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Kherson "liberated" but are the people really happy?

posted 2 years ago by FootOfDavros (8171)
31 replies | jump to latest

Anyone seen the pictures from the centre of Kherson where the locals are celebrating the Russian withdrawal?

The numbers look a little thin for my liking. Not exactly the masses descending to celebrate their liberation you'd expect to see...

Day time. One kid with a flat, and a few others floating around:-
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/live-experience/cps/624/cpsprodpb/vivo/live/images/2022/11/12/8bddf6b8-d440-4456-9fee-ae81538831e0.jpg

Close up shot of a few dozen folks at most by a roundabout:-
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/live-experience/cps/624/cpsprodpb/vivo/live/images/2022/11/11/41fb08d7-d512-4f97-9469-e45eb6b40924.jpg

These are the pictures being put forward to show us how happy the local population are at the Russian withdrawal.

Thoughts?

[–] millsey72 (10283) 2 years ago

I have no thoughts and I wish my tax dollars would not go towards this war. Ukraine is not a part of NATO. Whats the point of having NATO if my tax dollars are going to defend non NATO nations anyways?

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

... if my tax dollars are going to defend non NATO nations anyways?

Well, the question of what's really being defended there is something I never got to the bottom of anyway.

Is there some untapped energy fields which were discovered or something?

[–] millsey72 (10283) 2 years ago

Ukraine is a very corrupt nation and has 1 gigantic gas station underneath it. Family members of high powered politicians all over the West are employed in all kinds of Energy companies in high level positions. The Biden and Pelosi family are 2 right off the bat. The elitists in the West are fearful all this can be exposed and will do anything to protect this nation.

[–] SickSpazmoid (843) 2 years ago

Because NATO will look like a weak military alliance and may even disintegrate. Big part of Russian propaganda is that NATO is weak and will disintegrate the moment when one of its members is attacked. Not to mention that the war started because Ukraine wanted closer ties with EU and NATO. It is also about USA's world power status when an (self-declared) enemy country and (self-declared) world power starts a major war in Europe to prove its point.

Your money are much better spent in Ukraine than they were spent in Iraq and Afghanistan, believe me.

[–] AckbarsRevenge (3800) 2 years ago

Don't know what kind of point you are trying to make. Ukraine is a sovereign nation that was attacked by Russia. Kherson was occupied and destroyed by russian troups. They destroyed the entire infrastructure, raped, murdered and terrorized the population for months. Do you think this is some kind of "fake" story?

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

What do you mean by "fake" story?

They've clearly recaptured the city. I'm not making any point other than their doesn't appear to be any huge upswell in people celebrating their "liberation".

The Russians have always claimed that the people in these regions support being part of Russia rather than Ukraine.

So I'm trying to look at it with unbiased eyes and work out where the truth really lies.

[–] AckbarsRevenge (3800) 2 years ago

Exactly. Putin's propaganda has made these baseless claims for years to set up this war. There is no "seperatist movement" among russian speaking Ukrainians. It's a false flag created by Putin to legitimize his plan to restore old imperial Russian glory.

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

Well that's the story we get isn't it.

But you have to be open to propaganda from both sides surely... Unless you just want to accept what you're told.

With that in mind, I was questioning the media we are seeing from the liberated city. Small crowds, narrow lens angles used in the shots, etc.

Who knows though, perhaps we shall see more compelling shots at some point.

[–] AckbarsRevenge (3800) 2 years ago

With all due respect, Davros but that's typical conspiracy talk. Lens angles? , small crowds? Maybe Grassy Knolls? These people have been terrorized for months. Who knows what they can expect in that city? Mines, snipers?
There is zero evidence of Ukrainians secretly wishing to be "reunited" with Russia. Unless you can provide it. Putin's policies and goals are well documented and provided throughout numerous sources. Look them up for yourself, not trough "THE media" you mentioned.

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

Okay 👍

[–] SickSpazmoid (843) 2 years ago

There are multiple explanations.

1. Before the redraw there were reports that people were evacuated (or even kidnapped and deported, if we could believe this) from the city. Many probably already left in the beginning of the war.
2. The city is booby-trapped.
3. Reports of Russian soldiers in civilian clothes.
4. Every sane person should be speeding out of the city, because now it is a target of the Russian artillery. They will start to pound the city soon and, if they could afford the ammunition and not pushed away soon, try to level it.

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

These reasons may be true. But only as potential reasons why there aren't huge crowds greeting the incoming troops.

However, as per a post I made further down, it doesn't explain why we were being told the Ukrainian troops were welcomed into the city by "cheering crowds" when the images don't really seem to bear that out. So why even say it?

[–] CarterBlunt (1391) 2 years ago

So Putin has been shelling the Donbass for the past 8 years, and blaming it on Ukraine? Ok, bot.

[–] javie (2216) 2 years ago

It would be a it stale wouldn't it

[–] Memeito (364) 2 years ago

There were rumors that the Russians set up a trap and would bomb heavily the city after their retreat when the Ukrainians would enter, that's why few people were willing to go out and celebrate, most stayed hidden...

[–] xergan (1067) 2 years ago

This is one reason, Putin showed that he has no big issues with war crimes, so I would avoid celebrations until the war is really over. Reliefed and happy can be also done at home, in public you are an easy target of Putins drones.

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

That may well be true but it doesn't really match up with the news that "cheering crowds" are welcoming the Ukrainian troops into the city.

It is that potential propaganda I was questioning in relation to the supporting imagery I linked to in the OP.

However, I can see that, for some, even pointing that out effectively makes me appear supportive of the Russians rather than simply questioning the narrative... Which is interesting in itself I guess.

[–] northpole81 (135) 2 years ago

You realize most people left the city because of the war...? You're so dumb. 🤦‍♀️

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

mmm, not as dumb as someone who'd post this after looking through the comments on the rest of this thread.

[–] northpole81 (135) 2 years ago

You're right, I should have posted it BEFORE I read the rest of the comments. 🤦‍♀️

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

You should! At least then you would have been innocent of saying something utterly irrelevant whilst ironically calling others "dumb".

🤦‍♀️indeed!

[–] acidraindrop (3055) 2 years ago

Another good film discussion! From a Russian bot it seems?

Unless someone's actually questioning why people wondering why exhausted, scared, cold people aren't looking particularly excited. They took the city back, but it's not like living in Kherson at the moment feels safe or comfortable.

Like, do ppl seriously not having their own social networks to talk about the news? Is this the only place where some ppl go?

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

Lol, come on - Russian bot?

I've been posting high quality threads on a number of interesting topics for years now on here...

But anyway, that wasn't really what was being questioned in the OP (although strangely you're not alone in pulling a logic switcheroo). The question was why our media was portraying it as if they were.

[–] xanthas (3215) 2 years ago

Yes, you must be a moron.

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

LOL, really?

... You could only have posted this without reading the thread. In which case, you get the runners up prize of ignorance. Otherwise, we have a clear winner of the "moron" title...

[–] Moviegoer101 (46) 2 years ago

The southern part of the present day Ukraine was historically russian with and still has a russian majority, you can refer to the map provided in this article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Ukrainian_presidential_election
Blue color regions voted overwhelmingly for Yanukovich - the pro-Russian politician

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

That's a very interesting map - looks like a very polarised country!

[–] Moviegoer101 (46) 2 years ago

you won't hear about that in mainstream media though lol
now imagine which country ethnic russians living in Ukraine would like to be part of, considering that Russia has higher salaries and no laws limiting usage of the russian language

[–] FootOfDavros (8171) 2 years ago

There are always two sides to every story. Now this doesn't mean I'm pro-Russia or their behaviour here but rather against blindly believing one thing or the other. I think it makes sense to question things and draw your own conclusions.

That was really the point of the OP - to look at those clearly staged photos, with relatively small numbers of people, and ask what is the point of these. The map on the link you provided perhaps just serves to show the requirement to propaganda the support in these regions...

[–] Moviegoer101 (46) 2 years ago

kudos to you for trying to figure it out for yourself, i suggest you to watch Patrick Lancaster videos on youtube, he's regularly interviewing people in those regions of Ukraine