MovieChat Forums > ajr01 > Replies
ajr01's Replies
Well the last point you make is very interesting, because I happen to be a Catholic! Isn't it ironic that Jane Wyman who had the principal role in the movie as Cary in what could be described as a "waspish set" (although that never comes out in the story) converted to Roman Catholicism in 1953, two years before this? Of course, the election of John F Kennedy as president in 1960, only a few years later was evidence at least in some areas of America (and Kennedy of course was from New England where I believe the movie is set too), that anti Catholicism was on the decline.
I was not critiquing contemporary feminism, or what has happened to the ERA, in recent decades. It may very well be in effect. The book I refer to was published in 1980. I was trying to draw attention to the phenomenon of how this was such a trendy, popular issue at the start, and then for some reason it quite dramatically lost steam, referencing some of the statistics I mentioned. I attribute this to Phyllis Schlafly's effective grass roots campaigning. Because in studies that have been written about this, Schlafly is the person who is given most credit by both friends & foes, for stopping the amendment in its tracks. It will be interesting to see if these issues are covered in the new television series.
Sara is what you call a loyal friend. Yes, her life is taken up with club work and parties, and she is part of what you might call the 1950's bourgeoisie, but that does not define her. The very reason Cary is her best friend, is because she likes her down to earth manner, and is admiring of the fact, that her life is taken up with other pursuits. Obviously Sara is very concerned when news emerges of her best friend's engagement to her gardener, but she is more concerned about the reactions of other people to the arrangement, (and what that might do to her family) than the situation itself, realizing there is nothing sordid to it. But when Cary insists this is what she wants, and will not be intimidated by the narrow minded attitudes of others, Sara really admires her, and admonishes herself for her own behaviour in this regard, saying "I must say Cary you've got stubbornness and courage!" That is only the compliment of a true friend, and then she suggests to Cary to bring Ron to a social event she is having that weekend, so people can get to know him, instead of relying on their unfounded gossip. (Of course, it isn't Sara's fault, the evening turned into a disaster!). Whatever eventual path Cary chooses, if there is to be a wedding, you can bet Sara will be there as her matron of honour, as true friendship is something that is never broken by convention. To change the subject a little bit, Agnes Moorehead (who plays Sara) along with Jane Wyman, are the best actors in the movie, as the rest do not even come close to their standards.
Yes, we never get to know the names of that particular couple, but even when you see them for the first time when most of them are looking out the window, waiting to see the arrival of Cary and Ron at the cocktail party, (and they are shown in the background), just looking at their faces, they seem a mean spirited pair. Ron did not even give Howard a punch, just kept him in the chair. I actually have gone back to that scene, thinking at first I had missed something, based on that line!
It actually is not so strange as Faye Dunaway converted to Roman Catholicism in 1994, and is a daily Mass goer.
When did I do that? Regardless, I loved watching the movie again, in the colorized version. I was just a bit hazy about some details.
Now this has forced me to watch the whole movie from start to finish! Boy, there are details that can escape your mind after not seeing it for a while. When Barbara initially showed herself to Tony and the pet monkey, she followed him, but he did not take too kindly about her remarks about his face, leaving her alone. So she was standing outside the family's basement apartment on the sidewalk, and seeing her there, they felt sorry for her, inviting her in. Ransomer was standing on the staircase outside near the landing to the right, and he might have identified Barbara was wearing a school uniform, minus the hat. In the USA, school uniforms are a rare thing, particularly in that era, except for some posh schools, (and of course you made mention of her hair styling and manicured hands too) he quickly worked out something was amiss about a girl from most probably an affluent background, being invited to accept hospitality with a working class Italian migrant family! The girl who ran away from the orphanage just did not gel. By peeping & eavesdropping over the next couple of days, his suspicions were confirmed, (which wasn't hard as he was on the same floor as the Dolans) and the seeds were sown for his dastardly plan of action, which thankfully were thwarted by Puddin' Head, at the last minute.
Thanks for the reply. There is now a very good print of Poor Little Rich Girl on YouTube, and this forced me to look at some scenes I may have overlooked. This man lived in the same apartment building. He was constantly eaves dropping where Barbara was, so that he could find any information. When "Puddin' Head" used the phone in the hall, he called the Bureau of Missing Persons to find out if anyone had reported a missing "Betsy Weir", which was her current nom de plume. (His wife was extremely sceptical about the orphan story, and worried by including her in their act, they could be charged with kidnapping). The guy was behind his door listening in on the conversation, and there his suspicion was confirmed, that there was some other explanation for her being there. But I am not sure if he picked up that she was necessarily from a wealthy background, as much as I am sure he would have loved that to be the case, so he could collect his tidy ransom.
Thank you so much. As I think you have solved the problem for me. If Collins had been killed, she would have been taken to a morgue. But the next scene is one in a hospital where a doctor is saying they don't know where she came from. That would appear to imply she is suffering some amnesia as you say, and without her purse (which we know was stolen), there would have been no identification. The subject only comes again at the end of the movie when Barbara is reunited with her father. He asks her what happened to her, as she was to insure she arrived safely at school. Barbara said, "She lost her purse so I decided to go on a vacation". Now if she had been killed, by that time surely he would have been contacted as despite the fact that she was going on a holiday, this was her place of residence and employment.
They adopted the habits of the French order known as the Daughters of Charity, of St Vincent de Paul. They wore a cornette, and a blue scapular. I believe this is even mentioned in the book the tv series is based upon, but never was this order mentioned in the series.
I tell a lie. The other time is when Mr Bogardis in a terribly depressed state, and he hears the nuns singing "O Sanctissima". Then Fr O'Malley sings a line to it in Bogardis' office. But the same principle Most non-Catholic movie goers would not know Latin, and wouldn't appreciate this is a hymn to Mary.
Remember this was a Hollywood movie in a pluralist society, with a very strong Catholic tone. You coudln't play that part of the movie too much, if the intention was for it be highly successful. Apparently, it was the biggest box office draw in 1945. (Al Smith's Democratic presidential nomination in 1928, stirred enough hornets!) A Morning Offering (you know the old prayer Catholic schoolkids used to say, "O Jesus through the most pure heart of Mary" etc) for instance, would just be too much for a wider audience. So the pledge to the flag was obviously considered something far less controversial
And while we are on the subject of the Blessed Virgin Mary, despite the visible statues of her in the movie, the only attention she gets is when Fr O'Malley in a nice gesture, bobs his hat to her on his first day of looking around the school. Mary is of course is a main subject of contention between Catholics & Protestants, so if you want to include it, at least do it tactfully. Perhaps that is why it is called the Bells of St Mary's, rather than the Bells of Our Lady of.
But, can anyone remember this line from the movie, which is very pertinent to what we're talking about here? It's when the mother at the school says to Helen, "See you at vespers", and she repeats this. Pastor Dan, very incredulously asks Helen, "Do you know what vespers are" and then she answers "Some kind of a motor scooter," which is of course a vespa.
He obviously does appreciate that with Helen where the practice of religion is concerned, she is on a different page to him. He finds her disingenuous comments about Lutheranism and church going, quite amusing when she is trying to get the kids into his school, so then he teases her back saying the children require blood tests! Dan genuinely finds Helen a quite attractive and different woman (from his current crop of church going mums!) and admires her trying to raise the kids on her own, after the tragedy of them losing their parents. This would be a girlfriend out of the ordinary, for him. So he is not too perplexed about his differences with her regarding religion, but would find it an interesting challenge, in addition to her evident femininity which most men savour.
I mean, it dosen't matter how much you read the Bible! It is still preferable to come home to a nice looking, smiling, fun gal each night which Helen definitely is.
Lucia in 1921 entered a boarding school operated by the Dorothean Sisters in Vilar. She was told to use another name, ie "Maria das Dores", and to reply if anyone asks her where she is from "My home is near Lisbon".
She later on joined this order, and made perpetual vows, in 1934.
Pius XII gave her an official dispensation to leave this active order, to join the papal cloister of Carmelite nuns in Coimbra in Portugal, in 1948. The following year she was solemnly professed (in record time, as it normally goes for a lot longer), and remained living there until her death in 2005, at the age of 97.
If the events of Fatima which happened to her as a child, were the product of just a childish imagination or mental instability, this would hardly have been the basis of somebody living a very difficult vocation as a Carmelite nun, which requires a lot of personal discipline and dedication.
I have a number of female friends that had a shot at being an enclosed Carmelite, but had to leave, because of the strict regimen required of prayer and self sacrifice, finding that the vocation is very difficult, which even impacted on their physical health.
If she was out to just fool everybody, how does Sr Lucia's nearly six decades of enclosed life, square with this, in addition to earlier in her life being in another active order, where she also made final vows?
If we read her biography, no one can deny (even sceptics of the Fatima events) from a psychological perspective, she comes across as a very stable person, with a deep commitment to religious life, but more importantly the ability to reach the high standards required of this lifestyle. In a nutshell, hardly the product of daydreamers or the mentally ill. A person who is challenged on a number of fronts, often tries this and that, but rarely succeeds at anything they attempt for the long term.
I am not trained as a psychologist, but if there are any who come on here, I am very interested in your perspective about this.