MovieChat Forums > Beauty and the Beast (2017) Discussion > A few questions...

A few questions...

posted 8 years ago by sarahb2 (69)
11 replies | jump to latest

So, having seen the movie twice now, I have a few questions:

During the final ballroom scene, Mrs. Potts and Maurice look at each other; Maurice bows to her a little, and she nods her head.

What's THAT about? Are they supposed to know each other or something? That gesture made no sense to me. It's like there was a subplot about them being former lovers that got cut out, even though I know that's not the case. It's weird.

If we're supposed to accept that some of the villagers end up being the enchanted object's SOs (Monsieur Jean is actually Mr. Potts, and another villager is Mrs. Cogsworth), don't you think the writers should have made them NOT be jerks for the rest of the movie? Same goes for Stanley, who we assume ends up being LeFou's SO.

Are we supposed to be happy about this? For 99.9% of the movie Stanley, and Mrs. Cogsworth, are horrible human beings - they treat Belle like crap, have no problem harrassing Maurice, and heck, they were all for killing Beast! But what, now that the curse is broken that makes their previous behavior OK? Apparently it doesn't bother the prince to have all these horrid people in his castle - which they were very eager to destroy, and kill him too! - but it would bother me. If I was writing the movie I would have at least given them the kind of character arc that Pere Robert got.

Speaking of which - what the heck happened to Pere Robert? The last time you see him is when he's protesting Maurice being sent to an asylum. He doesn't join the villagers in storming the castle, obviously, but he's not in the last scene either. What happened to him?

Why did they water Gaston's character down so much? In the 1991 movie he was arrogant and disdainful of learning right from the get-go, brushing aside Belle's love of reading with a couple of snide remarks.

But here he seems, while not really understanding of Belle's interest in reading, at least OK with it. He comes across as romantically clumsy but not really offensive, which makes Belle seem like a real beyotch for rejecting him offhand. I mean, yeah, we all know he ends up being a creep, but at least in the beginning he seems earnest, and he's got a good point - without a husband Belle's going to be in trouble when her father dies. So why NOT marry a military guy who's going to be gone most of the time anyway? The 1991 movie gave a good answer, this one didn't.

Whose decision was it to NOT have the title song sung by Audra MacDonald? Because that was a bad decision. She's a trained singer who's won a lot of awards for her voice. Emma Thompson...isn't. And don't say "Hey, it's tradition, Mrs. Potts sings that song." They changed LeFou's orientation and a lot of other things. They could have changed that too.

[–] EDavies (41) 8 years ago

I don't think they've watered Gaston down. The only reason why he never doubted Belle's intelligence, is because he sees Belle as a prize to be won, and her intelligence only makes her an even better prize in Gaston's eyes. Also, here's this exchange during their conversation. may contain spoilers.

Gaston: (while following Belle) Belle, I heard you had trouble with the headmaster. He'll never like me either. Can I give you a little advice on the villagers though? They're never going to trust the kind of change you're trying to bring. (steps on Belle's cabbages)

Belle: All I wanted was to teach a child to read.

Gaston: The only children you should concerned yourself with are...your own.

Belle: (tries to get past Gaston but he blocks her path.) I'm...not ready to have children. (manages to get past him and enter the gate.)

Gaston: Maybe you haven't met the right man.

Belle: It's a small village, Gaston. I've met them all. (closes the gate and starts to head home.)

Gaston: (opens the gate and follows her) Maybe you'll want to take another look around. Some of us have changed.

Belle: Gaston, we can never make each other happy. No one can change that much.

Gaston: Oh Belle. Do you know what happens to spinsters in this village after their fathers die? They beg for scraps like poor Agathe. This is our world Belle. For simple folk like us, it doesn't get any better. (grabs her dress and pulls her closer to him.)

Belle: (pulls dress away from him, and backs away into the house as he creeps up to her.) I might be a farm girl, but I'm not simple. And I'm never going to marry you Gaston. I'm sorry. (closes the door.)

[–] sarahb2 (69) 8 years ago

So, based on the above dialogue, what's wrong with Gaston, actually? Notice he doesn't criticize Belle for reading like 1991 Gaston does; he just says the headmaster 'doesn't like him either', although he doesn't say why. He doesn't criticize her for teaching a child to read, either, just says she should concern herself with having children of her own. That's not such a bad thing to say.

He's actually being quite charming here, and an OK kinda guy, if a little dorky when it comes to romance. He's trying to tell Belle he's changed. And it could be argued that he's being very kind, trying to keep Belle from ending up a spinster begging for scraps.

There's nothing in that dialogue, or his demeanor, that's in the least objectionable. Yet Belle is the one who comes across as aloof and snotty, harshly rejecting him for no reason and even closing her eyes and shaking her head as she walks away as if to say, how DARE he want to spend time with me! What a MORON! Honestly!

Compare this with the 1991 movie, where Gaston expresses open disdain for Belle's reading: "It's not right for a woman to read! Soon she starts getting ideas and thinking..." AND he throws her book in the mud. It's very clear he objects to Belle reading, or any woman reading.

In the 2017 version, that's never even hinted at. Gaston even compliments Belle's book! True, it's a clumsy attempt at wooing her, but still, it's never shown that he has any objection at all to her reading, or even teaching a child to read. His only objection is that she isn't concentrating on her own childbearing - which isn't a bad thing to point out in the mid-1700s when a young woman had to have her children early before disease took hold so she would have someone to take care of her in her old age.

Don't get me wrong, overall I liked Luke Evans' portrayal, I just thought that they didn't build his character arc nearly as well as they did in the 1991 film. I wanted to see more of that arrogant menace early on.

[–] EDavies (41) 8 years ago

Gaston's only acting nice to Belle so he can have her as his trophy wife. This is what sociopaths do. They act genuinely charming in order to get what they want. Remember when he was offering flowers to her, there's a reason why Belle didn't want the kind of flowers Gaston was offering. She liked roses, like the ones in the paintings. Gaston's only offering Belle flowers and being kind to her is just a front so she'll fall into his arms instantly. He was also stalking her as well. Stalking doesn't make a girl fall in love with you. You could get arrested for stalking a girl. That's reality. We can't judge him based on his first impressions. That is what the film is trying to tell us. Don't judge anything by appearances.

[–] LeiaOfLothlorien (1980) 8 years ago

He was still a creep. That has very stalkerish vibes. Especially the pulling at her dress part. *shudder*

EDIT: I certainly wouldn't want to date a guy like that. Granted, I might accept the flowers, but I'd slam the door in face.

[–] LaurieGonzalez (130) 8 years ago

Oh my gosh Sarah are you for real? He's a pig! He's only ACTING as nice is he can to try and get her but she's not a fool! If you are a woman is this the type of man you want to be with? If you are a man and think his behavior is not "objectionable" then you need to get a clue. He wasn't even a little bit "charming". Wow.

[–] sarahb2 (69) 8 years ago

Actually, in the time frame we're talking about, a lot of women DID marry this kind of guy, mostly so they didn't starve to death in poverty.

But I digress. Please know that I'm not defending Gaston or saying that I don't find him so bad. I think he's a horrible human being. But that fact, which was made very clearly in the 1991 movie, isn't so clear in the 2017 version.

The Gaston in the 2017 is lacking a lot of the bullying, pushy qualities that the animated Gaston of the 1991 film had. He doesn't force his way into Belle's house; he doesn't act disdainful toward her reading; he doesn't get extremely angry when she refuses him. 1991 Gaston blew a gasket when she said 'no', growling that "Belle WILL marry me! Make no mistake about THAT!!"; you knew he meant business. 2017 just goes and sulks in the tavern. He's not angry; he's depressed. And nothing to really be afraid of.

If you doubt that 2017 Gaston does not get the point across that he's a horrible, violent, misogynistic jerk, just go to Tumblr and check out all the "Redeem Gaston! He's not so bad! He's actually really cute and misunderstood!" posts. Girls are finding Luke Evans' Gaston sexy and lovable, because Disney didn't make him nearly brutish enough in this version. That's right - even though Gaston tries to KILL THE MAIN CHARACTER, there are still girls out there who swoon over how sexy he is. Nobody did that for the 1991 Gaston, because the writers were careful to make it clear that he really was a despicable character. For some reason, Disney chose to not make Luke Evans' Gaston nearly as bad. And that's a shame.

[–] lemner (231) 8 years ago

Agree, Gaston only wants Belle because he wants the best, and he thinks she's the best because she's the most beautiful. Obviously he is only interested in appearances, and cares nothing for her as a person (as well as not respecting her wishes).

Also, "The only children you should concerned yourself with are...your own." Sounds rather bossy, if not bullying.

However, after she says she's not ready for children, I think Gaston's reply is more like, "maybe you haven't met the right man," implying she hasn't noticed him.

Then a nasty little threat about her becoming a spinster begging for scraps.

Anyone who still thinks he's a nice guy is just blinded by his good looks.

[–] LeiaOfLothlorien (1980) 8 years ago

(SPOILERS!)

1. The villagers lost all memory of anyone in the castle, so that might have messed with their personalities. Maybe Maurice and Mrs Potts were friends or something. I thought it was the Enchantress that looked at him, though, which would have made sense since she saved him from the wolves. Why the villagers were separated from their partners is another question entirely.

2. No idea what happened to Pere Robert. He seemed like an interesting character, though.

3. Gaston might not have openly objected to Belle's reading, but he was still a pr*** set on marrying Belle whether she wanted to or not. He even tried to kill Maurice! And he was clearly full of himself from the start.

[–] EDavies (41) 8 years ago

You can't be more right. Gaston was a narcissist and selfish from the start. He never cared for Belle as a person underneath that charming demeanor.

[–] LaurieGonzalez (130) 8 years ago

The villagers were separated from their partners because they were the hired help and got caught in the enchantment when they were at work. Staff do not have to live in the castle.

[–] Wint3rFir3 (7384) 8 years ago

Agreed, agreed, agreed.

The look was very weird and very jarring. They were never in on the enchantment or working together, and they definitely weren't into each other, so whatever they were trying to imply, sorry, implication fail.

The whole village being against Belle and her father to such a great extent that only one person was really fighting Maurice being locked up in an asylum on a whim made no sense on many levels - mainly because they didn't really establish Maurice as the town nut-job. They just set up Belle as kinda weird. So the turn around at the end, when you find out they're all part of the enchantment, it's not like, 'oh it makes sense that they were all d*cks!' - no it doesn't.

Pere Robert - exactly! Where did the only nice character go? And why? Was he crushed during the Gaston fall and we all just brushed it off?

imo, Gaston isn't watered down so much as drastically changed. He's written as one character - a nice one - until he suddenly isn't. I never saw him as a bad person until his character did a 180 and randomly became a d*ck. And it was random - he was willing to travel through the woods to help Maurice up until Maurice seemed to demonstrate an unreliable memory. Understandable that Gaston would be getting annoyed. Completely not understandable how he reacts, given what we've seen of his character previously.

He's narcissistic, sure. He's saying things to a girl to get the girl to be into him - not exactly rare for anyone to do when they're trying to hook up with someone. But to turn around so completely just to meet the requirements of the film after being written as a half-decent human being sucked. I thought they might actually do something different with his character and I was looking forward to it - but no, they just didn't know what they wanted to do with him and it showed.

Just, everything agreed. Everything.