MovieChat Forums > V/H/S (2012) Discussion > 'Sexism,' they whined

'Sexism,' they whined

posted 12 years ago by ProfSpielberg
51 replies | jump to latest

When I began perusing assorted bloggings, Internet wisdom, etc. on this movie I was expecting to see complaints about the ludicrous and useless wraparound story of the robbery-porn crew (and definitely read quite a few) but found these critiques were accompanied by an equal volume of people protesting the presence of certain disagreeable male characters--the moral quality of whom I'd have thought too self-evident to bother pointing out. The epithet most often and automatically invoked to decry the characters was a specific device for women's hygiene, ironically.

Now I know an easy evaluation is that the web supports an over-the-weight-limit load of fulminating commentators, female and otherwise, who get off on the sort of pointless grandstanding that can only be derived from slamming fictional persons, enough said. But it got me wondering: is V.H.S. prominently lacking in feminist fiber? Even by the standards of horror, the most notoriously sexist of all popular movie genres? Is there really a case for that?

At the end of the movie the macho dunces turn belatedly chivalrous, and there's also part of the Tuesday the 17th sketch where the meathead fratboy stereotype is approached by a sexually assertive maiden (with ulterior motive to be sure) but fails to react in the prescribed fashion. Ti West's entry plays like something out of The L Word and the Joe Swanberg-directed vignette, though undoubtedly fraught with feminine frailty, doesn't exactly portray the male authority figure in a glowing light. IMO the first recorded mini-story was too sickly comic to try to glean any message from it, but it wouldn't be a patriarchal one at any rate.

Compare to another "reality horror" staple, the Paranormal Activity industry, which purveys obviously sexist themes--to wit, that all post-adolescent ladyfolk act a little crazy (hormones, ya know) and anyway once they get fully possessed by poltergeists you won't notice till it's too late, so look out for any wandering toddlers they might swoop in to pick off. Naturally later in the series this motif was shifted into hilarious overdrive by introducing a real live coven.

If somebody who's put a bit of thought into it can precisely explain how V-H-S is essentially misogynistic I'd be curious to hear that. So far the criticisms look to me like reflexive, brainless sneering, or the rote reactions of people trying to get a grip on the obvious.

[–] DeusExKatrina 12 years ago

If you peruse the board you'll notice that VHS is accused both of being misogynistic, for the fact that all the female characters are evil betrayers, and misandrist, for the fact that all the men are horrible sleazy douchebags.

The fact of the matter is the film's simply misanthropic, and portrays humans as awful creatures.

---
"Pride is not the opposite of shame, but its source. True humility is the antidote to shame."

[–] ProfSpielberg 12 years ago

Lots of places, not just Imdb, carry irate responses of people claiming to be offended by the characters. Yeah, they're nasty pieces of work, but over the line for tolerable filmmaking? It's as if they thought they were renting a documentary on a traveling church group.

Compared to the usual subjects in a Mike Leigh or Neil LaBute movie these VHS clods are bad in a rather mundane fashion. Maybe the lack of mood music and professional lighting just brings it out more... Or people are getting sick from the swerving video style so they take out their anger on the hapless monster-fodder frat-boys

[–] DeusExKatrina 12 years ago

The fact that all the characters are bad people is what people take issue with.

---
"Pride is not the opposite of shame, but its source. True humility is the antidote to shame."

[–] shrugs 12 years ago

Are they all bad people though? The guy in the 2nd story wasn't so bad was he? The three in the 3rd story not counting the crazy bitch who brought them out there, were hardly hateful, they seemed to be written as 16 year olds and cast as 30 year olds which didn't help, but they really weren't that terrible. Even the guys in the first story knew to call it a night when the girl passes out. But the four guys in the last story, what was wrong with them? Nothing that I could see. In what way at all were they bad people? Obviously the guys in the wrap around were pretty awful, but we saw increasingly less of them anyway.

What if a squirrel wants a sausage?

[–] bing-57 11 years ago

> Are they all bad people though?

And certainly Emily was not a bad person.

--
What Would Jesus Do For A Klondike Bar (WWJDFAKB)?

[–] DrankyDrank 10 years ago

they seemed to be written as 16 year olds and cast as 30 year olds

Wow, that summed that one up perfectly. That's exactly what it was.

[–] mikelippenkrantz 9 years ago

And for their reality porn ambushes and burglary of a dead man's house, the men of the wraparound were punished with death by zombie.

[–] mark-hansen11 11 years ago

If anything, the movie is racist then. 57% of the world population are asian, so where was all the asians ??

[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] bud380 11 years ago

Both for the fact that they are either horrible sleazy douchebags, OR, the nice guy, who eventually gets it in the end anyway.

[–] drowninghero 12 years ago

How is the BF in the second story a bad person? Because he wanted to film his gf?

[–] midnight_rambler21 12 years ago

It wasn't that he wanted to film her necessarily. It's that after she made it explicitly clear she wasn't interested and she was uncomfortable he kept pushing harder.

[–] DBLurker 12 years ago

Oh noes, he asked her two-three more times, his own girlfriend. That means he was evil for asking that cheating whore for few nude shots.

[–] midnight_rambler21 12 years ago

Yeah, just re-watched it and it definitely wasn't "two-three more times". He keeps pushing way harder than that, he even tries to take her bra off after she's already said not to film her twice (and then keeps pushing).

Also add the fact that he started out filming her undress before she was even aware and without asking first. Not really the behavior of a good boyfriend/fiancee/husband (can't recall what their actual relationship was).

[–] bud380 11 years ago

Oh would you shut your naive little trap. He wasn't some rapist who was out to make money off nude videos of her online, you *beep* psychotic idiot, he wanted to film her, why? How would I know, or better yet, how you YOU know. I've seen people pushed into doing far worse things by friends, and yet this playful fiance/whatever is now evil because he wanted to do something new with her?

She was a cheating lesbian bitch anyway and didn't want to have sex in the first place probably.

[–] midnight_rambler21 11 years ago

Pump the brakes there buddy, you've entered rage induced straw-man territory. Never said nor even implied any of the things you're trying to put in my mouth. I simply pointed out some very inappropriate relationship behavior. Just because you're in a relationship doesn't entitle one to film their SO and if your actions or suggestions are clearly making your SO uncomfortable and they've said no to something three to five times the correct response is to drop it. If whatever it is is actually really important to you in a relationship and your SO doesn't want it then you need to rethink the relationship, not try and pressure them into doing something they don't want. Funny that you call me naive and psychotic when clearly, if you don't understand all that, you must have a 7th grade boy's understanding of how relationships work

[–] fedoraguy666 11 years ago

Kind of, yeah

[–] nek-5 12 years ago

- - -"Compare to another "reality horror" staple, the Paranormal Activity industry, which purveys obviously sexist themes--to wit, that all post-adolescent ladyfolk act a little crazy..."- - -

ugh. are you writing a ####ing thesis on film theory? on a turd like "V/H/S"?? unless you talk like that all the time, why are you swinging for the fences on the comment board of a lousy movie you saw once? im sorry, but that sort of pretentiousness on something as insignificant as a random comment board on IMDB.com pisses me off.

one could even make the argument that its a way, way bigger waste of time to REPLY to a pretentious, random comment board on IMDB.com, actually. hm. i'll think on that...and waste even more of my life

(jesus CHRIST the acting in this movie is brutal, though. i mean, really...! woof.)

[–] ProfSpielberg 11 years ago

It was a wind-up; you walked into it; congrats

[–] PreciousRoys 12 years ago

Just can't survive without an -ist can you?

Fak u Dolan..............Gooby pls

[–] ProfSpielberg 11 years ago

Yeah cool

[–] rac-shade 12 years ago

The only bit I found misogynistic was the opening. Specifically the prolonged and unnecessary assault on the girl in the car park and the fact that during the end credits the bit of them sexually assaulting the girl was played over and over and over for no apparent purpose other than, "Lawl tits".

That the entire opening was essentially pointless just made it more glaring and irritating. It should have just opened with them breaking into the house. A bit of dialogue about what they are doing, "So what are we looking for?" "A tape." And off we go. I don't need the justification that they are all *beep* who assault women and then sell the footage to porn sites. It's stupid. Ugly, pointless, and stupid.

Cut the opening and I wouldn't have had any problems with it at all.

[–] lazarillo 12 years ago

How come there is this inability among critics, viwers, etc. to distinguish between despicable CHARACTERS in movies and supposedly despicable attitudes of the filmmakers. Most people don't think Edgar Allen Poe was an insane murderer in real life, or that Vladimir ("Lolita") Nabokov was a child molester, but when it comes to movies--and especially HORROR movies--the presence of despicable woman-hating male character has to mean that the authors of the film either hate women or hate men. And all the viewers are supposedly complicit in this hatred--it's tiresome, really.

Also, the presence of undraped females in horror movies does not necessarily equate to "misgyny". It just means the predominantly young and male audience of horror films are heterosexual and horny. People read too much into things sometimes.

[–] ballsmahoney33 12 years ago

You're opening a larger can of worms with that argument. There are several factors that can be debated, but just a few from my perspective...

1.)People give film makers too much credit when it comes to what they create. Many of them aren't geniuses, and are reflections of their films. I'm a horror fan, but I'd also be a liar if I didn't admit there was a ton of misogyny in the genre. Poe, Nabokov, etc. have legendary writing. This film didn't have that.

2.) Actors will take crappy roles in films like this because it's a paying gig.

3.)You're right that just because a male character hates women, isn't necessarily reflective of the director. And usually, the director will express this with a strong female character that balances out the scales of justice vs. the villain. However, when you string together a bunch of tit-shots and an endless amount of women being slaughtered, then it's hard to say what you're watching isn't misogynistic.

[–] ForTheNonce 11 years ago

-However, when you string together a bunch of tit-shots and an endless amount of women being slaughtered, then it's hard to say what you're watching isn't misogynistic.-

I only recall boobs in the punks-running-around-de-shirting-women bit, which to me was more to show that they were asses, and if I recall, they do in fact get their just desserts. As for women being slaughtered, it hits more of an emotional button, I think, for women as opposed to men to be killed. Hence stuff like "Women and children first." Since they are usually physically weaker, a woman is seen as "more helpless." Not saying that is right or wrong, just pointing that out. Against a supernatural force, a man is generally just as helpless (if not more so, such as in Paranormal Activity where he wants to call the demon out.)

[–] G_Woman 9 years ago

I only recall boobs in the punks-running-around-de-shirting-women bit

What about the story about the guy with the camera in his glasses, they're whole plan was to get tit-shots and upskirts. and the guy in the front of the car on the way to the lake focusing his camera on the tits of the girl in the yellow shirt, and the guy pressuring his girlfriend/wife? to take off her sweater and taping her w/o her knowledge at first.

[–] the_zookeeper 12 years ago

Not only that, Lazarillo, but in many horror movies the female character is a bad ass and the only one to survive. Some of the best female role models (for a lack of a better term) in film are from horror movies. Hell, everyone loves Ellen Ripley.

The gene pool could use a little chlorine......

[–] byron418 11 years ago

Oh please. Watching this movie I could just envision all the amateur, douchey directors getting together to figure out how many young, inexperienced actresses they could get to show their tits in the movie.

Granted, I don't think this motivated by sexism so much as the typical amateur, independent filmmaker desire to come across as rebellious and hardcore. It's actually really corny.

[–] mikelippenkrantz 8 years ago

They are reviewing the footage of their assault on a TV in the scene before they set out on their fatal mission for the tape. One of them explains they sell this footage to a "reality porn" site and are generously paid for their "work." This is to indicate that these guys are sleazy, stupid, and will do anything for a fast buck. So of course they'll accept a bunch of money to break into somebody's house and steal a VHS tape. What could go wrong?

[–] tedthorne 11 years ago

Feminists will always cry their mundane banter of misogyny whenever any woman is portrayed as a victim. It doesn't matter about the storyline circumstances anything.
Feminists were screaming for equal lead roles, actually demanding to have Hollywood cast females as the predator in thrillers and crime stories. Then along came Fatal Attraction and the feminists screamed misogyny and wanted the film banned. Then feminists wanted women to be portrayed as villians with the heart of gold, and along came Pretty Woman and that seem to make some of the feminists happy, but not all as they wanted action & thrillers.
But that still didn't satisfy the feminists, they wanted women to be able to commit crimes and be martyrs, and along came Thelma & Louise.
There are numerous other films were women are the violent predators and the end result is that they "get away with it" or the storyline is some bizarre justification for a criminal act. Can't recall any films with males being violent predators getting away with it.
Funny how the feminists claim male versions of all these films are misogynists yet when they are women in the lead role then that makes the films appealing to misandrists.

Notice how lately Hollywood generally refuses to show any woman being physically assaulted by a male, however it is quite willing to show women assaulting men. And when the man protects himself Hollywood makes sure that the woman is not physically hurt by the man. The feminists have no problem with men being portrayed as dumbies but if a film even hints that a woman is not the perfect candidate for MENSA then that film is going to be labelled misogynist.
So nowadays it means nothing anymore for a film to be labelled misogynist, in fact it would be a feather in the cap of the filmmakers if it were.

[–] meikido 11 years ago

I agree with some of your points but using 'the feminists' as if every woman who calls herself a feminist has the exact same thoughts and opinions doesn't come across as very convincing.
You can't just generalize like that without losing some credibility.

[–] fedoraguy666 11 years ago

I'm pretty sure v/h/s is a feminist horror movie that's mostly about misogyny rather than supporting it. The riot grrrl music in the end credits is a pretty big hint. The first time I saw it I thought it was super gross and it made me uncomfortable, but seeing it again it was pretty good.

don't ask me about misandry though because that's not a real thing.

[–] TeaBunny 11 years ago

Man, you're pretentious.

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"Love means never having to say you're ugly." - the Abominable Dr. Phibes

[–] ProfSpielberg 11 years ago

I knew the thread title would get your ilk