MovieChat Forums > Top of the Lake (2013) Discussion > Too many loose ends ... here's my list o...

Too many loose ends ... here's my list of top 20

posted 12 years ago by theonemoviebuff
74 replies | jump to latest

1. Who was the father of Tui's child?
2. Was Matt really Robin's father or was he just bluffing?
3. Who was Robin's fiance of 5 years?
4. Why did Matt kill Bob but didn't take the land back from a bunch of old ladies?
5. Why did Tui decide to go to the woods to give birth? (very freak idea for a 12-year old)
6. Where did Tui's mother vanish?
7. What was the issue between Johnno and his father?
8. Why weren't Robin's rapists caught?
9. Why didn't Robin make any attempt to catch her rapists - even though she was a police officer?
10. Why was Robin sacked by Al for a petty brawl?
11. Why wasn't GJ able to solve the problem of any of the women?
12. Why was GJ heading to the bushes when she said she was leaving?
13. What was Al running in his basement? child pornography or child sex trafficking?
14. Did Al die?
15. Did Al rape Robin, or take advantage of her when she passed out in his house?
16. Why did Al take the keys out of her pocket when Robin passed out in his house?
17. What was the purpose of inserting that Pathologist's character when none of his cases were solved - or we didn't see any headway or link with the original story or characters?
18. Who really hanged Zanic?
19. Did Al manipulate the DNA test results in the end?
20. Is New Zealand really that beautiful?

[–] Jorge_Dunst 12 years ago

21. Why nobody paid attention to the singer girl.

ORPHAN BLACK
Saturdays 9/8c
BBC AMERICA

[–] Geekfreak13 12 years ago

Well we know it I was a pedophile ring. Al not interested in women. Tui was scared of the people that cause her pain.

[–] modman-2 11 years ago

how do we know that Al is not interested in women?

[–] MindusQA 12 years ago

1. Matt, her father
2. Could have been Robin's father...Robin's mom's reaction corroborates that theory
3. Some guy named Steve she wasn't that into ("a cop, a nice guy")
4. Legally, Matt couldn't take the land back but Matt killed Bob out of revenge and anger
5. Tui couldn't stand the idea of being at her mom's or dad's place. She felt outted and didn't want anyone to see her or find her. She was at home in the woods.
6. Tui's mom didn't vanish. She just didn't care.
7. Issue between Johnno and his father was probably that Matt knew his wife had cheated on him
8. Because it was obviously a man's world down there. They were punished by vigilantes
9. Robin has conflicted feelings about what happened to her that night. She also came from the culture where men ruled over women
10. Al was trying to get rid of Robin any way he could. He was probably getting $ from Matt for not busting the drug business and Matt wanted Robin dealt with
11. GJ was an interesting character but she never claimed to be able to fix anyone
12. Looked like GJ was heading to the gate, not the bushes
13. Probably both
14. Not sure. probably.
15. We don't know. He may have wanted to and he probably put Rohypnol in her glass because it was a dominant theme, but she doesn't know and will always wonder.
16. He didn't want her to drive
17. The pathologist helped Robin fill in some of the blanks and see there was a connection between the deaths
18. Probably henchmen for Matt
19. Doubtful that Al manipulated the results
20. Haven't been but Lord of the Rings was shot there

[–] modman-2 11 years ago

pretty sure we can't trust that the guy running a ring where they are drugging and raping children can't be trusted not to doctor lab results that could potentially be incriminating. it is possible, of course, that she was raped by her father but i think it's far more likely that she was impregnated by the men who we know were drugging and raping her and other children.

tui went to the woods because she was raped and impregnated and didn't understand what was happening to her. obviously shame is going to be a component, but that is an oversimplification. she knew she was being abused but neither knew what was happening to her nor was she able to process it - so she ran away.

why do you think it is doubtful that Al manipulated the test results? declaring that Matt was in fact the father would effectively close the case.

What boggles the mind is why they would insist on having a sex party with all of the events transpiring the way they did... couldn't put it off a few months?

[–] writetopcat 9 years ago

I have a different take on some of the questions.

1. I think the father was either Al or one of the men who came to his basement to Roofie rape those girls. Al told Robin Matt was the Dad, but she started thinking about it and put it together when she saw all those kids had been in some class run by Al. When Al got the DNA lab results back he studied them carefully, and the wheels were turning in his head as he figured out what to say to Robin. He said the father was Matt because it was believable and Matt was dead and could not deny it.
2. Looks like he was Robin's father. Matt was not a liar, for the most part. He would deny killing people of course, but he was straightforward on most things. There was the video of him with Robin's mom. ...Also, Robin's mom made Robin promise not to be Johnno's girl. She did that, I believe, because she thought Johnno was Matt's son, and she knew Robin was his daughter. She did not want them to commit incest and have a retarded child.

4. Yeah, after Matt killed the real estate guy, who had already said he would cancel the deal (whether that was BS or not, who knows), there was no way to legally get them off the land.
5. Tui left because Matt kept saying that a 12 year old girl was too young, and that Tui was NOT having that baby. Tui knew Matt would force her to have an abortion, probably a backwoods abortion.
10. agreed, but also, assault with a deadly weapon by a LEO is pretty serious.

[–] kiewikn 12 years ago

1. Probably Al of one of Al's clients in the pedophile ring
2. He was. Her mom thought so, and Matt bought her house to make sure she and her child were taken care of.
3. Some guy back in Sydney. Doesn't really matter because he mostly exists to provide background information on Robin's relationship history and current state of mind.
4. Matt didn't own the land. He believes that it's his families ancestral land, and he had worked out some agreement with Bob whereby Bob wouldn't sell the property to anyone. It's not revealed why Matt can't buy it, but killing a real estate agent wouldn't empower Matt to oust the women from the property.
5. She felt it was the best way to protect her child.
6. She didn't vanish. She lives in town but is completely uninvolved with Tui's life.
7. Johnno discusses it to some degree with Robin. They may have been estranged before Johnno went to prison, but he mentions that Matt did nothing for him when he was incarcerated in Thailand. Again, it's not really key to the plot. All we need to know is that they really want nothing to do with each other.
8. They were, apparently by Matt and other town members. Throughout the story it's repeatedly suggested that formal justice doesn't function very well in the area.
9. Her mother immediately took her away to Australia, where she had her child and lived until she returned and the events of the story begin. She had no real capacity to 'pursue' them at that time. During the story she seeks out Sarge and accosts him. Consider that it's often not easy for women to admit to anyone they have been raped, let alone track down their rapists. She was just a girl when it happened and the statute of limitations on the crime had long since passed by the time she returned. It's also implied that Sarge is the only identifiable rapist still living in the area.
10. Al wants her off the case. That was a convenient excuse.
11. She's an anti-guru. She wasn't there to solve anything.
12. She was leaving the compound, not heading for the bushes.
13. Both.
14. Don't know, doesn't matter.
15. There is no way to know, but it's suggested. This is a deliberate open question.
16. I don't recall this, but it seems trivial. Perhaps he searched her home and car for information about what she had found (and not revealed to him) in her investigation. Maybe he was just doing that in anticipation of washing her clothes in order to support his assertion that she got so drunk she that she vomited on herself.
17. This is an interesting question. First of all, he is definitely a tip that the police department there is extremely dysfunctional, and Al is at the core the problem. Second, he brings up the question of the road suicide girl, which remains a mystery but spurs Robin onward in her inquiry. Personally, I believe the road suicide girl is meant to remain a mystery to the audience as a means of indicating that not all mysteries can be solved in this place, and also to simply demonstrate that crimes against children are not taken seriously by the police department.
18. Most likely drunk townies.
19. Yes.
20. Yes.

[–] Uvtha 12 years ago

Well done. Seems like you actually payed a bit of attention to the show unlike some others. :P

[–] agro_sydney 11 years ago

I agree with you mate

[–] marta-kromkowska 11 years ago

The road suicide girl also worked in a coffee shop. When Robin saw her picture there she connected the dots.

[–] filmfancy 11 years ago

The road suicide girl also worked in a coffee shop. When Robin saw her picture there she connected the dots.

That's right. She worked in that barista program for troubled teens, run by the community. It also had a connection to the local police, which is why Al was involved. The program seemed to be a cover for the abuse that was taking place.

And all the pieces matter (The Wire)

[–] Chironomo 11 years ago

You just proved how stupid this show is if you did pay attention.
"9. Her mother immediately took her away to Australia, where she had her child and lived until she returned and the events of the story begin. She had no real capacity to 'pursue' them at that time. During the story she seeks out Sarge and accosts him. Consider that it's often not easy for women to admit to anyone they have been raped, let alone track down their rapists. She was just a girl when it happened and the statute of limitations on the crime had long since passed by the time she returned. It's also implied that Sarge is the only identifiable rapist still living in the area."
There is no statute of limitations for criminal offences in NZ or Australia. If you raped someone you can be prosecuted for it - right up until the day you die. This show is just bs.

[–] erikaridpath 11 years ago

There is no statute of limitations for criminal offences in NZ or Australia. If you raped someone you can be prosecuted for it - right up until the day you die. This show is just bs.

LOL at kiewikn's claim!

Is there a reference to the imaginary statute in the series Chironomo? I can't remember it but that may be because I kept nodding off! It would be hilarious to discover it was an actual plot point!

[–] amea_gari 11 years ago

The road suicide girl doesn't remain a mystery-- it's revealed she was one of the barristas in Al's little pet project. Coke was found in her V. Not hard to connect the dots-- she was a victim of Al's child sex ring too.

The kids were all obviously drugged out of their minds during the ordeal but they probably still felt something bad had happened to them. Maybe she had bad memories she didn't know were real. So she killed herself to escape the distress.

[–] kcolli11 12 years ago

1. Al or someone in the pedo-ring
3. Name was Steve but wasn't really relevant to the plot, so I'm glad it wasn't shown in more detail.
5. To keep her baby safe. As soon as Matt finds out she's pregnant, he says he'll take her to have an abortion.
6. Again, wasn't important to the plot so why keep her on more than necessary?
8. Robin's rapists were caught and given a beating, according to Al. Why they weren't arrested is up for debate. Robin left town after the rape, and her mother says in a later scene when Robin questions why they're out on the streets, "You'd rather have gone through a trial?" or something to that effect. If there's no complaining witness, there's no crime, especially in the case of rape.
10. I don't consider stabbing a man with a broken bottle to be "a petty brawl." That's aggravated assault in the US, a felony. Losing her job would have been getting off easy.
16. He took the keys before she passed out, to keep her from driving herself home.
19. Yes. I believe the scene was delivered in a manner that forces viewers to doubt its legitimacy. Not to mention we find out Tui is at Al's house while the children are drugged in the basement, leading us to conclude that Tui was raped at Al's home.

[–] angelicapotts 12 years ago

The baby's father was definitely Al or someone in the ring. When asked who did this to her, Tui said "No one". Later when talking with Jamie she said she didn't even know how it got in there. When the other kids asked Jamie if he was the father, he implied that it was Satan, because they had no other explanation.

Tui said no one did it to her because she was drugged--she didn't remember it ever happening and therefore couldn't name anyone.

[–] m_harriague-1 11 years ago

At the end when they get the test results, they find out the baby's father was actually Matt.

[–] albert-68 11 years ago

Al conveniently tells Robin en Johno dat the father is Matt, he couldn´t possibly say anything otherwise, cause that would mean the search for the father would go on and the chance he would be discovered for what he done would be bigger.

The events seen in the serie suggests - but doesn´t say - that the father was somebody from some random child molester. Something I think too. Matt really loved Tui, in his own assertive and aggressive way, but as a parent and nothing sexually.

[–] DerrrrDerp 10 years ago

Just before the scene where Al shows Robin the test results on paper, we see Al laying out very polished and official looking certificates for the kids. This is the clue that he probably created and printed out an alternate sheet of paper with fake results.

[–] marta-kromkowska 11 years ago

Al has beaten up Jamie at the police station, probably treated him badly in the coffee shop too. I think Jamie knew and that was his way of saying it.

What's really weird is how none of the kids realizes that there's something wrong going on. They go to get pizza and then all wake up with a headache, not remembering anything. There's bruises, maybe bleeding - remember how one of the guys dragged a poor girl to the room? They should have known.

[–] filmfancy 11 years ago

What's really weird is how none of the kids realizes that there's something wrong going on. They go to get pizza and then all wake up with a headache, not remembering anything. There's bruises, maybe bleeding - remember how one of the guys dragged a poor girl to the room? They should have known.

This is what I was wondering too. How could they be so clueless about what was happening to them? Couldn't they see/feel signs of abuse on their bodies? Unless the men abusing them weren't having sex with them and only filming them it's pretty implausible that they wouldn't notice anything wrong.

And all the pieces matter (The Wire)

[–] molkat 12 years ago

18. It was Matt's sons/men who killed Zanic. When Robin is first is in Matt's bathroom (where the trap door is) with the search warrant, Matt turns out the light and glowing orange and green paint can be seen in the corner of the shower stall.

There was neon orange and green painted graffiti all over Zanic's house the night he was killed.

[–] kiewikn 12 years ago

Good catch. I didn't notice this when I watched that scene, but if I re-watch the series, I'll be looking for it closely. The vigilante justice taken out on Zanic definitely mirror's Al's story about Matt and other townies taking their vigilante justice against Robin's rapists and reenforces the story's insinuation that Matt, while predatory in his own way, takes a strong stance against sex predators and anyone who victimizes children. From the audience perspective (assuming the audience was astute enough to notice what you did), Matt may as well have guessed that Zanic was the perpetrator at that point based on the same assumptions that Robin made, and he would have been likely to take out his rage in such a fashion.

[–] mmmmac 11 years ago

18. It was Matt's sons/men who killed Zanic. When Robin is first is in Matt's bathroom (where the trap door is) with the search warrant, Matt turns out the light and glowing orange and green paint can be seen in the corner of the shower stall.

There was neon orange and green painted graffiti all over Zanic's house the night he was killed.

I agree that Matt had Zanic killed but the shot in the bathroom was just showing the light coming from the hidden room in the basement. The color of the light was irrelevant.

[–] albert-68 11 years ago

Indeed, its Matt and/or sons and croonies who - probably - killed Zanic. That was the whole purpose of Al visiting Matt and telling him about Zanic.
In the same stance I´m even suspicious of Matt killing Bob, I wouldn´t be surprised if he did that on Matt´s ´orders´ too

[–] filmchaser 12 years ago

At least 16/20 of your questions were answered in the mini-series. Matt was the father of Tui's child, but was determined by DNA evidence not to be Robin's father. Robin's fiance of 5 years was some guy she didn't want to marry, so why would his character be developed or have a name? Matt killed Bob because Bob was a witness to Matt's involvement in the way he made his profits, and because Bob was trying to move far, far away quickly. Matt was terrorizing the ladies in an attempt to get them to leave before he had to resort to more aggressive and/or illegal measures. According to Matt, Tui had been raised around a bunch of men and had been taught advanced wilderness survival skills. Tui's mother didn't vanish, and was shown in a scene with Johnno living in town. The issue between Johnno and his father involved Johnno's dislike of Matt's abusive and violent nature. Robin's rapists were never charged but were punished via vigilante justice, and the entire theme of the series was the cognitive dissonance theme that children were exploited in Queensland. Statute of limitations expired on rape, most likely the reason why Robin didn't pursue it. Furthermore, Robin would likely lose her credibility as an objective investigator of crimes against children if she publicly launched an investigation of her own rape as a minor.
Al sacked Robin because she assaulted a person in public in front of witnesses, and the police are civil servants charged with protecting the public. Al would be liable for charges if he continued to employ an unstable detective. GJ wasn't trying to solve anyone's problems. GJ was trying to escape her own problems and find serenity by discarding material things and living in a peaceful environment. GJ was leaving on foot because she didn't have a car, and was not walking into the bushes. Al was running a child prostitution, child pornography business in his basement, and catered to a wealthy clientele. Not sure if Al died, but his career did. Al likely spiked Robin's drink to make her pass out, but doubtfully took sexual advantage bc she would've ended him. That whole trick was to win her trust. He took her keys so she couldn't leave without him knowing. Pathologist was a red herring trick. Zanic was hung by Matt and Al's devices to throw Robin off the track. Hard for anyone to manipulate DNA evidence because there is a law called chain of custody that laboratories are held to independently. DNA evidence is usually lost, or misplaced, but not manipulated. New Zealand is even more beautiful than what was shown. Thanks for testing my memory of the story.

[–] typhaon 12 years ago

I don't think there is any reason to believe those 'DNA' results were legit.

Every bit of circumstantial evidence in the series points to the father of Tui's baby not being Matt, but rather some guy that raped her while she was unconscious.

Of course... WE don't know any of those things with 100% certainty without an extra episode.

However - never fear! Following the situation at Al's house, I'm sure every aspec of the investigation would've been gone over with a fine-toothed comb by the New Zealand Bureau of Investigations (or whatever it is they have) and Robin and co. would've all received the certainty and answers they needed...

...everyone lives happily ever after.

The End

[–] modman-2 11 years ago

If you're going to be snarky, you might want to focus on also being correct

First of all, the DNA tests suggested that Matt wasn't actually Johnno's father but that he was in fact Robin's making Robin and Tui half sisters but unrelated to Johnno.

That being said, the authenticity of those tests are highly dubious as I'm not sure we can rely on the integrity of a man who drugs and rapes children. Especially when those particular results effectively closed the case. It is of course possible that Matt raped the girl, but we know for sure that Al and/or his associates raped her so it is far more likely that one of them would have been the father of the child.

matt killed Bob because he was infuriated that Bob sold the land on which his mother was buried to those women.

[–] jayjayjoop 11 years ago

I don't think you know as much as you think you do.

[–] beat 10 years ago

At least 16/20 of your questions were answered in the mini-series. Matt was the father of Tui's child, but was determined by DNA evidence not to be Robin's father.

lolwut? you point to the show to give the answers just to get things so fundamentally wrong?

[–] suzigard 12 years ago

My reply isn't going to answer any of your questions. I'm posting simply because all your questions are EXACTLY the same ones I had. It was really frustrating watching the last ep. I was hoping for some 'resolution' to all these questions. It's a relief to know we're on the same page as far as the unanswered questions. And since this was a miniseries, the opinions of all of you are definitely needed!