Is it true that german wermacht soldiers, not the ss or gestapo, behaved like that? By that i mean the slaping of jew who didnt greet the two soldiers who he walked by and when they made jews dance and embarras themselfs for no reason? I dont need opinions, just facts
shareGood luck waiting for the "facts" about slapping and dancing chiming in, but considering Wehrmacht did commit their share of atrocities, I certainly wouldn't put it past (some of) them.
"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan
Some of them did, based on their personal convictions. Most of them didn't though. Although the Wehrmacht officially swore an oath to Adolf Hitler, they remained in the traditions of the Prussian military, which prided itself in dignity and honour.
shareThis was perhaps one of the things which let the film down slightly - this stereotype of the boorish German soldier. Otherwise I might have given it a 9/10.
The vast majority of German soldiers were trying to make it through the war alive, like everyone else. Of course there were some who relished their power and behaved atrociously but the film portrayed the civilized German as the exception, when in reality it was the other way around.
I recommend this book although it's an indie book and it's a dystopia, the author said she made the hero a good german/russian soldier to oppose the stereotype and the topic seems to be loosely based on the rape of German women by the ally forces.
http://www.amazon.com/V-Girl-Mya-Robarts-ebook/dp/B00L6MFXWG
This film: I haven't seen it yet, but apparently it also portrays a german in a good light.
http://www.amazon.com/Good-German-George-Clooney/dp/B000S9ZBKC
And this is another book of another aspect of war that people rarely talk about. Germans had their side of story, too.
http://www.amazon.com/Woman-Berlin-Eight-Weeks-Conquered/dp/0312426119
the film portrayed the civilized German as the exception, when in reality it was the other way around
The vast majority of German soldiers were trying to make it through the war alive, like everyone else
Certainly, Germans were victims of the war on a tragic scale. But that doesn't necessarily make them good.
There was an awful lot more bad in the German army than there was in the US army in WW2.
shareMaybe. I won't discuss that as I don't have the exact data and I'm not about to trust hollywood movies (some made with Jewish capital) to portray accurately what really happened. All I'm saying is that there's good and bad in every army and since we have already seen a lot of the "americans are good, their enemies are rotten" angle, it would be interesting to see the other side of the story.
I'm sure there were more cases of German heroes, who acted with honor in WWII and that would be interesting to watch. Same for Soviets, Italians, and other armies that are usually portrayed as the bad guys. I'd love in one day there was a movie about how Allied forces raped plenty of women of the European countries they were liberating.
There's good and bad in all of us - and evidently some people are far worse than others.
Same for Soviets, Italians, and other armies that are usually portrayed as the bad guys. I'd love in one day there was a movie about how Allied forces raped plenty of women of the European countries they were liberating.
Seen this one?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0054749/?ref_=nv_sr_1
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11455664/Allied-soldiers-raped-hundreds-of-thousands-of-German-women-after-WW2.html
- Remember 'history' is written by the victors.
as I said, there was an awful lot more bad in the German army than there was in the US army in WW2.
shareSo you're saying that during the Holocaust & WWII, civilized Germans were the norm? Funniest thing I've read all week.
shareSame here. Even Hosenfeld at the end was portrayed as uncouth in contrast to history where he helped not only Szpilman but other Jews and Poles as well. The film fails to clarify his character, it also fails to notify the viewer of the fact that Szpilman later came back to look for Hosenfeld and searched for the latter for few years before being notified of his fate.
One day in the year of the fox came a time remembered well...
The slapping scene happened to Polanski's father for not walking in the gutter so Polanski used this and other personal bits in the film. Polanski actually fairly portrayed various types and behaviors among Germans, Jews and Poles.
shareOh yes they were indoctrinated from early age to view Jews as the enemy.
So yes it happen but the most savage and crazed ones were in the SS.
Fighting Hitler would of been one war- I would of gladly signed up for!!!
Talk about a war worth dying for. This would be it!!!!
According to Szpilman's novel of the same name, the soldiers did all that & even worse.
I'd say this cloud is Cumulo Nimbus.
Didn't he discover America?
Penfold, shush.
I think its important to separate the fanatical SS from your average German regular army soldier.
shareAccording to Szpilman's novel of the same name, the soldiers did all that & even worse.
The SS were responsible for most of the atrocities against Jews, but I wouldn't put it past Wehrmacht enlisted men to humiliate Jews for fun, given all the anti-Jewish propaganda they had inhaled. There were, however, good Wehrmacht soldiers and officers who despised the Kristallnacht and Final Solution. For example, Captain Hosenfeld, the Wehrmacht officer you see in the film: he helped hide and save many Polish Jews during the war. Unfortunately, he was tortured to death by the Soviets - guilt by association. Not to mention the July 20 Plot in which many high ranking Wehrmacht officers attempted to kill Hitler and stage a coup to overthrow the Nazi regime.
shareHello I am a student of history, especially the world wars. I recommend some great authors on this particular subject (Antony Beevor, Catherine Merridale etc). Know that teachings of World war 2 (not to mention in media) is still to a great extent influenced by wartime propaganda because it remains quite a recent event. It wont be until probably at least another 100 years until historians are actually able to draw a consensus on the facts laid out (many archives with vital pieces of information are still closed even to this day).
It is true what pretty much everyone here has already stated. The common German soldier was to a large extend just another soldier, but to say they had not been influenced by the militaristic nature of their government, and the years of extreme daily propaganda and simply "the times we lived in" would indeed be a lie.
You also need to separate German soldiers fighting on the Eastern front and those on the western front. On the western front, the Germans and their opponents treated each others with still a great deal of respect and humanism, there were atrociousness, but these were rare and usually well known cases (usually when a division had been transferred from the East to the West).
The eastern front was something entirely different. This was hell on earth for both parties as there were simply no rules or mercy given on either side. Starvation, exposure to weather, extreme fighting conditions, ideological hatred, racism, disease, hopelessness and so on, forced the regular soldier to commit horrible crimes, many times just to ensure their own survival.
Whatever war crime the western allies (US, Canadian, UK, ANZAC etc) committed during their advance (aside from the much debated bombing runs on German cities), it wont even come close to the horrors in Russia and elsewhere in Eastern Europe.
The German high command, the OKH and the OKW did assist the Nazi party in their criminal operations but historians are still debating to what extend, with many claiming it was all on a more bureaucratic level (transportation, logistics, handing over POW etc) rather then acts of individual soldiers.
People should also realize that the German soldiers were just soldiers, more so, they were conscripts, meaning they joined the war regardless of political conviction or moral compass. When crimes were committed, it was many times for the sake of their own survival or given orders by their superiors.
Soldiers have always fought for their country (British soldiers did not question their governments treatment of the Indian population when they were serving in the french trenches). Germany was at war, and the men served as she called on them.
All in all, the SS was most likely responsible for 90% of the crimes committed in the holocaust and other war crimes during the war, and was for this very reason branded an illegal organization after the war, with most of its members regarded as criminals.
The Wehrmacht committed more than its share of war crimes in WW2. Not all the evil acts were committed by the SS, Gestapo or irregular forces. The Wehrmacht for example were happy to allow millions of Russian soldiers to starve to death on the Eastern front even though they were prisoners of war and should have been treated as such. The German army likes to hold up its hands and act as though they were innocent in all the atrocities of WW2, this is far from the truth.
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