MovieChat Forums > Pretty Little Liars (2010) Discussion > Why are Spaleb fans so sexist?

Why are Spaleb fans so sexist?

posted 8 years ago by sarahbbbyyy
13 replies | jump to latest

I am just trying to get your guys attention.

I am actually not blaming all of the fans for this but some discussions I have had about Spencer and Caleb automatically lead to the blame of the Hanna Marin character for the breakup of the Hanna and Caleb relationship.

Can you tell me why the mostly female fan base is all about blaming Hanna for the end of the relationship simply because she did not follow the 1950s demands of the sexist Caleb to give up working on her career in fashion?

Hanna decided not to go to one of her fancy colleges that she got accepted in and wanted to go to fashion school instead. She started working jobs that took a lot of her hours. Let's not forget that a career in fashion like a career in anything entertainment based(acting as well) is a very hard business to get into and is very much a one in a million chance.

Caleb was being completely unfair demanding Hanna to choose him over her work and ending their relationship when (shocker) she chose her job. She was 19/20 years old: her main focus should be her job, not a silly romance that was most likely not going to last forever. If she gave up on it, then there is no way she would be getting any other chances. She could but it was most likely never going to happen. They were too young to plan a vacation to Europe anyway. They were on their own, did not have money, and Caleb ended up broke anyway whereas Hanna was far more successful and obviously her life turned out for the better. In the flashback, she was shown trying very hard to compromise with him and even ran back thinking she made a mistake and he was just gone. I thought it was horrible. The flashback showing him dumping her was not the Caleb I fell in love with. This one was immature, stupid, and unsupportive. It was like the Devil Wears Prada movie and the boyfriend is considered one of the worst movie boyfriends of all time. Again, why is it when SOME people defend Caleb and Spencer, they automatically make Hanna out to be the evil witch who was selfish and inconsiderate not choosing the love of her life. The sad reality is that she is a woman and she would have not any other option other than being Caleb's housewife. That is not bad unless it was not what she wanted, which it obviously was not. Just because he does not like her job choice, does not mean that he had to treat her like dirt. Spencer's job takes as much time as Hanna's but just because "he does not understand it", it makes her less worthy. That is pretty unfair.

[–] alecz-36042 8 years ago

I haven't really seen any Spaleb fans say that, given that I am one. I'm a Spaleb fan because I think they have good chemistry that they built up over the years. I don't blame Hanna, in fact, I'm glad they broke for the reasons you mentioned

[–] sarahbbbyyy 8 years ago

Any time the subject comes up, people always blame Hanna instead of Caleb. He is the biggest idiot of all and he should get ALL of the blame in my opinion because at the end of the day, even his relationship with Spencer was him initiating it and him not caring about Hanna's feelings. Spencer gave a damn and Hanna encouraged it, so at the end, there should not be a war where Caleb and Hanna fans blame Spencer or Spencer and Caleb fans blame Hanna when none of them make sense(except for the whole Hanna kissing Caleb part, that pissed me off, even though I was a previous fan of the couple).

I actually did not want Spencer and Caleb to be together but I also do not like Caleb and Hanna being back together either. They really messed up Caleb's character and Hanna not getting over someone after three to four years does not make any sense. Her also kissing him knowing he was with Spencer was out of character as well. The girls acted the same after the five years forward, except Caleb regressed and they just did not fit anymore. I also did not buy how he treated her when it came to her job. I wish she had moved on and I wish all the girls were single. Well, at least Spencer and Toby ended but that is going to change and so is Ezra and Aria.

[–] marinaalexis-87074 8 years ago

I have never once seen a fan of Spaleb blame Hanna for her and Caleb's breakup. Do you have any examples of this happening?

Speaking as someone who never minded Spencer/Caleb, Haleb broke up because their lifestyles just weren't compatible anymore. He wasn't being unfair for telling her that he couldn't stay with her if she was going to keep living the traveling, partying, jam-packed lifestyle, and she wasn't being unfair by choosing her work over him. They were clearly looking for different things in life, and the dreams they had in high school just didn't work out the way they expected. It's no one's fault. It's what happens to a lot of high school sweethearts and is the reason why Hanna and Caleb ending up together now is so unrealistic: What's different?

[–] sarahbbbyyy 8 years ago

It's mostly on Youtube. I have seen it in the course of some months. I would rather not dig it up but I am sure they are still there. I see what you are saying and I am not disagreeing with you but Caleb handled the entire breakup horribly. I understand his concerns but it seems rather odd that someone who spent so much time away from his girlfriend in high school age and even has suffered from her being in danger so many damn times, putting his life at risk to save her, would get upset because she did not spend time with him and would not go on a silly vacation with him. I would have never gone to Europe until I knew I could afford leaving a job and having enough money for it, yet he got upset because she could not go and that was not fair. He was being very cruel and just left her when things got too tough, without letting her have a say in it at all. I am not saying I want Caleb and Hanna back together at all. They are actually terrible together now, so I am not saying anything is different. It was just strangely out of character for someone who has been on the move his entire life. I think he just had a problem settling and it goes deeper than Hanna's dreams. Maybe, it has nothing to do with her or Spencer. He maybe just has really bad abandonment issues. Still, everything about it felt unrealistically written, given the characters, their past, and some of their previous behaviors or personality and life beforehand.

[–] perfect_lover2012 8 years ago

Caleb simply doesn't respect what Hanna does for a living and thinks fashion is meaningless. Once we saw the reason for their breakup It just became obvious that Caleb continued to run from his problems and he isn't a good boyfriend. He treated Spencer horribly and I doubt he would've asked Hanna before starting up with Spencer. He didn't respect his BFF, Toby, enough to talk to him first. Spencer and Caleb matched better than Hanna and Caleb but after seeing his behavior at the end of 6B and 7A I shipped Caleb with death. Then getting into the cheating fiasco, Hanna told Spencer and Caleb didn't. He just treated her badly when she was just trying to help them but of course Caleb only cared about himself. He hurt Spencer, Hanna, and Toby without apologizing or feeling guilty. No one holds him accountable either and they just jump back to their friendships/relationships with him. I just don't like or respect Caleb anymore. How can anyone trust his feelings? He was convinced that he needed to be with Spencer, makes out with Hanna, begs Spencer back 2 or 3 times, and then disappears only to want Hanna again. He's nuts. I wish Hanna and Spencer would've walked away from him for good. I didn't notice any Spaleb fans saying it was Hanna's fault. Then again there are only 5 Spaleb fans lol but most of the fanbase felt that Spencer was the only one at fault.

"When life gives you lemons"
Jessica D: sleep with their fathers and have secret lemon children

[–] sarahbbbyyy 8 years ago

I used to think that there are mostly Spencer and Caleb fans out there, judging by the acclaim they have gotten from very reasonable people in Reddit and a bunch of TV based websites that rate couples and so forth. It seems like the only people that ship Caleb and Hanna anymore are the people that are so obsessed with the original couples that they can not see clearly and that is probably the majority of the fan base, and they happen to be a little obsessive and immature most of the time. I am not talking about me of course because I actually love Caleb and Hanna together and just thought their breakup, Caleb's behavior towards EVERYTHING, and the way the entire storyline went down felt unrealistic to me. I can not find someone to have a real conversation about it with because a bunch of immature fellow Caleb and Hanna fans just call Spencer a s*** and a bad friend, which is just unfair to me. Okay, I do not think she is the best friend but if she genuinely fell for him and asked Hanna for permission to date him, then she should get the benefit of the doubt for at least trying to be good about it and yet the writers made Hanna out to be this bad friend when she stooped so low and kissed Caleb when he was with Spencer. They ruined my favorite character, thanks a lot writers. Those fans actually try to defend Hanna for doing that, which shows that they are not making any rational arguments or making them or Hanna look any better because it was not in anyway right to me at all.

Spencer and Caleb fans are more mature but I come across comments blaming Hanna, which was just unfair to me and it makes it seem that they are just finding a way to blame her to make Spencer and Caleb look better. They are just looking more intelligent and rational while doing it since they are not name calling like the "other" shippers.

Caleb was more mature as a high student than as an adult. Can you believe it?

[–] perfect_lover2012 8 years ago

In a way I can believe it but also not believe it at the same time if that makes sense. One thing I hate is the show's inability to address his behavior as character regression. Hanna and Spencer had issues for episodes because of him and I'm sure it won't be discussed in 7B at all. I hate the original couples overall after a certain point. I never enjoyed Ezria for many reasons, Spoby should've ended after the massive betrayal in 3B, and then Caleb and Hanna should've been done when he left her for Ravenswood. Caleb will always abandon her when she needs him. I think part of his issue stems from his upbringing but of course the writers won't address it and I think he resents Hanna for being less needy. He "saved" her quite a few times during the show and he moved to pay her tuition. As soon as Hanna became more independent and leaned on him less(earning her own money, going to college, being smarter than he thought, etc) he didn't really like it. The core issue with all of the main couples is that they can only thrive in dysfunction. They won't last a minute with real world problems. I also don't believe that Hanna would kiss Caleb even in a moment of fear. She's not that kind of person. I can see Aria doing that as she has done it many times before but not Hanna.

"When life gives you lemons"
Jessica D: sleep with their fathers and have secret lemon children

[–] sarahbbbyyy 8 years ago

Well, Caleb has always been considered secondary as a character until the writers realized how popular he was in comparison to the others. I do not why they do not go deeper through his issues. The audience has never met his mom and he has not talked about it much since he reunited with her. There has got to be some deep rooted issues there but of course the writers only care about ships and fandom. Everyone says that this show went downhill after Season 2 but it was never high end in the writing department. I mean, they do write some things well and they do focus on character development when it comes to some of the girls but they relapse to the idiots that they used to be and are a little disrespectful towards them at times. Some of these things need to be addressed however in order for it to be a higher quality show for people to enjoy for a nice long time. If only it was more character driven than plot driven because they obviously have no clue how to write a plot without so many plot holes and boring subplots.

Sorry, I was a little off topic. Anyways, you are definitely right that they should have ended after he left for Ravenwood. Everything about that did not make much sense and he was so rude to her for no reason when he came back and disrespected her many times yet she was so in love with him that she could not see clearly and dumped Travis. She was so obsessed with wanting to be with him in obviously a way subtle way than Aria but still. That is something I see often to is that fans of the show always call Hanna a bad girlfriend and say she does not deserve him but she reunited him with his mother, build a relationship with his father and forgive him, she helped him with a place to live when he had no place to go, I mean, the list goes on yet he has taken it for granted. Look, Hanna is no angel and she definitely needs to mind her own business a lot of the times but she tries and really cares. He used to care but it has regressed and now she has become a back up plan.

It's funny you say that about Spencer and Toby because their relationship was just awful and not the same after 3B but the fandom just can not forget it.

[–] Ladylalaal 8 years ago

A lot of people also blamed spencer for getting together with Caleb and said things like "she should have controlled her self" or "he had no choice but to fall for her." But that kind of thought process is super common amongst different show/book/movie fandoms. I think the bigger question should be "why are so many people in sexist when it comes to certain male character?" Who knows.

[–] sarahbbbyyy 8 years ago

You are right. That should be the main question on my mind since that is pretty common, even if it is obvious that it is the male's character's fault. The better question would be though is why are females quick to blame other females no matter what the circumstance and not stand by each other?

I do not think it is fair either that people are quick to blame Spencer for it all when she was very much worried about how Hanna might feel and Caleb could give a damn. It is wrong to call her a s*** when she is just a human being with feelings. Although, I do think she needs to work on her self esteem a bit but either way, it is very sexist.

I always felt that people loved Caleb and Spencer more but clearly the fan base is obsessed with Hanna and Caleb and are playing the blame game on either girl, especially Spencer but I never thought it was right. Also, they always defend the kiss between Hanna and Caleb in the Season 6B Finale and I also do not think it is right. It is a very twisted way of thinking to defend the ship when they are clearly in the wrong, no matter how right you think they are for each other or how wrong people think it is for Spencer to have dated Caleb.

[–] Brookiee124 8 years ago

I haven't seen anyone blame Hanna, especially not in this board. I remember we were all mostly against Caleb for being such an ass and wanting her to be a "kept" woman, essentially. Maybe you saw these reactions on another board?

[–] sarahbbbyyy 8 years ago

Oh, it was not on here. It was on Youtube. I was not exactly referring to this board. That is kind of why I wrote it here to see why and it seems that none of you guys know because most of the people here do not feel that way. Either way, I am happy I posted here to see some good, logical responses.

[–] Wint3rFir3 (7171) 7 years ago

I've seen more blame on Caleb than anyone - and I think that's sexist, too. For me, I will always take issue with the fact Spencer started a relationship with a friend's ex, but that's just my personal bias. Bias aside, you can't blame one person for the decisions of three adults. Either they are all to blame for their individual mistakes, which contributed to this triangle, or they are not to blame because blame isn't necessary.

Personally, I feel like the aftermath of this relationship was the part that needs more attention. I was on board with Spaleb when Hanna okay-ed it. Then, when they tacked on the whole 'I never stopped loving you' story, I thought that this was something that was always going to be a problem for Spaleb because Hanna and Caleb have always been the most grounded couple, and their breaking up never made sense. Now that they're back together, I feel like their being around Spencer as a couple can't really work because...awkward much?

See, there's not blame to assign. It's just a weird position for all of them to be in, and one that doesn't really make sense. It was just a way to make Spencer a more sympathetic character while also throwing in an unnecessarily fraught love story between two characters whose love was always the most...idk normal? Un-fraught?