MovieChat Forums > Star Wars: Episode VIII - The Last Jedi (2017) Discussion > Still the best Star Wars film since A Ne...

Still the best Star Wars film since A New Hope. Evidence within...


Last Jedi 85% Metacritic.

Empire Strikes Back 82% Metacritic.

Return of the Jedi 58% Metacritic.

Force Awakens 81% Metacritic.

Solo 62% Metacritic.

Rogue One 65% Metacritic.

Rise of Skywalker: 54% Metacritic.

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What is a meta critic and why are these numbers important?

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Google metacritic.

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No need to. Random critics and random numbers mean nothing to me.

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Run along then.

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In other words, you're relying on other people to tell you what is good, and what isn't.

Telling the world that you are a robot that goes where it is programmed to go, likes what it is told to like, is not a very admirable thing.

Think for yourself.

If you like the movie, fine (personally, I think it's complete crap -- but that shouldn't affect you one way or the other), but tell us why you think it's good for your own reasons. You are telling us it's good because other people say it's good.

Why the hell should that matter to me?

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Darren, i love the film, it’s just good to know that i’m not alone.

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Spin it anyway you want it is a bag of shit and will be remembered as the worst Star Wars film ever made.

Empire Strikes Back - 9.1 User Score Metacritic.

A New Hope - 8.8 User Score Metacritic.

Return of the Jedi - 8.3 User Score Metacritic.

Rogue One 7.6 User Score Metacritic.

Force Awakens - 6.7 User Score Metacritic.

Solo - 6.1 User Score Metacritic.

Rise of Skywalker: 4.6 User Score Metacritic.

Last Jedi - 4.3 User score Metacritic

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The users are angry nerds who never grew up, the critics are sane professionals who can understand character arcs.

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Assumption based evidence without any citation based on your own bias.

In short your opinion means nothing, just like critics.

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Based on reality.

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It’s an amazing film, but teeny boppers and 70’s children want ewoks, wookies, cuddly toys, happy endings. Rian made it real, and that’s why it’s brilliant

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TROLL ALERT! TROLL ALERT!!!

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Stop crying.

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Stop trolling.

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I generally liked the movie and what it was trying to accomplish. But I take umbrage with the silly "phone call" exchange toward the beginning with Poe and Hux. It was like it was trying too hard to go for Marvel MCU type humor. And then the slow chase toward the end could have been done better.

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I hated the movie and at the time I only watched The Force Awaken

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You probably loved it then after the abomination Rise of Skywalker

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Nah The Rise of Skywalker made sense given that The Last Jedi forgot to set up a third movie and a new villain.

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Yeah, okay, it's better than Empire Strikes Back because Metacritic says so.

Sure.

You can't see right now, but I'm rolling my eyes.

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Exactly it’s great and then Rian went on to direct the critic and fan favourite Knives Out, and Star Wars fans got that awful Rise of Skywalker. Unlucky.

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Knives Out was great. He stumbled with his take on Star Wars.

>Unlucky

erm, wut?

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Knives Out! is one of my all time favorite films. I love how Rian uses the tropes of the murder mystery and makes something new from them. It was brilliant what he did with that film and that genre.

This is also precisely the reason he failed with The Last Jedi.

Unlike Knives Out! where Rian had a story that was all his own, "The Last Jedi" is the 8th chapter of a 9 part story. The 8th chapter of a story is not the place to do the "subverting expectations" thing. Rian treated TLJ as it was his own story ignoring the character development from the previous 7 films. His "subverting expectations" with Knives Out! made people think "this is cool" because they did not expect it but it made sense whereas in TLJ made many people think "This is wrong" because they did not expecting and it did not make sense.

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I think he could have added twists, subverted expectations, and given new angles and ideas to Star Wars, but not the way he did it. The idea of the Force being bigger than the Jedi and Rey/we-the-viewers shouldn't fetishize one sect of Force-users: that's a cool idea and if it had been nestled into a better movie, it could have worked. The idea that the flyboy hero can't always work: that's cool and new to Star Wars and could have added a new dimension...could have if Poe was criticized for being a flyboy and learned to be a team player and squash his ego. But it falls on its face because we then get to watch a kamikaze attack from Holdo and a Hail Mary collision-save from Rose and both are treated in-film like they are effective and heroic. The film does this a lot, undercutting its own message.

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I agree that "the Force being bigger than the Jedi" is a cool idea but making is a plot point this late in the game would be the problem I have. It would be like in a murder mystery having a suspect who was not even mention be announced as the killer. Perhaps if the Force Awakens brought up the idea as something Luke came to that could have given the sequel trilogy a point of focus.

The entire Poe thing was off from the start in TLJ. Your comments are spot on and I would like to add that the execution of it was poor. There was no reason given that Holdo could not pull back the bombers and even so the results were in favor of the rebels. Holdo's plan would have failed if that big ship was not destroyed.

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Well, agreed, and also how it was executed. Like, Luke might have made the point, "I'm a Jedi, that's fine for me, and if you want to follow this path, that's fine for you, too, but don't get hung up on putting the Force into a little box."

And, absolutely, it's the execution that was the problem for me with most of TLJ. It would start something cool, some interesting idea, and then shoot it down.

Holdo's plan should have failed anyway. The Empire guys should have hyper-spaced in an arc and bunched the Rebels into a pincer attack. They probably should have stopped the escape pods like the one that went to Canto Bight. So many plot holes there (they aren't chasing escape pods? why isn't everybody using them? why wouldn't Hux and Kylo Ren start worrying about the hyperdriving escape pod? did it go for help? is help coming?)

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The "Force being bigger than the Jedi" is an old idea that was addressed a lot in the animated Star Wars stuff.

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But the force is not a new thing in TLJ. The concept of the Force and the Jedi being two different things is not
a new thing either. Luke expressing a point of view regarding the force in this way is the only new thing. But so what? Why would he have had that perspective before in the OT when he was just a boy trying to redeem his father.

It's not at all like introducing a new character who is guilty of the crime in the last act of a murder mystery at all.

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You say "exactly" to my post, then implied that TLJ was great. Let me clarify...

I love Knives Out, and the rest of Johnson's filmography. Brick, Looper - great films I've really enjoyed.

The Last Jedi was a swing for the fences that wound up ricocheting off the plate and back into the batter's groin. I respect it for its ambition and what it tried to do, but it had such miserable execution filled with tonal inconsistencies, plot holes you could drive a Buick through, mischaracterisation, poor use of characters, too many themes (some of which are self-contradicting), and bad editing.

I like the occasional scene or moment in TLJ, but man its it a mess.

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It’s not a mess at all, it’s brilliant. Did you not see the critic reviews that i posted? It’s the best Star Wars film for years. Are the critic reviews all bought by Disney? No, if so they wouldn’t have crapped over Rise of Skywalker.

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I don't think they were bought by Disney, but I don't think they're right. TLJ isn't winning any awards from me.

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That’s fair. Can’t win em’ all.

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😁

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Couldn’t care less I still think this movie is a pile of crap

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It's good but not as good as Force Awakens or Rogue One.

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Agreed!

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Not quite my tempo

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Such scores are meaningless, simply because unlike in the past, where critics would give honest scores to movies out of their own personal opinions of the movies, these days, critics HAVE to give high dishonest scores that please particular movie studios like Disney because otherwise, those critics will be denied early access, and thus exclusives, to future movies from those studios. It's simply a case of putting food on the table, and unscrupulous studios like Disney have these poor critics over a barrel.

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Interesting so that's why the live action aladdin, dumbo, lion king, rise of skywalker, and solo a star wars story all got great reviews from critics. Oh wait...

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Why do they crap all over Rise of Skywalker then? Your theory is debunked.

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Because some shit is beyond redemption.

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So your theory is debunked.

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my theory being?

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And Metacritic is based on the subjective opinions of the people reviewing it, my subjective opinion is that it's a soulless, ultra woke piece of SJW crap that turned the established characters we grew up with into a bunch of pathetic, infantile manbabies.

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I think it was a great film, and that you are all white fans, and then you got the awful Rise of Skywalker. No manner of opinion can save that.

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LOL the fact that you had to call me out for my skin color and that you assumed my skin color was white is only demonstrating your own issues with race. Also how are you racist for not liking this trash movie?

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You are definitely white then, thanks for clearing it up.

Please don’t use laugh out loud, it makes you look like a teeny bopper.

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LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL, race is everything to the DemoKKKrats, it is the most important aspect about a person. Thank you for proving my point libtard. I notice you have given up trying to defend this movie, doesn't surprise me, it's indefensible.

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People are racist/homophobic, Rian wasn’t. The ‘fans’ go on about SJW.

It’s literally the best Star Wars film for years. Even the professionals say so. And i agree.

Best rated Star Wars film for years.

Anyone who disagrees is a clown.

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Rian was clearly for child slavery because FINN and Rose were fine with just freeing the space horses and leaving the slave children to fend for themselves. That was so obviously a pro child slavery statement.

Good for you, plenty of people disagree with you.

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Freeing them and leaving them to themselves, exactly. How do you think humans came to be? Born as adults. No.

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The movie is clearly pro child slavery and the fact that you like it reveals a lot about your own bigotry and lack of character.

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Hahaha you must have smoked so much weed you don’t know what is real and fantasy.

It’s clearly obviously not a pro child slavery film.

Are you ok?

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It obviously is because the people who are supposed to be the heroes were satisfied with themselves after they abandoned innocent children to slavery. You clearly have issues, kid. Seek help.

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You need to grow up son, the 70’s are over. No children were enslaved. You must have been watching a different film?

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HAHAHAHAHA how can you even say that you like this movie, you don't even understand it.

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You don’t even like it so don’t give me that. The professional reviewers rate it as the best, and they are right. Did you even watch it? Or jump on the hate wagon?

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Now you’re arguing something completely different. The movie clearly condones child slavery

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It clearly does not condone child slavery. That’s why it’s the highest rated Star Wars film since A New Hope.

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Obviously it does, you’re just too stupid to see it

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That’s hilarious, you are too proud and stupid to see the high critical praise this film receives so you make up a slavery lie.

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High critical praise doesn’t justify child slavery little man

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Kid, you must love the child slavery narrative, that’s why you made it up.

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Hahahahaha you don’t even understand the movie you claim to love, go to bed you infantile troll

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Trolls make up lies for a reaction, i state facts. You make up lies. Hope you had a good sleep and woke up with more sense.

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Not trolling just calling you out for your own bias and bigotry along with your inability to comprehend the central themes of a movie you claim to love.

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Bigotry, look at the scores. There is actual proof that it is an amazing movie. I showed you that.

There is no proof that the film celebrates child slavery. You cannot prove that.

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So since a small group of critics are OK with child slavery that makes it ok? You have a very messed up sense of morality

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Ugh i’m tired of you not proving the child slavery angle. It means there isn’t one.

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I have explained it very clearly to you. The fact that you are too dumb to understand actually kind of makes sense.

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Nah you can’t explain it. You made up the idea that this film supports child slavery, and look stupid.

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You're just too dumb to pick up on obvious agenda's the movie had.

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More like i haven’t made them up as per yourself.

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You still pushing that arguement as fact. You are something else.

Critic review is a review based on a persons opinion and bias.

User revew is a review based on a persons opinion and bias.

In both cases it is personal opinion. Opinion isn't fact.

Opinion is subjective.

I've read some of your replys you must be trolling now. No one can believe what you are writing.

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You are the only troll here, full of negativity, i enjoy a good film. Not whine about it like the rest of you.

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How well do you think they survived?

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By being free and not stupid.

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Let's hope they did better than Spartacus then.

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Didn't Boyega roast disney for using him as a token?
And racially removing him form the story arc & posters to appease china?
Didn't that happen?

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This is absolutely golden, i’m glad you brought this up. Yes he did say that, in reference to The Rise of Skywalker, not The Last Jedi which is amazing. Him and Kelly Marie Tran were sidelined to bit parts in The Rise of Skywalker.

Just another piece of evidence of how great this film is.

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John Boyega's screen time in each film is second only to either Rey and Kylo or Luke

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Wouldn’t that make it fourth only?

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