Although it had a lower Thursday preview number than expected, a quick glance at today's matinee ticket sales indicates a LOT of families in seats.
They make cheaply-produced garbage but there is no denying that when it comes to animated films, Universal/Illumination really packs them in both here and abroad.
But if it was a Disney movie, you would be saying the opposite ? 34 ww isn't that great , another money loser for Universal what you say queen
share"34 ww"?
What are talking about?
Anyway..."if this were a Disney movie" then it would have a production budget 3× as high.
Unlike most non-Marvel Disney films, this will 80 million-budgeted film will be far from a money-loser.
Marketing and other costs? Will come off worst than dumbo by the end of the day
shareNot a chance.
Once again you are demonstrating you don't have a clue about the movie business.
I know more than you that's for sure , a lot more than you , for one , you cant predict for shit , you pretty much get it wrong every time , you reply on unreliable websites that only give you the production costs, you are a nothing more than a troll.
shareBut if it was a Disney movie, you would be saying the opposite ? 34 ww isn't that great , another money loser for Universal what you say queenYou probably meant to type $34 Million International instead of $34 million Wonder Womans, uh I mean $34 Million World Wide.
Since it cost 85 million less to produce, it could gross 170 million less and receive the same ROI as Big Hero 6.
Soooo...488 million would put it in the same box.
So will SLOP2 hit that $488 Million figure and if not what the hell happened? How could Universal perform so poorly?
You had $1 Billion as the absolute floor for this and the film is so far below ground that even China isn't going to save this film.
What the hell is going on Queen? Please tell us! Sharing is caring.
[–] QueenFanUSA (2081) 2 months agoExhibitors and Distributors are wondering where their $488 Million box office went? They're also looking to understand just what happened to that $1 Billion dollar floor, if $488 Million is now the ceiling. Kind of an upside down financial house, don't you think? Universal wants to know when that comparative ROI versus Disney is going to kick-in.
Since it cost 85 million less to produce, it could gross 170 million less and receive the same ROI as Big Hero 6.
Soooo...488 million would put it in the same box.
It is on its way. Still more markets to open.
Be patient!
Um... where exactly would that be? The latest release date I could find was August 9th, and that has passed already.
Please enlighten us to these other, future release dates to come.
Also, do you project those future release dates to garner the additional $84-million SLOP2 needs to make your $488-million mark?
Links and factual data, please.
[–] QueenFanUSA (2082) 4 hours agoWhat remaining markets are you being patient for? So far the markets that JUST opened (08/08/2019) are: Colombia, Mexico and Spain; and the three suggest a language synergy. Those markets did take in $45 Million for SLOP1 and if they perform for SLOP2 like they did for SLOP1 the remaining markets still would have to make up the additional $36 Million to get to the $488 Million that you state is comparative ROI territory.
It is on its way. Still more markets to open.
Be patient!
[–] QueenFanUSA (2124) 13 days agoWell almost two weeks have passed since you stated that we should all be patient and wait for this supposedly burgeoning box office (strong domestic legs based off of Universal's legendary summer performance - and - overseas markets that had just opened in the 1st week of August). Should we all continue to wait or do we have to accept the fact that you were wrong again?
It is on its way. Still more markets to open.
Be patient!
this is going to just murder the box office this summer?
1 billion worldwide is the absolute floor for this one.3. Wrong about SLOP2 merchandise sales based off of new characters being introduced and capturing a large audience. Nothing was "usual" about this for Universal. Maybe it is "usual" for Universal to see lackluster merchandising performances based on their films?
As usual, Universal/Illumination keeping the budget at 70 million. And the merchandise sales for the first film were off the chart. This one will introduce even more characters for merch.But wait....
I'll be glad to give you a response once you provide the "confirmed reports" corroborating billbrown's assertion that Disney got 65% of domestic ticket grosses and 55% of international for TLK2019. You implied you had them but are playing very coy indeed
share
[–] QueenFanUSA (2125) 19 minutes agoI never implied I had any such items and I have no need to be "coy".
I'll be glad to give you a response once you provide the "confirmed reports" corroborating billbrown's assertion that Disney got 65% of domestic ticket grosses and 55% of international for TLK2019. You implied you had them but are playing very coy indeed
If I provide for you a source that corroborates BillBrown what will I receive in return? Will you answer the myriad of questions that I have asked of you conversationally?You need to find your answer using google or doing some research or asking BillBrown. It is YOU who are being "Coy" in responding to our one-sided conversations based on your statements regarding SLOP2 and FandFH&S box offices which have NOTHING to do with BillBrown. Now does it?
You'd think that answering my questions would have nothing to do with BillBrown but sobeit!
Well...SLOP2 is an ILLUMINATION film so it definitely is "inferior animation and bad story-telling". That's a given. I personally can't stand their films BUT they usually do bonkers business both here and internationally.
Yes...I definitely got this wrong. While it is still successful and very profitable, it's definitely both an underperformer and a disappointment.
[–] QueenFanUSA (2126) 44 minutes agoInteresting response. You basically regurgitated what I typed as rhetorical questions to you and provided no insights of your own.
Well...SLOP2 is an ILLUMINATION film so it definitely is "inferior animation and bad story-telling". That's a given. I personally can't stand their films BUT they usually do bonkers business both here and internationally.
Yes...I definitely got this wrong. While it is still successful and very profitable, it's definitely both an underperformer and a disappointment.Stating that you got it wrong isn't a mea culpa that was requested as an answer to a question, but the implied question remains in how and why you got it wrong. If it was just a gut feeling or just your opinion what informed your opinion that made you want to state "hot, Hot, Hot" and why does your "Gut feeling" rotate 180 degrees when it comes to Disney films?
Ticket Price RevenueAs I stated to you in another post there is no 50/50 split between Studios and Exhibitors. Never has been and no Studio is going to correct this perception as it is to their advantage to keep Studio earnings and profits quite murky.
Theater attendance has been challenging over recent years, making it even harder for studios and distributors to profit from films. Usually, a portion of theater ticket sales goes to theater owners, with the studio and/or distributor getting the remaining percentage.
Traditionally, during the opening weekend of a film, the larger chunk went to the studio, while as the weeks went on, the theater operator's percentage rose. So a studio might make about 60% of a film's ticket sales in the U.S., and around 20% to 40% of that on overseas ticket sales.
The percentage of revenues an exhibitor gets depends on the contract for each film. Many contracts are intended to help a theater hedge against films that flop at the box office by giving theaters a larger cut of ticket sales for such films, so a deal may have the studio getting a smaller percentage of a poorly performing film and a larger percentage of a hit film's take. (You can see the securities filings for large theater chains to see how much of their ticket revenue goes back to the studios.)
My understanding is International is around 35-40% in aggregate.
shareBased on what? Furthermore does what I sourced for you not provide you some insight as to what BillBrown has stated as to Disney box office profitability?
Let's say he isn't 100% dead on accurate. His "formula" for calculations are more sound than yours that you use to bash and discredit Disney films. The industry leans in his favor and you've provided nothing more than protestations of his position and no references to the contrary.
Hang on...he said there are "confirmed reports" that Disney is getting 65% of domestic and 55% of international for TLK2019 SPECIFICALLY.
I'm still waiting.
What you provided ain't even close.
Why do you hate disney so much queen? You write that dc is killing it yet a disney movie makes 2.8 billion or 1.5 billion yet you find a way to be negative
shareI love Disney, furiousstyles! I like discussing box office and their films are much more expensive...I mean EVERY ONE OF THEM LOL..than their rivals. Thus...the path to profitability is much harder. This year has had only one big money-loser so far with Dumbo but last year saw half of their films losing money with three of them losing over 100 million apiece.
share"Based on what?"
First off, I never said that International(outside of China) was just 25%.
Second, your source material from investopedia and your expository comments are almost entirely undocumented assumptions and conjecture.
Ya.know...it kinda made news when Disney got 65% for The Last Jedi(domestic ONLY btw) so it seems to me that's not the norm. And in articles from Deadline, Variety and The Hollywood Reporter etc.when they are discussing profitability of films it is the general "twice it's budget + whatever they say they hear the P&A budget" was.
Yes...I've said it before THAT NO-ONE on the outside knows for sure what the exact takes are but reading industry chatter you get a general idea. I never read them giving special consideration to Disney films in discussion of their % take on the road to breaking even.
So, this discussion began with billbrown stating there are "confirmed reports"(his exact words) that Disney gets 65% domestic and 55% international for TLK2019. I can find "reports" about The Last Jedi((DOMESTIC ONLY) but can't find ONE on TLK2019. He's yet to provide me with one, and you sure didn't either.
Let's try this again.
[–] QueenFanUSA (2130) 16 hours ago
My understanding is International is around 35-40% in aggregate.
[–] QueenFanUSA (2130) an hour agoDid you mean Average? How could the total for International be 35-40% in aggregate? What countries are being added into the percentage to make it an aggregate? If it is an Average that would also mean some would be as high as 60-70% and as low as 10%-20%. No? Yes? Doesn't aggregate mean the "whole" or the "gross"? Which is why I asked "Based on What"?
"Based on what?"
First off, I never said that International(outside of China) was just 25%.
Second, your source material from investopedia and your expository comments are almost entirely undocumented assumptions and conjecture.My exposition (you don't say which statements you object to) are based on the article itself. Again you are being, your word "Coy" in expounding on your facts and being evasive with disproving anything that I stated with nothing more than, you just don't accept what I posted.
Ya.know...it kinda made news when Disney got 65% for The Last Jedi(domestic ONLY btw) so it seems to me that's not the norm. And in articles from Deadline, Variety and The Hollywood Reporter etc.when they are discussing profitability of films it is the general "twice it's budget + whatever they say they hear the P&A budget" was.Studios aren't going to broadcast what their contracts are which is why they don't print the details. Just because Deadline, Hollywood Reporter and other "Industry Chatter" don't allude to what "is" or "isn't" doesn't mean they know or don't know. They have basically dummied down the details to 2XBudget + .YP&A. Why because what makes up P&A varies due to accounting practicing. This was not conjecture, or supposition, or rumor, or innuendo.
Yes...I've said it before THAT NO-ONE on the outside knows for sure what the exact takes are but reading industry chatter you get a general idea. I never read them giving special consideration to Disney films in discussion of their % take on the road to breaking even.It is every one else explaining to you that your criteria for stating that Disney is failing because of how you set the criteria for their Budgets.
What "facts" am I "expounding" on?
I'm not the one stating I *know* what the exact %'s are so what am I supposed to be providing? The % I tend to go with(50% DOM/40%OS) are used in discussions much more than (65%/55%) but I'm not the one who said I KNOW exactly what they are.
I didn't outright "object" to any of your comments or the article itself. It's all assumptions and conjecture, though, with no documentation whatsoever. This discussion started off with billbrown stating that there are CONFIRMED REPORTS that Disney is receiving 65% of domestic and 55% of international grosses.
What is it you want ME to prove here? You believe billbrown is correct? If so, than the onus is on YOU to show I'm wrong in being skeptical. Where are these "confirmed reports"? I've asked you many times now and all you are saying is "Y'know, he's probably pretty close." Fine. Prove it. 65% domestic/55% International is never even discussed as usual %'s around here and then billbrown says there are "confirmed reports" and you say the onus is on ME to disprove it?
I weould say the one citing "confirmed reports" needs to provide them.
[–] QueenFanUSA (2131) 6 minutes ago1st. Did you mean Average or Aggregate? Big Difference in your discussion of facts and percentages.
What "facts" am I "expounding" on?
I'm not the one stating I *know* what the exact %'s are so what am I supposed to be providing? The % I tend to go with(50% DOM/40%OS) are used in discussions much more than (65%/55%) but I'm not the one who said I KNOW exactly what they are.
I DID read it and you must not have read MY response obviously. I said I don't object to any of that outright. It still wasn't a "confirmed report" that Disney got a "special deal"(also billbrown's exact words) for TLK2019.
Internationally, I used the wrong term...I meant the average...but I don't KNOW for sure. It's what I've seen generally accepted. Billbrown says his numbers are "CONFIRMED". When you say something is "confirmed" it would be nice to see this supposed "confirmation".
LOL...how many times do I have to repeat this?
"Again larger and more accurate Percentages aren't used widely due to the 50/50 being casually accepted without any veracity or rigor applied."
Well it's what they do in these articles on entertainment sites and Deadline's year-end profit roundup. 50/50 GLOBALLY + P&A expenses.
"2nd. You're supposed to provide a reference or source or site that validates or confirms the (50% DOM/40% OS). If you did that wouldn't that counter BillBrown?"
Ummmmm...lol...billbrown uses50/40 HIMSELF...that's why he pointed out that TLK2019 got a "SPECIAL DEAL" (again his EXACT WORDS) of 65/55%.
And you accuse ME of not reading and following?
Here's another "Source" for your reading pleasure on Box Office and "Confirmed Reports". https://www.rogerebert.com/letters/how-your-ticket-price-is-divided
From Steve Kraus, Chicago:Notice the part about SEC? share
This is a bit out of my area of expertise so I hope others with direct knowledge of theatrical booking will correct anything I say that is wrong but I wanted to correct the idea that as much as 90% of the movie ticket price goes to the studio.
When you hear figures that high...80-90 percent, that is AFTER a figure called the House Nut is deducted. The House Nut is supposed to be the operating costs of the theatre. In the case of a multiplex, it's the overall operating expense pro-rated by the seat count of each theatre. The reason I say "supposed to be" is because it's a negotiated figure that may or may not be real.
Anyway, they take the box office gross, deduct the nut, and THEN they split it by the high percentages you've heard, with the percentages usually changing each week, to gradually get less unfavorable to the exhibitor. This figure is then compared to a lesser percentage of the straight box office (without the nut deduction) and whichever is greater is the film rental owed the studio. There was a time in the past when exhibitors had to offer minimum guarantees, adding a third layer to this, but I believe that's gone away now.
To illustrate this, I have open in another window Regal Entertainment's most recent 10K filing with the SEC. For the year ending Dec. 29, they took in $1,842.6M at the box office. They paid out $953.7M as film rentals. Dividing, that means they paid about 51.8% of ticket revenue as film rental. No where near the percentages people sometimes think. Regal is a big company and might be able to negotiate slightly better terms but I believe the rest of the industry would be very similar.
During that same period they took in $708M at the concession counter. Concessions cost them (presumably not including labor) $96.6M for a gross profit of $611.4M. Ticket revenue minus film rentals were 888.9M
The 10K forms may be found on the investor part of their website.
So, this discussion began with billbrown stating there are "confirmed reports"(his exact words) that Disney gets 65% domestic and 55% international for TLK2019. I can find "reports" about The Last Jedi((DOMESTIC ONLY) but can't find ONE on TLK2019. He's yet to provide me with one, and you sure didn't either.I'm not even going to respond to supposedly providing you "Confirmed reports". These confirmed reports would no doubt be in the form of an SEC statement for Disney for one and there may even be other places that provide that level of financial summary on a film by film basis.
I am completely confident that the information in this article is a true representation of how these Hollywood blockbusters make money. The reason I am being a bit cagey about exactly where the data is from is partly to protect sources/ friends but also to avoid inviting lawsuits. The purpose of this site is educational and my sole intention is to help explain how our industry works. In the past, I have been contacted by lawyers for various companies, trying to prevent the sharing of key data points relating to their business. So far, I have managed to avoid lawsuits and also to avoid having to take any articles down, but if I were to offer the full figures as a download (or details of how to do the same piecing together I have) then I suspect I would get the wrong kind of attention.share
He said Disney got this SPECIFICALLY for TLK2019 and it is "confirmed"?
It's on me to go through SEC Reports? Are you kidding me?
Also...is it your position that it's only Disney that gets this "special deal" because billbrown definitely doesn't use this % breakdown for WB and Uni films that he says made "no profit" like Shazam!
If so, we need to use these new percentages for Disney's biggest rivals.
[–] QueenFanUSA (2134) 16 minutes agoQueenFanUSA, I understand you're frustrated but your frustration is born from your own ill-informed Box Office summaries of Disney films versus WB, Illumination, etc and your inability to even be marginally accurate.
He said Disney got this SPECIFICALLY for TLK2019 and it is "confirmed"?
It's on me to go through SEC Reports? Are you kidding me?
Also...is it your position that it's only Disney that gets this "special deal" because billbrown definitely doesn't use this % breakdown for WB and Uni films that he says made "no profit" like Shazam!
If so, we need to use these new percentages for Disney's biggest rivals.
"3. BillBrown being as verbose and loquacious as he tends to be, I tend to accept that he might be more correct than you at this juncture (not about the precise detail but about the substance) of your dispute with him. Your track record is spotty. "
He and I have debated for a long time now. We have always agreed on a general 50/50 GLOBAL take to...yes..."simplify things" when defining whether a film was profitable or not. He said there are "CONFIRMED REPORTS"(his exact words) and a "SPECIAL DEAL"(his exact words) where Disney got 65%/55%(his exact numbers) for TLK2019(specifically). Obviously he thinks that those are higher percentages than they would normally get.
I asked him to provide a link just one of the "confirmed reports" and he has yet to do so. I have tried to find one myself but have been unable to.
Here is my personal take-away from this exchange between you and I and it is about this board exclusively. You're a one person hype machine for other Studios except Disney and it is because of Disney.
You made statements as to SLOP2 having a floor of $1 Billion, having long strong legs at the Box Office, performing better than a comparably financed Disney film BH6 for example, and SLOP2 was going to own the summer and eviscerate Disney's summer Box Office releases.
When NONE of these things happened and more there wasn't a single comment on those statements from you. It is as-if you never said them.
Why? What made you state such random projections and what where your expectations based on? You've now moved on to The Joker board and it is the same spiel when NO ONE is stating that The Joker is not going to perform well both with critics and audiences. In this case you are stating the obvious and not providing anything of value. What is the point?
For the Joker you might be right but you will earn no experience points for stating what is rather obvious. Will it have a HUGE Box Office? You don't know and are too skittish to make a prediction. The best you'll do is copy BillBrown's model of stating what some other site or source has said and thereby hopefully insulate yourself from any and all accountability and just maybe criticism.
And yet you've never, to my knowledge, touted a single Disney film as, This one is coming in hot, Hot, HOT! Watch out guys!!? And yet you love Disney?
Maybe because there are always new movies coming out and I get bored locked into convos about the same ones? This board was a ghost town so I forgot it.
shareYes, I absolutely love Disney and of the "Big 3" studios(Disney/WB/Universal) they produce BY FAR the highest quality films. Universal is God-awful producing the most dumbed-down dreck in nearly all genres. Especially animation. But...they keep budgets low and put millions of butts in seats so what do I know?
share[–] QueenFanUSA (2739) 5 months agoYou know just enough to make factually wrong statements about Box office performance and projections? You know JUST enough to have non-meaningful opinions that you offer out loud on the internet?
Yes, I absolutely love Disney and of the "Big 3" studios(Disney/WB/Universal) they produce BY FAR the highest quality films. Universal is God-awful producing the most dumbed-down dreck in nearly all genres. Especially animation. But...they keep budgets low and put millions of butts in seats so what do I know?
"I'm not even going to respond to supposedly providing you "Confirmed reports"."
LOL...you do know that you first responded to ME asking billbrown to provide me a link to these supposed "confirmed reports", right? I mean it's kinda the whole basis for this back-n-forth. You just want to keep pulling up random, obscure postings of people saying "I'd love to tell you but then I'd have to kill you."
"It is an expansive site with lots, and lots, and lots of detail that will breakdown, detail, explain, define everything for you. How you synthesize the information is on you but it is all there."
Oh...so THIS is where it's "confirmed" that TLK2019 received 65%DOM/55%OS?
[–] QueenFanUSA (2137) 22 minutes agoThat is for me to know and for you to find out! I took the time to post the link. Ball is in your court. share
"It is an expansive site with lots, and lots, and lots of detail that will breakdown, detail, explain, define everything for you. How you synthesize the information is on you but it is all there."
Oh...so THIS is where it's "confirmed" that TLK2019 received 65%DOM/55%OS?
Queen, curious, do you even watch movies or just look at the sale numbers? When I browse the threads of movies I have recently seen and see your threads the most I see (at least for me) is you talking about the movie numbers/sales.
shareOh yes...I go quite often! About once a week at least.
shareto be fair, he's not the only one. Those he clashes with seem most concerned with the same.
It under performed.
shareWe're still waiting on today's actuals gross.
Also, remember that this only cost 80 million dollars NOT 175 million like Ralph Breaks the Internet or 170 million like Dumbo.
Rockfly...remember that animated films almost always have long legs (well at least Universal/Illumination's) and this is summer when kids are out of school. There is no animated studio more famous for producing leggy, cheaply produced and profitable films than Universal/Illumination.
shareToyS4 opens 3rd weekend of Pets2. OW should beat P2 gross. T2 will last all summer, P2 will be forgotten.
shareYeh , really hot, made 112 million worldwide and is falling like a lead balloon , told you queen , I know movies a lot more than you , this is a money loser as I said last week , game , set , match , you lose , I win , loser
shareCome on furious. Don't let your QFU disdain cloud your assessment of SLOP 2. It is a $80 Mil production movie. It clearly ain't Hot. Hot, Hot but it isn't exactly bombing either. What is bombing is QFU's take, view and opinions of what he thinks of the film's BO performance.
He is just trolling you instead of BillBrown now.