She (and the people who rules over her) wants to continue the proxy war against Russia,and want the consequent World War 3. A vote for her is a vote for war.
sharedems want war so they can continue to print and launder money to themselves and the oligarchs. its funny, not one dem is calling for a ceasefire for the Ukraine war.
shareShe along with half the republicans wants to protect our NATO allies from Putin who is threatening more invasions while Trump is telling those allies they're on their own if he becomes president.
shareWhen did Putin threaten more invasions?
sharehttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jun/29/russia-condemns-nato-invitation-finland-sweden
shareAs expected, no mention of an invasion. He's saying, "Don't point weapons at me, or I'll be forced to point weapons back." It's a pretty common sense position. What should he be thinking about NATO getting a full surround on his country?
shareUkraine is not Nato
shareThat's absolutely irrelevant. If Putin gains control of Ukraine, it will become even easier for him to invade another country (possibly a NATO country), which will make it even easier to invade another and then another and then another ...
shareBS
shareIs it?
shareYes, it is. Putin is not an idiot. And so he will not attack a NATO member. But fearmongering is the only thing the left can deliver well...
sharePutin most certainly will attack a NATO member ... after he gains a few other countries.
Putin most definitely is not an idiot. He's very calculating, and he's careful about what he says. But make no mistake about it, if he is permitted to simply take over Ukraine, he will not stop there.
Is he permitted to "simply" take over Ukraine? Do you know that there is a little war going on?
shareIs your argument not that the US should not be helping Ukraine prevent Russia from taking over? So if the US is not helping, would that not be allowing Russia to simply walk in and take over? I realize the US is not the only country aiding Ukraine, but losing the support of the US would be significant.
shareIt is not about "taking over" Ukraine but to keep it free of US missiles. Hard to understand, huh? Imagine your neighbor is pointing all day a gun at you. How would you feel?
shareYes, imagine your neighbor, Russia, was pointing missiles at you all day and even dropping bombs.
shareExtraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. What are you basing your reckless guess on? What was Putin doing to indicate he is going to take over the world? I know you are talking about Ukraine specifically but you said he wouldn’t stop there.
Precogs don’t exist yet.
I do not believe those claims are very extraordinary. Putin has often spoke about his desire to reclaim the former Soviet Union.
shareGroovy.
sharePlease tell me you are not so naive as to think that Putin will stop with Ukraine. Putin will never stop. His first goal is to conquer every nation that was once a part of the Soviet Union. Once that goal is achieved, he will be looking to expand his empire.
This isn't about Democrats or Republicans, and this is not about the United States overreaching. If Putin is permitted to simply walk into a sovereign nation and take control, he will do so again and again and again until he is forced to stop.
Lmao!!! Putin and Ukraine had a peace deal agreed to after 1 month. Democrats blocked it.
shareYou are really confused about the amount of power the United States has over other sovereign nations.
Ukraine proposed a peace plan in September 2022. Russia rejected it.
Russia invaded Ukraine in February 2022. September is hardly 1 month after February.
The Russia Ukraine skirmish goes back to 2014. 2022 was just the latest chapter.
Democrats have used to incident to launder hundreds of billions of dollars. They have plenty of power. The US calls the shots over there.
If Putin wanted to take over the world like you suggest, he wouldn’t be proposing peace deals.
If Putin wanted to take over the world like you suggest, he wouldn’t be proposing peace deals.
You're wrong on just about every point you are trying to make.
It was the US who invaded when you consider we couped the government of Ukraine
and put American puppets in charge. Then they began provoking Russia. Russia saw
they were going to go after Crimea so they took steps to hold on to it, like the US would
take steps to hold on to Hawaii, or better analogy would be Guantanamo.
Who cares if Russia has Crimea or not. Clearly the government of Ukraine was doing
nothing for the mostly Russian population there - not being served or defended, and
same with Donbas.
Nothing you said negates anything I said.
shareThe war goes back to 2014. Learn the history of it if it’s in your power.
Of course democrats bombed Nordstream 1. Democrats are constantly saber rattling. Democrats made up Russia collusion which lead to economic sanctions put on Russia, by Trump.
The war was over after 1 month, but Democrats chose to make it a tool to launder money and in the process have killed 250k people.
If Trump is elected this war will end.
Trump will never be reelected. Have you seen Trump lately? He's not doing well. Trump's cognitive abilities are fading fast and you know it. Get used to saying "Madam President" because it's coming, Cupcake.
shareOf course it was the Democrats. They have so much power and control the entire world!!! But Trump can save us. Trump can do anything.
It concerns me that you do not realize how ridiculous that sounds.
Except, he didn't say half of that.
It is completely reasonable to think that the dems did something wrong and that Trump can negotiate a peace deal.
Your pretense that either of that is crazy, is just you being a liar.
Is Gd5150 a he?
It’s called exaggerating for emphasis, except in this case, it’s not much of an exaggeration.
It concerns me that you either didn’t realize that or were pretending to not realize that. Does that make you a liar?
So you attack me for not realizing that your post was an obvious exaggeration. "for emphasis".
Yet, you also have to admit that it wasn't much of an exaggeration.
If it wasn't much of an exaggeration, then me taking you seriously was... reasonable.
Also, I've run into lots of leftards who, at least pretend, to really believe that trump supporters are all that stupid.
The reality is that gd5150 made a valid point and all you did in response was be an ass.
You are going to need to develop a much, much (MUCH) thicker skin if you think anything I said was worthy of the word "attack."
shareClassic lib tactic.
Act like an asshole, and when correctly called on it, act as though the person who called you on it is being unreasonable.
GO FUCK YOURSELF.
if you think that is an overreaction to your post, you can go grow a thicker skin.
And then fuck yourself again.
if you think that is an overreaction to your post, you can go grow a thicker skin.
Act like an asshole
GO FUCK YOURSELF.
fuck yourself again
Listen asshole.
The topic is whether or not Trump can hope to negotiate a peace or if we remain in conflict with a nuclear power.
YOU have managed to change the subject to the personalities of other posters, specifically me.
That IS an attack.
That is you using personal attacks to distract from the issue.
Why are you so strongly PRO-WAR?
Because the Democrats instructed their lemmings like ziggy to hate Putin in 2016. They did this because he refused to help them rig the 2016 election for Hilary. Before that they blew Russia/Soviet Union for half a century. These people instantly hate whoever their masters instruct them to. C💙lt.
shareAre you honestly saying that you think Putin is a good person?
Forget Democrat or Republican of MAGA or whatever. Do you really think Putin is a good person?
NOTHING he said indicated in any way that he thought Putin was a good person.
So why did you imply that he did say that?
Because the argument the two of you seem to be using is that the only reason their is a war in Ukraine is because Democrats started it and are using it for their own gain. You seem to be skipping the part where Putin and Russia invaded Ukraine. You seem to be conveniently ignoring the fact that the US wouldn't be involved if Putin hadn't attempted to gain control of a sovereign nation. That, or you think Putin invaded Ukraine because he's a good guy and has altruistic reasons for doing so.
shareI don't know where you are getting ANY of that.
Perhaps you should try asking more questions instead of... where ever all of that came from.
I don't know where you are getting ANY of that.
Ok. I did.
I saw nothing postive about PUTIN at all. I saw some people putting a negative spin on some US actions years ago, like supporting a faction inside of the ukraine.
You know the idea of Republicans or Trump or Trump supporters being PRO-PUTIN, is... just invented by the dems and the media as a propaganda talking point.
THe Cold War is over. Russia is not in a position to take over the world anymore. THey could MAYBE threaten poland if they got lucky.
That is not a reason for US to go to war with them. This conflict was OPTIONAL. We CHOOSE to get involved in this. We could have stayed completely uninvolved.
You are stuck on the concepts of "All Democrats" or "All Republicans" or "All ... " of whomever.
Until you break of out that "all or nothing," "us vs them," mindset, you are stuck on stupid.
By the way, Russia may not be powerful enough to take over the world, yet, but if they take over one country and then another country and then another country ... it won't take long. That is an actual threat.
The US is not going to war with Russia. They are aiding Ukraine against a Russian invasion. (That's not the same thing.)
To be clear, I never accused Republicans of being pro Putin, I simply asked one poster if that poster loved Putin. Again, you need to step out of that "all or nothing" mindset.
1. There is nothing stupid about discussing groups and their behavior. Indeed, it is stupid to say that it is.
2. Russia cannot take over the world. Teh SOVIET UNION had an ideology that they could export to other nations and control them. Russian nationalism is not an exportable ideology. Once they exceed russian ethnic territory their ability to expand is...limited. IMO. Also, their population is crashing. That is not a time for empire building.
3. There is a risk of escalation AND it is still very costly. What is it that you see as justifying that for America?
1. I don't know if there is a word for "All Democrats," but ...
"All African Americans ... " is racist.
"All females ... " is sexists.
"Gen Z thinks ... " is ageist.
What word would you use for "All MAGA's ... ?"
2. Putin's ideology is irrelevant. The fact that he thinks he is entitled to rule the former Soviet Union, is. Whether you think his goals are realistic or not, changes nothing. He still has the ability to invade other countries and be quite destructive.
3. Standing up to a bully causes less escalation than letting the bully just walk in and take over and gain momentum and feel entitled to repeat.
1. Ziggy, your point is based on you having been... indoctrinated to the point where you have "forgotten" how to talk about groups, like a normal person. That is a huge failure on your part.
2. YOU cited his abilty to keep going, as a reason for US to be involved. if he reach is limited, that is a reason for US to NOT be concerned.
3. YOu are overly fixated on the WWII model, ignoring the changes in the world, AND forgetting about the WWI model. Escalation can happen in different ways and you can't focus on just one.
1. Ziggy, your point is based on you having been... indoctrinated to the point where you have "forgotten" how to talk about groups, like a normal person. That is a huge failure on your part.
1. EVERYONE knows that discussing a group is a GENERALIZATION. This concept of pretending to NOT know that, is a tactic by which lefties give themselves a tool to use to derail discussions about groups when they are losing, by manufacturing outrage. It is nonsensical.
2. The threat level was exaggerated. As his failure has proved. Thus the past policies were based on bad information.
3. YOu disagree that escalation can happen in different ways? Do you know how wwi started?
When I say, “Agree to disagree,” I really mean,
1. I don’t agree with you.
2. You haven’t “proven me wrong,” I just don’t agree with you.
3. I wish you no ill will.
4. I’m simply done with this conversation.
Agree to disagree. 😘
I’m not pro war. You think Trump will end the war, and I think you are wrong. That’s not the same thing. Disagreeing with someone is not the same thing as attacking them. Calling someone an asshole and telling them to fuck off, is a form of attacking them. Pointing that out is neither about your personality nor an attack in you. It is merely explaining to you that those behaviors and not generally effective or looked upon favorably in society.
In other words, you are not effectively articulating your point.
You just didn't say that you thought we were wrong. You implied with your exaggeration that we are stupid. You didn't explain why you thought we were wrong, you just reworded our statements to make us look, IN YOUR WORDS, "ridiculous".
That is not a valid response or a civil disagreement. That was you being very rude, and making it personal.
That is an attack.
AND, when you next pretend that we are the weird ones because we get defensive to your making it personal, that is you doubling down on being a snide bitch.
AND the worst part is, that you are right. THat your sleazy tactics are working and society is going along with you.
YOUR sides shitty tactics make is impossible for us to have a real discussion on issues and have an opportunity to present our views and have them considered or addressed.
And policy is being made that way. People are dying here and there based on such shit behavior.
This war is going terrible for Russia. It is very likely that a serious good faith effort to negotiate a peaceful ending would work.
I want an end to the fighting. That is my goal.
It seems that Biden's and Harris's goal is regime change in russia.
What is it that YOU want and are you prepared to see more people die to get it?
You have double standards. You feel free to say "idiot," "asshole" and "fuck you," but you complain when anyone says anything negative to you or about you or even just explain why what you said was incorrect.
[–] Gd5150 (11561) 2 days ago
democrats bombed Nordstream ...
Democrats are constantly saber rattling ...
Democrats made up Russia collusion ...
Democrats chose to ...
If Trump is elected this war will end.
I want an end to the fighting. That is my goal.
It seems that Biden's and Harris's goal is regime change in russia.
1. If you are civil, I will be civil in return.
2. He made a list of things he said that the dems did. There is a big difference between a list and "everything". A valid response would have been to pick one and argue why the dems were not responsibile for it. The dems certainly DID make up reussian collusion and they torn this country apart over it. DO YOU HOLD THEM RESPONSIBLE FOR THAT BAD BEHAVIOR?
3. Putin is certainly a BAD person. How many Ukrianians are you willing to see die to get rid of Putin? For me the answer is zero. I assume that anyone that replaces him will be a very similar person.
4. NOT getting involved is not the same as supporting Russia. We do not need to be part of EVERY WAR on the planet. Are we the world's police man? I don't want US to be. If we are, then the world needs to pay us for our protection. In money and status and in benefits to our people. Instead of treating US like the world's bitch.
1. I have never not been civil. You have said, "idiot," "asshole" and "fuck you/off." Those are uncivil (and very aggressive) things to say. I have not said anything even remotely as aggressive.
2. Not aiding Ukraine is going to allow many, many more people to die than aiding them.
3. You do have to find the right balance, but recognize that Ukraine is defending against an attacking nation. Assisting them in their defense in the hopes of stopping the aggressor (Russia) from invading even more countries is a very small act compared to "policing the world." It's preventative medicine, so to speak.
1. Don't get overly focused on name calling. You were uncivil and I responded as I saw, "in kind". Moving forward you will remain in control of the level of civility.
2. A negotiated peace that allows Putin to save face and remain in power might end the dying on both sides, quickly. In my opinion that would be the better than removing putin at great cost of life. Do you agree or disagree?
3. YES, The Ukraine was attacked. But why are we invovled? it is on the far side of the world. If you want to get invovled in this one, why would we NOT get invovled in other wars? I have a family member who is in hte national guard and he is in fucking dijbouti! Why the fuck do we have NATIONAL GUARDSMEN in the horn of Africa? That sound like World Empire to me. If we are going to be a World Empire, then why aren't we getting the benefits of EMPIRE?
(to be clear my swearing here is directed at teh issue, and our leadership, not you)
1. You are really, really overly sensitive. I have no idea what you think I've done that's "uncivil" or why you think you need to "respond in kind." Name calling is uncivil (and immature and petty). If you can't make your point without it, you can't make your point.
2. Both Ukraine and Russia have made proposals that the other side rejected (for whatever reason). You're trying to paint the picture that Russia has proposed peace and the US has rejected it. (As if Ukraine has no voice or is being bullied by the US). Finally, who (besides you) has said anything about removing Putin?
3. The US has relationships with many nations and peoples all over the world. The degree to which the US gets involved varies for many, many reasons. I would not pretend to be an expert on every situation. Most of the time, the US is more involved when their are US interests involved. Unfortunately, it's not always for humanitarian reasons. The US has military bases all over the world. Why don't we have more of a presence in Central American? (I don't know.)
1. IMO, liberals have gotten used to calling people racist or stupid and thinking that is a valid debating point when it is actualy them being rude and illogical.
2. Since the end of the Cold War, the US, by and large has been treating Russia like a defeated power. To a certain extent that is "true". BUT, the arrogance from many in our leadership, has indicated to ME, a complete lack of understanding of the actual power balance between us. YES, we won. NO we don't want a fucking war with Russia and risking one is BAD POLICY.
3. During the cold war the justification for our military... sprawl was to fight communism. I supported that then. It made sense then. We have not had a real discussion on how to adjust our national security posture since then. We are drifting on autopilot. Our conflict with russia was dumb. Right now, we are the world's bitch when it comes to defense, spending more, dying more, doing more, than everyone else, often at their behest or to their benefit, and we get disrespect in return. That is us being fools.
1. That still doesn't explain how you think I have been uncivil.
2. Agree to disagree.
3. Agree to disagree.
1. I've explained it. If you want to dismiss me that's fine. My treatment of you will be as I said, based on your behavior.
2. Really? When did we reexamine our foreign policy and what did we decide? Cause I must of missed it.
3. Why are we taking the lead in the Ukraine, when EUROPE is bigger than US, and closer, and with plenty of money and power to contain Russia?
1. I have absolutely no idea what you think I’ve said or done that is uncivil.
2. Agree to disagree.
3. Agree to disagree.
Democrats are the ones who didnt allow peace talks to happen Vote RFK Jr also this isn't our battle to fight in Ukraine its there problem tired of being part Proxy War Also Both Republicans/Democrats are keeping Black Rock funded vote RFK Jr.
sharePutin is very much interested in restoring the former Soviet Union. He has stated that the countries that were part of the Soviet Union rightfully belong to Russia. He has stated that it is his right to regain those countries by force. Because he has said this, it is important realize that if he were to gain control of Ukraine, he would probably not stop there, but move on to the next country. This is a valid concern.
The idea of peace talks is often thrown around with one side or the other saying no for whatever reason. Russia wants control ... Ukraine wants Russia to withdraw troops. Not sure where you got the idea that it was the Democrats (of a nation not at war) pulling the strings.
Weak. Total BS.
shareIf you think Trump is going to do anything other than talk different, you're wrong.
Macho Trump is not going to make the US turn tail and run out on a commitment.
It was a stupid pointless avoidable war to begin with, but the planning of it went
way back, you could almost say as far back as the Cold War. Now it is a real mess.
No President can be honest and open to the American people about this war so it
will go on. I'm against it, but Trump would not get Americans out of Afghanistan
and had to leave that to Biden.
More of a chance that Kamala will wind it down than Trump.
Her and Trump both do as well Civil War Vote RFK Jr
shareRFK Jr is finshed and it's simply coming down to Trump vs Harris and since Harris pussed out on a debate on Sept 4th with Trump on FOX, he's now holding a Town Hall in Pennsylvania where he'll win and win the election as a result. If you win Pennsylvania, you win the election. Plain and simple
share