Am I The Only One?


Who didn't like Nightcrawler? I just rented it and watched with solid expectations and was very disappointed. Sure, the directing and acting are all very good but I found nearly all the characters to be unlikeable with the exception of Lou's partner and plus a very anti-climatic ending, and on top of all that, a decent amount of plot holes. I understand why it would purposely have unlikeable characters as your lead is a sociopath, but even compared to other sociopaths in film like Patrick Bateman, at least he was pretty hilarious and deliriously entertaining to watch.

Overall, I was sorely disappointed and didn't care for the film. I am not going to be one of those ridiculous posters and say it was one of the worst films ever but I will call it the most overrated film of 2014. 4/10 for me.

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... I found nearly all the characters to be unlikeable with the exception of Lou's partner and plus a very anti-climatic ending, and on top of all that, a decent amount of plot holes. I understand why it would purposely have unlikeable characters as your lead is a sociopath...


If you want, maybe you can try thinking about this satire from a couple of other perspectives. In the long run I believe it will stay in my head because of how efficiently it uses just the interactions between a character and the society that created him to detail so many relevant observations in 2 hours. Since watching it my thoughts have included:

1. A rare portrayal, but NOT a character study, of the progression of a more realistic narcissistic sociopath on film; Lou is a scavenger and both a contagious and an infectious virus... or LinkedIn profile 😄

2. Lou is the human embodiment of capitalism (particularly American), a corporation, and even a small business that is bottomlessly encouraged to be more and more cutthroat for not just survival, but fecundity

3. He is also the inevitable creation of capitalism, an individualistic system that measures success by financial profits

4. His face was emotionless as he watched Rick die, but comes alive as soon as he watches television programs and video footage

5. Consumerism; "Nightcrawler" (maggot-like media) is born when a culture of fear meets supply and demand

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I absolutely understand your points and certainly did pick up on the message of capitalism in America. Also, I do agree that it shows one of the most realistic sociopaths in film but with all of that being said and possibly because I did not know going in that Nightcrawler was a social satire, I thought it was a Crime/Drama/Thriller. Now, it is possible that because of my assumption, that I did not care for the film for that reason but I did find it to be quite unrealistic with the exception of the social commentary and characters and also, to have some plot holes that are just hard to overlook so easily.

Now, it may just be not my type of movie. I do appreciate your response, rarely do you ever have some sort of a decent exchange about film on IMDB without insults being thrown.

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This was a crime/drama/thriller. However, if you want a film that fits nicely in a traditional Hollywood narrative then there are about hundred thousand other titles where good triumphs over evil and sre completely unrealistic.

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Actually, I much prefer downer endings over your typical Hollywood ending. Also, I love independent films, don't get me wrong, there are some Hollywood films I like but you make it sound like you think I only watch movies like Transformers, Hunger Games, etc. There is a huge difference between downer endings and anti-climatic endings.

Films I love with downer/most realistic endings:
The Departed
There Will Be Blood
The Wrestler
American History X
No Country for Old Men
Shutter Island
Reservoir Dogs
Gran Torino
The Machinist
Drive
The Road
The Grey
Mystic River
Layer Cake

The list goes on and on.

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A lot of the films you listed have endings that could be considered anti-climatic. No Country For Old Men ends with Tommy Lee Jones talking in his kitchen. Great movie btw.

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I think No Country for Old Men is the only one on the list that is usually considered to have an anti-climatic ending. Some of those have ambiguous endings but I don't consider them to be anti-climatic. Like I mentioned in my second post to the first responder, Nightcrawler may have just been not my type of film.

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The spelling is "anti-climactic". Anti-climatic would be referring to climate.


"Don't believe his lies, he's the one, KILL HIM." - Memento

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Thanks, that is on me. I actually appreciate that so I don't look like that much of a fool with my spelling and grammar.

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Give Arlington Road a shot. It's worthy of your list for sure.

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Thanks for the recommendation, I never heard of Arlington Road before but am now very interested to see the film. Thanks.

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No problem :) Underrated film in my opinion. I remember seeing it in the theatre and when it ended, the whole crowd exited in dead silence.

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Um, yeah. I was all messed up on pain pills bc I just had my wisdom teeth out (watched at home) but I can still remember CLEAR AS DAY the feeling that movie left me with after the ending. But those are the kinds of movies I love the most. Also, OP, try watching "Bully."

"Hey, let me ask you a question, bonehead: Why are you trying to ki-ki-ki-killllll me?!?!?"

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Was it a good dead silence as in the movie made a powerful/deep impact on the audience?

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Yes. The kind of ending that leaves your jaw on the floor. I prefer that kind of ending too.

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The Road


I like you, I like you a lot.

You are now aware that Sam Rockwell will never be given the credit that he deserves.

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You are now aware that Sam Rockwell will never be given the credit that he deserves.


THIS

I still think that this guy is going to really catch on in a big way one day.

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for not just survival, but *fecundity*


Thanks for the opportunity to learn a new awesome vocabuary :)

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Not so much capitalism, but consumerism. If the viewers of news did not crave these videos, the station would not pay the big bucks and Lou would be doing some other type of work. Besides, Lou truly enjoys his work and does not do it for the money. But he is astute and charges what he's worth because it's the right thing to do. But that is not what is driving him. Now, his sidekick and partner, he is driven by pure need to make money. He doesn't care about this work and would be doing anything to make a buck. Yes, capitalism and free market economy and consumerism are tied together. But this film does not critique this aspect at all. It is more concerned with human behavior, specifically how a sociopath can exist undetected and actually thrive thanks to his lack of compassion or basic decency towards other people. A 'normal' person would not be able to do the kind of work Lou does. Even Bill Paxton's character would be appalled at some of the stunts Lou pulled. Anyway, capitalism is not on display here. This is a story of a deranged man, enabled by our devolved society.

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Not so much capitalism, but consumerism... Yes, capitalism and free market economy and consumerism are tied together. But this film does not critique this aspect at all. It is more concerned with human behavior, specifically how a sociopath can exist undetected and actually thrive thanks to his lack of compassion or basic decency towards other people... Anyway, capitalism is not on display here. This is a story of a deranged man, enabled by our devolved society.


I outlined out some thoughts in brief and never planned to elaborate on most of them, and they are not intended to be exhaustive or exclusive. Consumerism can apply, too--but certainly does not invalidate my attachment of capitalism to any extent in this symbolic situation.

Everything is open to interpretation, though I will note that consumerism more emphasizes DEMAND-side economics (media viewers in this satire), which the director uses Louis ("supply") to address more indirectly than directly. The focus of this specific observation is on Louis and not what it implies about his video footage audiences.

After reading your response I spent a while looking into how the director interprets his own project:

Every scene in Nightcrawler is ultimately a transaction. I’m very interested in the economic aspects of it, what it says about capitalism. I believe that Lou moves through a landscape of a world of transactions. I believe that’s the world we’re increasingly living in. I believe it’s a much more dog-eat-dog world. I believe that people are much more aware that whatever safety net we thought was there is really not there. What used to be a domestic competition is now a global competition. People are willing to do your job for a fraction of what you do.


I believe that Lou is representative of our times. And I believe the Lous are increasingly being rewarded… If you came back ten years in the film, Lou would probably be running a major company. I feel a lot of the people in the boardroom have sociopathic behavior and are being rewarded for it. They are making choices that are affecting tens of thousands of people’s lives. They are putting people out on the street… What Lou does would serve him very well in the boardroom… He’s an uber-capitalist. He’s a hyper-capitalist… The thing about hyper-capitalism is that everything becomes bottom line. Hyper-capitalism to me almost becomes the jungle. It’s the strong will consume the weak.


Interviewer: What I love about Lou is that he feels like if you shoved the Great Gatsby under a rock and just fed him self-help books and other forms of bullsh t for 50 years, and then saw what crawled out. Where did that whole “achiever” element of Lou’s personality come from?

Gilroy: I had heard about the nightcrawling world, and I’m very aware that there are tens of millions of young people around the world who are facing bleak employment prospects. Italy has 45% unemployment under 30 — it’s insane. So [I was exploring] idea of a desperate younger person looking for work.

I started [sic] to think of the anti-hero; I think you have to be careful and aware that you don’t want it to be a reductive study of psycho-babble. You are looking for something more. You want the audience to connect in a way that goes beyond a just sort of a pathological study. The idea of a character who had an implied back story of abuse and abandonments; I pictured him alone as a child, and all he had was his computer and he was going on his computer a lot surfing — this is the back story. And in his desperate loneliness and probably raging insanity, the precepts of capitalism became a religion to him. If you only had [one] direction to climb, which is up, then to have a goal would give sanity. I imagine he started to scour the internet for self-help maxims and aphorisms, and Forbes 500 corporate-HR manual speak. I believe he’s an uber-capitalist, and capitalism is a religion, it’s a religion that gives him sanity and which ultimately drives him insane and pushes him over the edge. It’s [sic] a mindless pursuit of a goal that can never be achieved. That ultimately leaves only a hunger, which goes back to the coyote — this perpetual hunger that can never be satiated.

The whole Zen thing of that wanting is to suffer, which capitalism never seems to get, because all capitalism is wanting.

It’s the perpetual spirit of poverty. I don’t know another system other than capitalism, maybe some mixed socialism thing. I wouldn’t want to hazard what the better system was, but I think we’re entering into this period of hyper free-market [capitalism] that’s becoming very much like the jungle, in which it is acceptable that the weak perish at the hands of the strong, and that’s the way it’s supposed to be. And I feel like the world as I see it — and this is a personal film on a lot of levels — has been reduced to transactions, and that Lou thrives in that world because that’s the only thing that has any relevance to him. And we approach it as a success story of a guy who is looking for work at the beginning and is the owner of a successful business at the end, and the reason I approach it that way is because I didn’t want at the end for the audience at to go, "oh, the problem is this psychopath!” I wanted the audience to go “maybe the problem is the world that created and rewards this character.” Maybe it’s a larger question.

...

When capitalism becomes dog eat dog, the problem is a) who wants to be a dog? And b) who wants to eat one?

Right, you’re going to be one or the other. And Lou is someone who has made peace with it and understands it and has no emotional attachment to thwart him or to slow him down. I find much of my energy in a day is worrying about people I love or myself. I wake up at 3 o’clock in the morning and find myself worrying about myself and friends and stuff and people I’ve encountered. Lou is unencumbered by that, and it gives him great ability to focus in and hunt.

...

... And if you were wrong about the bottom line being the only thing that's important, you wouldn't be being rewarded.

I believe — and when I was writing this film, I firmly believed — that if you came back in 10 years, Lou would be running a multi-million dollar, multi-national corporation. Lou would do better in comparison between himself and a corporate head who broke the company apart and put 40,000 people out of work and then went off to build an 8,000-foot square home and wound up on the cover of BusinessWeek Magazine...

... For increasing shareholder value.

These attributes are celebrated, and I believe Lou is a small fish compared to other people. And I believe Lou will [sic] do well and thrive when the movie ends.

It's the reverse of a canary in a coal mine: The better he does, the worse trouble we're in.

Absolutely. I believe it's only the stupid sociopaths that are caught, and I believe most sociopaths are insanely brilliant in deciphering what human cues need to be manipulated, and the sociopaths know people like lions know gazelles; they know every weakness, they know every smell, they know every element that can be manipulated... and Lou understands people and knows how to do that.


I apologize in advance for quoting larger swathes of the interview than necessary. I just figure someone may find them entertaining to read.

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Thanks for this interview, I could feel much of what the writer was conveying as I watching the movie. For instance I felt he would do well after the movie ended and such are the people who are the corporate heads nowadays who have scant empathy towards anyone below them. To feel that the writer had this idea and translated brilliantly into a gripping story that people can relate to /understand and again the top notch acting to bring out the essence of the characters is just phenomenal!

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Thank you. It was an interesting read.

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Agreed and also a depraved media culture in which such behavior would not only be tolerated but rewarded.

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I read your comment and the reply by redlightdistrict. You are closer to the point. It is good that the director gave the caveat (in the interview) that those are just his personal thoughts. They reveal his intent but they reveal nothing about capitalism. And an economic system is not "responsible for" the actions of those who operate within it.

The most egregious error in the comments about capitalism is the suggestion that successful capitalists are sociopaths. Yes, it is definitely implied if you look carefully. In rebuttal, let me point out that there are many (of the most successful capitalists) who are not sociopaths (e.g. Gates, Buffett, Disney). And others do not advocate a "dog eat dog" society (Ben & Jerry, anyone?).

Would Lou survive or flourish in other economic systems? If so, then his success is not dependent on or related to the economic system in which he operates. It would be easy to place Lou in (for the most extreme example) Soviet Russia and have him succeed to the head of the party because of his ruthless approach to "success" and his ability to adapt to the system. e.g. ingratiating himself with those in power, trading favors, destroying those who oppose him. Such crony socialism would be a good fit. I might point out that crony capitalism--the system that is predominant in the U.S. (as opposed to the more preferred market capitalism) can also be manipulated in similar ways.

I understand Gilroy's point of view, but we might term his views on capitalism (and those of some others on this site) to be econobabble, which should be avoided as much as psychobabble. And his statement that "capitalism is a religion" certainly falls into that category.

Of course we can understand the director's point of view to some degree, since this film was not created to make money and he work gratis. Oh wait. No, the fact is that this film is part of a capitalist system. I am guessing he hoped that audiences would enjoy the film and he would be rewarded monetarily because of it (supply and demand). This is not to say that there was no artistic motive, but artistry and economics are not mutually exclusive.

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Of course we can understand the director's point of view to some degree, since this film was not created to make money and he work gratis. Oh wait. No, the fact is that this film is part of a capitalist system. I am guessing he hoped that audiences would enjoy the film and he would be rewarded monetarily because of it (supply and demand). This is not to say that there was no artistic motive, but artistry and economics are not mutually exclusive.


Yes the director made a film so he could get paid but the film is fake, people weren't really dying in the movie. No one is being exploited. Everyone who worked on the film, I am assuming was paid for their effort.

The news industry on the other hand makes money off of people's suffering, real suffering not fake deaths but real death. Does anyone who shows up in a news report ever get paid? True ruthless capitalism, or if you want to say consumerism, where money is the only thing that matters above any thing else, even ethics. anyone who knows the US knows that people in the US will sell their ethics for a pay check. That's capitalism as well as consumerism in a nutshell. Its not supposed to be like that but the cold hard truth is that it is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_BbtXj2P4g

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I was not criticizing the filmmaker or his motives.

News is something that consumers want. And that makes sense, doesn't it? We want to know what is happening in our neighborhood and the world. But so many TV consumers desire titillation--stories that involve sex or violence. We can criticize that all we want, but it's a fact. As a result, the news media give the public what it wants. Any news person or organization that feeds the public this pulp but pretends to be an objective source of non-sensationalized news is a hypocrite and deserves criticism. That has nothing to do with capitalism. The classical example of providing news without bias is to be applauded, though few such newspersons remain.

"True ruthless capitalism" is a manufactured term. "True capitalism" will suffice to describe free market or laissez-faire capitalism. Should people always call true socialism "true force-driven socialism"?

The fact remains that any economic system can be subverted by individual actors. That is not a condemnation of any particular economic system. And it is not a way to judge different systems.

One of the best ways, in my opinion, is to consider if it relies heavily upon government to operate. When individuals barter (exchange something for money or another thing), they don't need a government--except for protection, to make sure the terms of the exchange were met. Otherwise, there is theft. Basically, government's charge is to protect everyone from anyone who would initiate force (against one's person or property). When the government taxes us for that protection, it does so at the threat of force (don't pay your taxes and go to jail). What we don't need is a government that provides police, runs schools, regulates every transaction in minute detail, provides day care, hospitals, roads, gives goods to other countries, authorizes arms deals, listens in on its citizenry, considers itself a welfare organization, supports foreign political entities, etc. Every dollar spent by government was raised by threat of force. The less force the better. The more government the more corruption and the more waste--this is strictly an observation tested over time. All organizations, whether private or public, struggle to be efficient and true to their mission when they get larger.

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I've had a many of discussion with people that enjoyed this movie.

I'm on the other end of the spectrum where I absolutely loathed the thing.

I've seen a many a film and have pretty varied tastes, but this thing plays out like a poorly written C-level horror flick that relies solely on shock value rather than plot or character progression.

It makes absolutely no sense that this guy is portrayed as being so clever and able to scheme up enough cash to purchase a $70,000 mobile studio when he starts out unemployed and driving a beater.

He's pushing 30 and to think he just wakes up one day, walks down the road, and sees an accident for everything to just click is so far reached it ruins the entire film for me.

They basically create a psychopath out of an autistic kid and have Jake Gyllenhall spewing weird speeches just to make him weird.

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I disagree. He wouldn't have been able to hold down a 9-to-5, his employment track record would be abysmal, and filled with thefts, vandalism, and probably violence. People like Jake don't have a tendency to do well unless they find a niche. It took him a while to find his. It doesn't really come out of the blue - he had been wheeling and dealing, being his own boss, before he discovered he could peddle video. In another life he might have found a niche as a Wall St trader.

His amorality, and his bartering skills were suited to a career where he did not have to respect authority figures, got to be the boss immediately, and was known and respected for what he did. All the things denied him in the kinds of jobs open to someone that had a bad employment history and a web-education.

I don't see him as autistic at all. A sociopath/psychopath and a narcissist but he gave no indications of being autistic to me.

Of course there are weak bits, like the video he shot of the women talking to the cops through the window. He could have set up a great picture resting the camera on books and then happening to catch her hearing her husband had died and having a wail. This would have been good footage - what he got instead was pretty lame, but for the film it is 'great' footage. I also thought watching the entire broadcast of his home invasion was tedious, and I wasn't really interested in a discussion of the lack of accountability or inner workings of the news media. I was more interested in where this was going for our psycho cameraman.


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I liked it a lot, but, yeah, there aren't any likeable characters. His sidekick is okay, but he's a hapless dupe. But, it's not a movie about likeable characters. The guy's a complete sociopath, and you're not supposed to identify with him, just be appalled at what he does. Kind of like Taxi Driver. That's one of my favorite movies, but Travis Bickle is a total lunatic creep. He's interesting to watch, but you don't root for him.

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Taxi Driver is a masterpiece, even though Travis Bickle is a lunatic. However, I was thoroughly interested in Taxi Driver all the way through, I wasn't really in Nightcrawler. I didn't find Bloom interesting and therefore may have been put off by the film.

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[deleted]

Nah.. I was completely fascinated by this character. It's a very refreshing portrayal in my opinion. I thought the movie had a refreshing tone as a satire too.

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Some people would find the movie too dark, but I thought it improved as it went along, completely immersing you into the story. One of the best thrillers I've seen in a while.

http://www.tinaaumontseyes.com

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I love dark movies, those are usually my favorite type of film. I will give Nightcrawler this, I wasn't bored, I was interested enough in the story that the film flew by it's running time.

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Well, at this point what is the use of discussing it any further? You seem to agree that on a surface level the film is ok, just that it's the plot an the characters you personally could not keep your interest. Other people have given their own reason for why they felt those elements did work for them.

End of discussion would say. Going any further would just turn in to pointlessly repeating ourselves.

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Come on man. How can you write that but only give it 4/10? Even my most loathed films get a 5/6 at least, I really don't understand the harsh ratings on this site.

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I thought it was the best film of 2014. It might be a grower for you? I noticed Taxi Driver being mentioned which I think this had a similar tone to and is incidentally my all time favourite film. The reason I bring it up is I first saw Taxi Driver about 25 years ago and to be honest it didn't really make that big an impact on me but it grew into my favourite film in time. There is also the possibility that this film won't grow on you of course but maybe check it out again in a few months?

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You are not alone. It gets 5 for being preachy. We get it already. Satirical? Yes but only because it becomes a satirical narrative based on satire. Poor exaggerated acting on the part of the lead...and just poor on the part of some others including Russo...poor woman!
What "artsy" folks in Hollywood can do is to make a film that exposes the news business by exposing/analyzing society's demand for fake news.

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It didn't blow me away but it kept my interest, I could easily name 30 movies from 2014 I liked better tho

I prefer '15 Minutes' which has a similar theme of news-agencies going way over the line to sell stories

The sun don't shine forever, but as long as it's here then we might as well shine together

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I thought Jake did a great job as Louis Bloom. His cold, dead eyes, the fake smile he uses with people that makes him look like a grinning skull, the psychotic rage you can see boiling just under the surface; everything he did to fully embody this character makes it a great performance. I've never been a Gyllenhaal fan, just thought he seemed like an mediocre actor, but he really impressed me in this. I'm not surprised the Academy didn't nominate him for this, since they frequently screw it up, like awarding Crash Best Picture and Eddie Redmayne over Michael Keaton for Best Actor.

Anyways, I think his portrayal of Bloom elevates this otherwise mildly entertaining film and makes it far more riveting. He was a horrible character but electrifying to watch. You can't help but keep your eyes glued to him to see what horrible thing he'll do next.

"Devour me, devour me - if you really think that you can stomach me."

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I thought Jake gave a solid performance as well, I was so impressed with Gyllenhaal in Prisoners which I thought was a great film, definitely recommended if you haven't seen it yet. Never go by the Academy, even though I liked Crash, it surely wasn't the Best Picture of that year and the fact that Eddie Redmayne won over Keaton this year was ludicrous especially if you seen Redmayne's performance in Jupiter Ascending. Keaton was fantastic in Birdman.

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You realise Eddie Redmayne won for an Oscar for his performance in The Theory of Everything and not Jupiter Ascending, don't you? Otherwise I really don't see the point in what you're saying. Also I loved Birdman, and I loved Keaton's performance, but he was playing a washed up actor, hardly a huge stretch for him was it?

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Of course I know Redmayne won for The Theory of Everything and not for a critically panned sci-fi film. However, say, the case of Eddie Murphy, many people consider Murphy didn't win because of the hideous Norbit. As for your other response, different rating systems, if I loathe a film, it is going to get a 1, no doubt about it. If I gave a film a 4, it means I don't like the film but it does have positive moments in it. I don't consider a 4/10 to be a harsh rating, different rating systems, that's all.

As for Keaton's performance in Birdman, it may not be a stretch for him but that doesn't take away from the performance, in fact, I think it makes the performance more real. Same with Mickey Rourke's fantastic performance in The Wrestler.

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You're obviously not the only one, but your reasoning is somewhat poor. I don't understand why the characters need to be likeable for people to enjoy movies. Making Lou sympathetic in any way would have been so corny. The sidekick being such an essentially decent guy was already flirting with disaster...

I gave it an 8, but feel I overrated it. It had a good performance from Gylenhaal (sp? I hate his name), was well made, thematically relevant and nicely paced, but too damn obvious. Almost terminally predictable. I could accurately forecast what was going to happen at each and every juncture. Would have been nice to occasionally be at least a little surprised...

It probably deserves no more than 7, but meh. It's certainly a solid film.

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I don't believe I said that a film needs to have likeable characters, I did say, it should have interesting characters whether likeable or not. I think it is good they didn't make Lou sympathetic but I didn't find him interesting to watch.

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