MovieChat Forums > 300: Rise of an Empire (2014) Discussion > Gorgo as female commander was an insult ...

Gorgo as female commander was an insult to both men and women

posted 11 years ago by Lin301
187 replies | jump to latest

I hate how gender roles are being all messed up these days under the 'feminist' flag and anyone who dares say otherwise is a sexist. I believe in equal rights for men and women, but this is not that! This is women taking over male atributes and archetypes and thereby both denying men's masculinity and their own femninity.

I think the first 300 did it perfectly: men were men, women were women; both respected and loved the other for their attributes; women were the birthgivers, nurturing and wise, men were the leaders (not bosses!), protectors and somewhat selfdestructive as I believe all men are. This is what made the relation between Gorgo and Leonidas so intimate to me, they had a deep mutual respect for one another whilst maintaining their own gender attributes.

Then along comes Rise of an Empire and we suddenly see Gorgo swinging around a blade in her evening dress as the front commander of the Spartans. Remember how 300 ended with Dilios leading the troops (where did that battle take places anyways?) and not Gorgo; it's because it was not her role as queen of Sparta. Apparantly now we have to ensure women are just as manly as men? Even if it's a historical piece of a time where this wasn't an issue? Are we not simply destroying what it means to be a woman by having them adopt male attributes? To me this is the same as wanting equal rights for gays and then showing they can be just as hetero as hetersexual people. Am I the only one seeing the insanity of this development? I hope someone can provide me with more insight because this was just ridiculous

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Edit for further elaboration in reply to:

" women were the birthgivers, nurturing and wise, men were the leaders (not bosses!), protectors and somewhat selfdestructive as I believe all men are."

This in itself is sexist against both males and females lmao. You do realize a lot of "feminine" and "masculine" attributes are social constructs? As in they have been made up at one point and then spread? Several aspects and/or things that are commonly thought of as male or female have been neither gender or thought as belong to the opposite once upon a time (easy example is the color pink, considered to be feminine, when it was at first considered a masculine color. Now you got guys like you probably, thinking it make a man look "womanly" if he wears pink. Btw high heels were also for males at first, yet a guy wearing that would get so much crap today for acting "gay"). Do you even realize that the belief in rigid ideas about masculinity is one of the leading reasons for male suicide since it plays a huge role in causing anxiety in men? You whining over what? A female being assertive? Because that belongs only to men? That is utterly ridiculous. And lmao on women being "nurturing and wise". The idea that all women are nurturing is *beep* despite all girls being exposed to the idea that they should be since they are children (e.g. girls are almost always giving toys/dolls that they have to take care off, even if they have no interest). Guys are denied to be shown as nurturing as well as if there is someone wrong to care for others, especially their own children. No gender is inherently wise either. That is just a posterous idea.

I agree with you that some gender attributes are social constructs, but you can't deny there aren't any biological differences between men and women; I must admit I dont exactly know which is which (I don't believe a clear distinction can be made) but I do like to discuss this topic with women and most say they believe they act more from their emotions than men, which act more from their ego (which makes some sense I guess evolution-wise). The examples I gave in the part you quoted where just the ones I felt were set up in the world of the first 300, where women were respected for ''giving birth to real men'' and the men were heavily trained in the art of combat. Sexist or not, that was 300. Obviously these attributes don't apply today; I apologise for not being more clear about that. I also didn't mean to say women can't be assertive; as Gorgo was assertive in the first 300 when she stabbed that corrupt politician dude and she obviously had some control over Leonidas as he asked for her permission to kick the Persian messenger down the pitt. I actually thought she was a strong female character in that movie. My main beef was with how Rise of an Empire broke with these roles set up in the first movie and we suddenly see Gorgo on the front line waving a blade around. Note that I didn't mind Artemesia as a assertive female warrior, just how they changed Gorgo for whatever reasons; as I mentioned in the op my best guess was to conform more to modern gender roles, which is exactly what I hate in a lot of movies these days (or ever)

[–] hugobolso-1 11 years ago

The femele spartans had more rights than most of the other greek kingoms, and all have millitar training. still gorgo as Queen of Sparta commanding the spartans is too much!!!

Any thougths

[–] Rigel1337 11 years ago

I thought that Lena as Queen Gorgo standing on the deck of the ship with her warriors was awesome.

That moment in the movie reminded me of the winged victory statue which is my favorite piece of western art/ancient art.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winged_Victory_of_Samothrace

Eva's character was evil and the Persians were supposed to be evil as well. The Persains were wearing armor that reminded me of Scorpion from Mortal Kombat.

Eva's character wore her hair long and had unique black armor with spikes on the back like a Japanese monster.

I noticed that the huge statue of Athena in Greece that Xerces men toppled was wearing a helmet. So the Athenians in the movie must have thought that some women might possibly be an exception to the stay at home role.

[–] libianu2002 11 years ago

incredibly stupid for two legs walking people...

[–] Agent_f00 11 years ago

I don't agree with the majority of stuff in this thread. Except I laughed when I saw Gorgo chopping up dudes in that dress. She just didn't fit. Eva Green fit, they showed up an anomaly , who still fit in. She wore the Persian uniform, dark clothes, lots of eyeliner.

Gorgo wasn't wearing the uniform, had never been set up to be a great warrior in her many previous scenes, and was intentionally at the very tip of the fight. Maybe if she hadn't obviously aged in the realtime 7 years she would've seemed more able bodied, or if she was dressed differently(dunno how, Greeks only wear helmets apparently), or if she was ever mentioned or shown to be a great warrior before that scene.

I thought she was gonna give a rousing speech, and then she plowed in and starting chopping fools up like a super ninja, and I started laughing. It wasn't because she was a woman, I liked Eva Green. It's because it wasn't set up, and she didn't visually fit the mold of any other fighter types in the movie.

I think it has more to do with the fact that she had very little to do, and was one of the few living protagonists from the previous movie. They already had a woman fighting, so they were like, why not?

[–] SausagePourVous 11 years ago

Preach,Lin,preach. I agree with every word and you expressed yourself as a poet of truth.

Reminds me of a reviewer here in Sweden that thought what was wrong with the new The three musketeers was in no way that Lady Jovovich was an asskicking ninja(Like that wasn´t insanely feministic and"equal" enough),the female writer asked why there couldn´t be,now that we live in a modern time and should be equal,a fifth musketeer who was female...

"I guess the world sadly isn´t ready for one." Isabella Espinoza said and it was a real review in a respected paper. Yes. We shuld change Dumas classic work and include a chick musketeer,nevermind the credibility,this is the future and we shouldn´t be so narrowminded and misogynistic. Sarcasm.

Feminism and equality just went....wrong somewhere. Females can kick ass but within context,in fair dosage and at least with some credibility. I enjoyed watching girls kick guys asses up to a point where it became too much,where that is the story or the plot or at least overshadows it.

Both wanting complete equality when every thing a man ever does is for sex and love,every war is started cause of a boner,more or less,something the other gender knows,fully expecting free entrance and free drinks while shouting we should evolve and not be stuck in old stereotypes...it doesn´t work. Nature did make us man and woman and both genders have our deeply rooted instincts and needs and different ways of thinking.

We are equal in the way that both genders have their advantages. But we as humans can´t eat the pie and have it too,since that becomes hipocracy or just plain silly....but I rather have the two powerful 300 chics as role models for women,taking charge and kicking ass then getting respect for slutting it up a´la Paris Hilton. Now only if there was a middleground. Hmm....

[–] shwen 11 years ago

agreed

also I personally think 300 is a myth, how do we know it actually happened

[–] takeo7 11 years ago

But it's set in a time period so long ago, it doesn't really matter.

[–] kenneglds 11 years ago

What is funny is that the people making a big deal about Gorgo leading the Spartans into battle, is that the people are making a big deal about what is only the last 5 minutes (or so) of the movie. And we only see Gorgo in actual battle for about 20 seconds. Nevertheless, there are people here who seem to have a big problem with it. ( and in a movie that really isn't meant to be taken all that seriously, to begin with)

[–] dgannati 11 years ago

Actually in the Persian (Iranian) society women enjoyed a very strong equality. They held very high posts in both government, military and business. Women could be generals in that times military. They even had right to their salary during maternity leave. These are all records saved on stone tablets from that era.