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Why I prefer 'The Rage' to the original 'Carrie'

posted 11 years ago by Wuchakk
30 replies | jump to latest

I just saw the original "Carrie" and "The Rage" back-to-back and I liked the latter better with the exception of the original's prom scene, which is iconic with the blood-splattered Sissy and the fire in the background. Plus, the '76 version is the original version and it gets points just for that whereas "Carrie 2" loses points for merely being another take on the same basic plot. You could also argue that the original has better mood, which it does.

Yet I prefer this sequel because Rachel is a much more interesting character than Carrie in the original film and Jesse is really attracted to Rachel -- even loves her -- rather than Tommy just doing his girlfriend a favor and feeling sorry for Carrie in the original.

Also, the thin plot of the original is clearly padded -- unimportant scenes are drawn-out to almost twice the length they need to be -- and this makes the movie seem long at 98 minutes and some parts boring. "The Rage," by contrast, runs 104 minutes but it doesn't seem as long (or boring) as the original because the story and characters are more interesting and the film isn't padded.

Don't take this to mean I don't like the original -- I think it was great as the original film and iconic -- but "The Rage" features an overall more interesting story and characters.

=========================

"I... don't... see... any... method... at... all... sir."

[–] 11 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Wuchakk 10 years ago

Rachel isn't interesting in the slightest.

Yes she is; and she's certainly more interesting than Carrie in the original.

Everything about this sequel was 90s formulaic.

You compared it to "Clueless" and "She's All That" on another thread. "The Rage" isn't anything like those films. Not only have I seen 'em, I own 'em.

all of the characters in Rage were 90s teen movies archetypes

Yeah, archetypes all true to life, huh? Besides, you have this in any of these types of movies because, after all, they have to tell the story in under 2 hours.

Name one teen/school flick that doesn't use such archetypes.

My 150 (or so) favorite movies:
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls070122364/

[–] 10 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Wuchakk 10 years ago

No she isn't (interesting of a character than Carrie in the Original).

Yes she is. I just saw both films back-to-back several months ago and, while the original gets a lot of points just for being the original and the great prom scene (including the devastating loss of Carrie's dream), "The Rage" is the better overall film IMHO. It's more entertaining with less "filler." For instance, a lot of scenes in the original were almost twice as long as they needed to be (or, at least, one-third too long), but "The Rage" doesn't make that mistake. Nor does it make the mistake of having the religious nut stereotype.

As for Rachel being more interesting of a character, she's an outcast like Carrie but she's stronger, more confident and doesn't have a dream to fit in with the popular kids. One of the film's themes is: Does love really exist? Rachel says she doesn't believe in love. Her mother's in a mental institution. She's a foster child and her foster parents clearly only have her for the extra money, not because they love her. Furthermore, although Rachel is portrayed on the surface as a cliched 90's misfit who likes Marilyn Manson, that's really not the case because she's not a rebellious, disrespectful teenager in the least. She never "answers back" her foster 'father,' she works, she isn't promiscuous and isn't an idiot party monger. As such, she totally defies the stereotype.

Jesse also breaks the high school stereotype. He's truly attracted to Rachel, despite the fornication game the stud players are playing. But why is he attracted to Rachel? It's not that she's conventionally beautiful like his ex-girlfriend, although Rachel's not ugly either (I guess she's an acquired taste, lol). Jesse sees the superficiality and conformity of the spoiled "popular kids" clique and veers toward someone more humble, loving and genuine, like Rachel. Also observe that Jesse isn't a conformist, even though he's technically part of the popular kids jock/cheerleader clique: Because of his love for an outcast he fearlessly stands up to the most popular (arrogant) jock; everyone on the team gets his head shaved except Jesse, etc.

So there are two characters -- the main protagonists of the story, in fact -- that disprove your theory that all the characters in the film are one-dimensional, dull high school archetypes.

Contrast Rachel who can handle the bullies just fine (until the movie requires her to lose it)

What you say about he original movie is well said and I agree, but I disagree with your low appraisal of "The Rage."

Concerning your above point, you missed out on the theme that Rachel didn't believe in love until Jesse came along and proved her wrong, which turned her whole world around. Then, in the last act, the video is played at the party where some of the in-crowd were pretending to like her. Suddenly, Rachel's "new world" is crushed as she thinks Jesse was using her as part of the stud game. Her life wasn't great up to this point, but she was strong enough to handle it; this, however, was the proverbial straw that breaks the camel's back and; after all, she's only like 17. How much emotional self-control did you or I (or anyone) have at that age?

S you're claim that it's not believable that Rachel breaks at the end is without merit.

I compared it to Cruel Intentions not Clueless.

Whoops, sorry about that. I don't own "Cruel Intentions," lol, and have no (cruel) intention of doing so.

Popular kids are all evil sociopaths, except for the one guy that likes the "misfit girl" the misfit girl is just a misunderstood loner.

I'll take your word for it because I never studied the 90s teenager/school genre, which shows, by the way, that I'm not a fan of this particular sub-genre. I've probably seen only like five of them (from the 90s). Still, I'd like to see a list of the films that all have these elements. In any case, "Dazed and Confused" definitely doesn't fit this mold, which you'll likely argue doesn't count since it takes place in the late 70s.

Rage can be completely summed up as "What if we remade Carrie as a 90s teen movie?"

And why not? We already have the original "Carrie" so why would we want a more modern duplicate? I enjoy the different take on the same basic story that "The Rage" offers the viewer.

Plenty of movies avoid the "sociopathic jocks and cheerleaders" archetype.

I noticed that you didn't name any, except for "Carrie." And that film didn't wholly avoid the "sociopathic jocks and cheerleaders" archetype, as you say, because there was the small group of sociopathic jocks and cheerleaders who plotted and carried-out the wicked pig's blood stunt.

You point out that Tommy is a jock in the original but it doesn't define his character the same way it defines Jessie in "The Rage", but it doesn't defines Jessie's character either since he refuses to shave his head and is boldly willing to confront and fight the main arrogant jock.

You're not giving "The Rage" the credit it deserves because you're writing it off as just another entry in the 90's youth genre, but I can't think of many films of the teen/school genre that rise to the level of its quality, 90s or otherwise. Although it's a movie and therefore has its limitations, its depiction of high school life and the potential glory & shame thereof rings true. I know because I experienced it; and so did you.

My 150 (or so) favorite movies:
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls070122364/

[–] 10 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Wuchakk 10 years ago

I will say that for all the problems I had with Rage, I was never bored by it

Guess what? You just described a "quality" movie.

By contrast, consider Coppola's "Youth Without Youth" that has a lot of interesting elements, locations, etc. and cost a gazillion dollars, but he forget to make it entertaining. As such, it's an interesting film, but not a quality film.

And I don't find having a religious nut stereotype to be a mistake.

I never said it was a mistake in the original; I said it would've been a mistake to utilize this annoying, cartoony stereotype for the sequel.

But, in a way, it was a mistake for the original in that this annoying, offensive character makes it a hard film to watch and enjoy but, then again, it's a horror movie so I guess it was fitting.

There was no believable reason for Rachel to go columbine at the party.

Apparently you weren't reading my response very closely because I explained this: "you missed out on the theme that Rachel didn't believe in love until Jesse came along and proved her wrong, which turned her whole world around. Then, in the last act, the video is played at the party where some of the in-crowd were pretending to like her. Suddenly, Rachel's "new world" is crushed as she thinks Jesse was using her as part of the stud game. Her life wasn't great up to this point, but she was strong enough to handle it; this, however, was the proverbial straw that breaks the camel's back and; after all, she's only like 17. How much emotional self-control did you or I (or anyone) have at that age?"

Rage falls into the hollywood cliche that you're either popular or you're loser.

Wrong because Rachel was hardly a loser.

Carrie understands that it's not Carrie didn't hang out with the in-crowd that made her an outsider, it was that she couldn't fit in with anyone.

What's this have to do with whether or not "The Rage" is a good film? Rachel had a couple people whom she was close to, but didn't fit in with the popular crowd and didn't necessarily want to. There are people like this in real life.

saying "They're all going to laugh at you" just like the original even though it made no damn sense as Rachel never met Margret.

What happened to Carrie 22 years earlier was now happening to Rachel, albeit not exactly the same circumstances. Plus it was an homage to the original. What's not to get?

Mean Girls is another. American Pie is a late 90's teen film that avoids it.

I never saw the former while the latter was unnecessarily raunchy and "The Rage" blows it out of the water (and, no, I don't care about how popular "AP" was).

Jesse being on the football team is basically the whole of his character.

If this was the case then the film would've depicted him living, breathing and sleeping football and radically adhering to the sheeple team spirit, not to mention going after the cheerleaders and popular girls, which wasn't the case at all.

Please. It was anything other than a quality film as it was basically a 90s cliche storm. It's an enjoyable but stupid movie at most.

Okey dokey, Mr. Grumpy.

I like the movie and have explained in detail why I like it, but you essentially spit on it as 90's teen genre drivel. So be it.

You can have the last word; I don't have the time for an ongoing debate.

My 150 (or so) favorite movies:
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls070122364/

[–] 10 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Wuchakk 10 years ago

And I never found Margret offensive, but maybe its because I think all religions are creepy cults.

Sorry for going back on my word, but I need to explain: I didn't mean offensive in the sense that Margaret offended my spiritual sensibilities since even the Bible shows that those types of sterile religious whack-jobs exist. I meant offensive in the way she arrogantly abuses Carrie; plus she was just plain annoying, but I'm sure that was the point.

Also, your basis for totally writing off "The Rage" is rooted in your belief that it's derivative of numerous 90's teen/school films, which is why I asked for a list; and so far you've only mentioned three films: "Cruel Intentions" (of which I've only seen clips of), "She's All That" and "Mean Girls" (another I haven't seen). I own "She's All That" and I don't see any glaring similarities, although you may be right in a very general sense about the groups/individuals (I can't remember because I haven't seen it for awhile). Besides, the tone of "She's All That" is completely different. Regardless, you're not naming all that many movies to denounce "The Rage" as a woefully derivative piece-of-sheet.

I repeat the main reason "The Rage" stands tall in my view: Its depiction of the social dynamics of high school life and the potential glory & shame thereof rings true. I know because I experienced it. So your accusations that it's fake, hackneyed or whatever are inaccurate.

Okay, now you can have the last word.

My 150 (or so) favorite movies:
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls070122364/

[–] 10 years ago

[deleted]

[–] KinksRock 10 years ago

I think it was misguided to make a sequel, just as I think it is misguided to make a remake (and there have been two that I know of). That being said, I didn't think this sequel was awful. It covers a relevant topic. Just recently, a guy got into trouble for sexual assault that happened as part of a contest like the one in this film. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2720152/Graduate-prestigious-boarding-school-attended-John-Kerry-accused-raping-girl-15-contest-seniors-conquests.html

Jaan Pehechan Ho

[–] Wuchakk 10 years ago

Thanks for the link. I don't mind sequels as long as they're done well and give us a different take on the same basic story or continuing it, staying true to the tone that was set. "The Rage" accomplishes this imho.

My 150 (or so) favorite movies:
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls070122364/

[–] ScorpionTDC 10 years ago

I'd certainly disagree about Rachel being interesting, let alone even sympathetic. Considering she wanted to be best friends with the people who drove HER best friend to suicide, I only wanted her to die horribly. Awful actress too

Death Awaits (Horror forum)
http://w11.zetaboards.com/Death_Awaits/index/

[–] Wuchakk 10 years ago

I'd certainly disagree about Rachel being interesting,

She was leagues more interesting than Carrie in the original, not that I dislike the original film, just that Rachel is a way more interesting character.

let alone even sympathetic. Considering she wanted to be best friends with the people who drove HER best friend to suicide

They didn't drive her best friend to suicide; it was one of the guys playing that bang-as-many-chicks-as-possible game who devastated her and then she decided to handle the situation by committing suicide.

And Rachel didn't want to be "best friends" with the more popular kids at school, but they were friends of Jesse, her beloved. Jesse was the one person in her 17-years who taught her that love was real, which she didn't believe in beforehand. As such, she decided to go to the party because Jesse genuinely wanted her to go and, furthermore, she was inspired to stop being an outcast and try associating with people from the more popular groups at school. Unfortunately, like in the original film, it was a trap orchestrated by a handful of the popular kids -- a wicked few -- and certainly not all of them.

My 150 (or so) favorite movies:
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls070122364/

[–] SillyGayBoy 10 years ago

Definitely a better movie with a better story. I thought the remake was better but just rewatched both and, nope, Carrie 2 kicks its ass.

[–] 10 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Explorerfrey10 10 years ago

I was a bit disappointed with the sequel. I expected a little more about the world and Chamberlain after Carrie White´s rampage and its relation with the new school and the plot could have been more elaborate.

[–] dntbreathe 10 years ago

The original Carrie is only good because of the performances and score but no way is it worse than this pointless cash-in.

Rachel is a much more interesting character than Carrie in the original film

How? She was just a boring goth who loved her friend and had powers. Oh, and she has a crush on a guy and her mother left her. Carrie was interesting because you never knew if she was going to feel sad, happy, or use her powers during specific scenes.

and Jesse is really attracted to Rachel -- even loves her -- rather than Tommy just doing his girlfriend a favor and feeling sorry for Carrie in the original.

I did really like the character of Jesse and he gave a MUCH better performance than William Kat, so I agree with you there. I also felt like Tommy was TOO attracted to Carrie at the prom scene and I'm sure the writers forgot he was Sue's boyfriend. Though I hated the actor who played him, the latest Carrie remake got his character right.

Also, the thin plot of the original is clearly padded -- unimportant scenes are drawn-out to almost twice the length they need to be -- and this makes the movie seem long at 98 minutes and some parts boring.

I do agree about the original being very slow and I thought the second act was boring but I didn't find any scenes to be drawn out. Most were 2 or 3 minutes at best. The film just bored me but the scenes weren't drawn-out.

"The Rage," by contrast, runs 104 minutes but it doesn't seem as long (or boring) as the original because the story and characters are more interesting and the film isn't padded.

You are saying the word "characters" like there is a whole bunch of them. Carrie has about six characters that relate to the plot but The Rage only has Rachel, Jesse, and Ms. Collins. I'm not counting the bullies because they were very unmemorable.

Don't take this to mean I don't like the original -- I think it was great as the original film and iconic

I disagree. It's an insult to the source material with some horrible editing and pacing but that's besides the point.

but "The Rage" features an overall more interesting story and characters.

It's almost the exact same as the original Carrie minus a goth lead, no religious parents (besides Rachel's mother who is only in it for three minutes), modernization, gore, and Ms. Collins planning to take Rachel's mother out of the mental institution. Oh, and there's a party instead of a prom.

[–] Wuchakk 10 years ago

no way is it worse than this pointless cash-in.

You're phasing it in the negative, like I don't like the original "Carrie," which isn't the case. I just like "The Rage" better because it's more compelling and has more interesting characters. That said, some parts of "Carrie" are better than the sequel, like the entire prom sequence.

She was just a boring goth who loved her friend and had powers. Oh, and she has a crush on a guy and her mother left her.

She wasn't an uber-goth; she was basically a social outcast but refused to allow it to make her weak. She didn't even desire to be part of the "popular crowd." Because of her past she didn't believe in authentic love; that is, until she met Jesse.

Carrie was interesting because you never knew if she was going to feel sad, happy, or use her powers during specific scenes.

Carrie's home/school situation was pathetic and it makes the viewer sympathize with her, but IMHO she was uninteresting as a person and I find it unbelievable that Tommy was even a little enamored with her at the prom. They didn't have anything in common and it was impossible for him to have a conversation of any depth with her; she was too weak, needy and pathetic. This only works in making the prom scene so horrifying because all her pent-up anger comes gushing to the fore. Beyond this, however, she's a boring character -- sympathetic, absolutely, but not interesting.

The film just bored me but the scenes weren't drawn-out.

Either way, we agree that it had palpable boring stretches.

You are saying the word "characters" like there is a whole bunch of them.

Yes, I'm including some of the bullies, like the dude that Jesse clashes with (I forget his name). They're essentially the villains and therefore paper thin, but I found them interesting in the sense that they were true-to-life -- reminding me of people I knew in school, etc.

It's an insult to the source material with some horrible editing and pacing but that's besides the point.

I never read the book, so I wouldn't know.

It's almost the exact same as the original Carrie minus a goth lead, no religious parents (besides Rachel's mother who is only in it for three minutes), modernization, gore, and Ms. Collins planning to take Rachel's mother out of the mental institution. Oh, and there's a party instead of a prom.

Rachel isn't just a quasi-goth, she's essentially the express opposite of Carrie, which changes the entire tone of the sequel even though it has the same basic plot. The absence of the religious-wacko mother also completely changes the tone and makes the story much less annoying. And then there's the addition of a genuine romance between Rachel and Jesse; there was no romantic/true-love angle in the original.

My 150 (or so) favorite movies:
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls070122364/

[–] Dark_Phoenix89 10 years ago

I like the original more, but I also really love this film as well (better than both remakes combined).

I rate both an 8/10.

"Speak of the Devil, and He shall appear."