MovieChat Forums > General Discussion > Things you're glad to see gone

Things you're glad to see gone


For me, pay toilets.

For those not old enough to remember the 1970s, they were common everywhere, at least here in the US. You had to put a dime into a coin operated lock on the stall door. Then it would unlock, and you could enter, sit down, and take care of business. You were wise to carry a few dimes with you when outside your home. You never knew when you might need them.

Otherwise you could end up having to cheat by sliding under the door. Humiliating, and quite difficult when wearing a fish costume. http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-bCjbCy76S5c/VQzOJTNk8PI/AAAAAAAAALc/ObtZg_hKtkQ/s1600/Fish%2BStory%2BWKRP%2Bpig%2Band%2Bfish.jpg

Women's lib changed that. Their leader called pay toilets sexist. Both genders had to pay to crap. But we dudes could use urinals and so we could pee for free. Women had to pay to do that.

Some men were in favor of women's lib. Those men shouted, "damn right!"

Some men were against women's lib. But they understood that the very existence of pay toilets was now in critical condition. Those men shouted, "damn right!"

And then, no more pay toilets.

What are things you don't miss about the past?

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The motorized automatic shoulder belts that were on so many cars in the early to mid 90s.

I believe in seat belt use but those motorized ones were infernally obtrusive and either tried to strangle you or get in your way if you didn't get in and seat yourself in the strictly choreographed way the system seemed timed for.

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Yeah, those things were awful

They would choke you out like Hulk Hogan if you didn't sit 'just so'

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I've always worn seat belts, but have had even more reason for doing so in recent years. About fifteen years ago I got into a pretty bad accident. Aside from a broken pinky, I wasn't hurt, but the car was totaled. The air bag should have gone off but didn't.

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heavy televisions. i bought a 40 inch television a few weeks ago and it weighed about 20 pounds.

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Add CRT computer monitors to that. I had a pretty big one of those once, 20 inch at a time when most were 14 inches. Expensive and heavy. Then I went on vacation and accidentally left the PC and monitor turned on. When I returned I found that the screen image had been burned into the monitor. That's another great thing about today's monitors and TVs, it's practically impossible to burn an image into them.

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LOL! I feel sorry for the owner, but that's pretty funny. And I know some people who would have been quite happy to pay for that TV.

My burn-in image wasn't anything that bad. Just my normal Windows desktop, with a web browser opened to a map I had been looking at. I could still use the monitor but that kinda ruined it for me anyway. Twice a year my town has days when the sanitation department will pick up anything, even things like couches that are past their lifetime. The next time they did that I trashed it.

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My dad was so pissed when this happened with our TV with first generation "Pong"

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Typewriters. I think about how many hours I spent typing papers and correcting mistakes when now all of that is so easy - corrections, spell check, etc.

Long distance phone calls that cost a fortune by the minute and to conduct business during the day before cell phones, we had to rely on pay phones - what a pain.

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It amazes me how far phone technology has come, just in my lifetime. I'm in my late fifties, and I remember when there was a time there were still phones in the US you could not dial direct; you had to go through an operator. And while my parents never had a "party line," my grandparents did. One of their neighbors listened in to every call, and didn't even try to hide it. Once I heard the eavesdropper's radio playing in the background. At least she was letting people know what she was up to. My grandparents and their neighbors seemed to just shrug it off.

Now you can dial most places in the world for pennies per minute. In 1990 I dated a Japanese woman for a while. She was spending the year after her college graduation abroad. Our relationship never got heavy and serious, and there was never any question that when the year was up she'd return to Yokohama. Still, when we parted we were on very good terms and wanted to stay in touch. International direct dialing was already implemented by then -- in case you ever need to know, the country code for Japan is 81 and Yokohama's city code is 44. But even after signing up for a plan where I got cheaper rates to Asia in exchange for using at least a certain minimum number of minutes per month, I was still paying about $0.80 per minute. $48 per hour. A couple of $400 phone bills made me decide that snail mail was a wiser option.

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We had a party line when I was a kid in the 70s.

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The comedic style of Pauly Shore (1990).

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Absolutely agreed.

Fine username, BTW ... I've got a baseball autographed by Pete Rose, over on the other side of this room, and until COVID I'd make several trips to GABP each season.

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Cash.

Apple Pay - or even using debit cards - is so much better than having to juggle change, having exact change, having to retrieve the right amount of money, or having to break a fifty because you were 10 cents short.

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I can't agree. I do use my credit cards for a lot of things. But we're also at the point where we're pretty much required to carry cell phones around -- not by law, but just that life is massively inconvenient without them. Which means the government can monitor our whereabouts 24/7, and can even listen in to what's going on around us without our knowledge. Stop in at a 7-11 for a can of Coke and flirt with the pretty cashier you've been trying to get a date with? Big Brother might very well not only know you're there but also be listening to what you're saying to her. Real privacy is dead, but I'm going to hang on to whatever scraps of it I can for as long as I can. I routinely use a Faraday bag for my cell phone when I'm not making a call. As for credit cards, debit cards, Apple Pay, et cetera, those things carry the cost that your transactions are on the record, also available for nosy government bastards to peruse at will. I'm not doing anything illegal, and as such I think that what I say, where I go, what I buy, and other such things are none of Big Brother's business. Cash protects my privacy and so I use it often. Long live cash!

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I’m not important enough for the Government to worry about.

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Andy, I'll tell you a little story. A true one. Long, but worth reading IMO.

When Edward Snowden revealed to the public that the NSA was snooping on US citizens on a massive scale, I wasn't surprised. I and some of my friends already knew. Thirty years ago, I lived in DC, and an acquaintance of ours worked at the NSA. And he just couldn't resist dropping hints about details in our private lives, things he had no business knowing about. Things he only could have known about by having access to our phone bills, credit card records, and bank statements. There simply was no other possible explanation.

Many people are under the misconception that only super-bright people work at the NSA. No. The requirement is qualifying for a security clearance. That means being able to keep secrets, and not being vulnerable to blackmail. The latter means making ones life an open book to Uncle Sam. Those people's personal lives are under continual, intense scrutiny, to ensure they're not getting involved in things they shouldn't be. More on that later. This particular guy is fairly bright, but he's no Mensa member. But high intelligence is not a requirement for a clearance. Lee Harvey Oswald had a security clearance when he was in the Marines.

We knew he wasn't supposed to be doing this. The law says that the NSA can only spy on foreign nations and individuals, not on US citizens -- and we know even now that they don't spy on us; why, because they say they don't, ha ha! -- and so we were all angry about the situation, to various degrees, but what could we do? If we confronted him with it he'd just deny it and keep doing it. Then one day he phoned me on some matter, from his own home. While talking he mentioned something about me he shouldn't have known about. Dumb. I didn't know the mechanics of how the NSA gathered information about the general public, the details Snowden later revealed. But I did know that its own people essentially live their lives under microscopes. I figured it was a safe bet that its employees, including this jerk, consent to having their phones tapped and actively monitored. And now he was playing his little games while talking on his home telephone.

(continued below)

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You just lost your job, you stupid, nosy son of a bitch, I thought.

"How do you know about that?" I asked. He evaded the question. I asked again. I said, "That's not an answer to my question. I haven't mentioned that fact to anyone else. Again, how do you know about that?" Again, a non-answer. Finally I said, "OK, you're just not going to answer. I understand, you can't. But you know what I'm talking about."

I figured that couldn't fail to get someone's attention. Well, whether that was the cause or not, after that, his games stopped cold.

NSA employees are supposed to only look into people when there's a legitimate reason for doing so. Sometimes employees snoop on people they know, illegally. The official position of the NSA is that it happens but it's also very rare. I doubt that, though. The agency uses various acronyms for different things. For example, "signals intelligence" is called SIGINT. Well, this misbehavior is sarcastically referred to within the NSA as LOVEINT, because it's usually people snooping on their significant others. The fact that there's a name for it implies to me that it happens more often than the NSA claims.

This guy probably was snooping on his spouse and playing games with her. She later divorced him, but I never found out if that was a cause of her disaffection. But he was doing it with others, too. I later found out from his brother -- who can't stand him -- that both he and his mother had been targets of his snooping, and they had both independently figured out what he was up to.

Yeah, the guy was going through Mom's personal records, seeing who she was talking to on the phone, et cetera. What an asshole.

That was in 1991. About fifteen years later, he told a story. At one point in the past, he had really screwed up at work. He came close to losing his job. But then this senior manager had stepped in and said, no, he's worth keeping and everyone makes mistakes. When he told this he tried to make it sound like the agency considered him to be such hot shit that he could fuck up massively, and as long as it was the rare exception to his usual level of super brilliance they'd consider his hyper-competence to be well worth that cost.

After the Snowden story broke, other journalists looked into the NSA. One looked into LOVEINT and wrote about it. It seems the NSA's standard approach is to take the miscreant aside, where two things happen. First, they show him all the paperwork he signed when he was hired, acknowledging that he was instructed on all the relevant federal laws regarding things he is and is not supposed to do. They inform him that he has committed multiple felonies. They tell him a few things about how his future life in a federal penitentiary will be.

They scare the shit out of him. They convince him his old life is over. They tell him they're off to meet and work out the precise details of his damnation, then leave him alone in a room with guards outside.

Then, after being left to stew in his own sweat for a while, he's told that some lone, upper level person went to bat for him in the meeting. Pleaded on his behalf, saying that he'd probably learned his lesson. And so, reluctantly, the upper management decided to take no action -- just this once.

Not surprisingly, that approach usually works. If that happened to me, upon arriving home I'd down a whole fifth of vodka with a few gulps. I read that story, thought of that guy, and laughed. Oh, you're so brilliant that the agency forgives you your occasional transgressions? Suuuure, dude.

Here's an interesting fact about US law. Everyone knows that law enforcement can't tap your phone and listen to your conversations without a search warrant. And most people understand that the burden of proof is upon law enforcement to show that a search warrant is necessary, and the level of proof required is moderately high -- "probable cause."

But law enforcement can also get access, in real time, to the information about what phone calls are occurring without tapping the phone. For example, without knowing who is on the phone or what is being said, knowing that yesterday at 1:36 PM my home phone received a call from (202) 456-1111 and that the call lasted 12 minutes. It's called "pen register" for outgoing calls and "trap and trace" for incoming ones, but when law enforcement gets that access it usually gets both.

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The burden of proof for that is so low that it's nonexistent. Someone -- a state level law enforcement officer or a federal attorney -- has to appear before a judge and say that it's relevant to a current investigation. That's all. There's no requirement that the person being targeted is the subject of the investigation, just that it's somehow relevant. There's no requirement that it's significantly relevant. There's no requirement that the person even explain to the judge why it's relevant. And unless I'm mistaken, the phone number need not even be in the LEO's jurisdiction -- a state trooper in Kentucky can ask for this information regarding a California phone number and get it.

When I found out about that, things started falling into place. Anyone who's ever played the Kevin Bacon game but with different actors wouldn't be surprised if they found out that Walter Matthau and Jack Lemmon had vacationed together, right? (I have no idea if they ever did.) So which phones call each other can tell you a lot. Naturally, the nation's intelligence community would gather this information and use it. I also knew, as a former network administrator, that there's no legal right to privacy for email -- at least that was the case when I had that job, and I doubt that's changed. So when Snowden later blew the whistle on the NSA, the things he revealed weren't much of a surprise to me.

How bad is it here? Tucker Carlson says that last week he was told by an NSA whistleblower that they had been hacking into his emails and texts, and showed him excerpts from both as proof. Some will dismiss his claims out of hand, I'm sure, because he's with Fox News and because he's not a reporter but a commentator. He's the person who took over Bill O'Reilly's time spot after his fall from grace.

But those inclined to think along such lines could not call upon those sorts of excuses to brush aside the statements of Sharyl Attkisson -- recipient of multiple Emmys for "outstanding investigative journalism," and the RTNDA Edward R. Murrow award -- who, while a reporter for mainstream media network CBS, stated that her personal and work computers had been quite illegally hacked into by the Department Of Justice and that they had forensic evidence to prove that.

I'm not doing anything illegal, and I really don't give much of a shit if the FBI or NSA prowls through my emails and phone records. They're welcome to all the spam and robocalls. But I do object generally to what's going on. So yeah, on principle I hang on to whatever privacy I can.

One final quick story about the NSA jerk I mentioned earlier, passed on to me by his brother. He's still at the agency, he made it his lifelong career. One night, a couple of years ago, he decided to save a little money. Instead of paying to see a movie he wanted to watch, he downloaded a pirated copy of it. An illegal act, and the NSA doesn't want its people to break laws other than when at work. Rightly so. That would make them vulnerable to blackmail.

Well, the very next day, when he arrived at work he was called on the carpet for it. They knew he had done it.

Now, if I worked at a place like that -- which I never would, not in a million years -- I'd accept that intensity of monitoring as necessary. But I'd also find it uncomfortable. What other ways are they using to keep an eye on me, I'd wonder. Hidden cameras and microphones in my home? Even in my bathroom, to make sure I wasn't placing documents there for foreign operatives to peruse via telescope through the window? A GPS tracker installed in my car? I'd think that anything was possible, and I'd find it pretty creepy. And I'm guessing that there are quite a few who work there for a while, don't like living like 1984's Winston Smith, whose every move was monitored by Big Brother, and leave for that reason.

He thought it was cool. He likes living his life with Uncle Sam's nose rammed four feet up his ass. I guess it makes him feel important. That's pretty warped, in my estimation. But that's the sort of person who sticks around the agency for the long term -- and I have to imagine the top bozos who run our national intelligence agencies are all like that.

Well, thanks for putting up with my rant. I still get angry when I think about that asshole snooping in my bank records and other things.

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Before the pandemic I would use cash whenever possible, until some places started discouraging it. Otherwise I use a debit card. I don't own credit cards because they are legalized loansharking with their outrageous interest rates.

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> I don't own credit cards because they are legalized loansharking with their outrageous interest rates.

Agreed on the interest rates. I've got credit cards but mainly use a debit card against my checking account. The bank will cover the loss if some thief gets the card number and makes charges, but even if there's a problem there my loss would ultimately be limited to the amount of money in my checking account. I do use credit cards but most months I'll pay off the entire balance. But they do have their uses. For most young adults, they're the first step in establishing good credit.

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I have good credit and have had an account with the same credit union since the '90s. Should I ever need a loan that's where I would go. I don't do business with banks.

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It is very good to use cash to teach small children the concept of money.
I noticed that with my niece.

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carbon paper

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SAMOANJOES...WHEN IT HAPPENS.🙂

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You've started this thread about toilets and the 1st advert I see on MC this morning is for ... an automated type toilet!
Coincidence? I think not.

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