And twice? I mean honestly I don't understand it. And I didn't find it funny either. Poor guy had his father's watch stolen, is trying to play chess, and okay, he refused having a glass of vodka with her or dancing with her, but that's not a reason for her to slap him. Twice.
Is there an explanation for her behavior?
You are all bunch of pussies. Women can act however the *beep* they want around men. It's men's job to put them in their place. If you can't of course you will complain. *beep* feminism *beep* everything up.
Hey, Soldier. Do you know who's in command here?
I sort of agree. If anyone is acting like a *beep* then they should be put in their place and that includes women but only if they are acting like a *beep* and she definitely was.
Do agree completely about the feminism bit. That's why we have *beep* scenes and characters like her dragging every scene she's in down.
It's running films
Sexual Frustration?
shareI think that's the best answer I've read on this thread.
share[deleted]
Jeez, why are you so invested that he doesn't find her attractive? It was obvious that he did - are you blind or are you besotted with the actor?
Let it go...
OMG, now you've done it. Be prepared for a lengthy lecture from BTT.
share[deleted]
Oh, he wanted her - he was just shy and trying to be professional. You must be blind (or way too invested in the lovely Illya).
share[deleted]
Evidence? You haven't posted any evidence - just your opinion, which is way off the mark.
If you couldn't see the sexual tension and the want in his eyes for Gabby - get thee down to specs-savers pronto!
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I assume this is a little comedy routine you've got going here unless you really are serious. Crack on if it makes you happy.
Don't be jealous of Illya fancying Gabby - it's only a movie you know.
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We get it. You're gay and you really, Really, REALLY like the idea of two hot guys getting it on, and you hate and despise any woman who gets in the way of that.
I never thought that Ilya fell in love with Gaby, but I certainly saw signs that he was attracted to her. What were they?
1. He DOESN'T slap her back. It should be obvious to everyone that Ilya was perfectly capable of defending himself against a much more physically dangerous foe than Gaby. The very fact that he didn't retaliate indicates that he didn't consider the slaps to be all that abusive. When she first dragged him into the dance, he was just going through the motions to shut her up, which is what made her so annoyed with him. The slaps were to get his attention. It worked. The next day, he tells her that he enjoyed the evening and says that he likes a strong woman, indicating that he is now attracted to her. He's not attracted to her because she hit him, per se, but because she made it obvious that she wouldn't put up with being ignored.
2. When they are wrestling and she pins him on the floor, his hold on her grows so soft as to be almost caressing.
3. He might not be moving towards her when she almost kisses him, but he damn sure isn't moving away until something interrupts the moment. Why doesn't he pick up on it later? On the one hand, there are important matters to deal with first; on the other hand, he's just not as much of a player as Solo is.
It really is ludicrous that you see it as proof that he has no attraction for Gaby just because he is distracted from noticing her departure by something as momentous as being told to murder his partner, a man that he has grown to respect and trust to some degree. Even a man in love could be forgiven for being a bit distracted by something like that. And quit equating people saying that he was attracted to Gaby as people saying that he was madly in love with her. He barely knew her. Of course he barely knew Solo, too.
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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Whatever your reasons for wanting to see it, you seem more motivated by your desire to see two hot guys getting it on than your desire to understand what motivates the characters.
Gaby's slaps to his face clearly did not hurt him at all, and yet you think he SHOULD HAVE slapped her back, even though you claim he could have easily killed her without meaning to do so by slapping her. That just shows me how deep your unwarranted hostility to Gaby runs.
I didn't really like Gaby's character. I thought she was unappealing myself. I found the scene in which she was slapping Ilya to be quite uncomfortable. A grown woman has no business slapping a man just because she's miffed that he isn't paying her any attention. But that's no reason to root for the man to risk killing her accidentally when it's obvious she's done nothing more than surprise and offend him.
And a man who can throw a woman right through a wall with one hand can certainly get out from under her without permanently injuring her if he wants to do so. The fact that he just lay there "pinned" and let her move in closer shows that he really didn't mind. At all.
But I don't make the mistake of assuming that just because I don't like Gaby's behavior and I don't think she was an appealing character, that that proves that the movie character of Ilya had no attraction for her. He clearly did. I also think that he let the interruptions stop him because he was trying to keep the relationship on a more professional level until the mission was ended.
I will agree that Gaby was more attracted to Ilya than he was to her, and that she was obviously interested in him before he took any real notice of her, but he definitely was beginning to develop feelings for her. The tender way he wished the "little chop shop girl" goodnight shows that, as does the way he took it so personally when she betrayed him and Solo. He was acting almost as if he really had been her fiancé.
But that's the other thing. I think that his feelings for her changed after she betrayed him and Solo. Once he learned that she too was an agent who had simply been acting on orders, he understood and didn't hold it against her, but it's the kind of thing that would certainly put a damper on someone's attraction to a person.
He's telling her that he doesn't like women who are weak and useless -- he wants them to be more like a MAN. What does that tell you?
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If you actually read my previous post, you would already know that I am not a fan of women smacking men around for no reason. Does that justify a man taking the risk of killing or seriously injuring a woman in response to a couple of slaps that weren't intended to hurt and probably barely stung? And yet you have repeatedly said that he should have slapped her back even though you also said that he might very well have killed or seriously injured her by doing so. That's hardly twisting your words. If you really think that he was likely to kill her or seriously injure her by slapping her, then what's your excuse for repeatedly saying that he should have slapped her back? Because so far, you haven't given one. He didn't have to hit her in a way that would risk injuring her. He could have turned her over his knee as he threatened to do, but that's not what you keep repeatedly saying he should have done. I think Chris Rock was the one who said that there was no excuse for a man to hit a woman but that he could sure as <bleep> shake the <bleep> out of one. Ilya didn't do that either. He doesn't have to risk breaking her neck to stop being a punching bag.
But I described a number of circumstances that led me to believe that Ilya was attracted to Gaby. I am hardly relying on the mere fact that he didn't slap her back, so please quit pretending that I did.
Ilya never pronounced the Cowboy nickname with the tender affection he did "little chop shop girl". He never held Napoleon with the gentleness he did Gaby when she had him "pinned". And if he were only attracted to men, he damn sure wouldn't be waiting for a timely interruption to break away when she starts to kiss him. When Napoleon pointed out that Gaby had betrayed him too (spoiler tags, please?!), Ilya immediately said that it wasn't the same. Did he have to try to ravish her while she was unconscious - which would be an act of rape actionable in a court of law - in order for you to even consider that he might have been attracted to her and developing feelings for her?
Gaby wasn't a professional spy the way the two men were although it looked like she was intended as a permanent member of the team at the end of the movie. She was just helping out Napoleon and Ilya to stop world devastation and to get out of East Berlin. No, she wasn't as professional. So?
Ilya never said that he liked a woman who is more like a man. YOU are the one twisting words here. What he said was that he liked a strong women. When you make the leap from liking a strong woman to liking a woman who is more like a man, that reveals a lot about your true motivations and feelings. It is NOT evidence that Ilya likes men better in the sack.
Who said that Ilya and Gaby were going to fall in love? I certainly never did. All I ever claimed was that I saw signs that he was attracted to her and developing a measure of affection for her. Every time someone says that Ilya showed signs of being attracted to Gaby, you start running on about how they aren't in love. Every time you see any signs that Ilya and Napoleon might be starting to like each other a bit, you immediately jump to the conclusion that they have the hots for each other. You need to get over the idea that being sexually attracted to someone is the same thing as loving someone. It's possible for people with no biological relationship to love each other deeply as human beings without having any sexual feelings for each other whatsoever; it's also possible for people to want very badly to have sex with people they don't love and don't even like all that much.
The fact that there's a TONNE of slash fiction being written by and for women, about male couples like Napoleon & Illya, Starsky & Hutch, Kirk & Spock, Cassidy & Sundance, Wally Cleaver & Eddie Haskel, etc. etc. etc. should tell you that it can be a HUGE turn-on for women to see strong, masculine men being tender with each other -- instead of just killing each other or punching each other in the face, like they are USUALLY doing.
For the record, and BTT is aware of this, the director was interviewed directly about a possible homosexual relation between the two male leads and he flat out denied it. It is on record. OK, continue, because BTT will NEVER quit. Death, taxes and Illya & Napoleon forever!!
shareGiven that this:
it can be a HUGE turn-on for women to see strong, masculine men being tender with each other -- instead of just killing each other or punching each other in the face, like they are USUALLY doing.
You're referring to "buddy" movies and I agree. I have no problem with homosexual relationships. However, it simply wasn't the intent of the director in this instance(according to the WORDS) of the director. I mean, what better source can you get, other then from the director himself! I admire BTT's passion for her POV and this vastly underrated film but at a point, a reasonable person has to give it up. If not, you lose your credibility. BTT is a female by the way. A very stubborn female.
shareBuddy movies and also real life. It's hateful for people to pretend that men can't possibly care about other men as human beings without wanting to sleep with them. I don't have any problems with homosexual relationships either; I only have a problem with the people who assume that if two men like each other, they must be homosexual and attracted to each other.
I watched a mini-series that showed two men developing a friendship. Then one day, they encountered each other alone in a quiet hallway. The man who had been making most of the advances looked at the other man. He didn't move and didn't speak a word; he just looked. And yet, I took one glance at him and thought, "He wants that guy. Bad." Sure enough, it wasn't long after that that the mini-series made it obvious without showing anything explicit that the two men had become lovers. I can see it when it's there; I'm just not going to pretend it's there to satisfy someone's salacious cravings that have no basis in fact.
By the way, kudos to that actor who portrayed so much feeling with nothing more than his facial expression but without overacting. The mini-series was titled World Without End. It wasn't that great a show, but it had the elements to appeal people who like that sort of "slash" fiction.
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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The only blatantly homoerotic line that I can recall was the one from Napoleon's boss talking in the bathroom while urinating and telling Napoleon that he wouldn't like the taste of this but he was going to have to swallow anyway. But if there really are so many blatantly homoerotic lines between Ilya and Napoleon, then you ought to be able to list one or two. So let's hear them. Put up or shut up.
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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** SPOILERS AHEAD **
I don't think the line about swallowing sailed over anyone's head. Why do you assume that heterosexual men are such idiots? Do you dislike heterosexual men? You sure don't seem to have much respect for them. Is that why you're so eager to see each and every male as a closet homosexual?
For someone who claims to be a woman who knows oh so much about men and what they like, it seems peculiar that you’re so sensitive to how inappropriate Gaby’s behavior toward Illya was, but you think it’s okay to speak contemptuously of heterosexual men in general. Most men would probably rather get a playful slap from a gorgeous woman seeking their attention than to be spoken of as disrespectfully as you just did, and she was only giving one man a hard time, while you just insulted the vast majority of men. You have no room to call Gaby rude; you’re worse than she is. Far worse.
But at least you actually do have some lines. I had forgotten those things Napoleon said, because although I caught the innuendo, I couldn’t see it as flirting. When Napoleon said those things, the two men still hated each other, distrusted each other, didn’t want to work together, and could barely tolerate each other. Even if Napoleon had been attracted to Illya at that time, he wouldn’t have been flirting with him. He said those things as ironic banter to needle Illya, because he figured that was the sort of thing that a big, tough guy like Illya was most likely to find annoying. And unless there was something I missed in the context, there’s nothing remotely sexual about Illya’s comment of “Loving your work, Cowboy.” Even if you do have something with your lines, it’s all one-sided.
As for the truck rescue, we must have been watching different movies. You claim that Napoleon rescuing Illya proves that Napoleon loved Illya, when all I can see that it proved was that Napoleon wasn’t a complete and utter douchebag. Moreover for a second or two, Napoleon seriously considered doing exactly what you're basing your whole argument on his not having done: namely that he thought quite seriously about just driving away and leaving Illya to drown. And yet you want me to believe that Napoleon was in love with Illya at that point? At that point, they could still barely tolerate each other.
They must have? Both men are perfectly capable of returning to their hotel rooms alone, undressing themselves without help, taking a hot shower without assistance, and drying themselves off without aid. Why do you say they MUST HAVE? Because that’s what you want to have happened? Because you said so? You can’t make something true just by declaiming it any more than anyone else. Are you aware that everything you have taken people to task for doing in this thread is something that you yourself have done in this thread?
You want to pretend that Illya MUST HAVE showed his gratitude for being rescued from a watery grave with sexual favors, and that Napoleon MUST HAVE showed his gratitude for being rescued from torture with sexual favors, and that Illya MUST HAVE showed his gratitude for the return of his watch with sexual favors. Do you think that everyone who is rescued from violence or injury owes sexual favors to his rescuers or will want to have sex with his rescuers? Do you think that everyone who gets his property returned owes sexual favors or will want to have sex with the person who returned it? If you think people owe sex or will want to have sex with everyone who does something nice for them, you’ve either been very shabbily treated your whole life or have spent a lot of time on your back.
If you had been paying attention to everything that was said in that phone call, a huge part of the reason that Illya was upset was because of his boss’s insults to Illya and Illya's father. That was clearly a very sore point with him. There was also the fact that Illya might well have been intelligent enough to realize that it wouldn't be good for the world in general for a brutal, tyrannical state like the soviet union to get that far ahead in the arms race.
But of course Illya didn't want to kill Napoleon by that time. I've already said that by that time, Napoleon and Illya had developed a measure of respect and trust for each other and even showed signs of beginning to like each other. Naturally Illya would be upset. But that doesn't prove that they were in love or wanted to have sex.
And quit with the whole thing about Illya not noticing when Gaby left during the phone call. I've already said that at that point, I believe Illya's feelings toward her had changed. But if I'm a spy and I get a call from my boss who disses my dead father, disses me, orders me to steal nuclear weapon tech to get a regime as brutal as the soviet union ahead of the rest of the world in the arms race, and tells me to do so even if I have to kill someone that I've started to consider a friend, just because this distracts me from someone’s departure is no proof that I have no affection or attraction for that person. Pretending that it would be proof of such a thing just shows how desperately you will grasp at any circumstance whatsoever to support your claims. Just give it a rest.
Why would Illya be focused on Gaby when she joined him and Napoleon at the end of the movie? Can’t think of a single reason. Illya knew which one hadn’t betrayed him even when it meant not following an order. But NO, I saw nothing that looked like afterglow between the two men, and if you read my other posts on this thread, you’d know that I can spot when two guys in a mini-series want each other from a single look. You clearly are GOING TO see it whether it was there or not, simply because it’s what you want to see.
Seriously, I’d like you to answer the question. Why is it so hard for you to see two men who care about each other without believing that they are in love and wanting to have sex with each other? Are you the same way about women? Can you see two women become emotionally close without believing that they want to have sex?
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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As for the truck rescue, we must have been watching different movies. You claim that Napoleon rescuing Illya proves that Napoleon loved Illya, when all I can see that it proved was that Napoleon wasn’t a complete and utter douchebag. Moreover for a second or two, Napoleon seriously considered doing exactly what you're basing your whole argument on his not having done: namely that he thought quite seriously about just driving away and leaving Illya to drown.
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By the way, about this movie that you are lauding for having two strong, masculine men being tender with each other instead of punching each other in the face or trying to kill each other ...
They start the movie by punching each other in the face and trying to kill each other. Is that what you mean by men being tender with each other: when they finally stop punching each other in the face and stop trying to kill each other and stick to insulting each other instead?
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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You are determined to miss my point, because it shows up the flaws in your own point of view.
I can see that the two men might be starting to care for each other. I'm just appalled that for some reason you seem to think that means that they must be in love and in lust and secretly yearning to bone each other. Why can't they have affection for each other without being in love in your world view? Why are you so unwilling to consider the possibility that two men can like each other, care for each other, and have affection for each other without being sexually attracted to each other?
after Solo had returned Illya's treasured watch to him, and he had expressed his "gratitude" in some way, the two guys are enjoying a cosy drink on the balcony together. (Looked like "afterglow" to me.)
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And why are YOU so unwilling to consider the possibility that two men can like each other, care for each other, and have affection for each other and also be sexually attracted to each other? Why is that a problem for you?
I'm just appalled that it's always only about sex with you. You think that's all there could be, don't you! You can't accept that men can LOVE each other without just wanting to "bone" each other?
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You know, you say that you like to switch the roles of men and women in situations you see to see how it reads then. Let's do that.
If Napoleon started moving in to kiss Ilya and Ilya just stayed still and waited without punching him, pushing him away, or even turning his face aside with an expression of disgust, wouldn't that look to you like proof that Ilya was sexually attracted to Napoleon? Because when Ilya does that with Gaby, you took it as proof that Ilya was NOT sexually attracted to Gaby.
And that has been your strongest argument so far. You clearly have nothing.
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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He didn't graciously offer her his cheek or move away, though. He just waited for her to kiss him.
Thanks for the correction. With my imperfect vision, it’s kind of hard to tell the difference between Ilya and Illya in a sans serif font, especially considering that it’s a name with which I have no familiarity.
But for someone who wants to call someone else desperate, how do you explain your unwarranted sneering and your grasping at the most nitpicky details?
Again, hypocrite much?
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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I guess their size difference was suppose to make it funny but I didn't find it funny and I'm not the type to whine about girl-on-guy violence. The whole thing just kind of made her look like bitch without actually being funny.
shareAgreed, the slaps were a bit weird but his face was a picture! . At the time i put it down to the fact she was practically kidnapped and being a used as a pawn in their game so was showing some rebellion and resentment. Could have been the fact that Ilya as a bit inscrutable and an enigma and was somewhat ignoring her.
Still found the scene rather rewatchable though. His reactions were very cute. The same sense of missed opportunity, tension and frustration that I liked about the bedroom fire scene in Jane Eyre.
Exactly, and I also think it's important to remember she is an East German woman...and as such has MANY reasons not to trust/like a Russian man (just look up the Red Army occupation of Germany. AWFUL) not to mention his country currently is ruling hers with a puppet government and turned it into the most strict police state to have ever existed to that point. All those factors combined and then add in her attraction to him physically and, eventually, emotionally, and you get a hell of a lot of cognitive dissonance.
(And in reply to all the people who say she is a 'bitch' and 'mean': have you ever met anyone who grew up in East Germany? They don't trust anyone who isn't family...and for good reason. They are reserved and suspicious and, in Gaby's case, she wouldn't likely be the 'bubbly' sweet chick that everyone expects young women to be in Hollywood movie roles. I personally am glad they didn't try to sugarcoat her...it would have been highly unrealistic for her background.)
All that being said, the scene itself is awkward mainly because 1.) It started off as improv and 2.) Alicia V. isn't a comedian and as such isn't very funny...so I think this is just what happened and Guy was like 'That's as good as we are going to get from this actor who really only does dramas so...CUT!'
Very good point about how she would have felt towards Russians. They were imprisoning and killing her people. She would have known family and friends who would have been horrifically raped at the end of the war. East Germany was a grim place.
shareI really enjoyed the dynamic between the two of them, considering their rather tragic existences behind the Iron Curtain and the complicated relationship b/c their two countries. Too bad we aren't getting a sequel :( but I doubt Alicia would have been in it anyway as she has moved onto bigger and better things and is kind of out of the league of Henry and Armie as co-stars now...so maybe it's for the best! Hello fan fics lol
shareIt was improv? That would make sense. It really wasn't a good scene. It's too bad if that was the best they could get from her, but comedy is a lot harder to do well than drama.
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
It was, according to one of her interviews. Apparently when they were running through the scene at Guy's house he scrapped the script, took her aside and told her to slap Armie in the next take and told her to 'be funny', but she was very uncomfortable with it, esp. since English isn't her first language and humour is very difficult to translate (more so than drama, as you mentioned).
I think she is a fantastic actor, has done amazing work, and deserved her Academy Award, but she comes off a little vanilla in interviews and presumably in real life. I just don't think she is a particularly 'funny' person and I think that affected this scene, but maybe it ended up working as I don't think a woman from 1960's East Berlin would be very funny anyway...
The slap is so un PC but the look on his face did make me laugh, didn't she use his own hand to slap him - twice? I just liked the way that they handled their attraction and romance throughout the film but especially in that scene. He looked so disappointed, poor soul when she passed out on him. He had finally started to let his guard down and was at last showing some gentler vulnerable side and some emotion.
It's the only thing I've seen her in so not sure of my opinion yet though I found her voice a bit strange and a little annoying. She is very attractive though, can't blame Illya for falling for her.
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Oh he wanted her. His sad eyes every time they were interrupted. Poor Illya, I really felt for him!
share[deleted]
Film is art and as such can be interpreted by every individual differently. This is also a fictional work of art which means there is no 'truth' behind any of it as it does not have a real-world counterpart. Want to think I and N are bangin'? Cool. Want to believe I and G are in love? Sure, why not. Convinced Sanders, Oleg and Waverly have been in a homoerotic threesome, using the background of the Cold War to play out their power-wielding sexual fantasies? GO FOR IT.
Don't get so worked up about what someone else sees in a fictional work of art. There are many many other things in the world to get annoyed by, this is not one of them.
Yes true, much can be into your own interpretation. But, I'm sure in regards to Gaby and Illya - their attraction/ burgeoning romance was exactly what Ritchie was going for - part of the plot and script - so not really open to much interpretation. The romance able seems to be commonly accepted and was one of the highlights of the movie for the majority of the people I've seen comment on it how seemed to really tap into the two characters shy, awkward attraction for each other. So romantic and I'm usually a scifi/ action/ thriller fan.
share[deleted]
I wasn't talking to you. I was talking about the lovely romance which really helped make the movie. Illya's awakening attraction and feelings to the beautiful Gaby (who could blame him, she is gorgeous and he was lucky to have her interested in him as he was a bit serious and dorky) was fun and sweet to watch - counteracting with the action. Just wish there as a sequel to see what happened next, would Illya finally get the kiss he so desperately wanted, the look in his eyes every time he looked at Gaby and missed his opportunity - poor love sick Illya.
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look, you need to embrace the love - you sound a bit worked up. Watch the movie again - you might have missed it. Illya's little sigh of disappointment, his caress on her waist. His mind in her instead of his chess. They would have such beautiful babies, don't you think?
share[deleted]
The face that the overwhelming majority of IMDB participants agree with you regarding the Illya/Gaby attraction matters not to BTT. Never let the truth interfere with a baseless, obsessive, misguided opinion.
share[deleted]
Unfortunately, for all the Illya/Napoleon shippers in the world, you're going to have to get used to the idea of Illya/Gaby being together on screen if you have any hopes for a sequel.
Literally the only way this movie will get a sequel is to piggy-back off of Alicia Vikander's success. Neither of the male actors in this film, unfortunately, have much of an audience draw and have each proven twice over that they cannot lead a franchise (HC as Superman might be an exception but really only because they melted it into the Ben Affleck/Batman franchise).
Once Alicia's Tomb Raider movies are released, which are guaranteed to be box office gold, audiences and studios will be falling over themselves to get her in more movies/franchises...and making another TMFU movie with her headlining would be an easy money maker...and they won't not have her with a love interest (Illya). So sorry....but it looks like 'bitchy' Gaby, ironically, is your only chance at a sequel...
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The studio execs won't care what loyal TMFU TV fans will think about a sequel because they didn't show up to support the first one....and per your comment on cashing in...that's literally the only thing large film studios care about. Hence all the sequels for stupid comic franchises that never end despite terrible reviews.
What they WILL care about is that they will have Hollywood's hottest actor, freshly coming off a successful franchise and audiences will pay a lot of money just to see her in 'cute 60's outfits'....but also as a freakin' spy with two hot semi-famous sidekicks along for the ride. Pretty much Lora Croft but Cold War era. $$$$$$$
The oscar is just the cherry on the top. In two years or less AV will be a household name. Everyone will know her, and the other two will still be 'That guy from The Tudors' and 'That guy who played the twins in that Facebook movie'. No one will touch this sequel with a ten foot pole unless Alicia is in it. Sorry!!!
So you know more, are more observant and scarily more intuitive then the overwhelming majority of the IMDB participants?? You should modify your screen name to "Better Than Just About Everybody"!
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Well you believe why you want to, and everyone else will enjoy the sweet Ilya / Gabby romance and how it helped raise up the movie to a more memorable event. Win/win all round. Hopefully if there is a sequel he'll get that kiss he wanted so much.
share[deleted]
I never claimed she was a lady. I never said women should be allowed to beat on men with no retaliation. But here is exactly what you said, word for word. I copied and pasted rather than retyping so there would be no mistakes.
He just didn't want to injure her accidentally, which he could easily have done.
And when she kept slapping his face for no reason, he SHOULD HAVE slapped her right back.
Of course he doesn't slap her back (although he should have) because a guy like him knows he could accidentally KILL a little mosquito like her just by swatting her away.
It's just amazing how many people seem to think that a good rebuttal to a listing of facts and evidence they disagree with will be to declare that "Oh no, it wasn't!" -- and they leave it at that, as if they imagine that their opinion about it is all the "proof" that's necessary.
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You're just not going to be honest about this, are you? You have repeatedly said that Illya could have seriously injured or killed Gaby if he had slapped her back but still you said again and again that he should have slapped her back anyway. And if you can't be honest, I'm not sure there's any point in talking to you.
Did I ever say I was a woman? You're the one who equated being strong and useful with being like a man, implying that to be like a woman is to be weak and useless, so you've got no room to talk about someone else not being "liberated".
I wasn't talking about a man physically abusing a much weaker woman, and you know it. I only countenance what occurs between consenting adults. I was talking about those couples where both of them are into the spanking and such. And little Miss we-should-reverse-the-roles suddenly thinks it's okay for a woman to spank her husband but not for a husband to spank his wife because the wife should want to be loved and cherished and if she likes spanking she should be in therapy? You clearly are extremely judgemental of things that are none of your business, and you clearly have completely different standards for men and women. Have you been abused by men? Is that why you're so disrespectful of them? Is that why you can't conceive of a woman who might be into a little naughty spanking?
Missing the point again. If you saw Napoleon starting to kiss Illya in the sequel and Illya not moving away, you would be crowing in triumph and telling everyone how that proves beyond question that Illya is attracted to Napoleon. When it happens between Gaby and Illya, you pretend it means something completely different.
Good comedians don't snigger when they deliver lines. You really are scrambling desperately for anything whatsoever to bolster your claims.
Then you call me a liar. I didn't lie about anything. You either prove that I lied about something, or you owe me a serious, groveling apology. And you're about one post away from being muted and earning my eternal contempt.
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Strip away the phony tinsel of Hollywood and you find the real tinsel underneath.
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Gaby and Illya clearly had a mutual attraction, stuff just got in the way. It is an age old movie plot device.
It's interesting that there were some sad, delusional, misguided viewers that unsuccessfully argued that the real sexual tension in the film was between Illya and Napoleon. Despite the fact that the director contradicted this interpretation/theory several times in writing, there was actually a pathetic poster that simply could not accept the reality as explained by the director himself. This thread as well as many others, contained the misguided drivel of the decrepit shriveled old soul who, like a misguided mantra, kept repeating the debunked theory until ALL of her posts were thankfully deleted, as evidenced by the numerous posts that were erased on this thread. I wonder whatever happened to that pathetic woman Better Than absolutely no one?? Do you have any idea Ms. Kennedy?
Let it go, Woody. You've lost.
misguided drivel of the decrepit shriveled old soul<laughs> Getting nastier in your desperation? That just makes you look mean and spiteful. (I can see an angry old codger pounding away at his keyboard, sputtering with rage....)<laughs>
Just admit it, your deranged....one card less than a full deck etc
shareStill waiting to see your evidence that might suggest I'm mistaken. Don't have any? Yeah, I didn't think so.... I always provide plenty of evidence to support MY point of view.
You guys are so quick with your snide snickering and putdowns, but so SLOW with providing any suggestion whatsoever that any thought processes were at work when you jumped to your incorrect conclusions.
It's just sad, really.
I was waiting for it.
There isn't a film made these days without a badly written nasty female character that does the sort of crap to men that would get men beaten up or killed.
Must have the forced strong female that's not there on merit but to tick boxes that would be considered sexist if a man did it.
And immediately after where she throws him about and pins him down and he can't get up.
Up to this point he has be shown to have almost superhuman strength and no equal when it comes to fighting but that's probably just for this one scene so they can show she's really the strong one by buffy-ing her.
It's a tired and worn out sexist cliché that keeps being retread over and over.
Films don't have to have the token female in them and if they do surely they can write them better than the typical one-dimensional tripe we see in every film.
Honestly you can swap almost every "strong female" character between films they are so similar as well as all the interactions other characters have with them.
Throw in a love story sub plot and I can predict most of the script the writing is that lazy and repeated.
Better written male and female characters please.
And I get 2 minutes further into the film and she's better at fixing a racing car than the driver and the cars mechanic itself.
More making her look good by making her better than all the men around her expecially the ones doing their jobs.
Feminist wet dream.
You're right about that, Gambit. Smart women aren't fooled by fake portrayals of women characters who are really just "pretty" bitches who men will drool over. That's the worst kind of tokenism.
I want to see a REAL strong woman, who really IS as capable as a man -- not some dolly in a sexy outfit who really has no "skills" other than looking cute and getting the men going. That's just insulting to women who are really capable.
People constantly pretend that Gaby was an equal member of the team, when she was not even close. The MEN were the team, doing all the fighting, and espionage, and struggling, and taking abuse -- while SHE just showed up wearing a cute '60s outfit??? And that's supposed to be an equal member of the team?? Sorry, no.
She would just be useless baggage as the real team went forward. (About her "pinning" Illya, he could have thrown her through the wall with one hand -- but he was probably afraid he'd accidentally kill her, with his strength.)
Far too often, women in a movie are really only there to provide a bogus "love interest" for some clueless male clod. Which is why an amazing number of people just assumed that Illya would be "in love" with her. He wasn't at all.
He would never kiss her, even though she kept giving him opportunities. A man who is interested does NOT jump at the first interruption as an excuse to move away from her. It was obvious that Gaby had the hots for Illya, and she thought the annoying movie cliché of the rude and snotty bitch would attract him. But it was equally obvious that Illya just didn't want her.
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Gaby slapped Illya to both get his attention and generate some emotion from him. She was bored being holed up in the hotel room and wanted some interaction. Illya, with the exception of his uncontrolled rages, seemed to be more comfortable holding his emotions to his vest. I thought it was a charming, comic scene.
shareGaby was getting desperate to make Illya pay any attention to her at all, when he clearly wasn't interested in her in the least. Instead of just accepting his rejection of her with grace, she resorted to physical abuse.
Disgracefully, the way she attempted to get his attention was by assaulting him -- TWICE. Is there anyone who would think it was "charming" or "comic" if he had started to smack HER around, if she hadn't been interested in HIM? Let's not kid ourselves.
It's just sad that appalling rudeness and violence against men is somehow supposed to be sexy and seductive, when if the genders were reversed, he'd probably go to jail.