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Rewatched all seasons - and I like Brienne even less than before

posted 6 years ago by BanditOne (98)
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Never been a fan of hers. I don't mind Daenerys or Arya. I quite like Arya even, especially her killing Meryn Trant, Walder Frey (and all other male Freys and members). Sansa is fine, even though she seems a bit full of herself more and more. And If Cersei ends up on the throne I'd be quite happy. Despite her getting more and more insane I like her...actually that's why I like her. Her blowing up the Great Sept with all her enemies inside was rewarding.

But Brienne. Jeez....can't stand her (character...not actress). She always acts like she's better than anyone else. Bending the knee to every King, Queen or even Lord who comes across. She claims to be a great swordfighter. But yet the biggest fights she had with:

- Jaime...who's been held captive for a while and was clearly weak at the time
- The Hound....who's been wounded before the fight
- Stannis...who was beaten and dying already

Not that hard to come out on top of these fights. And when she met a true opponent she had to be rescued (the bear) or she lost (Arya - even though just in "training").
And her "training" Podrick. Nothing but just hitting him, beating him and kicking him to the ground. Not much teaching here....just building on her own self-confidence. If this character is gone...I'm the first to cheer.

[–] TexasJack (12516) 6 years ago

She is single-minded. Her only goal is honor through service. Basically, how any "true knight" should behave. At some points, I did find it annoying and even unjust -- she had no right to execute Stannis, in my view. On the other hand, I cheered for her when she charged in to save Sansa and Theon from Ramsay's men.

I think Sansa is worse by a large margin. Withholding critical information about the Knights of the Vale prior to the Battle of the Bastards cost untold numbers of lives and was unforgivable. Undermining Jon in front of the Northern lords was also completely wrong.

I agree that her fight against The Hound was unrealistic. Stannis wasn't even a fight, he was half-dead and yielded to her. The fight against Jaime was reasonable because he was weak and shackled at the time.

[–] Otter (24464) 6 years ago

I like Brienne. She was meant to embody the one person in WEsteros who truly believes in the ideals of Chivalry and knighthood, even though she can't be a knight. The fact that this makes her an unpopular misfit in a realistic world is a hell of a commentary on human nature.

And her existence is one reason I think that Jamie is going to live, and become Lord of the Westerlands, with Brienne as his Lady to keep him in line. It would be tragic to kill off the one person in Westeros who believes in chivalry, and they can't leave her serving Sansa because oath or not, they're never going to get along. Like most real people, Sansa doesn't believe in chivalry, Sansa believes in "by any means necessary"! (May the Gods have mercy on that girl's next husband.)

[–] R_Kane (15828) 6 years ago

Thank you for that, Otter. I only just now found this topic; don’t know how I missed it before. You said what I would. One more thing: Stannis has to die. Period. Brienne had no legal right? There is a higher law, as the judges pronounced at the Nuremberg trials.

[–] whynotwriteme (7815) 6 years ago

She may like to think she believes in the ideals of chivalry, but her actions, as outlined in the OP, make it clear that she is not living up to them.

[–] Alerra (244) 6 years ago

Don't forget her joust with Loras. We often forget just how good a sword fighter Loras was because he's a lover, not a fighter -- we very rarely ever see him fighting. But way back in Season 1, he defeated the Mountain, so that should give us an idea of just how good he was.

Brienne's character development has taken a nosedive, for sure -- although I'm not certain if it's better or worse than what's in the books -- but I like her interplay with Pod. And I love seeing Tormund making his googly eyes at her.

[–] Otter (24464) 6 years ago

We certainly see more of Loras as a lover than a fighter... but remember, he didn't defeat the Mountain with superior strength and swordplay, he beat him by riding a mare in heat while Mounty was riding a stallion. Which was brilliant of him, I respect a win by strategy more than I respect winning through strength - but winning is still winning whatever the means.

But yeah, it's like they haven't really known what to do with Brienne once Stannis got the chop (yay!). Hopefully they have something big planned for her.

[–] TearofLys (2666) 6 years ago

I like the Brienne haracter a little more now than I did in say season 4, but she is far from one f my favorites.. One thing they did, for SJW reasons I imagine, is make her commander of the entire left flank despite the fact she has no military experience. Meanwhile, a guy who has commanded armies (Jaime) volunteers to serve under her. That is just mind numbingly stupid. Brienne the invincible is a creation of the show, and that too is a part that is a little hard to swallow. Book Brienne was almost killed by biter. What I hope for her character is she finally gives Tormund Giantsbane what he so desperately wants.

My thoughts on some of the other female characters:

Daenerys is becoming more tyrannical, but I that is in line with her arc. Some go from bad to good (Jaime, Hound), and it looks like Dany is going the other way. I wouldn't be surprised if she is the "villain" by the last episode. Her against Jon.

Cersei, like her son, is a great villain. Lena Headey does a fine job playing her. I do think she gets defeated by Dany in season 5 or 6, leaving the rest for Dany to become power mad tyrant like her father.

The new Arya isn't as charismatic as she was in earlier seasons. Not much you can do with her now that she is an emotionless assassin.

Hannah Murray does a good job with Gillie. Some of her best scenes were when she travelled with Sam back to his homestead. When she stood up for Sam when his dad was berating him...

Ive never cared for the Sansa or Yara characters.

[–] MovieFan00 (211) 6 years ago

Brienne is an excellent fighter. Than can’t be taken away from her and what you seem to see as Brienne feeling superior, I see as false bravado. She has been mocked her entire life and she’s built walls to keep people out.

[–] R_Kane (15828) 4 years ago

^This. Name 1 other woman who could go TOE TO TOE with The Hound? Okay: Arya; but Brienne was bound by a Code of Honor, while Arya had the freedom of the Code of the Faceless Men. It killed me when Arya refused to go with Brienne. She could have learned SO MUCH from Brienne as a mentor. It was like the moment in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, when Zihy Zhang killed Fat Chow-Yun: in each case, the young warrior rejected the ONE TEACHER who could have taught her. So tragic.

Not for nothing, Brienne was the most honorable character in this story. She WAS superior.

[–] Otter (24464) 4 years ago

Well said!

[–] R_Kane (15828) 4 years ago

Thank you, my friend.

[–] Otter (24464) 4 years ago

[Blushes]

Although... maybe we could say that she did rather start using Jon as a role model even if he wasnt a proper mentor, and he was a better fit. He wasnt a knight and didnt follow thr code of chivalry, but he was compassionate and ethical like Ned, or as compassionate and ethical as a lord of Westeros could be. She'd never really get chivalry.

[–] Quasimodo (16388) 4 years ago

As an ASOIAF book reader from 1997 I had high hopes for Brienne after the first three books. I thought that GRRM had big plans for her. HAH ! How wrong I was.

I thought that Gwendolyn Christie was miscast as Brienne. Physically she was big enough but she didn't sufficiently capture Brienne's essential vulnerability. Christie's Brienne was mostly defiance and hard edges which made her unsympathetic where books Brienne was among the most sympathetic characters.