beating up multiple 200lb+ guys. I thought we were heading in the right direction with the Gina Corano and Ronda Rousey types. Even Charlize Theron in atomic blonde was very believable.
However, it seems we are back to the waifs with Batwoman and this. I suppose you could argue that movie fights are unrealistic/stylized anyway so why should this matter? True.
Yeah.
My thoughts? Keep ‘em coming! (But more Caranos would be nice.) Whatever will keep the always screaming Neanderthal chuds on the internet mad sounds good to me.
I am personally sick to death of bad ass women. They think it’s cutting edge but it’s really over saturated and stale. I used to enjoy the occasional bad ass woman like Buffy the Vampire Slayer but when every movie has them it’s no longer refreshing, it’s nauseating.
I am personally sick to death of bad ass men. They think it’s cutting edge but it’s really over saturated and stale. I used to enjoy the occasional bad ass man like John Wayne but when every movie has them it’s no longer refreshing, it’s nauseating.
shareWow! That was neat how you turned it around on me. I never realized that men and women can be equally bad ass, and physical structure has no bearing whatsoever. Color me embarrassed.
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Name as many action movies as you can that have come out within the last 5 years starring women and I can absolutely guarantee you that I can name ten times as many that have starred men.
shareName some women that are stronger than Arnold Schwarzenegger or The Rock or Sylvester Stallone and your point will stand.
sharePhysical strength is irrelevant. Action movies are completely unrealistic, Schwarzenegger or Stallone or The Rock could never do the things they do in their movies in real life. You've also altered your point, which was that the market is oversaturated with female action heroes, which you and I both know is simply not true. A literal handful, or less, come out in a year. At best the ratio is 1:10 of women vs men. You may dislike watching women in action movies but to suggest it's being overdone is absurd.
shareI haven’t altered my point. As a matter of fact you changed the subject to focus on men in action roles. The market is over saturated with bad ass women movies. If you enjoy watching cliches be my guest. Enjoy if you want. It doesn’t change that it’s become tiresome. But by all means go see Anna, Humans in Black, Batwoman, Peppermint, Terminator 6, Jean Gray, Captain Marvel, Rey’s Episode 9, Miss Bala, Red Sparrow, Atomic Blonde, Proud Mary, and whichever recent releases I’ve missed. Do a marathon. Enjoy.
shareWow. Look at all those movies starring women. After I get through those I'll barely have time for these action films that came out in the last 18 months starring men...
The Meg, The Commuter, Stratton, Acts of Violence, Den of Thieves, Braven, Samson, Black Panther, Death Wish, Mohawk, Pacific Rim, Rampage, Upgrade, 211, Believer, Superfly, Blackwater, Escape Plan 2, Sicario 2, Bleeding Steel, Skyscraper, The Equalizer 2, Mission: Impossible Fallout, Mile 22, Kin, Reprisal, Venom, The Predator, Hunter Killer, Overlord, Speed Kills, Blood Brothers, Robin Hood, Aquaman, Renegades, Backtrace, All the Devil's Men, S.M.A.R.T Chase, Vengeance, A Prayer Before Dawn, Damascus, The Assassin's Code, Corbin Nash, The Humanity Bureau, Hurricane Heist, Beast of Burden, Operation Red Sea, Wastelander, Kickboxer: Retaliation, Spider-Man: Far from Home, John Wick 3, Shaft, Shazam, Hellboy, Cold Pursuit, Triple Frontier, Trading Paint, Triple Threat, We Die Young, Buffalo Boys, Avengement, Killers Anonymous.
So basically any more than 2 or 3 action movies a year starring women is oversaturating the market.
shareWhy is it that no matter how many are released starring men no one will ever say the men are oversaturating the market?
shareYou are aware that men and women are different, aren’t you? You’re aware that they have different physical abilities?
Who am I kidding? Of course you’re not aware.
Welcome to my ignore list, Mary Sue.
Physical strength is not irrelevant...nor is it what the OP was talking about to begin with. Note he said 90lb waif vs 200lb guys. The reference is more in the camp of the movie ignored the basic laws of gravity. A 90lb woman could kill a 200lb man simply by shooting him or using poison. But if you stick on in hand to hand combat the odds of the woman coming out on top is exceedingly low. Now multiple the number of time said woman takes on the 200lb men and the odds drop even more.
shareShe's holding a gun in the picture on the poster. A 90-lb woman with a gun is just as dangerous as a 200-lb man with a gun.
Same goes for superpowers, once you bring them in body type doesn't matter.
Its also not that much different for swords and knives. Pretty much any item thats lethal remains lethal.
shareActually, size, reach, and strength make a big difference in sword fights, where a big tall opponent has a huge advantage over a smaller one. Think of Darth Vader driving Luke backwards with every blow in "The Empire Strikes Back", before he brought his Sith Powers into the climactic duel, to use an example that everyone in the universe has seen.
I'm no expert on knife fights or fighting in general, but I think that pretty much every form of fighting that involves close contact favors the big and strong*. No, it's only when you put distance between opponents by using guns or ray guns, that physical size and strength cease to matter.
* Not 100% of the time, a small smart martial arts expert may be able to beat up a big biker dude, but in general close combat favors the big guys.
True reach does matter. Strength can too but can be made up for by the sharpness of the blade.
However reach doesn't necessarily scale with size as much as you'd think. Even just talking about height, the wingspan of someone 5'5" really isn't all that different from 6 foot. We're probably talking about 5 inches but only 2.5 inches per arm.
But then other factors come into play. How fast is a 90lb person going to move versus a 200lb person. The guy might be able to swing harder but she's probably going to get out of the way quicker than he will.
Actually, size, reach, and strength make a big difference in sword fights, where a big tall opponent has a huge advantage over a smaller one. Think of Darth Vader driving Luke backwards with every blow in "The Empire Strikes Back"
I'm sure the type of weapon makes a difference as well, fencing with an epee probably takes rather different techniques than whacking someone with a broadsword. But I can't think there are many types of sword fight where a 90-lb woman like the typical Hollywood actress wouldn't be at a disadvantage against a strong adult male.
But with guns, though, no problem! Body type can't make a lot of difference when you're standing back and putting holes in your opponent, and there's a woman with a gun on the movie poster.
My personal experience as a 2nd level delver in the field makes me think this:
Foil: finesse. strength not much of an issue at all
Epee: slightly more brutish than foil but still reliant on finesse and skill over strength
Saber: higher strength can definitely create an advantage but skill rules the day
Given this progression, I assume that strength becomes more and more important as the size of the weapon increases. Still though, my perspective is from a mere 3 years of fencing in college. I have never wielded a long sword nor any heavyweight blade so I am no expert.
Personally I am fine with the action chick heroes performing supernatural combat feats. A certain amount of realism can be tinkered with without bucking me from the horse. It's not like it's a Renny Harlan film. Treat the story with a realistic approach and I can be AOK with the hero not breaking any bones from a fall or walking on that leg they shot ... to a degree.
Anubis, what’s really tiring about a sword is its balance, or rather, lack thereof. A perfectly-balanced blade feels light as a feather and comes ALIVE in your hand. An unbalanced blade has the weight and grace of a meat axe.
share"Meat Axe"
Yes, the few times that I have held a sword have felt exactly like that. Murder on the wrist and I want to hold it like a 2Hsword for control. Although the Katana felt natural, like an extension of the arm.
I very nearly joined up with some friends who are members of Society for Creative Anachronism. They'd spin tales of seriously whacking each other, full force with maces, hammers, and even swords in massive mock combats. Are you, perchance a member?
Otter, remember Raiders of the Lost Arc, the scene where the big guy menaces Indy by wielding a scimitar with great skill, and Indy sighs, rolls his eyes, pulls out his pistol and kills the sword master?
shareFunny you mention that. Originally Harisson Ford was scripted to get into a long windedfight with that guy but Ford was so ill that day that rather then going through with the scene the director allowed him to just shoot the guy to exit the scene quickly. Its on the comentary.
shareOne of the things I love about that scene is that the instant the swordsman dies, the surrounding people seize his sword and joyfully run off with it. The opportunity to rob the corpse doesn't age more than a second.
shareOf course I remember that scene! I didn't realize it, but I'd been WAITING for someone to do that for years - ever since I saw my first episodes of the cheesy sixties "Batman" TV show!
Even a four-year-old can look at Batman traipsing around in no protection but his stockings, and think "Well why don't the bad guys just shoot him".
PS: The inverse of that scene, the same scenario played for tragedy rather than comedy, is of course in "The Seven Samurai".
In gymnastic-type combat, such as many martial arts, smaller people have the advantage. We have a lower polar moment of inertia. We can flip and rotate faster, change direction faster and move our limbs faster than the hulks, because we have less to move than they do. Think of the Olympic gymnasts: they are all tiny, and that’s why. In sword combat I have dropped to my knees while running at an opponent and slid right under his guard and claimed his legs (with a bamboo sparring katana called a Shinai). There are 3 kinds of fighters: aggressive, strong and/or intelligent. While it’s best to be all 3, sword really rewards the intelligent combatant. Don’t overestimate the importance of physical strength in swordplay. A katana can slice 3 men in half in one stroke, but the blade is surprisingly fragile. Any cut or block that is not made precisely on the blade’s cutting edge will bend the blade, perhaps shatter it. Fighting with other weapons, such as Bo staff, short sticks or nunchucks, does not demand such precision.
share That doesn't fly in real combat though. Its why we have weight classes in fighting sports. If smaller guys had a real advantage we'd be we woulden't need these weight classes.
I think the only intelligent fighter these days will use a gun. Swords are not the intelligent choice of combat these days.
No one said that they were; but sword is the great art of combat, as opposed to sending in a fleet of drones to lay down a shitstorm.
Using a sword I have backed down opponents literally twice my size and who outranked me. This is not the norm, but I know that it’s possible. I agree with you: there are so many times I see a movie where I saying to the screen, “He’s got 40 pounds on you, easy. DO NOT go toe-to-toe with him! Smash him in the fucking temple with a brick! Gouge his eyes! Both!”
I wrestled in school. We both know that anybody who “makes weight” with a normal amount of fluid in his body is going to be eating a lot of floor.
Except that she also just does the hand to hand in the trailer.
shareug really? no more!
shareIf it helps there are only two fights in the film and they were both shown in the trailer.
share Of course movies are unrealistic but 90lbs vs 200lbs just breaks suspension of disbeleif. Theres also a difference between batman getting lucky and succeeded He still gets beat up in the process and suffers for hist cause. Movies with waifs just make the waifs indestructible and uninteresting as they are never in any real danger.
I agree sometimes. There is a line within the realm of the absurd that I can be fine with. In this quasi-entertaining movie I was ok with the weight disparity because the heroine would get hit or take damage. It wasn't the typical "hero is perfect and bad guys are throw away casualties" kind of situation .... sometimes.
I feel weird defending this movie.
That's what i disliked most about the new tomb raider.Alicia Vikander was so damn tiny and bony.I just couldn't take her seriously in the part.
shareyou guys are missing steven seagal damn that guy was crazy with hand fights in his prime and the guy could actually fight unlike gay ass john cena wannabe tough guy or tyrese gibson.the rock can actually lay the smackdown on anybodys candy ass and can fight,same goes for kane,undertaker,booker t,goldust,even lita and stone cold steven austin.
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