MovieChat Forums > The Dark Knight Rises (2012) Discussion > No arc.. how it could of been far better

No arc.. how it could of been far better

posted 5 years ago by JlawsANormlHuman (847)
28 replies | jump to latest

it was really simple. he lost to Bains sheer strength and ability not to be distracted or beat by trick and strategy batman learned from ra's al ghoul. because while batman learned them Bain was "born in the darkness".

the execution of this should of been easy to show physically and the most obvious path taken. Bruce is put in the dark pit (that isn't full of old people and women and children). He learns to live in the darkness and embrace it. escaping it is somehow connected to this embracing of the dark mixed with things he learned from al ghul.

He not only physically rises from the pit, but is "reborn" a better and stronger batman who can finally best Bain. This is the perfect mix of physically showing it, the metaphor and symbolism or "rising" or being reborn", Showing batman arc as he becomes a better fighter and stronger person, finally becomes the true "DARK knight" and evenTies in with the title!!

in the new edition final battle with Bain. he confronts him yet again. this time he forces Bain into the dark (again more development as batman overcomes where he lost last time). and through what he learned and his own skill and cunning and his mastering of fighting in the dark overcomes Bain.

Welcome to storytelling and arc 101. Instead what we got was him punching Bain in the mask. something he could of done in the first fight! so it becomes irrelevant, pointless and we don't see our main character make any arc that has any significance.

kinda sad when I can write a far better arc and story than what we got.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 5 years ago

There was an arc, in the second fight Bruce still wasn't stronger than Bane but he fought smarter by going for the mask (the first time he didn't know that was Bane's weakness).

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

So the worlds greatest detective didn't realize first fight to go for the obviously vulnerable breathing apparatus? noted....

[–] Joogle83 (4546) 5 years ago

he was in self-imposed exile for 8 years off course he wouldn't realize it

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

lol what?

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 5 years ago

Bruce: you’re afraid that if I go back out there I’ll fail
Alfred: no I’m afraid that you want to

That quote clears up your confusion

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

not at all. it literally didn't address anything I said

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 5 years ago

Hmmm well then I guess pretty much the whole film flew right over your head. My advice is just stick to Batman forever, it’s much easier to follow

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

hahahaha you are an idiot. please stop embarrassing yourself

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 5 years ago

You would LOVE the Schumacher films, I think you'll enjoy the simplistic nature of the story.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 5 years ago

He didn’t know knocking the breathing apparatus out would defeat bane, that’s something he learned in the pit

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 5 years ago

He didn't care the first time he saw Bane, it wasn't until he rose from the pit that he's the Batman character we are familiar with, the one who cares about his life and is going to fight harder and faster because he is not only fighting for Gotham but for himself. Clearly that character arc went right over your head.

[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

There was a lot of crap in this film.

I don't think the writers knew what they wanted to do which is really crazy given the amount of money involved.

For instance, Alfred hooks Batman up with a bionic knee device. It is so strong that he is able to kick through a brick wall.

That was a scene with no point in the movie. However, it seemed like foreshadowing for use such devices in the future.

Batman is about technology and I thought he was going to get a bionically enhanced suit to fight Bane. That would have been sensible.

The whole movie sucked though due to the BS "realism" nonsense. Catwoman wasn't Catwoman, Bane wasn't anything like the character, and Batman either kills himself or retires. Batman cannot retire due to his driving passion for being Batman.

Lots of crap, which is too bad.

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

I agree. the film was supposed to have the joker and two face (and maybe they could of thrown one more in.

I guess Legers death really crapped on their plans for a villain teamup film

[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

I didn't know that.

As I've said, Bane could have been okay with the super steroids and Batman would have been fine with an enhanced suit.

It's amazing that the writers are getting huge amounts of money to make the movie and they just kinda give up.

That's some crazy shit.

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

I'm fine with the badass "moulded in the dark" Bain.

but the well/prison isn't dark or scary.. its bunch of old men and families... in a well lit area... it actually looks cozy.

Like I said Bruce should of been "reborn" and "rises" out of the darkness having learned what Bain did. Finally completely his training from Ras al ghul and giving us not only a single movie arc, but an arc over the films as Batman progressively has to face external and internal challenges (first his master, then his friend and a psychopath, finally himself and his own darkness)

its truly amazingly stupid how the director thought learning to hit the vulnerable mask would be okay. but actually it is, cause look at all the defenders on here who think it was

[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

I can't stand how Hollywood is so PC, then they make BANE AND ENGLISH GUY and the MANDARIN and English guy. The Mandarin was English because they didn't want an Asian Villain because that's insulting, so they don't hire an Asian for a very high paying job, lol.

Bane is Latin American and he was experimented on in prison, that's his STORY he's not English and didn't group up in some stupid hole prison.

Comics are like the best marketing tool in the history of stories. You make a cheap comic story, see if people like, they do, and then for DECADES they will buy the story. So, will they like that story in a movie---YES THEY FUCkING WILL!!!

Okay, let's not use it.

I thought BANE was STUPID to the point of disgust. He made no sense at all.

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

maybe. maybe they were worried about Chinese censorship.

yea well DC isn't exactly know for doing great fan service and sticking to the original.

[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

They could have made the Mandarin a complex character. I just don't like how you never see Asian people in anything. There are like NO currently famous Asian actors in the US.

I do not understand DC. They must be living in a bubble.

I watched Birds of Prey and it was really terrible.

Most of it was shot in the day, Harley is out shopping in a supermarket, as Harley, and it was like they decided to get a camera and make a movie, like some kind of fan thing on Youtube. Black Canary was an average looking black girl looking nothing like the character.

It's just weird. It's like they just throw stuff together and maybe have no idea where it all came from.

[–] JlawsANormlHuman (847) 5 years ago

Im not disagreeing man. and for sure or they are typecast as "that kung fu fighter" for years.

I think they wanted and were chasing that 1.5 billion dollar box office ensemble super hero film money so bad (like the avengers) that they somehow missed that that was only attainable by first doing some solid groundwork and character development in a solo film and creation of a complex universe.

iron man made 500 million. iron man 2 628m, Thor 449m and captain American 350m. there's a reason there are literally almost ZERO ensemble films released. you normally focus on 1 or two main characters and a protagonist.

it would of been perfect. so the superman, then wonder women, then a batman solo film and maybe a cyborg or martian man hunter. Now we have well established characters we actually care about.

there just isnt enough time to develop 4 or 5 characters in a single film. its basic filmmaking. but DC couldn't be patient

[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

DC has a huge problem with bizarre character development.

I liked Man of Steel and didn't see many problems. But when they added Lex Luther and he was acting like The Joker, you just know they don't understand the character although there's decades of material with the character in it acting consistently.

DC doesn't care about their characters in live action films. In the cartoon movies, the filmmakers are right on target. I don't get that.

So, DC could make individual movies, but if they don't get the "brand" right, then they will fail. Characters this famous are a brand, and that's what they don't get. If I get a cheeseburger from McDonald's it had better smell and taste like one, not a hotdog. I don't want a black girl playing Gordon's adopted daughter turned Batgirl, or any of that shit.

You would think they would get this already.

[–] tarantinofan4lif (0) 5 years ago

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[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

Who is in charge of the animated ones then?

They have to be two entirely different groups of people. The Communist Superman movie is coming out and I saw the trailer. I will of course rent in with glee.

The massively expensive films ought to evoke the same response.

They have to have some kind of weird isolated group of people doing the DC movies who think they're smart but aren't. They need to break that up.

Lex:

I actually thought Eisenberg was going to be great! He has that flat affect dead behind the eyes monotone quality a lot of Jewish guys have. See Mayor Bloomberg as an example. Spock is based on that type of person. That would be a good Lex.

A real Lex is an intensely jealous man who is a genius. The moral of the Lex story is that if he wasn't so jealous he would shine and be just as popular as Superman, but he is too emotionally consumed to understand that.

Any idiot could understand the basics of Lex if you read some old comics. When you stand to make a billion dollars over night, you'd think you'd do that.

[–] tarantinofan4lif (0) 5 years ago

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[–] TheAdlerian (2092) 5 years ago

Good point there!

Anyway, a giggling rambling talking to himself Lex was not Lex. As we have been saying, it's like existing Batman characters, which is correct.

[–] ss5mmyers (164) 5 years ago

The arc is about Bruce moving on past Batman, not being a better Batman.

[–] [deleted] 5 years ago

"Could have," not "could of."

[–] tarantinofan4lif (0) 5 years ago

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[–] [deleted] 5 years ago

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