MovieChat Forums > Mad Men (2007) Discussion > Mad Men: Down on Marriage

Mad Men: Down on Marriage


(MAJOR SPOILERS)

I expect you could say that if Mad Men had one theme that emerged over the years -- though it turned out to have a big caveat -- it was this.

Marriage is a crock.

Consider: the lead is Don Draper(aka Dick Whitman) a handsome man married to a beautiful, regal blonde wife, with kids. But he cheats on her all the time; she is miserable as a housewife(she had been a model), and they eventually break up.

Don marries again, to a younger woman who eventually makes him feel old -- and he starts cheating on HER. They eventually break up.

Roger Sterling cheats on his wife with ad women and hookers. When he has a heart attack during adulterous sex, he swears new loyalty to his wife -- but soon starts cheating again. And dumps his supportive wife for a young "new model."

Caught in Roger's crossfire is Joan, the va-va-voom redhead who was Roger's main squeeze and likely hoped to be Mrs. Roger. But after Roger's heart attack and sworn loyalty to his wife,, Joan shifts her attentions to a young yet vapid surgeon in training, and marries HIM. Then Roger marries the young secretary that Joan had been ordering around, and the tables turn. Then the young doctor proves to be not only a stick, but a "pre-marital rapist"(he forces himself on Joan BEFORE their marriage, in anger over Roger, and she STILL marries the cad.) Then his future as a surgeon evapoarates. Then he ups for Viet Nam. Joan's marriage is loveless and long-distance, to a lunk(She finds out that "marrying a doctor" proves wrong in every outcome) .

Meanwhile, Roger eventually dumps his second wife, but doesn't re-unite with Joan or his first wife(though he makes a kid with Joan during a post-mugging sex clinch.)
And then there's Pete Campbell, seeking one last tryst (with Peggy) pretty much the night before his wedding to another woman of "better breeding." And having his own affairs along the way. (His wife makes a decision along the way to grant Pete an apartment in the city --knowning that means she's given him a license to cheat.) THAT marriage breaks up.

Don Draper's young daughter, Sally, accidentally witnesses two adulterous hook-ups(actually seeing the sex take place): Roger Sterling with Don's French Canadian mother-in-law, and her own father with another man's wife, cheating on Sally's STEPMOTHER (Megan). So Sally won't have a very great take on men and marriage when her time comes.

No, Mad Men didn't seem to see marriage as much of a workable institution.

But there were these caveats:

Its the fifties/sixties, and the men have the jobs and the money and the power and hence believe they can cheat with impunity. Many women accept those terms -- both the wives and the mistresses. But that changes as the sixties roll out.

These ad men(and some of the ad women) are RICH. Either through family roots, the high pay of the ad world, or both. Money makes cheating at a high level possible; working stiffs struggling to pay bills aren't so able to stray.

The men and women of Mad Men are, largely, handsome and beautiful, respectively. The show makes the point that gorgeous people come to take multiple sex partners (even during marriage) as almost a privilege.

And some caveats within the show:

The marriage of Betty Draper to Henry Francis is solid, start to finish, even though it began with Henry making the moves on a married, PREGNANT woman and Betty welcoming the cheating. But Don was a cad, Henry is solid(if boring) and the Betty-Henry marriage is a happy one. Right up to Betty looking to die young of cancer from smoking.

Comes the final episode of the series, Pete and his wife have reconciled and flown off to the Midwest to make a new life. Peggy has finally found a husband of equality in artistry and caring. . Roger looks to settle down with Don's ex-mother-in-law. It is suggested that MAYBE these three couples will make marriage work. It is suggested that everybody just keeps getting married, "hope over experience," not wishing to live alone.

But on balance, marriages ain't got no chance on Mad Men.

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One is a multimillionaire playboy and the other grew up in a brothel... So, it's not like we should generalise the men of that era based on these two guys... πŸ˜‰

But yeah, Mad Men shows the dark side of screwing around, as much as it does failed marraiges... It's a portraite of loneliness and the yearning for real connection in the modern post-industrial world...

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One is a multimillionaire playboy and the other grew up in a brothel... So, it's not like we should generalise the men of that era based on these two guys... πŸ˜‰

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That's true. The show can't be about "ordinary people." Especially not with Draper's brothel upbringing. I guess you could say he's like Tony Soprano without the murders: Don is trying to "fake" a family life when his upbringing was nothing less than sordid and oversexed.

And Roger, well -- Da Big Bucks. Though they did run that "fake out" with him swearing loyalty to his wife after that heart attack(BOTH heart attacks.) But he couldn't redeem himself.

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But yeah, Mad Men shows the dark side of screwing around, as much as it does failed marraiges... It's a portraite of loneliness and the yearning for real connection in the modern post-industrial world...

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Its a theme running through the whole thing. Consider Don in the pilot episode. He's in conflict with the attractive and dynamic Jewish department store heiress...but clearly attracted to her. And he's already got a Bohemian girlfriend. And then,at the very end of the episode, we find he has a beautiful blonde wife and children. Don's probably attracted to all three women simultaneously...and he's just not going to commit to any one of them(which his why all three of those women ultimately end up with other men.)

There IS a dark side to screwing around. At least if you're married. Consider Don all thrown out and living in a dingy apartment after Betty throws him out. Ditto Pete Campbell some years later.

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Yup. You are correct ecarle. It's difficult to find ANY positive representations of marriage in TV or movies nowadays. Perhaps I'm just not watching the right shows, but I can't think of any happily married couples portrayed.

I adore Mad Men, so this is not a criticism of the show, but all of the characters are spoiled brats and terrible people. It's great to watch, great for interesting situations, and highly dramatic. These characters have zero self control. They give into their base desires. I know most people don't go around like an untrained dog humping everyone, even if they are gorgeous people. These characters have no conscience. Because they have no conscience and never learn from their mistakes, it's a self-sabotaging cycle. The entire series is cyclical in this regard.

Advertising is about manipulation, desire, warped perception, and group-think. It's studied as a science. You should read the trade magazines for advertising, it's all psychological warfare. Not only is Mad Men part of the social engineering, it is simultaneously making commentary on it. Sometimes getting what you want (or what you think you want) doesn't make you happy at all.

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Yup. You are correct ecarle. It's difficult to find ANY positive representations of marriage in TV or movies nowadays. Perhaps I'm just not watching the right shows, but I can't think of any happily married couples portrayed.

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Uh..Roseanne, maybe? But that's from the 80's come back and...they're neither beautiful nor rich, as with the Mad Men crew.

I don't watch much TV, but I really hated "Everybody Loves Raymond" because he was such a wimpy whiner and she was such a shrew. It was like the worst parts of marriage, distilled.

Part of the issue with all these "marriage doesn't work" shows is that the COME from rich and beautiful people in Hollywood who have their own problems with faithfulness and commitment, yes?

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I adore Mad Men, so this is not a criticism of the show, but all of the characters are spoiled brats and terrible people.

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I always used to say "its a show about a bunch of jerks." I watched every episode, so it must have had its lure. I think the long trek through the sixties was one hook("Wait til they see what's gonna happen on November 22 1963!), and the business world machinations of the ad game were another(Starting with Sterling Cooper, the ad agency lived, died and was resurrected in new forms many times.) The sexual shenanigans were fun "in the happening" but invariably seemed to pay off wrong, in a very depressing way.

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It's great to watch, great for interesting situations, and highly dramatic. These characters have zero self control. They give into their base desires. I know most people don't go around like an untrained dog humping everyone, even if they are gorgeous people. These characters have no conscience. Because they have no conscience and never learn from their mistakes, it's a self-sabotaging cycle. The entire series is cyclical in this regard.

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Zero self control. That's about it. With Don, in Season One he has set up "the perfect American family" but it is a strait-jacket to him(remember when he got drunk and ditched out on Sally's birthday party.) He's faking what he's been told he has to be. And then he loses it and -- he misses it.

And within a year or so, he's married again. A much younger woman. More exotic. Kids aren't on the menu this time and -- he blows that one, too.

Roger Sterling got away with it all, I think, because he's all that money, he's got all those great one-liners, a marvelous sense of humor...and he maintains loyalty to his first ex-wife all through the series. Some men are like that...they need multiple women but always treasure that first one, that reminder of a more innocent, young time.

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Advertising is about manipulation, desire, warped perception, and group-think. It's studied as a science. You should read the trade magazines for advertising, it's all psychological warfare. Not only is Mad Men part of the social engineering, it is simultaneously making commentary on it. Sometimes getting what you want (or what you think you want) doesn't make you happy at all.

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Yes, the show took up a very difficult and adult subject when it took up advertising and how THAT stimulates "false realities."

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It was very sophisticated. I recall a quick shot of Don walking past Peggy and she notes that the set-up for the hairspray ad won't play anymore after the JFK assassination -- the characters were positioned in a car like JFK's death car.

Don walks by Peggy, she makes her comment, he nods and keeps walking -- and then he stops for a moment, thinks, looks back at her and moves on, "delayed-reaction impressed" by Peggy's acumen.

It was a small moment. There were tons of them like that on "Mad Men."

It helped us put up with all the soap opera stuff.

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Thanks for your in depth replies ecarle! You're making me want to re-watch the entire series on Netflix.
By the way, unhappy people buy more stuff. Edward L. Bernays wrote about this in the 1920's. He was Sigmund Freuds nephew, and is known as the father of public relations and modern advertising. His ideas are throughout Mad Men, and you will see similarities to many of his advertisements in the show.
Bernays used his uncle Sigmund Freud's ideas in a campaign to market cigarettes to women by calling them "torches of freedom" in 1929 (it was not lady like to smoke in public at the time). Also, he did an ad campaign for Beech Nut to increase bacon sales by asking doctors "is a hearty breakfast healthy?" and the doctors say "yes" and then asking them "is bacon part of a hearty breakfast?" and the doctors reply "yes" which then somehow becomes "Bacon is recommended by doctors" LOL! These are just small examples, his entire life's work was extremely influential for ads and policy today.

Here is a quote from Bernays book 'Propaganda'
β€œThe conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ...We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of. This is a logical result of the way in which our democratic society is organized. Vast numbers of human beings must cooperate in this manner if they are to live together as a smoothly functioning society. ...In almost every act of our daily lives, whether in the sphere of politics or business, in our social conduct or our ethical thinking, we are dominated by the relatively small number of persons...who understand the mental processes and social patterns of the masses. It is they who pull the wires which control the public mind.”

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By the way, unhappy people buy more stuff.

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Hmm...I pause to give thought...

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The Freudian angle reminds me of the pilot in which Don angrily tosses the German psychiatrist's report on smokers having a "death wish" into the trash can...and the woman(the WOMAN) out of his office. But then Pete "lifts" the report and uses it later.

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I found the quote from "Propaganda" interesting, start to finish, and I will add this layman's observation:

What is the soft drink that everybody thinks of first? Coke, yes?

What is the beer that everybody thinks of first? Bud, yes?

Coke has Pepsi coming at it, and Bud is under siege from all manner of beers, domestic and import -- but the sheer massive size of the budgets these companies can throw at Super Bowls, weekly games of all sorts, broadcast TV hits, cable movies with commercials, etc -- it seems to me "the money made them." Bud and Coke uber alles. Folks are conditioned to say those words FIRST when asked what they want.

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ecarle wrote: The Freudian angle reminds me of the pilot in which Don angrily tosses the German psychiatrist's report on smokers having a "death wish" into the trash can...and the woman(the WOMAN) out of his office. But then Pete "lifts" the report and uses it later.
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Yes, exactly! Great catch. I love when the psychiatrist (she is Austrian from Vienna) said "Good luck at the meeting. Sure it vill be a qvick vone."
Also Betty is seeing a headshrinker too. They all have mother issues! Very Freudian indeed.

Quote from Don in that first episode when he's pitching to Lee Garner Jr. "Advertising is based on one thing: happiness. And do you know what happiness is? Happiness is the smell of a new car. It's freedom from fear. It's a billboard on the side of a road that screams with reassurance that whatever you're doing is OK."
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ecarle wrote: What is the soft drink that everybody thinks of first? Coke, yes?
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The 2009 slogan for Coca Cola was "Open Happiness"

ecarle wrote: What is the beer that everybody thinks of first? Bud, yes?
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Yes, but my husband was a bit saddened when it was sold to a Belgian company a few years back.
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ecarle wrote: Coke has Pepsi coming at it, and Bud is under siege from all manner of beers, domestic and import -- but the sheer massive size of the budgets these companies can throw at Super Bowls, weekly games of all sorts, broadcast TV hits, cable movies with commercials, etc -- it seems to me "the money made them." Bud and Coke uber alles. Folks are conditioned to say those words FIRST when asked what they want.
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Conditioned. Yes, that's the word! Exactly.

I was thinking more about your original point: all the marriages are doomed. It's one of the only elements of the show that's not realistic. That generation didn't have high divorce rates. All that started with the boomers (my parents are divorced boomers). The older generation stuck with their spouses, hell or high-water. Married at 19 till death.




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Do these "conditioned" consumers have more loyalty to their brands than loyalty to their spouses?

On the subject of Freud, his theories are very much about how our parents messed us up mentally (to oversimplify). The one thing that helps make a person less messed up would be a good family life. Why has divorce been on the rise? It's very rare to find a happily married couple nowadays, on TV or in real life.
In the earlier seasons of the show, I thought Don and Betty could have been together until the end, till death. Betty reminds me of my mother-in-law. She was beautiful, classy, and extremely tolerant of her husband. For Betty, the cheating wasn't the only reason to end their marriage. It was the secret drawer and secret past and the secret first wife. The betrayals were too many. Like you, I also thought Roger would forever be with his first wife, but no. If it was "real life", I think the Sterlings would have never split.

A personal note: I am happily married to my husband. We have a family, and we are traditional. It will be 17 years together this month. My husband and I built a life together. I have no idea why our society decided marriage doesn't work, I just can't relate. It's the typical consumer mindset of "out with the old, in with the new" and throw away the most meaningful elements of their lives. Love and devotion is something you can't buy. The strongest societies in history had powerful family units.

Bernays understood that people who were focused on themselves were usually unhappy (and unhappy folks are better consumers, as written above).

I love the quote from Stella in Rear Window "When a man and a woman see each other and like each other they ought to come together - wham! Like a couple of taxis on Broadway, not sit around analyzing each other like two specimens in a bottle." and "When I married Miles, we were both a couple of maladjusted misfits. We are still maladjusted misfits, and we have loved every minute of it."

Yup, that's true!

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Do these "conditioned" consumers have more loyalty to their brands than loyalty to their spouses?

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Ha...it is possible. Spouses can't advertise daily about how great they are.

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On the subject of Freud, his theories are very much about how our parents messed us up mentally (to oversimplify). The one thing that helps make a person less messed up would be a good family life. Why has divorce been on the rise? It's very rare to find a happily married couple nowadays, on TV or in real life.

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Oh, this topic is perhaps "above my pay grade," but I think once divorce was no longer stigmatized; and once both men and women could earn without needing the other -- divorce became less painful and marriage became more flexible.

A phrase I've read that fits this is :"serial polygamy." A man or a woman being loyal to a spouse for ten years or so, divorcing, getting the next spouse, divorcing...a series of true-blue marriages of ten year spurts.

And as wealthy TV mogul Lorne Michaels (SNL) says: "I think your third wife will offer you your most successful marriage." He had three when he said that. I wonder if he's still married?


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In the earlier seasons of the show, I thought Don and Betty could have been together until the end, till death.

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As I've noted elsewhere, one of the shocks of the 3rd season finale -- "Shut the Door, Take a Seat" was that the marriage actually DID end. One felt -- along with Don at least(Betty had Henry on deck) -- that REAL sense of : "How do I start over now? Where do I go, what do I do?" Even bad marriages(especially with kids) offer the solace of "a home with people in it, waiting for you." Don Draper is shown moodily stuck in a bachelor apartment in Season Four, hiring hookers for immediate solace...but without a home. He rather quickly makes a new one, and we know how THAT turned out,

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Like you, I also thought Roger would forever be with his first wife, but no. If it was "real life", I think the Sterlings would have never split.

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Well, the show did show that loyalty that a wealthy man in particular can show to the first wife and mother of his child...Roger always seemed to enjoy talking with his ex because she was a link to his youth, and the better times he had then.

Irony: in real life, the actor playing Roger WAS(and is?) married to the actress playing his first ex-wife.

I'm reminded of Cary Grant playing a Madison Avenue ad man way back IN the time of Mad Men -- 1959. North by Northwest. Grant's famous line:

"Now you listen to me. I've got a job, a secretary, a mother, two ex-wives, and several bartenders depending on me...."

Two ex-wives. In 1959! Well, he was Cary Grant...

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A personal note: I am happily married to my husband. We have a family, and we are traditional. It will be 17 years together this month.

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Rockin' good news! I don't know you, but I am happy for you.

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My husband and I built a life together. I have no idea why our society decided marriage doesn't work, I just can't relate. It's the typical consumer mindset of "out with the old, in with the new" and throw away the most meaningful elements of their lives. Love and devotion is something you can't buy. The strongest societies in history had powerful family units.

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It is troubling. I am old enough now to have friends going back several decades, to high school. I have taken note that our marriage rates of success are about 50/50. Half of us have marriages going back 30 or more years, one spouse only. Half of us have a divorce(or two) on our resumes. And that half dates(or marries) other divorcees, which compounds the parents for kids, etc.

I guess I'll linger here on the rock solid marriages, the long term ones. I've seen enough of them to know that they ARE possible in this day and age.

As for me...well, I've got several bartenders dependent on me....but I'm no stranger to long-term relationships of SOME quality.

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Bernays understood that people who were focused on themselves were usually unhappy (and unhappy folks are better consumers, as written above).

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Interesting. Since we've got some Hitchcock quotes going here, I'll offer this exchange from Psycho(the early part before the horror comes):

Millionaire Cassidy: You know what I do with unhappiness? I buy it off. Are you unhappy?
Janet Leigh: Not inordinately.

Not inordinately.

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I love the quote from Stella in Rear Window "When a man and a woman see each other and like each other they ought to come together - wham! Like a couple of taxis on Broadway, not sit around analyzing each other like two specimens in a bottle." and "When I married Miles, we were both a couple of maladjusted misfits. We are still maladjusted misfits, and we have loved every minute of it."

Yup, that's true!

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And worthy of envy. She's shaming James Stewart for his admittedly crazy-looking rejection of gorgeous Grace Kelly as a potential wife(Grace wants him BAD.) But Jimmy's got a point. His character is a globe-trotting Man's Man of an action photographer, he thinks Grace is too ladylike for him AND too good for him. Happy marriages seem to have a certain "simpatico of ambition and lifestyle."

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ecarle wrote: The Freudian angle reminds me of the pilot in which Don angrily tosses the German psychiatrist's report on smokers having a "death wish" into the trash can...and the woman(the WOMAN) out of his office. But then Pete "lifts" the report and uses it later.
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Yes, exactly! Great catch. I love when the psychiatrist (she is Austrian from Vienna) said "Good luck at the meeting. Sure it vill be a qvick vone."

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This scene between Don and the German psychiatrist helped set the "pilot tone" of Mad Men -- and the pilot wasn't filmed for years while Matt Weiner tried to sell the show(in the meantime, the pilot SCRIPT got him a writer-producer job on The Sopranos.)

Its 1960. Don definitely has trouble connecting with "powerful, careerist, officious women." He visibly detests this middle-aged German woman; he won't be much better with the pretty Jewish department store queen.

Its 1960. WWII wasn't all THAT long ago, and even though Don/Dick served in Korea, here is a woman who reminds one of Hitler's folks.

Its 1960. Freud is rather peaking as the patron saint of so many things: movies, books...advertising?

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Also Betty is seeing a headshrinker too. They all have mother issues! Very Freudian indeed.

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But...its 1960. The headshrinker REPORTS on Betty to...DON.

But Betty finds out(reading the phone bill) and Betty turns the tables in a session with the shrink by ..reporting on her suspicions of Don's infidelities("I can smell it on him.") The shrink can't report THAT.

I note that Matt Weiner worked on The Sopranos prior to Mad Men and therapy was a big deal on THAT show.

I suppose it is like the high infidelity and divorce rate on these shows. HOLLYWOOD people have money and power and bad marriages and infidelity; their shows will reflect their lives. They go into therapy a lot, too.



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I was thinking more about your original point: all the marriages are doomed. It's one of the only elements of the show that's not realistic. That generation didn't have high divorce rates. All that started with the boomers (my parents are divorced boomers). The older generation stuck with their spouses, hell or high-water. Married at 19 till death.

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And I again note that the many crash-and-burn marriages of Mad Men perhaps reflect that segment of American society: rich, privileged, highly driven and ambitious(Don didn't START rich), good looking. Hard to maintain a 40 year marriage under those circumstances(unless the marriage is a fake one, with lovers on the side for both partners.)

You also have the tricky bit of business that was sung of in the sexist song "Wives and Lovers" of the time: men leaving their housewives at home to go where there are "girls at the office, and men will always be men." Evidently more of a risk back then, but obviously an issue today.

On the other hand, even in these "me too" times, I must point out that the office is exactly where men and women can meet without the false pressures of a bar or a blind date. They work together, they get to know one another, next thing you know: relationships bloom. I am speaking of singles, and I am speaking from experience. If a woman is INTERESTED in a man who approaches her at work, it will be consensual, mutually flirtatious and it will lead somewhere. If a woman is NOT interested in a man who approaches her at work -- he'd better stop mighty fast.

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My folks were married around 1954. Dad was 11 years older than Mom, and he was divorced from a previous marraige.
Have little idea of the dynamics of the first marriage, but obviously they had problems, and no kids.
Neither high nor low income, I have no idea what their deal was.

Does anyone remember the Bickersons? That was an old radio show of a married couple who fought constantly. It was played for laughs, but the vitriol poured out of the radio, and I'm sure there were plenty of people, especially women, who might have found it nearly terrifying how close to blows these two married people would come to.

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One thing that nobody had addressed on this thread... It was the SIXTIES!

During the years show on the series, the sexual revolution happened, feminism became mainstream, the hippies came in and broke all the rules regarding sex and marriage, etc. Suddenly staying married yo the same person one's whole life was no longer obligatory, it was even unfashionable.

And of course all these changing attitudes would have been seen with the people shown in "Mad Men", who were very fashionable indeed. These are people who were rich enough to indulge themselves and image-conscious enough to put every possible effort into staying up to date and with it.
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One thing that nobody had addressed on this thread... It was the SIXTIES!

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Point taken. Yes indeed. Different era.

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During the years show on the series, the sexual revolution happened, feminism became mainstream, the hippies came in and broke all the rules regarding sex and marriage, etc. Suddenly staying married yo the same person one's whole life was no longer obligatory, it was even unfashionable.

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But I suppose that was part of Weiner's message , too. The rich and beautiful (and often driven) people of Mad Men were already IN the sexual revolution. The men were cheating all over the place, but Betty Draper had her own affairs, as did Peggy..and Joan before settling down with the doc(well, she didn't cheat for a long time, and then with Roger again.)

These folks were already doing the advance work so all sorts of "regular" not so great looking not so rich people could start breaking up and recoupling.

I witnessed THAT myself. A lot of men breaking up their marriages. But women, too.

That said, a marriage can be a good thing. Gives you a team to fight the hell that the modern world is(pressure, bills, depression.) Issues forth children "to stay in the marriage for."

And some marriages still do great. I know a number of couples married for many years where when one of them dies...agony for the other.

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And of course all these changing attitudes would have been seen with the people shown in "Mad Men", who were very fashionable indeed. These are people who were rich enough to indulge themselves and image-conscious enough to put every possible effort into serving up to date and with it.

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That's the key to Mad Men, I think. Rich, indulgent, image-conscious. They never should have GOTTEN married, most of them.

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You're right, these people got an early start of the Sexual Revolution!

As for marriage, well, it works for some people, I know some great life partnerships. But I always suspected that many of the marriages from The Good Old Days that lasted from the day after high school graduation until death go us part weren't that great. People stayed because they couldn't get away or had no place to go, and spent many many years looking forward to "the comfortsble estate of widowhood.

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As for marriage, well, it works for some people, I know some great life partnerships. But I always suspected that many of the marriages from The Good Old Days that lasted from the day after high school graduation until death go us part weren't that great. People stayed because they couldn't get away or had no place to go, and spent many many years looking forward to "the comfortsble estate of widowhood

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I agree with that, across the board. Indeed, long-term marriages were , at one time, practically quiet polite prisons til "death do us part." If early enough, the widow or widower remaining could continue on with the rest of their life on their own terms.

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