MovieChat Forums > Joker (2019) Discussion > Good Although Uncomfortable To Watch.

Good Although Uncomfortable To Watch.

posted 5 years ago by Jeepster (1168)
11 replies | jump to latest

It’s true you know, most of what goes on in this film does make you turn away in discomfort despite the fact that you have to look at the screen to watch the movie. Watching the unraveling of a extremely disturbed individual, especially his prolonged & embarrassing laughing outbursts isn’t a easy task.

Joachim’s “Joker” isn’t so much the psychotic crime lord type that Ledger/Nicholson/Leto portrayed to the point of overdoing it in their respective films but rather that of a very well meaning but deeply disturbed person who ultimately did some very bad things.

He didn’t want to blow up a ferry or gas a city, he just wanted some semblance of normalcy but was pushed to the breaking point. His motivations weren’t greed, hate or revenge (yet) or total anarchy as the others were focused on where they didn’t care who they hurt, women, children, the elderly, handicapped etc. In some ways he did care which kinda sets him apart.

Even so what can be said of Arthur Fleck? Did you see someone who had what it took to corral & run the most brutal criminal organizations in Gotham & put them under his thumb? Did any part of him scream “Criminal mastermind” as The Joker truly was? Joker wasn’t just a bloodthirsty psycho, but a natural leader & shrewd business man, a criminal visionary. Ultimately at the end of the day do you all buy that’s what Arthur was, that, that was what THIS Joker was?

Hey I liked this well enough but it’s going to take some convincing to believe that’s what he would go on to become. What do you all think?

[–] thenewnexus (1913) 5 years ago

You know what's uncomfortable? The birds of prey trailer.
We see a psychotic female clown gunning people down for fun and we are suppose to feel sorry for her. But you find this movie uncomfortable? Lol

[–] Jeepster (1168) 5 years ago

Ok.

[–] Roguemail (1634) 5 years ago

On the contrary...the ending of the movie for me saw the Joker well on the way to becoming the fully formed crime villain that we all know.

[–] Jeepster (1168) 5 years ago

Appreciate your opinion Roguemail, I really do. My problems with it is according to canon we all know that Joker was a former gangster, who worked for a crime family. High/low level I guess it doesn’t matter, but he had experience & knowledge of that world, he lived the life.

Arthur was someone who didn’t, he wasn’t a criminal per se, until he killed a few people of course but still. He was insane yes but no experienced knowledgeable criminal. How would he be able to transform into the clown prince of crime we all know The Joker is? He has no actual chops for it, where’s it coming from? What does he have to draw on to be Batman’s main nemesis?

The Joker we’re all used to was as crazy as a bat but a brilliant mastermind. Arthur can’t even spell correctly. How’s he going to go from “here to there?”

[–] tom8 (3119) 5 years ago

so this joker is not true to the batman universe?

[–] Jehosaphet (1063) 5 years ago

Yeah I'm right there with you. Was virtually impossible not to sit through this movie looking for any indication at all that he had the potential to become the Joker we all know, and I don't know, I didn't really see it either.

[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

This Joker is close to what inspired the Joker back in the 30s.

It was a book called The Man Who Laughed.

The guy's face got mutilated as a children, which forced a smile on his face, then all these bad things happened to him and he couldn't stop smiling. It was a story about how most people feel the need to do that in life and how life sucks.

That's very close to this story. However, in the comics Joker gets injured and has the forced smile too. That's very necessary to the character.

[–] Recognizer (386) 5 years ago

Like he said to Murray: “I’ve got nothing left to lose”. A man who has literally nothing to lose is capable of absolutely anything, even things that regular crime bosses wouldn’t do. That sets him in a position of power over them.

[–] not_a_virus.exe (1267) 5 years ago

I didnt buy that the Arthur we saw in this film represented the criminal mastermind that we know in batman, but Bruce was very young in this. And I have a feeling that with enough years, he could adapt to become the joker as we know him. Toward the end you could see what was left of his sanity erode. I think it would take another two films to flesh out his transition fully.

[–] McQualude (4231) 5 years ago

Arthur at the end had lost all ties to society, his fear, and transitioned from prey to predator. The world is full of people looking for someone to lead them.

[–] actionkamen (23176) 5 years ago

That's why religion is popular.