Question, not for the religious. - Left Behind (2001) Discussion

[–] falcon2484 13 years ago

I bought it at the library in a clearance sale for 25¢. I put off watching it till there was nothing on TV and nothing else doing. The only things I remember from it are the cool exploding jets at the beginning, and that Janaya Stephens is pretty hot. But other than her presence and the exploding jets, there's really little to recommend it.

And by the way, fundies, I'm not so closed-minded that I can't tolerate any views other than my own, or recognize the message of this movie as a point of view held by a lot of people who believe it to be legitimate. For those who believe in a literal interpretation of Revelation, I'm sure this is a fine piece of future history. For everyone else, their suspension of disbelief may be difficult to accomplish. Maybe I should watch it again, and try to appreciate it as simply another fantasy movie, like Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory, or the Harry Potter series. Yeah, I said it.

Kirk (and I can't believe I'm saying this) really isn't too bad in this. Neither is Clarence, of whom I've always been a fan.

The Falcon flies

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

For the record, not everyone that's "religious" believes in this nonsense.

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi

For the record, not everyone that's "religious" believes in this nonsense.

No, perhaps not, but by the fact they are religious, it shows they believe in some type of ridiculous nonsense.

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

So says you. But I'm a Christian that, believes the earth is billions of years old, think dinosaurs once roamed the earth and so on. And the Bible does not disagree with that. I just happen to believe it more ridiculous that there was nothing and then out of that nothing was the big bang, etc. And there's no way I can look around me and not see intelligent design. You believe otherwise and that's fine. But I'm not here to debate evolution or anything else with unbelievers. I'm at a board for a "religious" movie to plant seeds to believers.

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi

the earth is billions of years old, think dinosaurs once roamed the earth and so on. And the Bible does not disagree with that.

Well that depends on who you ask, there are a lot of your fellow christians that seriously disagree with you.

And there's no way I can look around me and not see intelligent design.

But even if creationism were true, how do you get from there, to your specific god?

And lets not forget evolution is a FACT backed up by (quite literally) tonnes of evidence, where IDC has nothing.

I'm at a board for a "religious" movie to plant seeds to believers.

And I'm here to help remove the shackles of religion from the people here with the potential to think for themselves.

Out of interest, talking about the bible, do you believe in talking snakes/bushes/donkeys, people living inside fish, insects having four legs, every plant and tree which yield seed are edible, there were giants on the earth at one time, rabbits chew cud, the cure for leprosy involves incantations and the blood of a bird, the bodies of dead saints can go for a stroll around town, slavery and rape are both good examples of morality? Because all of them are in there.

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

I believe in the bible in the context that it's supposed to be taken. And taken back when at all possible to the Hebrew and Greek, because certain things can be lost in translation (chewing the cud, etc) I don't believe in the traditions of men that have been handed down year after year, rapture, eternal hell, earth is only 7000 and the list goes on. (none of that is biblical) I can even pull out a few of those right off hand and say yes, I believe that giants roamed the earth (geber born out of the sons of God having sex with the daughters of men), the saints rose as a one time thing to show that Christ had risen, etc.
I can even list alot more than that you've probably not even heard of -three earth ages, Satan will be here playing Antichrist and everyone's own messiah before the generation of 1948 dies out to deceive the entire world, including Christians and that list goes on as well. But what's the point, you're still going to think I'm delusional and I'm still going to have my beliefs firmly in place. As I said, I'm not here to debate with unbelievers (been there, done that over the years) Oh I had my questions when I was brought up in a fundie home, till I actually, like you suggested wanted to think for myself. Then 10 years ago instead of going by what most churches taught, read the bible for myself and came away with questions being answered- There was an age before this one, during the katabole, God shook the mountains and everything moved slightly.( Which is why there's no true north) No one knew that back then. Why some mammoths died with buttercups in their mouths when no climate suggested you would find them. Petrified forests found, african animals found in the US and so on. The first earth age was a perfect one until God destroyed it in anger. We are in the second earth age to be tested. Now have I really blown your mind? Hopefully so and you'll think me even more delusional than most- think me a lost cause and move on to someone else.

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi

I believe in the bible in the context that it's supposed to be taken.

If it is the imutable word of a perfect god how could it ever be in a context other than the one it was meant to be read in?

And taken back when at all possible to the Hebrew and Greek,

Very untrue, there were lots of languages in existance then.

because certain things can be lost in translation (chewing the cud, etc)

So why didn't your god think of this and create a universal language to circumvent this problem?

I don't believe in the traditions of men that have been handed down year after year,

The bible and everything in it is traditions of men that have been handed down. You do understand that the bible we have today exists only because the various parts were voted in, or out by men?

rapture, eternal hell, earth is only 7000 and the list goes on. (none of that is biblical)

Again, there are a great many of your fellow christians who strongly disagree with you.

I can even pull out a few of those right off hand and say yes, I believe that giants roamed the earth (geber born out of the sons of God having sex with the daughters of men), the saints rose as a one time thing to show that Christ had risen, etc.

Do you not think this is at least a little bit crazy?

I can even list alot more than that you've probably not even heard of

Having read the bible (and the qur'an for that matter) cover to cover several times, probably not. The ones I listed were just what happened to pop into my head as I wrote.

But what's the point, you're still going to think I'm delusional and I'm still going to have my beliefs firmly in place.

Correct on both counts, however there is always the hope you may realize how crazy some of your beliefs are.

As I said, I'm not here to debate with unbelievers (been there, done that over the years)

Then why are you doing so?

Oh I had my questions when I was brought up in a fundie home, till I actually, like you suggested wanted to think for myself. Then 10 years ago instead of going by what most churches taught, read the bible for myself and came away with questions being answered

Congratulations, you have already made your first steps to becoming a free thinking Atheist.

There was an age before this one, during the katabole, God shook the mountains and everything moved slightly.( Which is why there's no true north)

And obviously you have evidence to back this up?

The first earth age was a perfect one until God destroyed it in anger.

I'm glad you admit your god is both falible, and has a really bad temper, most christians wont.

We are in the second earth age to be tested.

Tested by whom and on what criteria?

Now have I really blown your mind?

No, why would you think that?

Hopefully so and you'll think me even more delusional than most- think me a lost cause and move on to someone else.

If you believe in nonsense, then yes, by definition you are delusional, as I said earlier.

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

Hmm... Let me just ask you one question, since you have read the Bible cover to cover several times and this pertains to your post,

rapture, eternal hell, earth is only 7000 and the list goes on (none of that is biblical)

My part

Again, there are a great many of your fellow christians who strongly disagree with you.

your part

I'll ask you from an atheist point of you what the Bible says on those subjects since you've read it several times, are these teachings in the Bible?

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi

from an atheist point of you what the Bible says on those subjects

Like most things regarding the bible, it depends on how you choose to interpret it, which is why it is such a weak starting point.

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

That's what I thought. Come on dude, it doesn't sound like you've read the Bible cover to cover one time let alone several. It sounds like you're just another dime a dozen non believer whose basic Bible knowledge is just what they've picked up through the years -by hearsay or maybe reading some passages here and there. If not, sorry but I have had atheist friends and even some atheist posters on here that have actually read the Bible and know there's there isn't any rapture, and eternal hell, etc teachings in the Bible. And they didn't need an interpreter.

Matthew 10:2828And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

One verse disproves eternal hell for the soul. Imagine that. If this verse needs interpreting, I would worry about someone's even basic reading comprehension.

And there's nothing about a rapture in the Bible. A lot of Christians (that believe in a rapture) have taken one verse out of context because one woman in the 1800's dreamed and had a vision. (1st Thes 4:17) If they would just read into the next chapter and into the next book (imagine that, verse by verse, chapter by chapter) they would see there is no secret rapture. It needs no interpretation, it's as plain as day. Matthew 24 debunks the rapture and the Left Behind movie all in one chapter. One and that's not the only place.
)The early churches didn't teach a rapture. As an atheist I thought you would have seen that- especially after reading Matthew 24, 2nd Thes and so on because one would think you would have to be objective right? But no, just haven't read.

Let's just stop wasting each others' time.

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi

That's what I thought...

Wow! I fire off a quick, but still 100% accurate, 30 second response before having to run off and meet some people about a charity event I run, and you think this somehow gives you the psychic ability to know if I've read you magic book of faerie-tales or not? You truly are delusional LOL

dime a dozen non believer whose basic Bible knowledge is just what they've picked up through the years -by hearsay or maybe reading some passages here and there.

Sorry, you seem to be talking about christians here rather than Atheists, it is a FACT that your average Atheist knows more about religion than the average theist, there have been many tests carried out on this.

A lot of Christians (that believe in a rapture) have taken one verse out of context

So make your mind up, do you agree with me on not? Because this sentence seems to match what I said about depending on how you read the bible EXACTLY!

But no, just haven't read.

As I said before, the bible can be interpreted in many different ways, this is why there is around forty thousand different denominations of christianity, just because somebody doesn't agree with your reading of it does not mean they have not actually read it.

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

Wow! I fire off a quick, but still 100% accurate

Nope, not even one percent accurate.
The points I mentioned are specifically laid out in the Bible. That's why I brought them up. Especially the timing of Christ coming after the tribulation. He even says the words "immediately after" LOL. The fact that you still left it up to interpretation definitely means you have no clue to what Christ or Paul taught on the matter. If you really had read it, how do the words "immediately after the tribulation" need to be interpreted? I'm really curious. They even gave out warnings to not be deceived on the timing. They couldn't have been more clear. So for you to come off like any rapture believing Christian instead of someone who could be actually objective was my clue that you hadn't read the New Testament at all. Not completely anyway. Rapture believes for the most part want a security blanket, that's why Christians would rather someone preach to them, give them what they want to hear instead of picking up the Bible and really reading it for themselves. And as I said the Rapture doctrine is relatively new, sprouting from a protestant preacher in the 1800's because of a vision. So that's only one specific group that actually believes in the rapture.

Sorry, you seem to be talking about christians here rather than Atheists, it is a FACT that your average Atheist knows more about religion than the average theist, there have been many tests carried out on this.

Exactly. Hence my first reply to you that I'm on this board to plant seeds, most definitely to other Christians.

A lot of Christians (that believe in a rapture) have taken one verse out of context

So make your mind up, do you agree with me on not? Because this sentence seems to match what I said about depending on how you read the bible EXACTLY!

You seem to be missing my point. They haven't read it exactly. Say you're reading any book, and you go straight to the middle. Forget the chapter before and the chapter after but you take one sentence, pull it out and have a basis for a debate. Don't you find anything wrong with this picture?? Obviously not since you think it can be interpreted that way. Never mind going up a few verses to get the subject or going even further past that one verse so nothing can be taken out of context.

If you really had read the Bible (even if it is a bunch of fairytales to you and it's certainly your right to think so)One would think you would have at least touched on the subject. Instead you pulled out the same card everyone else pulls out. And if that's how you really want to answer than as I said, let's stop wasting each others time. I'm still going to be a Christian and you're still going to be an Antheist. But when someone claims to have read the Bible you had me interested because I wanted your objective point of view. Sorry I asked.

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi

Nope, not even 1 percent accurate.

So why did you agree with what I said the in your rant post?

You seem to be missing my point. They haven't read it exactly.

Haven't read it exactly the way you wanted them to you mean LOL

Instead you pulled out the same card everyone else pulls out.

If everybody says this, do you not think there may be something to it?

let's stop wasting each others time.

As long as you don't post anything else incredibly stupid, I'm happy to leave things.

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

Haven't read it exactly the way you wanted them to you mean LOL

Are you joking???? LOL. Read it the way anyone would read a book, chapter by chapter, book, by book. I only ask them to read it they way they were taught to read in school. Geez, is there a new way out there I don't know about? Please enlighten me.

If everybody says this, do you not think there may be something to it?

So, you're aligning yourself with the rapture believers, proving they haven't read. Fine by me.

And how am ranting?? I honestly wanted your take on those subjects in the Bible. And you refused, more than once. Why even bring up the fact that you've read it several times cover to cover if you can't answer a specific question about it. But anyway, let's just let it go.

Oh and I do apologize about the 1 percent. I was only thinking of those subjects I had brought up, not your entire post.

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi

Geez, is there a new way out there I don't know about? Please enlighten me.

You yourself referenced people reading verses differently to you, and if there was only ONE way to read the bible, why is there around forty thousand different types of christianity?

So, you're aligning yourself with the rapture believers

Not in the slightest, I am saying if everybody tells you there are many ways of interpreting the bible, perhaps you should consider the possibility this is true.

I honestly wanted your take on those subjects in the Bible. And you refused, more than once.

Giving an answer you don't like is NOT refusing to answer.

Oh and I do apologize about the 1 percent.

Apology accepted.

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

Not in the slightest, I am saying if everybody tells you there are many ways of interpreting the bible, perhaps you should consider the possibility this is true.

About those subjects I brought up no. Because the verses can speak for themselves. They need no interpretation. I asked you what about these words- "immediately after the tribulation" needs interpreting?( Can it possibly be interpreted "before the tribulation"? LOL) But you didn't even answer. You've not answered anything specifically about the Bible. You've glossed over anything to do with Bible specifics after claiming to have read several times. I don't claim to know everything about the Bible but you guys with thinking it's too hard to even read a simple sentence without having an interpreter on hand it boggles my mind. (it's not that hard people! LOL) The New Testament is actually easy to read.

Giving an answer you don't like is NOT refusing to answer.

You
never answered any of my Bible questions.

Oh and

You yourself referenced people reading verses differently to you, and if there was only ONE way to read the bible, why is there around forty thousand different types of christianity?

Yes, but most don't believe in the Rapture theory (early churches definitely didn't) yet I found it puzzling you aligned with them in believing the timing was up to interpretation, that's all. Thousands of years and then one woman has a dream, but ok. You choose the one group that has pulled a verse or two out when many other churches can see the truth plainly. But it made me question if you had read. Most people who've read, like I said, chapter by chapter, verse by verse so one doesn't lose context have a firm understanding of what the Bible teaches about the Second Coming. As I said even other atheist posters on here (doublejanus for one) have read and know.

So you can see why I questioned you, no answers other than it can be interpreted different ways.

Ok so when I read "after", it actually could mean "before".....

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Hi,

This is getting incredibly boring now.

1) As an Atheist, my position should be blindingly obvious, I do not believe the bible predicts ANYTHING

2) The bible can be read many different ways FACT!

-Mex

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Did you ever notice that people who believe in creationism look really un-evolved?

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[–] Mex5150 13 years ago

Double post (replaced with this) due to an Internet drop-out.

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[–] joni-kantoniemi 13 years ago

This got to be one of the most boring movies I've ever seen. I do not recommend this to anyone.

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[–] MsGAPeach 13 years ago

Read the books first and then you'll get 'sucked' in. I have every one of the books and could not put them down. They make you stop and think, what if. Well, what if, do you want to take that chance in not believing or do you want to believe? I'd rather believe and be wrong than not to believe than it be the truth.

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[–] life4all 13 years ago

Well I admire your zeal for reading. Reading can be a powerful tool in permitting us to gain invaluable knowledge. Now I have not read the entire Bible but I have studied this "Rapture" idea to see if it holds water or not. Remember first that God is not the author of confusion. So would you be as willing to actually spend some time reading enough of the Bible to come to your own conclusions about the "Rapture"?

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[–] Disco_Shrew 13 years ago

do you want to take that chance in not believing or do you want to believe? I'd rather believe and be wrong than not to believe than it be the truth.

Except not one single person has the slightest bit of control over what they believe, that's the nature of belief, you either do, or you don't. You can't just decide to because it suits the situation. You can say you do in order to alter someone's perception of you, which sounds like exactly what you're doing. You're saying you believe because you're afraid of what might happen if you don't.

Fear is no basis for belief, religious or otherwise. I feel bad for you.

For the record, I'd rather think for myself and be wrong, than compromise my integrity by claiming to accept that which is so fantastic to me as to be laughable.

That said, these movies sound like a riot, I'll track them down and MST3K the crap out of them.

Who lives in the east 'neath the willow tree?

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[–] LeddyBs 13 years ago

Except not one single person has the slightest bit of control over what they believe...

Utter nonsense and balderdash.

I was raised Catholic and went to catholic school for 12 years of my young life. That didn't stop me from making a choice once I reached the age of reason to reject the dogma and leave the church. I bore witness to the inconsistencies, abuses and fear mongering and said, "Nope, not for me. I don't believe in a God that empowers people like this."

Those people who believe the world is only 6,000 years old have made a choice to be ignorant and oblivious to science. It doesn't make them bad people, but it is their choice. They gravitate towards publications and propaganda that confirms their beliefs and wander through life in a tiny bubble.

A clown is a transvestite who doesn't know when to stop

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[–] julielb67 13 years ago

I don't believe in a God that empowers people like this."

I totally get where you're coming from. Although I believe it's alot of the churches(many denominations) that try to empower people, not God. That's why I haven't been in years. And I'm actually closer to God than I've ever been.

I also believe that the earth is billions of years old and the bible coincides with this, not against it. The earth "was" void translated back is "became" void. And there are other scriptures that talk about the world that "was". I always bring up the traditions of men. And to me, it's the traditions that have went on for so long that is taught these days not the true word of God.

But I will say I agree with you that the fear mongering, etc is ridiculous. Fear is not the way to go.

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[–] Lopsided55 13 years ago

Laughably bad. The first one is worth watching for the laughs after that they get boring. The books are unreadable imo.

The Thief in the Night Rapture movies from the 70s are better. Track down those.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070795/

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[–] Zero_Wolf 12 years ago

I've only seen bits and pieces of two episodes.

My first impression was that it was just kind of cheap looking.

But it really wasn't that bad. And I for one think the whole Rapture thing is kind of an interesting concept. I've always thought so, and that's primarily why I decided to have a look at it.

I've always been bothered by the logical consistency of it (I mean, when the Rapture happens wouldn't that pretty much prove Christianity, and so only cretins wouldn't convert, and so how would the Anti-Christ have any followers at all? Wouldn't the whole world be like, "dude.....you're the anti-christ. book called it like 2000 years ago" ?), but I've ignored bigger plot holes.

At no point did I really think this is 'laughably' bad though.

It is definitely very religious, with alot of praying and preaching. Not implied, or truncated, but full out praying and preaching, which I've always found weird.

________________________
How 'bout that LEM, huh!?!

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[–] AndrewGS 11 years ago

I thought the movie overall was OK, Cameron was terrible (although at times amusingly so), Johnson and Gilyard OK but just barely but the villains were kind of entertaining.

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[–] Blueghost 10 years ago

by Disco_Shrew » Mon Oct 17 2011 02:33:11 Flag ▼ | Reply |
IMDb member since August 2003
If you're one of them, don't say you weren't warned.

I'm asking people who are not dumb enough to be sucked in by this nonsense, but really, how bad are these? I mean are they so bad it's good kind of bad? or just boring kind of bad. I love awful movies and these just popped up on my radar.
I figure anything with Kirk (I can hold a banana so there must be intelligent design) is in it, then it must be worth a laugh.

It's not campy bad where you can laugh at it. It's just bad that you can't get any entertainment out of it at all.

I bought the three DVD "book case" edition for $7. $7 that could have gone towards a Big Mac and fries.

That's how bad this film is.

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