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Over 10 million were killed during the Holocaust - how do I know...read

posted 17 years ago by movieman-232
125 replies | jump to latest

I've been reading threads here and there on boards dedicated to movies about the Holocaust. On those threads there seems to be a big heated debate about how 6 million Jews couldn't have been the real number, and seeing how they think that, how could there be an 11 million count when we get right down to the actual total death toll. I'll tell you how, and this knowledge came from getting off this site to educate myself, which is something many seem to lack: The education of one'sself.

To begin, the source that says that the Holocaust begun with the systematic extermination of the Jews from 1942 to 1945 is erroneous. The Holocaust did not start in the gas chambers but in 1933 when Hitler came into power. The government had decided that to make the aryan race the strongest they made it law that sterilization was required. The handicapped as well as mentally ill and mentally challenged individuals were treated to vascectomies. The real plan behind this wasn't to necessarily sterilize but to murder for many going through this operation had suffered complications, killing them.

In 1939 the 1st gas chamber was used. So, from then on up until 1945 there were chambers being used, not just from '42 to '45.

Now considering these chambers, others on these boards claimed that after each usage there must be a period of time to let the gasses drift away, meaning there couldn't be as many put to death as there is said because those gasses take a long time to clear. That isn't correct because I'm sure that they used gas masks to clean up the bodies and paint the chambers a nice color before the next. I believe 3000 were killed each time. It would take anywhere from 15 minutes to, I assume, 30 minutes to get one chamber used to its completion - remember, there were a lot of workers there to help out. Take into mind that there wasn't just one gas chamber in a camp, either. So, from 1942, when the chambers were worked over time, there was enough going through there for a Holocaust to be as high as 10 million by the end.

And there were also trucks used; a hose from the tail pipe to the inside of the back was used, too. As was taking them out to burial sites to shoot.

The thing is, I believe that the Holocaust claimed lives before Hitler came into power, hence those who were full of hatred had probably ganged up with friends...

Point is: Everyone that comes on these sites claiming there to be no documents found containing the historical facts are being lazy. You only need to type in various words on the internet to find these facts. Heck, I was halfway lazy myself; I asked a friend about this because I knew she wouldn't be against working to help me find these accesable sources. I was more put off because this kind of thing gets to me. But I needed to do something considering what I've read here about the doubts.

And this goes as implication to all of those whom have read an opinionated post regarding their theory of "why 6 million couldn't be the correct number": Nazis were lazy too. Got off your high horse and get the facts. Quit ranting about what you feel is correct because others have said it. Find it for yourselves. And no, I will not give the net pages that account for my knowledge, because I did not ask my friend. If anyone were to ask that I would consider this initial post a failure. Education isn't only found within schools.

[–] juhis-sydis 17 years ago

IMO Stalin is more evil than Hitler. Because his "purges" something like 35 million people were killed. Thats a lot more when comparing how many Jews Hitler killed.

But again, Germany lost and Russkies won... and that makes hitler the most evil person ever lived.

[–] movieman-195 17 years ago

It isn't the fact of how many were murdered, but that the nazis got rid of more than anyone else in such a short time. Sure, Stalin is supposed to have far more to his record, but did his government do the same damage as the Hitler-government in such a short time? It isn't merely how many, but how many so quickly.

[–] therion23 17 years ago

He only killed 12.5 million. The rest he gave free train rides!

When the Czech and Polish pilots who fought with the RAF returned to their homes, Stalin feared their courage so much that he sent the lot on a Siberian vacation too. Plus the mystical disappearances of Romanians siding with Ceaucescu, every single Hungarian politician and policeman, tons of Bulgarians, Ukrainian Partizan troops and whatnot.

35 million is not correct if you stop counting at end April 1945, but yeah, until his death in 1953, you might get there ..

[–] Desepticon 17 years ago

Just a quick note: the main reason the United States supports Israel is because its the only democracy in the middle east and the only real ally they have in the region.

My brother was eaten by wolves on the NJ Turnpike

[–] corturia2 17 years ago

no they dont,they support israel because the jewish community in america demand it and its major votes lost if an administration wouldnt do it. america doesnt give a monkeys about democracy,if they did they wouldnt have put all those tin pot genrals in charge in countries in south america. personally i have no problem with u.s policy in the region,its a long debate over who should be there and such,but i
i dont belve a people ahould be wiped out for trying to make a home for themselves

[–] MobitzI 17 years ago

America is Israel's puppet. How/Why is it that America's Secretary of HOMELAND Security is a Jew and an Israeli citizen? Why is that he (A JEW) helped author the Patriot Act. And how can a man with dual citizenship be impartial??? Would a man with dual citizenship of say... America/Pakistan or America/Iran ever be Secretary of Homeland Security??? Or maybe ask yourself this... would a man born in America, with single citizenship (American) to Pakistani or Irani parents ever be Secretary of Homeland Security???

BTW Secretary of Homeland Security is Michael Chertoff, if you care to look it up.

[–] movieman-232 17 years ago

To correct all of you anti-semites; it isn't because of a Jewish person or peoples that greed and evil sustains, but because of the human being; humans are at fault, not a group of people. It's always the case of humans that we take what one person - or a group of individuals who have the same ideals - did and make their entire religion or whatever to be blamed. It's not the Germans and it isn't the Jews. It's the human being, capible of great evil.

And money isn't the root of all evil; greed is!

[–] sliptdisk 17 years ago

This yeah sure individual has a clear agenda. I wouldn't waste my time with him, anymore. There's no arguing with a true believer.

[–] lenny_kravitzro 16 years ago

this crap is with 2 sides, if u dont agree u are a nazzi, if u agree u had fall in trap
so leave the subject and for shore wasnt 10 mil maybe was 2-3 no more no less
all history is a truthlie or a thutable lie, the history start liening since bible was writed
a lot of things happened but not such huge scale as the books said

[–] sliptdisk 16 years ago

I'm sure your parents are very proud, lenny.

Jesus H. Christ. Read a book, once in a while, would you, you illiterate cretin?

[–] londor11 16 years ago

See the documentary "Shoah" if youre not moved or horrified then kill yourself because you are not human.

Its a bit tough justfying beating a baby against the side of a train cuz its crying (After 4 days in a cattle car,freezing,with no food or water).

Nazi: "Baby shouldnt complain,it makes us look bad".

[–] karltrowitz 16 years ago

Most of those who died in the camps died of hunger or Typhus, due to poor sanitation and medical care.

Don't get me wrong, crimes against the prisoners did happen and they were treated abysmally, but as for the gas chamber story, I don't believe it. In the Red Cross publication "Inter Arma Caritas: The work of the ICRC during the second world war" (Geneva, 1946) it says the Red Cross found no evidence whatsoever of gas chambers in any of the camps and that "in the chaotic condition of Germany after the invasion during the final months of the war, the camps received no food supply at all and starvation claimed an increasing number of victims." They say this was due to the Allied bombing of the German transportation system. On the 15 March 1944 they protested against "the barbarous aerial warfare of the Allies" in the interests of interned Jews.

You can not trust "evidence" from people who are making money out of their horror stories.

[–] yeah_sure 16 years ago

Come on, karltrowitz, what are you talking about?! What "barbarous aerial warfare of the Allies"? Everyone knows that only Germany could be "barbarous". Those stories about Dresden, Hamburg, and many others, were all made up by Goebbels. In reality, the Allies only bombed armament factories. I think they may have killed 2 or maybe 3 civilians, unintentionally of course, but I'm not sure.

So, of course they didnt bomb the German transportation system, either. Those trains kept working right until the end of the war, taking gourmet food, but only to the camps' staff. Those evil germans. Oh, and the trains also brought Zyklon-B, of course, as well as lots of coke, hundreds of thousands of tonnes of it. Because thats the amount you'll need, if you're going to burn so many bodies.

In conclusion: the trains must have been working, otherwise how could they supply the materials to dispose of all the millions they killed? Get my point?

[–] gillianmadeira 16 years ago

The firebombing of Dresden was, indeed, barbarous. You will get no dispute from me. As was the firebombing of Tokyo, of course, and the original US plan to drop the bomb on Kyoto, not because it was a military target but because it was a psychological one. The Allies, bluntly, committed war crimes for which they were not prosecuted, and that's flatly shameful.

But to deny the Holocaust is pig-ignorance. No. The Allies didn't do what they could have to stop the massive amounts of deaths, and that's another shame they'll have to bear. Yes. The train system did keep working for an awfully long time, as anyone with the slightest amount of awareness of World War II could have told you regardless of their ignorance on the Holocaust. "Gourmet food"? By the end of the War, no one was getting much food in all of German-occupied territory. The German people weren't well-fed. Even in Hitler's bunker, in fact, which you would assume would be getting the best there was in the Reich. Again, anyone who knows anything about WWII knows that.

But the simplest way of showing that the Holocaust existed is not the tons and tons of documentary evidence, which is there and only deniable if you don't want to see it. Look at population figures. That's all it takes. Millions of Jews disappeared. Not that long ago, a collection of brains from the subjects of medical experimentation were finally buried, and the man responsible for the program never had to face consequences for it. These were not studies done by the Jews. They were studies done by Gentiles. Where did they all go? Starvation and typhus? That much typhus would assuredly have spread to the Gentile population; it's well-documented in camp records that there was a constant effort to contain typhus as much as possible.

Why do you discount the records? Why do you discount the population decrease? Why do you discount the testimony? Why do you discount the photos, the film, the stories told by liberators? Are you really so determined to believe the lies that you can't even look directly at the truth? I bet you believe the Moon landings were faked, too.

[–] Abstraction1 16 years ago

I must agree, the USA's Jewish lobby really does the country no favours what so ever imo

[–] movieman-232 15 years ago

Whew, boy, it's been along time since this arguement...

The moon landings. Hah! I remember when one of those late night comedy shows, Lettermen, Jay Leno, one of them, maybe. There was this acter who wears dark lensed glasses. Whoever he was he said he thinks that the famous photo of earth from the moon isn't real because there were no stars. I was intent on believing this until I realized that there aren't stars when the sun casts its light.

As for yeah sure. Hmm. I might have messed up a few points, like the repainting of the gas chambers so the next "batch" of Jews wouldn't be suspicious seeing the blood and such on the collumns. I got that from the movie Grey Zone. I'm sorry if that wasn't accurate. But in my beliefs the Holocaust happened. And it might have started a long time before the nazis siezed their power. Whenever a nazi thug beat up and killed a Jew or someone they thought wasn't of pure race, I'd say that was part of it, long before the gas chambers were constructed. Many things contributed to the Holocaust, not only gas chambers. Starvation, diseases from unhealthy environments, etc. That was all a part of it. The nazis created their own projected hatred for the Jews, thinking they were filthy and diseased, that was their justification, I think, to put them into those surroundings and say that's how it had always been so they could justly get rid of them. Hey, I could be wrong, but that's what it seems to have been to my eyes.

And there's this uncertainty of the amount of people killed in the gas chambers; well, to my knowledge, Auschwitz was just one of many of the death camps. Am I right? So, if it only read "1 million" on the sign at that one camp, think of all the other camps that were used.

[–] krink_74 15 years ago

*beep* :)

[–] JackC_32 14 years ago

Consider this, right off the bat, even before anyone knew there was a holocaust the Jews were screaming their six million figure. Then as soon as the war ended they claimed that the majority of the deaths were in Auschwitz, the initial figure placed at around 4.1 million and a plaque was erected. Then after a few years the figure was lowered by about 1 million, yet the total figure of 6 million didn't change. Over the years the estimate got lower and lower and it now stands at around 1 million, yet the total figure still stands at 1 million. Now what I want to know is, every time they lowered the figure for Auschwitz, where are the countless documents that served to prove that the figures for ALL OF THE OTHER CAMPS were thousands less more than they thought? See? How can they just spread the missing Jews across all of the camps without any evidence to support it, and then teach this all in schools! If this was a court case it would be laughed out of the building, it's absolutely disgusting.

[–] RemiRoyer33 13 years ago

The number of handicapped, mentally ill, mentally challenged (retarded) in Germany and Austria was less than 500,000. The combined population of Germany and Austria was 90 million.

[–] JackC_32 13 years ago

The Soviets managed to kill 12 million people in one year in 1933. All they did was cut off all supplies, land and sea and ensure the people starve, it doesn't take long for people to starve.

The Nazis had 14 years and they only managed to kill 6 million Jews? What the hell were they doing?

[–] WWu777 12 years ago

What are you saying? There is no evidence for six million Jews being gassed. No physical evidence at all.

See the four hour documentary film "One Third of the Holocaust" on YouTube. So far, it has been irrefutable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNOBtsg9eQQ

The Nazis deported most of the Jews to Israel. Why would they do that if they wanted to exterminate them?

http://www.happierabroad.com - Discover Global Dating Solutions!

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] greyson-forkturner 8 years ago

WWu777 -

You state that "The Nazis deported most of the Jews to Israel. "

How?

[–] fuentealbach 9 years ago

We have a fundamental disagreement, because you believe anything the jews wrote after they took control of Germany, 1945. Anyway, the important thing here is not whether they were 6, 3 or 1 million, the bigger point is even though we know for a fact the jews have lied repeatedly on this matter in the past, with invented camps, numbers, photographs and the hiding of information, we still believe in all of "their books". A lot of this set-ups have been discovered and exposed by revisionists, but there comes the major issue, the hilarious one! They can put you in jail if you deny the holocaust. Strangely, those are just the only words that are forbidden worldwide. I wonder why...

[–] greyson-forkturner 8 years ago

"A lot of this set-ups have been discovered and exposed by revisionists"

Who are these people? What have they published?