Subtle Dutch anti-Semitism - Zwartboek (2007) Discussion

[–] slash83_mus 17 years ago

First, it's Verhoeven, not Verhoven.

Second, it's 'verdomde Jood!', not 'fradomte Jood'.

The Dutch traditionally tolerant of Jews? No more or less than Germans, French or other west-european countries. The end of WW1 and Hitler's nation-wide hypnosis changed all that, within a few years many Jews were social (and later, in Germany, by law) outcasts in many countries, including the US, Britain and Holland. Hitler triggered anti-semitism in a develish smart way, but I think you know that.

Barbaric, murderous, insane Nazi's? How old are you? No grown up I know would ever say something as narrow-minded as this.

Vile, psychotic Germans? Talking about a *beep* prejudice! Get back to school, grow up and then talk to me about prejudice.

Fool.

“I feel so miserable without you; it's almost like having you here.”

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[–] silentmovie 17 years ago

<<<...Barbaric, murderous, insane Nazi's? How old are you? No grown up I know would ever say something as narrow-minded as this....>>>>

Please, educate me. Explain to me how Nazi's were NOT barbarous, murderous, and insane.

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[–] mikejena 17 years ago

Subtle? Weren't those Dutch soldiers beating them, throwing *beep* on her & making the Jews listen to christian music at the end, telling them it was their one shot at redemption? The American officer comes in & tells them they're worse than the Nazis. hardly subtle.

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[–] europudding 17 years ago

the people in prison at the end were there for being traitors and caught because they used to colloborate with the nazis...not Jews! Ellis/Rachel was there by mistake because they thought she was a spy for the nazis, not because she was Jewish.

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[–] Cripplehawk 17 years ago

THat was a Canadian officer that came up. And they were not Jews they were Dutch accused of Collaberations with the Nazis (She was accused as well)

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[–] monimm18 17 years ago

"<<<...Barbaric, murderous, insane Nazi's? How old are you? No grown up I know would ever say something as narrow-minded as this....>>>>

Please, educate me. Explain to me how Nazi's were NOT barbarous, murderous, and insane."

Don't fool yourself. Any human being, if placed in certain circumstances would commit the horrors the Nazis committed (have you ever heard of Stanley Milgram? If not, I would suggest reading about his experiments and what they proved about human nature - there's a whole big chapter in Psychology about all that). Look at the Punic Wars, the Spanish Inquisition, the crusades, Hiroshima & Nagasaki, Cambodia... The Nazi military was one of the most organized and efficient ones that ever existed - that takes disciplined, evolved individuals, not barbaric and insane ones. The sad thing is, most of the Nazi soldiers were just regular people who went to serve their country and found themeslves part of the evil the leaders have sunken into; many got sucked into it out of ignorance, indoctrination, mob mentality, or given into it out of fear, or mere obedience. The worst thing we can do is the mistake of thinking the Nazis did what they did because they were different from us. That allows evil to happen again.

I would also suggest reading a bit more about World War One, the Treaty of Versailles and all the circumstances that led to the rise of the Nazi regime and twisted the mindset of a nation of rational people. It makes for a really good cautionary tale.

Now, The "vile, psychotic Germans" phrase is really infantile and ignorant.

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars."
Oscar Wilde

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[–] silentmovie 17 years ago

Let me re-phrase:

"...vile, psychotic Nazis, who happened to be Germans...."

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[–] Dutch90 17 years ago

The worst thing we can do is the mistake of thinking the Nazis did what they did because they were different from us. That allows evil to happen again.

Monimm18, that has got to be one of the best posts ever, especially the bit that I quoted.

Let me re-phrase:

"...vile, psychotic Nazis, who happened to be Germans...."

Do you at all understand what Monimm18 said?

www.alienexperience.com- great Alien/Predator forum!

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[–] monimm18 17 years ago

Thank you

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars."
Oscar Wilde

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[–] melkdw 17 years ago

There were many, including at least a couple in this movie who tried to be fair and humane at their own peril, as best they could under the circumstances.

This movie also very well illustrates what even some good people had to do to survive their circumstances.

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[–] gmsmith-4 16 years ago

I know this dates back a year and a half, but I also want to second that this is one of the best posts I've read on IMDB. It's too bad there is no recommendation system for posted replies.

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[–] stopfief 17 years ago

Dutch90 said:

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The worst thing we can do is the mistake of thinking the Nazis did what they did because they were different from us. That allows evil to happen again.

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Monimm18, that has got to be one of the best posts ever, especially the bit that I quoted.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Let me re-phrase:

"...vile, psychotic Nazis, who happened to be Germans...."
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Do you at all understand what Monimm18 said?

I couldn't let this pass. The OP's comment about Germans was racist, but his comment about Nazis was absolutely fine.

Both Dutch90 and Monimm18 seem not to have grasped the distinction between a German and a Nazi: you don't choose to be a German, but you most definitely did and do choose to be a Nazi.

Nazis, to a man, were foul and disgusting, and their descendants in the form of the BNP, FNF, etc are just as disgusting. The Stanley Milgram experiments are irrelevant to this.

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[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] stopfief 16 years ago

Actually, if you were not a member of the Nazi Party then you would not get a good job, education, etc. People were forced into joining the Party by simply making a person's life horrible otherwise. This did not mean that people who joined the Nazi Party simply out of economic necessity automatically became anti-Semites.

I've never heard of mass coercion into the Nazi Party. Membership of the Nazi Party never went beyond 10% of the German population, as far as I'm aware.

I'm not denying it may have happened from time to time, and I certainly wouldn't include people like the present Pope as former Nazis (because he was too young to be considered politically developed), but actually forcing people into political parties doesn't really make much sense anyway.

It's also true that not joining political parties can hamper people's prospects (like the Communist Party today in China, or formerly in the UK for the Tory Party) but that doesn't explain, justify or excuse anyone joining a party like the Nazi Party, or, for another example, joining a formerly pro-apartheid party in South Africa.

Political parties are not theoretically-neutral organisations like armies or the police, where the "I was following orders" defence might have some weight.

People always have a choice, even in Nazi and Communist countries.

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[–] monimm18 16 years ago

"Political parties are not theoretically-neutral organisations like armies or the police, where the "I was following orders" defence might have some weight.

People always have a choice, even in Nazi and Communist countries."

Ummm.... no.

What you say is only correct when the country's government has more than one party. Otherwise the term "party" is meaningless, a sham, because at that point we're dealing with a totalitarian regime a.k.a. a "dictatorship". I doubt you've lived long enough in a country ruled by one of those to realize the psychological implications and consequences of such a powerful oppressive apparatus on the population and the individual. "Choice" is something that allows someone to assume sole responsibility, to be the only one having to support the consequences; but when someone's choice results in others dear to him/her being subjected to pain and suffering, it's not really a choice anymore - at that point all one can do is try to figure out which is the lesser evil: hurt those they love or hurt strangers they would never know. Which "choice" would you pick? Would you have your children blacklisted and never allowed to study more than high school, condemmn them to a life of minimum wage and squalid housing conditions because their file, which will be checked every time they try to enroll in a University or apply for a job, will say "unhealthy origin" - the term applied to all those born from parents who didn't submit or cooperate when asked by the regime? Or would you join, talk, bend, hoping that your acts won't be too hurtful to whoever might suffer from what you did.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not advocating for collaboration. But it'll be quite ignorant, intolerant and judgemental to assume I know what such people went through, and that I would do better than billions in whose shoes I never walked...

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars."
Oscar Wilde

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[–] stopfief 16 years ago

"Choice" is something that allows someone to assume sole responsibility, to be the only one having to support the consequences; but when someone's choice results in others dear to him/her being subjected to pain and suffering, it's not really a choice anymore - at that point all one can do is try to figure out which is the lesser evil: hurt those they love or hurt strangers they would never know. Which "choice" would you pick? Would you have your children blacklisted and never allowed to study more than high school, condemmn them to a life of minimum wage and squalid housing conditions because their file, which will be checked every time they try to enroll in a University or apply for a job, will say "unhealthy origin" - the term applied to all those born from parents who didn't submit or cooperate when asked by the regime? Or would you join, talk, bend, hoping that your acts won't be too hurtful to whoever might suffer from what you did.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not advocating for collaboration. But it'll be quite ignorant, intolerant and judgemental to assume I know what such people went through, and that I would do better than billions in whose shoes I never walked...

If you can provide evidence that people people were actually physically, financially or socially coerced into joining, for example, the German Nazis, then I would agree with you, up to a point.

But as I have already pointed out, the Nazis never had the membership of more than 10% of the country at any given time. It would appear that whatever suffering non-membership caused people, 90% of the country was able to withstand it.

It's a good thing that people nowadays try to understand what Jews, Gypsies, Slavs etc suffered under the German regime in WWII, and also in other times and places. Hopefully it helps people to think twice about whatever prejudices they themselves might hold today. However, having sympathy for politically-motivated, career-minded, or even just weak-willed people under a foul regime like Hitler's Germany is taking things too far.

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[–] monimm18 16 years ago

"But as I have already pointed out, the Nazis never had the membership of more than 10% of the country at any given time. It would appear that whatever suffering non-membership caused people, 90% of the country was able to withstand it."

Neither the nazi party, nor the communist one offered membership to just anyone. The party was supposed to be a political elite that ruled over the majority with additional, well selected members who were there only to make things look good and democratic. The non-member majority were made to believe that with loyalty and hard work to support the regime they too could one day belong to the party and have a better life. Those who didn't comply were either repremanded or eliminated.

"If you can provide evidence that people people were actually physically, financially or socially coerced into joining, for example, the German Nazis, then I would agree with you, up to a point."

My father was a doctor in a communist country. Intellectuals were tolerated only if they were part of the "in" crowd, so they could be better controlled by the regime. He was offered membership in the communist party and he refused. Bear in mind that in a communist regime jobs, commerce and housing were controlled by the government.
First, they removed my dad from the hospital where he worked and sent him to work in a dispensary attached to a factory, in a position that was supposed to be filled by a nurse. After they got married, my parents tried to move together into a two bedroom apartment - they were denied the application. My dad was offered the membership into the communist party again - he refused again. My parents were assigned a room in a multy-family home where they shared the kitchen and the bathroom with four other families that were not exactly the cleanest people. When I was born, I slept in my parents' bed or in the stroller - there was no room for a baby bed. They washed me every day in a basin propped on two chairs, carrying water from the bathroom in buckets and boiling it to make sure it's safe. This happened many years ago, when disposable diapers and bottles, or formula didn't exist. The laundry washer was used by everyone in the house. Clothes were dried by hanging them on wires. My mom spent her days boiling my clothes after washing them and ironing them after they were dried, to make sure I don't get sick (no such thing as dryers). One day someone stole the basin they used to wash me. The bathroom was filthy, as usual. The kitchen sink was full of someone's dirty dishes again. They washed me in a cooking pot. My mom cried herself to sleep almost every day. She and my father spent their days fighting, crying and feeling trapped and helpless. The day I came down with a severe respiratory infection (I was eight months old) he went to the Party Headquarters and applied for membership.

I really doubt that life under the nazi regime was easier, or more forgiving that the one under communism...

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars."
Oscar Wilde

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[–] stopfief 16 years ago

Neither the nazi party, nor the communist one offered membership to just anyone. The party was supposed to be a political elite that ruled over the majority with additional, well selected members who were there only to make things look good and democratic. The non-member majority were made to believe that with loyalty and hard work to support the regime they too could one day belong to the party and have a better life. Those who didn't comply were either repremanded or eliminated.

This description can't be applied to the German Nazi Party. The "general membership" section on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Party , indicates that the Nazis drew their membership from all classes, including peasants. No surprise that the bulk of their membership (51%) eventually derived from the middle classes.

As to your story, it is very long and sad, not to say long - not least since you have been forced to lived in conditions that my parents and grandparents sometimes lived in, in the UK - and I am curious to know which country you come from. And when.

As I said before in this thread, I am not denying that party membership coercion happened from time to time - like encouraging a hungry population to turn up for a political rally in exchange for a bag of rice, or something - but I am saying that most people, in most political parties, whether in one-party regimes or plural democracies, ultimately get to make a choice, even if that choice means having to make some kind of sacrifice.

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[–] monimm18 16 years ago

MWA-HA-HA_HA!!!

You get your information from... Wikipedia?

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars."
Oscar Wilde

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[–] stopfief 16 years ago

Er, no, I don't, but it was a quick and easy way to supply you with some fairly reliable information. Unless you seriously think Wikipedia is wrong on the composition of Nazi membership, then I'm willing to read an alternative source you might have; I can wait for it for an indefinite period too, because I am notified by e-mail if you respond to this thread. I suppose I can find and provide an alternative source myself, if you're serious about this.

But I'm not convinced that you are: I'm still interested to know which country you/your parents come from, and when. I only ask because I don't understand why you were determined to attack what I said.

This is a political subject, so it could be any number of reasons: maybe you're not interested in politics, and you hate the fact that politics seriously interfered in your life; or maybe you are politically committed, and have an agenda of your own, and I can't trust what you say.

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[–] Menecairiel 16 years ago

I think that the film "Good" with Viggo Mortensen and Jason Isaacs might be good to watch to see what could make moral, normal people turn into Nazis. The time is right for such examinations.

As for Dutch anti-Semitism, I have to disagree. Zwartboek isn't about it. If anything, it is about the Dutch people who worked with the Nazis and how the women who fell for Germans were treated by their own people after the war. Things that couldn't be addressed in Soldaat van Oranje in such depth. It is just one of those things.

Holland was very tolerant of Jews. I know tolerant is an awful word to use, since everyone should be respected regardless of gender, race, sexuality and religion, but back then it was different. Another country was Norway, that had one of the greatest writers of the country in the late 19th Century being a defender of the Jews.

Ellis/Rachel isn't treated how she is because she is Jewish, but because she slept with a German occupier...as simple as that.

"Well, me whole family's musical, Jeffo... even the sewing machine's a Singer." John Constantine

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[–] stopfief 16 years ago

Phew! I thought you were that crazy person I was exchanging posts with.

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[–] Menecairiel 16 years ago

Nope, just a half-Dutch girl who enjoyed Zwartboek and doesn't think there is that much anti-Semitism in it, apart from when they're all gathered around the table and say that good Dutch lives are worth more than the Jews that died...

"Well, me whole family's musical, Jeffo... even the sewing machine's a Singer." John Constantine

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[–] stopfief 16 years ago

...I just realised you meant to respond to me (I think) - I thought you had the common imdb syndrome of thinking that the "reply" button means for the whole thread, and not for the individual poster, as it actually does. When I first saw it, I just quickly scanned your first post and didn't realise that your first paragraph was meant for me.

I might actually watch "Good" - I haven't seen it before - simply because the subject of good people doing bad things interests me, but the fact that the vast majority of Germans never took the step of joining the Nazis, along with things other groups of people did during the war still makes me think that people have choices, as unpalatable as they can be.

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] fullmetaljackie 16 years ago

>>>>"Nazis, to a man, were foul and disgusting"

schindler was a nazi

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[–] monimm18 16 years ago

Good point. I think the majority of the people who judge so narrowly harsh have never experienced, not even been able to imagine the circumstances of living in a dictatorship, and are also unable to realize the power that propaganda based on a mix of patriotism and religion has on people.

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars."
Oscar Wilde

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[–] fullmetaljackie 16 years ago

i find it hard to judge anyone. there are people who tick me off and people i wanna scream at etc but it just seems impossible for anyone who has ever really thought about things to actually judge someone like that. on the more obvious end of the scale i ask questions like "how can i know what i would do if my family were threatened?" then there are more complicated ones like "what would i do if i wasnt as strong a person as i am now?" i mean i know that sounds like liberal poo but seriously some people are just born wimpy. i dont feel judgment toward them cuz i just think "well there were times in my life when i was totally wimpy for whatever reason" and maybe some of those people are like that all the time. ya know, like someone who does mean evil things out of fear.

farther down the line (and i think this is where i usually lose most of my friends, cuz most of them are immature dummies) some people are just born total buttholes and they really dont have any say in the matter. im not saying they dont have free will (if you believe in that sort of thing) but for some people it's just easy to be cruel and hard to be nice. to illustrate what im saying better (at the risk of sounding arrogant)....let's take the opposite kind of person namely me :0) - someone who would find it hard to be cruel. i dont think i could shoot a bunny rabbit for a million bucks. you might say "oh it's free will, you could shoot the bunny" but really i dont think free will has anything to do with it. i just cant be that way, end of story. kinda like the dude in clockwork orange after the treatment - for me to kill a bunny it would make me puke. i dont know if i was born this way or what (doesnt matter)...im just the way i am and i really feel like i dont have a whole lot of control over it. some people are just mean evil & stinky. im not saying when people are mean & evil we should give them coupons for free pizza or anything but im just saying let's not be judgmental and let's try and realize the playing field is not even.

wow im rambling

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[–] TheSqueee 16 years ago

Thank you for mentioning Stanley Milgram. I'm currently studying psychology and I'm just about to start on the part of it concerning social psychology, and looking in the textbook, Milgram is mentioned! Seems very interesting. :)

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] fullmetaljackie 16 years ago

great post

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] ib011f9545i 17 years ago

I don't know how you can suggest that there was not something long term and deep about German and Austrian anti semitism.
Jews did have problems in France of course (DREYFUS AFFAIR,STAVISKY AFFAIR)but even under Vichy/nazi rule many French people were not anti jewish.

In Britain jewish people had been well treated for hundreds of years,mass Russian jewish immigration in the early 1900s had caused tensions in parts of Britain but Britain was the best place in europe to be jewish in the 20th century.

The nazis managed to carry out the holocaust because they tapped into anti semitism which was strong in the societies of German,Austria and most of the eastern european countries they occupied.
You can't justify the idea that all european nations were equally anti jewish.
Why go to such trouble to defend what the German government did?,it is all on record.

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[–] russelledwards001 17 years ago

there was a lot of anti-semitism in most of europe at the time. The nazis were welcomed with open arms by a lot of people in the occupied countries.

It is well known that the nazis genocide was so successful in part because of the levels of collaboration by the people in the occupied countries - against their jewish countrymen.

I also believe that people did have a choice to fight against fascism - you always have a choice. I was watching a program recently about some germans who disagreed with the nazis and so fought in france with the french resistance against their own countrymen. There were many like this - a lot of whom were killed.

Black book just highlights some of the brave people who fought against the nazis and who ended up dead - but fought for what they believed was right.

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[–] mzladymoon-1 17 years ago

I was going to start a thread touching on this. I don't think there was anything subtle about Dutch anti-semitism at all. It made me realize how very ignorant I am of the full details about this period of history: the rise and fall of Hitler and Nazism.

The Story of Anne Frank I think erroneously contributed to a misconception that the Dutch were these altruistic people helping the Jews to escape the terror of the Nazi's. I understand now that I didn't educate myself about the details. There's a lot more info I need about this period in history.

Although, I agree with the description the OP made about the Nazi's. I also agree that their behavior is not unique to them and that ALL human beings are capable of this kind of savagery. Excuse me, but why do people always so summarily dismiss and forget slavery, the African Slave Trade and the HORRORS of the Middle Passage? Africans were captured like animals, tossed in the belly of a ship by the hundreds, chained side-by-side in a dank, dark, hole, and expected to survive the journey from Africa to the New World for several long months, lying in their own vomit and excrement. And for those who survived(only God knows how), the terror continued in the form of slavery, which lasted 600 hundred years (the latter part of the 19th century), followed by the terror of racism, segregation, lynchings, etc., right up to and beyond the halfway point of the 20th century. And this is just one stain on the character of humanity. Humans torturing, slaughtering each other, all of these acts of genocide apparently are well within our human nature. It's nothing new. Tragically....

ALL human beings are capable of committing really disgusting, insane atrocities against their fellow man. Look no further than some of the horrors being spawned by the Iraq War.

It's a mistake, and one that we are making even today, to think that we are above the behavior of the Nazi's. We need to focus on how not to recreate the same environment and to make sure that humans never sink to this level again.

This movie was intricate and well-done on many levels. It was a bit too long and I agree that telling it in flashback killed the suspense. I also wish that one of the Dutch Resistance characters had had some kind of dialogue that explained what was really at the heart of the Dutch Resistance. Clearly, it was more a function of a stronger anti-German sentiment.

IMO, the point of movies like this is not to detach ourselves and look down on the barbaric behavior, but to make us STOP and THINK so that we won't do the same thing.

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[–] DurakSuka 9 years ago

You are an idiot. You must either live in denial or never have gone to school.

Hama cheez ba-Beer behtar meshawad!

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[–] silentmovie 17 years ago

<<<...This topic creator is clearly an anti-German/anti-Dutch bigot. Something tells me he/she is a Jew with a superiority complex. What a surprise....>>>

I'm a Jew with a superiority complex?

LOL!!!

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[–] simon12345 17 years ago

"Something tells me he/she is a Jew with a superiority complex. What a surprise"

Frankly, you sound like an anti-semite yourself.
We are all just trying to discuss and understand the movie, there is no need to "accuse" someone of being a Jew. It doesn't smell right to me.

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[–] coquiero 17 years ago

It seems to me that most of the Western world was anti-semitic to some extent at the time of WWII. Eleanor Roosevelt, an open and fair minded individual, wrote some very bigoted comments about Jews in her published letters.

I agree with the poster who pointed out the danger is in thinking the Nazis and their sympathizers were monsters or psychotic killers. There were a few psychotic people and a lot of followers who were willing to believe they were "serving their county" or being "patriotic"

I didn't think the Dutch anti-semitism in this film was subtle at all. It really highlighted how even those who were willing to risk their lives to help those persecuted Jews, in the end held the same predjudices in their hearts. At least they were trying to overcome their bigotry and try to help those in peril. It's what defines us as humans; we all hold stereotypes and bigotry in our heart, but some give in to it and some try to rise above.

An interesting discussion.

Happiness is not a potato. -Charlotte Bronte

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[–] simon12345 17 years ago

coquiero -

Your comment is insightful, intelligent and true.

Beautiful post.

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[–] The_Manchurian_Nominee 17 years ago

Europe has had a long standing tradition of disliking Jews, and it's not only them. Israel is one of the least liked countries in the world. It is ignorant to use Nazism as an anchor for this discussion.

They're funny people, the Italians. Culture really isn't their thing.

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[–] Dutch4ever 17 years ago

Oh please. Yes there were anti-semetic sentiments in The Netherlands at the time but not any more so than other neighbouring countries. We also had a lot of people willing to help Jews despite of being in danger themselves for helping them. Have a look at this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Righteous_Among_the_Nations

It shows that there were a lot of Dutch people helping out the Jews during wartime.

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[–] tieman64 17 years ago

It wasn't exactly subtle. They cut her hair, beat her and covered her in faeces!

"Rape is no laughing matter. Unless you're raping a clown."

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[–] lindyla_007 17 years ago

If you read history books of WWII era, you will see that anti-semitism was world-wide at the time. Even in America it existed along with hatred and non-acceptance of blacks. Only when the atrocities of Hitler towards the Jews after the war in Europe ended did people begin to change their attitude toward Jews. It was not as blatant as in Nazi Germany, but it was there. Even Roosevelt did not want to help the Jews in Germany because he did not want to turn people against him as he was working to rid the world of the Nazis. It was a sad time in history.

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[–] tieman64 17 years ago

"Even Roosevelt did not want to help the Jews in Germany because he did not want to turn people against him as he was working to rid the world of the Nazis. It was a sad time in history."

Yeah, he even denied them entrace or refugee status in the USA, resulting in tens of thousands dying.

"If you read history books of WWII era, you will see that anti-semitism was world-wide at the time."

In those days even a black man couldn't get a seat on a bus. The 30s and 40s were a very racist time.

"Rape is no laughing matter. Unless you're raping a clown."

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[–] sumbitch212 17 years ago

people are still racists. Its a sort of reverse racism now. Its ok to hate the white man now more than ever. People still seem to hate the Jews though. Americans, too

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[–] Sanjuro-15 16 years ago

"It wasn't exactly subtle. They cut her hair, beat her and covered her in faeces!"

That was for being a Nazi collaborator, not for being a Jew.

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[–] Kinematico 16 years ago

Yep, back then anti-semitism was spread all over Europe (and not only Europe). It wasn't only a dutch or german thing. The Nazis went farther than anybody else but jews have been disliked since the medieval period by fundamentalist christians.

Just a couple of years after the end of the WW2, anti-semitism was so obvious and present in US society that a even a movie dealing with that problem was made winning the Academy Award for Best Picture (Gentleman's Agreement).

Sadly it's still alive. Don't you remember the infamous statement made by one of the most visible heads of the conservative groups in Hollywood (Mel Gibson)?

Let me quote it: MEL: "Fu*king Jews [...] The jews are responsible for all the war in the world"

Do you know where you can find anti-semitic websites in a greater number? It's not in Germany or Austria, Poland nor Holland. But in USA!

Just google it and you will be amazed and probably scared.

So Mr. Verhoeven is just showing a historical fact. Jews weren't appreciated by everybody back in the 40's. Some people liked them, some just tolerated them, some disliked them, some hated them to the core and then you have the Nazi-Fascists.
Currently anti-semitism is still popular amongst certain groups but things have improved, not totally, though.

Just for the record: I am christian but not a fanatic one.

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] Agent-69 15 years ago

You really need to understand the difference between a movie character and reality. Just because a character is anti-Semitic doesn't meen the movie and/or a person is.
You don't really think that Arnold Schwarzenegger is a cyborg from the future, for example. Please in the future spare us from such idiotic remarks.

"Let's hear you call Boris Karloff a c_ocksucker."

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[–] LSUGamer 15 years ago

From what I hear from dutch people (I live in holland) is that people were anti-semitic back then but not near on the level of the ideaology of nazism

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[–] Father_Anthonis 15 years ago

in 1930 America not much more Anti Semitic then 1930's Germany.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TzcANOHiDo

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