I will say I do appreciate you two taking the time to look at that scene again and I myself also watched it tonight just to be sure. While I will admit that goddessxinda brought up an interesting point that I had not considered being that he was sizing him up, and that it also fits in with the way his character presented, I still feel that he was gay and constantly over-compensating to hide that fact. I am going to rewatch the entire mini-series fairly soon and maybe the totality of the series and taking into account the points that you made may make it seem different the second time around.

Also, I did have another question for both of you. Based on your interpretations of Luke, do you think he cheated on Meggie while he was away from her? He did let it slip out that he would go to town to dance when he visited her on Christmas wearing the kilt and that was as close as it ever came to suggesting anything. That's one of the things I loved about the series; that it was so rich and nuanced and all the characters were so vivid.

reply

[–] Seanpdineen 16 years ago

not gay. There is a deep bond in aussie society called mateship.
Its friendship, beyond what we thing of as such.
I saw it when i was over there in 2006, it was only stronger in those days.

reply

[–] 16 years ago

[deleted]

[–] lindawinnett 17 years ago

Luke Gay????? How Funny! Seems you are looking WAY to deep for something that simply is NOT there! Luke getting Meggie was all about the catch.

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

reply

[–] harlemsushi 17 years ago

Well, those scenes where he was staring at Meggie's Brother's back weren't in there by accident and a lot of the other things he did seemed very suspect. I may be reading into it but I'm just citing what I see and trying to facilicate a discussion about it with others.

reply

[–] lindawinnett 17 years ago

Well....ya know I am gonna have to look up the scenes to see that you are talking about...are they before, during or after the shearing competition? You say "those scenes", so I am assuming that you mean more than one scene.

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

reply

[–] lindawinnett 17 years ago

And as far as anal...you are waaaaay off there......

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

reply

[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] lindawinnett 17 years ago

TTHBRN....Yes...in a nutshell!....(for those that do not know which contraception Luke used...it was the withdrawl method.)

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

reply

[–] pittstate_sax_appeal 17 years ago

I've read the other replies, and I can see where you would get the idea that Luke was gay, but I have to say, I don't think he really was. He was more worried about money than about his wife. Even when I read the book, I didn't get the idea he was gay, but that he mainly married Meggie for the fact of being able have a sex slave, but that was my take. The way that I took the explanation for he preferred cutting cane, was that was how he was able to make a living. Another reason that sex hurts her, as the 'french letters' aka condoms, and the way they apparently were made back then. I don't think there was any lubrication used on them which made it extremely painful for Meggie. Also, I don't think that when this took place, they knew too much about conception, being that the reason he allowed for her to be on top (as explained in the book) is because they didn't think that a woman could conceive if she was on top because of gravity, but she wanted a baby so bad that she after they were done, she would roll over and lift her hips up to so that it would hopefully allow her to conceive. When I first watched the movie, there were a lot of things that I did not understand until after I read the book. I highly recommend you read the book by Colleen McCullough (I hope I spelled that right, I don't have the book sitting right next to me).

reply

[–] charmkat 17 years ago

The interesting thing about the answers I read here re the 'first time' sex etc, is that no-one actually appears to have read the book. If you do, it is made clear that aside from it being Meghan's 'first time', Luke always insists on using a condom which she finds uncomfortable. When they 'make a baby' it is because she gets him to have sex without a condom... and that is what she means when she says it is better that way. Read Colleen McCullogh's book for more info.

reply

[–] Mrs-Misfit 17 years ago

I, for one, have read the book several times. Please see my first reply to the OP.

Certainty like this comes but once in a lifetime.

reply

[–] pittstate_sax_appeal 17 years ago

She tricked him with a combination of being on top and not using a condom, check my previous post, i don't have the book sitting open with all the passages right in front of me, but that was one thing i clearly remembered cuz it explained more of the movie for me.

reply

[–] ColinChapman 17 years ago

To OP. No,he was just a jerk that saw his wife as a posession he could display to his friends like some prize. He needed her also to do all the housework,like cleaning,laundry all everything else.

Like most of his macho crappo kind he prefered to hang out with his friends having a good time,than treating his wife with love and respect.

Sadly,loads of women repeat Meggie's mistake and pay a heavy price.

The nazis always believed women were good for two things,taking care of housework and putting more soldiers to the world. Luke wasn't too far off these ideas.

reply

[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] ariennye 17 years ago

No, I don't think he's gay. The book provides a much clearer picture of Luke.

I don't recall them ever having anal sex. I believe he didn't know much about sex beyond what he liked himself, so he slipped on the condom and just sort of jumped on Meggie without any foreplay. What she meant by the "better this way" comment was sex without the condom.

As for the other part about his machismo and the like, he liked working himself to exhaustion and outworking other men. He could walk the walk and all, but it didn't excuse the fact that he's an egotistical asshat (in the book).

Lastly, also in the book, he makes a point of not letting himself get attached to Meggie because it would distract him from his pursuit on money. It's mentioned that he has trouble with it.

---------
"My name is Sue! How do you do!?! Now you gonna die!" - Johnny Cash

reply

[–] luvmoviesandmusic 17 years ago

No, I don't think so. He is the quintessential blokes' bloke.

Music Eternal

reply

[–] eac1027 17 years ago

I've read the book several times and seen the miniseries and while I don't know if the author actually intended it, it can totally see why someone might think Luke was gay. I remember reading the book and thinking "hmm, he's totally not into sex with her, and he seems more interested in hanging around other men, wonder if he's gay". Then in the series, he appeared to be checking out Meggie's brother who if I remember correctly, had no shirt on. I could just be reading too much into it, but I think there were some hints there, whether intended or not.

reply

[–] Gal5280 17 years ago

As mentioned in a previous post, I think Luke was just sizing up Bob, in terms of competing in the sheep shearing contest, not in a sexual way. It has to do with the male ego, and being macho, and also the way he was raised.

Meggie had a difficult time talking about sex because of her background. Look at Fee, she was a very reserved, proper woman. Remember, Fr. Ralph is the one who told Meggie the facts of life. Also, the Cleary's were a strong Catholic family, and it wasn't something that was discussed.

As for the question of whether Luke cheated on Meggie...I'm sure he did. Going to the dances, he was bound to be hit on by the women at the dances. Even Miss Carmichael hinted heavily that she wanted him to ask her to dance.

As an aside, in the book, Meggie, knowing she is pregnant with Ralph's child, sleeps with Luke one more time before leaving him. She did this so if there was any question as to Dane's paternity, she could say Luke was the father. In the mini-series, she goes to Luke's barracks with Justine, and hints that she has been sleeping around, as an alibi, should Luke ever find out about her pregnancy.

01/20/2009 - The End of An Error

reply

[–] eac1027 17 years ago

I liked the mini-series version better-where she hints that she has been sleeping around and that they are "better than Luke. It was just a slap in the face to him after the way he treated her. However, I do think that line about Like being a bad lover was in the book and the series.

reply

[–] cynicalsim 15 years ago

"I could just be reading too much into it, but I think there were some hints there, whether intended or not."

That doesn't even make sense. How could there be hints to something that just wasn't so? He wasn't written as gay, so I don't see how there can be unintended hints that he was. Don't get it. I think people are just seeing what they want to see.

reply

[–] highpriestess32 15 years ago

I'm not looking for a dispute here but I do think his character was unintentionally ambiguous. The more of the Thorn Birds I watch on Sky Freeview the more he does actually seem to have gay tendencies in spite of my earlier comments.

But as someone has explained, he wasn't portrayed this way in the novel. At one point, Meggie even says to him he might get more use out of his friend.

Basically, they should have made it clearer in the TV adaptation if Luke was not intended to be portrayed as a homosexual.

I often drink to make people seem more interesting

reply