MovieChat Forums > Higher Learning (1995) Discussion > Black Racism

Black Racism

posted 19 years ago by the_asmodeon
189 replies | jump to latest

Why don't I see any of the black people on the board protesting this film?

Some aspects of the film are very good. Black racism is displayed with nuance, and even a degree of sympathy, warmth and intelligence. It's not made up to be a load of PC *beep* it has depth, it has its reasons. Then look at the other side of the coin: white racism (which is the dominant theme of the film) is universally portrayed with condescension. It is a purely stupid, simple, deranged, manic, insecure, and childish thing, which has no root in any real greivances. Do any of the black people on the board seriously believe that's how it is?

The black guys in the film have a real cause for their racism - basically, the white guys racism and discrimination. But the white guys racism doesn't have much of a cause, it would seem. It's largely due to the white guy being envious, immature, afraid, and pathetic. He was abused as a kid, he can't compete with the non-whites at school, and he's gay. Sure, the blacks do some trivial provocation and "attitude" every once in a while, but it's the white guy who blows it say out of proportion. He's deranged. And that's about it.

Is there a single black person on the board who found this a bit too rightious?

The difference between this movie and X, is that X doesn't try to injustify white racism. The white racism of Higher Learning is the work of a condescending black man.

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

As I explained on another post on this board, Black people can't be racist. White people are racist on the other hand (please see my other post!).

EVERY ACTION HAS A REACTION..

Black prejudice/discrimination is a direct reaction to white racism. And of course John Singleton would portray it was such. Whites created the system of racism to keep POC's subordinated. What's good about that? Discrimination and/prejudice from POC's isn't good either, but really...is that truly hurting whites? (How dare POC's treat whites the way whites treat them...that's ubsurd right?)

[–] gsanchet 19 years ago

From what I understood, Power + Prejudice = Racism. Any power that one group holds over another group can be turned to racism if the group in power is prejudice against that group.

During the LA Riots, Korean businesses were burned to the ground because the rioters (who were mostly African American) disliked the idea that Koreans had owned businesses in their part of the town. The majority had power (which is a group of individuals who had physical power) and were prejudice against those businesses because of the race of those owners and therefore performed racist acts (i.e. burning down the business) to the owner's livelihoods.

There weren't any "white people" involved with this violence. Sure, the riot started after the trial, but the point of the violence shot out to those who wanted to feel powerful...affecting the lives of those who had nothing to do with the original point of violence.

Violence is a power. To hold that violence over another due to race is still racism.

- g

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

NO WHITE PEOPLE? Come on...i don't believe that one.

And I don't agree that that instance is racism...discriminatory/prejudiced? yes. I never said that violence and hate can't come from POC's. I just said they can't be racist

[–] gsanchet 19 years ago

>>>NO WHITE PEOPLE? Come on...i don't believe that one.

Okay, let me retract that. Can we agree that the LA riots started based on the verdict by the Rodney King trial and that most of those instigating violence were African Americans?

>>> And I don't agree that that instance is racism...discriminatory/prejudiced? yes. I never said that violence and hate can't come from POC's. I just said they can't be racist <<<

I don't agree. Prejudice is simply prejudging based on preconcieved notions. Racism is discriminating due to race and having the dominant role above another race. This dominance is a form of power over another group.

Could violence not be considered a power above another group?

- g

[–] jatwell22 19 years ago

What in the hell is wrong with you. Are you racist? Anybody is capable of being racist. Just because your black, doesn't mean you don't hate.

[–] the_asmodeon 19 years ago

I must agree. The responses of Ajat demonstrate my point much more effectively than anything I could write.

Ajat: my point is that the main cause of racism, prejudice and hatred against a race, in daily life, is the actions of the *beep* individuals of that race. IE, both sides have a reason for prejudice against the other, it's not just the whites who can act like *beep* to blacks. Blacks are mean to "whitey" as well, and often.

Propaganda plays a heavy role, to be sure; black racists read and see material about *beep* whites, and white racists read and see material about *beep* blacks. But the most important reason for black anger, hate, and racism against whites is their experience in real life, with real, white racists - it's not all an illusion, BLACKS ARE SUSPICIOUS OF WHITES FOR A REASON: *DIRECT EXPERIENCE*. You agree with this, I'm certain. But you refuse to see that it can possibly go the other way around, and that many whites are racist towards blacks because of experience with blacks who are spiteful, hateful, selfish and racist towards whites, for no good reason.

*
I can imagine, for example, that you've inspired an amount of racism against blacks. I probably do the same, by provoking you. :) But, it is worth it, to have this important fact laid clearly on the table. If you can't agree now, you might later, and readers will certainly learn from your response... I might as well.

[–] missella-19 19 years ago

That is so true jatwell22. I find a lot of Mexicans to be prejudice against blacks.

[–] alouis 18 years ago

I think the point that was being made is that there's a difference between actions that are PREJUDICED (which; in and of itself; is bad) and RACIST (which is institutionally supported).

RACISM = racial prejudice + the institutional power to oppress an entire group based on that prejudice. Contrary to what the Dictionary might say, that's the definition most applicable to today's world...

[–] t1380 18 years ago

Very biased and misguided definition

[–] 18 years ago

[deleted]

[–] ajatcollege 17 years ago

Re: Black Racism

by alouis

I think the point that was being made is that there's a difference between actions that are PREJUDICED (which; in and of itself; is bad) and RACIST (which is institutionally supported).

RACISM = racial prejudice + the institutional power to oppress an entire group based on that prejudice. Contrary to what the Dictionary might say, that's the definition most applicable to today's world...

___________________________

I agree. And hello to all my fans ;)

[–] pixieprincess83 19 years ago

Excuse me my dad is a former LAPD officer and most of the people who were involved in the riot were blacks and hispanics, and a few whites. Overall it was the poorer people.

It's not what people do to you that defines who you are, it's what you do to them.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] xlucasthebandx 19 years ago

Black People can't be racist, that itself is a racist remark

You're a complete brainwashed idiot.

I have known plenty of black people that are racist, and make racist remarks. I had a problem at school once with some black kids calling me a spic or wetback, I went to mostly black school in Missouri, I brought it up to the principal who was black, and he insunated that I was stupid, later I I saw him high five the kids who kept calling me spic and wetback.

So don't ever tell me black people can't be racist, I know first hand they can be.

[–] skenny9000 19 years ago

Racism is discrimination perpetrated by a majority on a minority based on race. It depends on the situation. If you are at a mainly black school then it is racism, but if like in the movie you are part of a minority it is self defense, trying to protect yourself from discrimination.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] muloobutter24 18 years ago

hello xlucasthebandx i know how you feel i went to a all hispanic school and i was in the third grade and the kids kept calling me a *beep* and calling my friend who was a hispanic female a *beep* lover though at the time for some weird reason by the grace of god it didnt bother me THAT MUCH but it hurt when my friend said she cant hang around me anymore cause im making her life hard.

[–] jatwell22 19 years ago

Black prejudice/discrimintion is from ignorance. Subordinated? Is that the way you really feel. Have some self respect, some dignity. Enough whining. Do you have any education or do you just get your ignorance from movies like this?

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

yes, i'm probably more educated than you. to be subordinated, there is a system holding you in a lower place than someone else...that doesn't mean that you're not doing anything to try to get out of that spot...

No matter what is said, my opinion isn't going to change...I still beleive that Black people can't be racist...and like i said, prejudice and discriminatory, yes...racist, no.

[–] warm4yrfrm 19 years ago

>>>No matter what is said, my opinion isn't going to change...I still beleive that Black people can't be racist...and like i said, prejudice and discriminatory, yes...racist, no.<<<

Please define what racist means then. I'm confused. Was there no racism among the jurors in the OJ trial? Everyone was holding their breath about the verdict-but if people got to see the makeup of the jury then no one would have cared. Cchran played the race card so much because of the makeup of the jury. He had every right to. Job #1 was to get his client off. And he had the perfect jury to do it with and played their racist beliefs about whites and white cops and white women and got a killer to go free. What Cochran did was no different than what white lawyers did with their all white juries over and over again in the South against blacks. Does that fact make it right? No way. Racism is racism. Those all white juries were wrong and so was Oj's jury. Racism can be practised by blacks and no matter who uses it they are wrong-good people always get hurt by it.

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

prejudice + power = racism.

I'm not even gonna talk about the OJ trial because I don't think he was guilty. If you tink back to the announcement of the vertict Blk ppl were relieve and white ppl were outraged...But that's not the point.

I think there's a difference in impact. Racism holds people back, prejudice and discrimination is hurtful.

[–] Movie_Buff_Brad 12 years ago

"I'm not even gonna talk about the OJ trial because I don't think he was guilty."

I bet you felt stupid after the release of "If I Did It".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hII5rQEtoic

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] roobad 19 years ago

OK, So I guess women can't be sexist to men then? Hmmm, I don't think so.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"YOU are not educated. If you were you would not make such remarks on here. People come on here to discuss issues about the film, and you preach that white people created racism. I would like to know WHERE you get your proff of this? Racism the belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others, if you say whites createdthis, than your saying we are superior. We are not, we the people are suppose to be equal. When people like you keep harping on it, then you are breaking down the walls of equality. It is as if you WANT racism to prevalent, you want African Americans to suffer. Why do you want this? AND I will be happy to debate you about the Scientific origins of race. If you are as educated as you say you are??? I will prove and explain that YES black, white, asian and all other ethnicities CAN and WILL always have racist people within their cultures. You cannot change this, but by saying African Americans are not racist is probably the most "stupid" thing I have ever heard"

Not that I think your are racist or anything, because you don't seem to be, but white americans did pretty much create racism. Although forms of slavery have existed through out much of human history, America was the first society to have slavery based soley on skin color. And through out America's history the superiority of whites over blacks was perpetuated by supreme court rulings like the dredd scott decision, which said that blacks were considered property, and the constitution didn't apply to blacks. This was used as a reason to keep blacks from having a vote, ability to be educated, get a descent job, etc.

America was also the only country to segregate a whole race of people. It was suppose to be seperate but equal, but it was not equal. Whites had better facilities, more resources, more opportunities period. This didn't start to end until the late 1960's, which wasn't very long ago. So it's no wonder racism issues still exist. And whites saying that they weren't born yet and had nothing to do with it does not mean it will go away. Young blacks didn't have anything to do with it either, but we still feel the effects of the past.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] t1380 19 years ago

That's right QL, that jerk is just in denial as most of his hateful ilk is, that's why racism will be with us for quite a while yet.

GOT DAMN IT! MF'ER'S, WHY I OUGHTA!

dude, you didn't read and listen to his problem carefully. He was abused by black staff and black patients not only because he was white but because he was also gay. A black guy said he wanted to be treated by a black nurse to him! what was that all about? It looks like you are in denial of the fact that blacks who have power could be as racist as their white counterparts on the situational level and there are many similar cases, so the jerk is you.

[–] t1380 19 years ago

Young blacks didn't have anything to do with it either, but we still feel the effects of the past.

hey quinn larkins, America can be racist society where whites have the predominant power, however it does not excuse blacks to join gangs and live on welfare, instead of going out there and search for jobs. The past is not an excuse for the present

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"hey quinn larkins, America can be racist society where whites have the predominant power, however it does not excuse blacks to join gangs and live on welfare, instead of going out there and search for jobs. The past is not an excuse for the present"

No, the past is not an excuse for anyone joining a gang or living on welfare, but it is a factor. And you have to understand that to realize why a larger percentage of blacks than whites are on welfare or are in gangs.
But there are also whites who are in gangs or live on welfare, I'm sure they have their own personal reasons like everyone else.

But the main reason for anyone being on welfare or commiting crime is poverty. And it was the oppression of blacks for most of america's history that has caused the higher rate of poverty in black families. For generations blacks couldn't be educated or earn money. This was followed by generations of blacks who earned far less than whites, and still couldn't be educated. All the while whites earned money, saved, passed down money and property to their children which they used to increase the family wealth.

These are the factors you have to consider when you ask why such a large percentage of blacks are in jail or on welfare. It's not because blacks don't care, it's because blacks have far less resources than whites to achieve the same goals.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] t1380 19 years ago

Listen Brick, why don't you read some books like "Illiberal Education," or "The Voices of Conservative Blacks," so you can learn a more open-minded perspective and then we will talk?

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"I refuse to acknowledge their arguments any more. They will never believe people are equal. It is funny look at howmuch they are on this board, look at their comments. They are constantly referring to the White race as "supreme", "the antagonizers", "rulers", "all racist", I work part time as a social worker for MI Works and Ibring in their comments and what they say on this board, and the African Americans in my classes laugh at them and saytheymake up a very small population of the community of African Americans. They cannot get past the racial issues because without "racism" they have nothing to hold on to. They want racism to stay alive. Thank you for seeing my post and understanding the frustration many of us white people go through regarding racism and prejudice."

Ken, I haven't seen any blacks calling whites supreme or all racists. I've just been stating historical facts that have contributed to the current condition of black families and communities. You say forget about them like these incidents happened a thousand years ago, the main ones happened just a few decades ago. So I will not forget them, because poor black areas did not get into the current state they are in soley because they never tried to achieve something better. The governments allowance of blacks to be discriminated against is what contributed to it. And in return, whites benifited at the cost of black families remaing poor. This is a fact, not a complaint. Blacks should and do take responsibility today for everything they do. But if the black welfare moms in your class laugh at the historical racism that has turned a large percentage of blacks into second class citizens, then I feel sorry for them, and their children.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] t1380 19 years ago

he maybe lying but maybe not. one of my friends who lives in philly and who is black thinks that those black homeless people he sees in his neighborhood did that to themselves, which is being homeless, by saying that some white society did not make them bums.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] t1380 19 years ago

nobody has any excuse to be homeless, black, white, or yellow and that's that!

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"nobody has any excuse to be homeless, black, white, or yellow and that's that!"

They may not have excuses, but I'm sure they have reasons. It can be as simple as a man loses his job, soon he can't make the next months rent or mortgage, and he loses his home. This is where wealth comes in to play. White families have more wealth than blacks in general, so a larger percentage of whites than blacks either have savings that they can use in tough times, or get family members to help. A large percentage of blacks have neither since we got such a late start in having equal opportunities, so we have less resources to use in tough times.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] pkabooo69 18 years ago

**quote: Although forms of slavery have existed through out much of human history, America was the first society to have slavery based soley on skin color**

WRONG! The american white man was know where near the first. world wide and throughout history damn near every country that has ever held power has enslaved or tryed to exterminate the black race. Re-read some of your history or study a little more.

Rasism is retarded on all sides. Its plain stupid. ANYONE CAN BE RACIST REGARDLESS OF RACE. Truth of the matter is many americans are friggin ignorant, oversensitive, scared of the truth and selfish.....oh and completely full of s*it. Compared to most of the rest of the world america is soooo far behind the power curve with issues like this. Sad fact is racism toward the black comunity is promoted by black people. In america many black people LOVE to segregate themselves from normal productive society, and make a point to talk, walk and act different. BS things like "black history month" and "BET" doesnt help either. They help to segregate one race from others. I refuse to say "African American" unless the person is 3rd gen or less African. Americans are Americans.

Why can I say all this? Experience. I have earned the right to say what I know about America as I served my country in a time of war. With my world brothers of many races and nationalities, any of us will tell you we are all human, race means nothing. I also am telling you all this out of my experience of living in 27 countries worldwide 1st to 3rd world. Whats my race? What does race matter?

[–] ClaudioAdriano 19 years ago

So, ajatcollege, what you are saying is that Black People can't be racist because they are black ?

That's the dumbest comment I've seen in my life.

http://claudioadriano.deviantart.com

[–] bjean280 19 years ago

sorry but i have to agree that every group has a racist or predjudice person in it. I have seen whites who are racist against others. same goes for asians, blacks, jews , adians...to say blacks cannot be racist or predjudice is ridiculous. i am black and most predjudism and ethno centric behavior i have faced in my life came from black people. and i have seen blacks making fun and insulting asians(arabs, orientals and indians) and hispanics brcause they are not from this country now you tell me that these people have some kind of power over blacks or have done things to oppress us.

yes i am black and i hate it when we try to justify our actions by using this whoaw is me attitude. you can't tell me these behavior are the result of being opressed. for once i would to see some kind of common since from all posters instead of the my way or the highway approach.

[–] jacobdtober 19 years ago

bjean280, you are the reason i am not a racist. you give me faith in the black community.

http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=14158447

[–] muloobutter24 18 years ago

i agree we a black ppl have to realize we are capable of oppressing just as much as be oppressed. And to all Racist we all need to get to know eachother more that would solve alot of problems.

[–] t1380 18 years ago

I agree with muloobutter24 100% but Singleton believed otherwise and he showed in the movie that only whites are oppressors.

[–] hammerfall__79 19 years ago

"As I explained on another post on this board, Black people can't be racist."

I think everyone can see the contradiction in that statement. Such a racist thing to say.

[–] t1380 19 years ago

Yes, prejudice from POC's does hurt whites and guess where, on campuses? I am white, have been going to 3 colleges so far, and I have noticed that POC are allowed to say whatever they want, even if it is a direct offense to somebody whereas whites are always being silenced by professors. If you a white, and you say a word "yo," the professors would criticize you and say you are insensitive to diversity. On the other hand, I have seen bunch of black and hispanic guys saying "Jew bastards" and nobody said nothing about it. I mean, everybody is trying to be politically correct. What about freedom of speech? Looks like, freedom of speech is only allowed to POC on American colleges. This is *beep* Whites are being expelled from schools for speaking the truth about what is happening in our country but blacks and hispanics are heralded as poster children even for talking smack. So, think about it again.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] keepitpimpin 19 years ago

Ajatcollege, you obviously don't understand the meaning of the word "racism." Racism is the unjustified belief that one race is superior to another race. That's it. You are attaching absurd notions of a cause-and-effect relationship that simply have nothing to due with the issue.

It may be true that the major of black racism is the result of years of white racism (I do not completely agree with this assertion either, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt). But feelings of black superiority over whites, regardless of the cause for this belief, is still racism. So yes, black people can be racist. Just as Whites, Asians, Hispanics, and all the other people of the word can.

[–] celtic-10 19 years ago

i'm biracial. i've experience racism from the brown and white spectrums. to say that black people CANNOT be racist is wrong.
ANYONE who harbours negative feelings towards people of a specific race, is RACIST. it doesn't matter what's happened in the past. all that matters is what you carry in your heart NOW.

look at Maya Angelou. she's not racist. after all she's gone through she still has it in her to see the good in people, and not hold ALL white people responsible for the crimes of the past.

i'm also gay, and can tell you i've experienced more homophobia from the black community, which i personally find disgusting. all this talk about how much We as a group have struggled, and fought for equality, and still, the black community as a whole has stood by and allowed homophobic attitudes to run rampant.

anyone who's ever experienced discrimination firsthand should never, ever stand by and let another minority group become the targets of bigotry. where is the compassion, the empathy? to not join the fight is cowardly and shameful.

"but ya ARE Blanche! Ya ARE in that chair!!"

[–] Cheena71 19 years ago

I realize it is July 19, 2006 and these issues were discussed last year but I'm going to comment on a few things regardless. I agree with "ajatcollege" when he says "....black prejudice/discrimination is a direct reaction to white racism." I don't mean to offend anyone however I hope that these few comments will cause everyone to think.

As I said, I agree with the previous comment. The difficult thing for white people to understand is that they can never TRULY understand what it is to be a minority. If a white man goes to a conference, for example, that includes predominately black attendees as well as presenters, it may be uncomfortable for a little while. Let's go as far as to say a few comments were mad against the white male. After a period of time, his anger will dissipate. WHY? He won't face it again? Please understand, minorities (blacks) face it more frequently. After a period of time, it causes bitterness, anger, and resentment. I'll use this term lightly, but this is "your world." You face opposition when it comes to opportunities but black people have to work twice as hard in proving ourselves. Where I work, I offer ideas, I am a team player, I try to suggest what would work best for the company as a whole. Time and time again, I am rejected. I notice that years later, the idea "pops up" and it's implemented. It isn't about credit (in this regard) but I stated that more because I began to notice my ideas were rejected not because of the content but because of my color. Sorry, got off track...

When it comes to Affirmative Action, many (not all) white people say that it should be dismissed, it limits opportunities for others. Some black people didn't have the chance to attend private schools but that doesn't mean they are not intelligent. Though college entrance is based on grades, there are factors that may have prohibited SOME people from getting better grades. For example, I know some who raised their brothers/sisters while working and though education should have been a priority, it wasn't always possible to deem it so. Does that mean that this person wasn't able to perform in college? NO! In fact, this person is doing very well for himself! Anyway, dismissal of Affirmative Action sounds prejudicial/racist to me. Think about it!

As far as this movie...take it from me, a black female who attended a Big Ten, predominately white university. THIS STUFF HAPPENS!!! At our university, there wasn't a "violent shooting," however there were fights, there was unequal behavior from the campus police!! It still exists. Just because you can't wrap your mind around it doesn't mean it doesn't happen! Did anyone see "Black White" produced by Ice Cube that aired on FX? This involved several people who lived in "opposite" lifestyles for a period of time. For example, one white couple was made up to be a black couple and had to live as such. It was a very good example of how being put in "our shoes," for a period, can help you see a small portion of what we deal with.

This isn't to say that white people aren't mistreated! I don't agree with all behavior from black people. I will say that we are viewed as angry and bitter (or "what's their problem?") without really taking the time to find out why. Yeah, you can say that the black people in this day and age weren't shackled and bound as slaves as they were years ago but that doesn't mean that the mentality of ALL white people has changed to reflect that we are equal NOW!

I MUST say this, I don't remember the person who said the young lady did not get raped, she "changed her mind during the act of sex...." WOW! She fought! She got to a point where she did NOT want to continue and as the slogan states, "no means no" at any time.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] starship_mongo 18 years ago

What do you mean blacks cant be racist? all races can be rasists. *beep* retard.

[–] snowlovermikayla 18 years ago

So then why are white people called slurs when they don't do anything wrong?

[–] Mokosh 18 years ago

What?...

Racism exists in every group...and it still does today...and will probably exist in the future if our social structure doesn't change dramatically.

[–] 18 years ago

[deleted]

[–] HollywoodVenom 17 years ago

if u think black people cant be racists then seriuosly go kill yourself cause u live under a rock. They have a reason to hate, *beep* you, ur the racist piece of *beep*

[–] redvonmunster 17 years ago

ajatcollege

As I explained on another post on this board, Black people can't be racist. White people are racist on the other hand (please see my other post!).

____________________________

Most ignorant statement ever.

[–] foreverblu 16 years ago

your a racist tool

i have to return some video tapes

[–] LexiLex 16 years ago

Black people can't be racist? Do you NOT hear yourself? I'm black and I think that's absolute BS! It's as if your saying that if blacks harbored any racial hostility towards whites, then it's ok. ANY form of racism is pathetic in my eyes.

[–] law573 15 years ago

Wow, did you parrot your professor directly or did you change enough words to make it seem like an original thought?

[–] osopestoso 13 years ago

100% *beep* People of color are some of the MOST racist SOBs Ive ever met, and that against members of theier OWN race. Gat lost.
"They sucked his brains out!"

[–] teryolaw 13 years ago

Anyone who says that black people can't be racist is an idiot who is a part of the whole problem with racism.

The point of this movie is that racism is racism. And ANYONE can be racist, it doesn't matter if they are black or white. It doesn't matter who "STARTED" it. As soon as you discriminate and generalize people because of their skin colour, as soon as you think that "they are all the same" because of a few bad apples - You are a racist.

And the black people in this movie are worse racists then anyone, because they if anyone should KNOW how unfair it is to judge people based on their skin. But they didn't learn from the stupidity that they were exposed to, instead they became that stupidity themselves.

[–] gsanchet 19 years ago

>>> Some aspects of the film are very good. Black racism is displayed with nuance, and even a degree of sympathy, warmth and intelligence. It's not made up to be a load of PC *beep* it has depth, it has its reasons. Then look at the other side of the coin: white racism (which is the dominant theme of the film) is universally portrayed with condescension. It is a purely stupid, simple, deranged, manic, insecure, and childish thing, which has no root in any real greivances. Do any of the black people on the board seriously believe that's how it is? >>>>

I would agree with you to a point. The leader of the skinheads actually makes a point, saying how they would actually benefit from Remy staying in college. He was a bright kid and the leader points this out that he shouldn't be like he is. I believe he actually wants a better life for Remy. When Remy dies, he becomes a martyr instead of a hero for the cause. Remy isn't given the choice to find a way out of such a polarizing situation. He has no grasp of how to make his way out of it. He doesn't believe in himself so he follows the dogma quite closely to the point of dying for a cause because those people believed in him.

Malik has a choice. He can either let himself get carried away in the violence of such polarizing thoughts that, for the most part, his friends would support. Or Malik could choose another path of his own making. That's the point of the Ice Cube character and of the Professor. They try and follow their own path of their own making. It's never a clear path, but it's a path they choose regardless of peer pressure. And, moreso than anything else, they try to impart that knowledge on Malik.

I agree with the director that Dustin Hoffman would've made a better professor than Lawrence Fishburne, if only to show that the situation isn't this black and white issue as one would think.

The idea wasn't to make this a polarizing story, but a story based around how people find themselves in a place where old ideas a challenged. For some, it becomes a place where you find something to believe in strongly to the point of not thinking for yourself (like Remy). For some, it becomes a place where tragedy changes your perception of how to approach love and relationships (like Kristen). For some, it becomes of choice of choosing your life and having a life chosen for you by your peers (like Malik).

I can see this viewpoint getting lost in the whole "white/black" issue, but I agree with another reviewer that his silent moments are much more poignant than his violent moments. I remember the part where Wayne takes a condom from his nightstand getting applause from the audience when I saw it in 1995...even though it was such a subtle moment. I also remember liking the montage of Remy/Kristen/Malik putting up posters in their room and the music that reflected each personality.

- little kon-el

[–] the_asmodeon 19 years ago

It is true that the skin leader does have about a scratch worth of personality. But how does he compare to Ice-Cube, Gsanchet?

[–] milesb757 19 years ago

Dustin Hoffman...I can cosign that for sure.

This post seems the most level headed main reason being the issue isn't black and white, it's way to complex for that. It's funny how people always say those two words, black and white, but don't realize that what there talking about cannot be set in "black" and "white" stances. I wonder if movies like this and Crash have to be so extreme for its themes to be heard. The silent moments are the most important, and could have made enough of an impact. The girl Kristin, getting stares from people, Remy, seeing so many different races. I would have loved to see a scene with Deja and her roommates accusing her of stealing. I think that is one reason why the movie wasn't taken seriously, plus I hate the colors, just the colors alone say bubblegum and I can't stand that look in a movie with such a serious topic.

Singleton made Fudge a good character, 6 years in school, trying to be a knowledgeable authority but while still speaking from the knowledgeable end he still would regress to fighting and not going to class, Fudge touched me in a special way...I'll be in school for 5 years.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

"White people do everything for them..."

Oh, please explain...I'm just an unedumakated negro...

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

Why don't you just face it...you are racist, and that's the way you like it.

You have stereotypical beliefs about every race of people, and you chose not to look past that.

You say that you know that not all Blacks are "lazy and primive" (do you mean primitive?), but that the media doesn't focus on that. If that is so, then why do you chose to concentrate on the negative aspects of every race except those concerning white people?

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] holy_materia 19 years ago

Is this thread about racism, or is it supposed to be promoting racist, essentialist values itself? Because I'm seeing a lot more of the latter, especially on your part.

"Well if it weren't for the Europeans, you'd be sitting in a bush right now waiting for a gazelle or something to pass by. But instead you live comfortably in the United States, speak some English, and have many options to pass your time with instead of wearing a grass skirt and skinning lizards. But then again, maybe you would've been better off wearing a bone through your nose and clicking in Sandawe or some other crap after all."

Well, russianbear, I'm African... so, in honor of the incredibly profound comment you've just made, I would like to take this moment to thank the good White Man for civilizing me! I only wish he could have saved my family from the Heart of Darkness sooner! Or can you not understand me through my "clicking?"

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] groucho_de_sade 19 years ago

Don't you love it when people make soul-drainingly racist statements and then chalk it up to "political correctness" when you call them on it?
What an a____le.

I don't want some renegade necrophile princess as MY roommate!

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

Think what you want, but I dont consider that racist...

Prejudiced and hateful? Yes. Racist? No...

...in my opinion...

Racism includes some type of power differential...there was none in your example.

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

Why are you "sorry"??

[–] Kidmarvelman 19 years ago

Race is nothing more than a weak attempt to attach DNA to culture. Sadly people were and still are naive enough to believe it.

The concept of race is pointless social construct to take away human individuality and use as a security blanket for insecure tools.

[–] Blazin_Angel 19 years ago

A definition of Racism: The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Do you honestly believe that, that can only be applied to white people? That black people don't have those traits?

Sometimes you're the bug, and sometimes you're the windshield...

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

discrimination and prejudice do NOT equal racism.

so yes, i DO think that black people and other people of color have those traits, but I DON'T accept that definition as racism.

Racism = power + prejudice...that's what I believe

[–] Blazin_Angel 19 years ago

That may be true of institutional racism but applying that definition to individual racism I believe is just an excuse for the minoritys to absolve any accountability for their racist actions.

Bottom line, I respect your opinion but I don't agree with your definition of Racism.

Sometimes you're the bug, and sometimes you're the windshield...

[–] ccr1633 19 years ago

It's clear that ajatcollege needs to do two things:

1. Consult a dictionary
2. Develop some common sense

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

Definitions are not right or wrong...they are accepted or not...that's why thry often change.

Accept what you want and I will do the same

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] kmazzocco3 19 years ago

I was just wandering around here and found this ridiculous thread. I feel sorry for you, ajatcollege. I really do. Not because of your race, sex or age, but because of your attitude. I noticed that you have to keep reminding everyone that you are educated. Who cares? You keep saying that racism = "this" + "this" + a pinch of "that", yet in your last comment you said that definitions don't really mean much, they're just accepted. Odd, seeing that you stand very firm on your definition of racism. Do you have many friends? Just asking because you seem very argumentative and most people instinctively steer clear of malcontents. Oh well. To each his own. You will have to reply to this, I'm sure. I will take no offense to anything you say, because it's just in your nature to have to have the last word. Have a great day!!

[–] OggieBoogieBoy 19 years ago

rac·ism Listen: [ rszm ]
n.

The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

End of story.

Fact is, whites have subjected others races to Racism on a massive scale, but they aren't the only ones gulity of racism.

If a black geezer hates me because of the way I look, he's is implying that because my ancestors were a bunch of ignorant, murdering f---wits, then I must have some of those traits myself.

That’s Racism right there.

Now it may be more justifiable, and it may be more understandable, but neither of those things make it any less racist than me making idiotic comments like our ‘Russian’ friend about ‘sitting in bushes in Africa’.

Tit for tat racism gets us nowhere, you only have to look at the middle east to see that.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] abhagwat 19 years ago

Kmazzocco3, way to mask your own insecurities by picking on someone else's. Might be a good idea to grow up and gain some maturity if you ever want to be considered a real adult.

[–] ajatcollege 19 years ago

Swinebaby...I never said anyone was justified in their actions...that's just the way you interpreted it. That's on you not me...

That has become the problem with this entire thread, just as someone else stated before... People interpret what other people say the wrong way. No agreement can come out of this.

[–] Blacktrack 19 years ago

"Well if it weren't for the Europeans, you'd be sitting in a bush right now waiting for a gazelle or something to pass by. But instead you live comfortably in the United States, speak some English, and have many options to pass your time with instead of wearing a grass skirt and skinning lizards. But then again, maybe you would've been better off wearing a bone through your nose and clicking in Sandawe or some other crap after all. "

lol, well that is definately racist.

I think what's important is that every human has an equal chance to live a full and happy life. That, or something like that, should be the goal in my opinion.

All this discrimination on the basis of skin colour is getting tiresome. A metaphor of this could be a man beating his children because he got beat up. There's no good purpose, not even discipline. His kid's grow up and beat their own kids. When does it stop? When one of them stop's being a fing moron and refuses to pass on the *beep* to the next generation.

I guess the problem is, there are so many fing morons in our society, on every side.

For your information Africa was a very advanced contient back in the day. While anglo saxons were still walking on all fours in europe, we figuired out open heart surgery. I hate it when people think of africa they thing of lions and stuff. The reason why africa didnt become a world power because there were so many tribes and all of them couldnt unite so the British came in and made the Contienentwhat it is today

[–] abhagwat 19 years ago

To all the sanctimonious whites on this thread,
Your obsession with semantics has disguised the main theme, both in the movie and in this thread. While all people can be racist, most people keep this within natural limits. Only whites have turned racism into a science. Only whites have destroyed entire cultures and civilizations due to their racism. Only whites refuse to admit their responsibility and persist in denying justice. And only whites sabotage and renege on all attempts at restitution. It is utterly appalling that 140 YEARS after slavery ended and 40 YEARS after the civil rights movement, we *still* have such problems with racism today. This is not the fault of African-Americans. In fact, the history of racism is a history of white people, with other races making guest appearances as victims.

Black racism is a justifiable reaction to white racism, whereas white racism has no rational cause. These two facts are portrayed very well in the film and indeed I find no fault with the director's tone or stylistic emphasis. I fail to understand why others can't follow that simple logic. Furthermore, the hypocritical "Racism is bad except when I do it" double-talk of many of the thread commenters proves Mr. Singleton's point exactly.

[–] warm4yrfrm 19 years ago

>>>Only whites have turned racism into a science. Only whites have destroyed entire cultures and civilizations due to their racism.<<<

Whites haven't turned it into a science you're all confused THEY USED SCIENCE to create a technological edge that enabled them to dominate other races. What you're saying is the purest from of racism. You're saying some innate evil exists in white people that makes them turn racism into a science. Now that POC have the same weapons we see nothing but violence all throughout central Africa. You're a racist pure and simple.

>>>Black racism is a justifiable reaction to white racism, whereas white racism has no rational cause.<<<<

So what you're saying is that racism CAN be justified! Therefore IF some white kids get bullied at school by black kids because they are white then it is understandable if they hate blacks. I mean if you're beaten up or robbed all the time and it's blacks doing it isn't there a rational cause to hate them? Oh wait it has nothing to do with the color of their skin....but whites somehow have this innate drive to "turn racism into a science". If you want to excuse racism then you open the door to all kinds of justifications.

People are people.

[–] abhagwat 19 years ago

Warm4yrfrm - Since your obviously still in school, a bit of advice. You have to take words at face value. Don't start making up intentions and meanings that simply aren't there. Otherwise you're just wasting you're time.

"Now that POC have the same weapons we see nothing but violence all throughout central Africa" - Bingo!

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] abhagwat 19 years ago

thx for proving my point (again)

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] gonzoforsherriff 19 years ago

I am British , and as such, I live in a very racially excepting country where everyone is an equal. As such, I feel as though I stand rather neutrally on the whole race issue, so I submit this question to you; why is it that the black race just can't let the past die?

Never forget the hardships that you're people went through, but why dwell on them and make them the focal points of your life? I live in London, and we have a huge Jewish population, they are respected and excepted the same as anyone, and they don't feel the need to throw the Holocaust around every time that they feel as though they are being oppressed. They have gone through more unspeakable torments than your race will ever know, and they have the dignity and the class to leave that horror in the past and move on into the future. It is also important to note that the Holocaust only happened a little over 50 years ago, and in that small amount of time, they have healed themselves. Sure, equal rights are only about 50 years old in the states, so you do have a valid point there when it comes to racism still being evident in places. But, you are going to find that anywhere you go.

It seems to me that Americans want to let the shameful past of their country be lost to time, but Black people won't let this happen. They want to throw it into the face of the whites whenever it seems necessary. They use it as a weapon, rather than their past. Also, why is it that after the unbelievable struggle for civil rights, blacks created their own racial barriers and made their own type of separatism? I mean, you have black owned businesses that only hire blacks, all black schools, etc. It seems as though blacks want the same rights as whites, but they want nothing to do with them on an interactive level.

[–] bocabonita_amh 19 years ago

Good evening, this reply is to gonzoforsherriff that he/she posted on 3/12/2006. You had some very good points gonzo and I agree with some except the ignorant statement of------- "They (Jews) have gone through more unspeakable torments than your race( I assume you meant Black race) will ever know, and they have the dignity and class to leave that horror in the past and move on into the future".------No intelligent person will dispute the horrors that the Jews have suffured and in some parts of the world still experience, but please realize that it is very stupid to compare racism/disc etc that one certain group experienced to the racism/disc that another group experienced.
Many Black people in the U.S. get upset when you compare slavery,Holocaust,pogroms, and discrimination Jews faced to the slavery,lynchings, riots(that whites started in major cities in the early part of the 20th cen. in the U.S. as a result the Blacks moving North to exscape the oppresive South)redlining, restrictive covenents,Jim Crow, etc that Blacks in the U.S. faced. Or the murder and oppression that our Native American tribes faced (they were practically exterminated). My point is this all races/ethnic groups have experienced racism and discrimination at some point in history, and yes it is best to move on and work for a better future, but it is insensitive to compare groups like that.
Also, you could bone up on your American history in general. Black owned business have been around since Blacks came to America. Today most are located in predominately Black comm. where Whites do not even apply and if they did they probably would be hired. A more prominent Black owned business is PHAT FARM that employs many races. Also Black schools were found because Blacks could not attend schools with Whites. These Black schools flourished i.e. Spelman College, Morehouse College, Howard Univ etc and today they admit students of all races and colors. (Since you want to compare Jews and Blacks please remember that there are several prominent Jewish schools in the U.S.) Also most so-called Black sedparatism is a result of housing crisis in SOME parts of the U.S. Many Blacks and Hispanics cannot afford to live anywhere else, and where they live they naturally start their bussinesses ( stores,car wash,salons, restaurants) I could go on and on but I won't. But one more note---you must be very naive to believe EVERYONE is treated equal in the U.K. I attended college with several British students and they discussed the prejudice faced by Indians, Blacks, and Muslims.

[–] gonzoforsherriff 19 years ago

Thanks for the reply. You have some valid points, and I take them in stride. Forgive me if I overly generalized the points to which I was attempting to make, but I am human am I not?
Firstly, I am a man, I would just like to clear that up. Perhaps it was a bit presumptuous of me to remark on the state of American integration when I am not an American, I was making the claims that I did based on the integration that I have witnessed being British, which can't be that different. Why I generalized "You're race" is because I was replying to someone who had already made it clear to everyone that he was a Black man. As I look back on what I wrote, I do think that I came off a little bit too vehemently about the state of the Jewish populous, so on that end I give apologies.
Lastly, I made the comment that people are treated fairly in my country because when compared to what I have seen and read as apposed to your country, they are. Of course their is prejudice in the U.K., but when compared to the rather shameful history of your country, we are quite muted in comparison. That is not meant to be a statement of pomposity or sarcasm, just simple fact.
Well, that is all that I have to say at the moment. If you have a reply or a question, then I will answer to it. It is not my intention to throw my fists around, or to blatantly ridicule people, just to have conversations. If I offended you, then I do give you my apologies.

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"It seems to me that Americans want to let the shameful past of their country be lost to time, but Black people won't let this happen. They want to throw it into the face of the whites whenever it seems necessary. They use it as a weapon, rather than their past. Also, why is it that after the unbelievable struggle for civil rights, blacks created their own racial barriers and made their own type of separatism? I mean, you have black owned businesses that only hire blacks, all black schools, etc. It seems as though blacks want the same rights as whites, but they want nothing to do with them on an interactive level."

Gonzo, there are some things you need to understand, and then maybe you'll understand why blacks won't just let the past die.

You mentioned the hollocaust. That was an event. It lasted for several years. The oppression of blacks in America was not an event that fits in a timeline, it was a life style, a life style that many white americans went along with willingliy. It's a part of Americas history since the late 1600's, and it includes the events of slavery, lynchings, segregation, KKK, police brutality, racial profiling, and more. It's not one generation or two or three that felt this oppression in some form like Jews, it was experienced my many generations for hundreds of years. It's not just one bad incident that we can forget, it's the mentality by white america of blacks being less than human that is at the heart of the issue.

Another thing you have to understand is that the effects of Jim Crow are evident today. The reason why black families have a higher rate of poverty than whites, why black communities have less resources than whites is because of the effects of segregation. Blacks had to create their own schools was because whites wouldn't allow blacks, but black schools did not have the same resources, and black graduates didn't get the same jobs as their white counter parts. This resulted in black families having less wealth than whites, and it continued for generations. That is why blacks remember the past, because it affects the present.

[–] gonzoforsherriff 19 years ago

Thanks for your thoughts. The way that you have put it does make more sense to me rather than the other guy's thoughts on the matter. Take care.

"Buy the ticket, take the ride!" -Hunter S. Thompson

[–] thelonewolf74 19 years ago

abhagwat wrote:

Black racism is a justifiable reaction to white racism, whereas white racism has no rational cause.

OK thanks for the education, abhagwat. I'll try to keep this in mind the next time I'm walking down a street minding my own business when a bunch of black people swarm me and beat me to a pulp,calling me a stupid cracka or honkey or whatever because my skin colour happens to be the same as the guys who enslaved blacks hundreds of years ago, I'll try not to take it too personally. After all, they're only acting in a normal, rational way to oppression they -- or their ancestors have suffered.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"Im jewish, i seem to remember a whole race of my ancestors being enslaved, tortured and killed by the egyptians. I dont see anyone ever taking responsibility or apologizing to me nor would I expect that. I take responsibility for my life "now"."

Every time I here a jewish person bring up the enslavement of hebrews in ancient egypt when discussing race relations in america, it makes me laugh.
Why would that have any effect on the Jewish community in America today? It happened over 3000 years ago on another continent. Why would america apologize for that? Why would egypt apologize for that? The people that enslaved the Jews were either forced to other regions or whipped out by invading countries.

Blacks in america had to deal with slavery "in" america up into about 140 years ago. And then had to deal with Jim Crow segregation up into about 40 years ago. These events have had a direct impact on the black communities in America. And the american government was directly responsible for allowing it to happen for so long.

[–] whenbeautydies 19 years ago

"Black people can't be racist." That's hilarious. Whoever said that obviously doesn't understand the concept of racism. Anybody is capable of being racist. The very idea that one race is inherently not racist is in itself racism. You, sir/ma'am, are an idiot. Go take a class or take a class on the social construction race.

[–] indigentsoul 19 years ago

Oh God, here it is again; like blood in the water, the sharks come to harp and feast on the oh so controversial topic of Racism, and yes, i am a hypocrite because i am putting up this post in response to the "heated" debate that is surfacing from this one comment. Does this give anyone a clue about human nature? Anything ring a bell in your primitive little brains? We Need Racism, more specifically, we need the power, the domination over groups, races, nationalities, whatever; "Wherever there is fire we will bring the gas" or something like that i think epitomizes the general mentality here. And i'm sure i will receive plenty of little angry messages, the words leaping off the pages, invisible or visible italics, i'm sure this message will not die on its own. The point i'm trying to make is, Racism is provocative because it focuses all of the primitive energies that our savage brethren and ancestors got out of fighting wars, imperializing, and raping other people. And this movie follows with a bang at the end for the exact point i'm making; everyone got real catharsis after the rising action was over; and the black guy and the hippy lesbian girl finally met and wondered Why didn't we meet before? This message probably makes me sound terrible. I'm not trying to be anything but truthful. So doesn't that mean something, how we get such a release out of movies, events, incidents like this; why everyone looks on the shoulder or the center of the road while driving their cars to look at the crash, or the guy getting pulled over for speeding; very convenient, seeing as he's getting the ticket and you're not. So let's all get over this little hump of altruism please, and admit it; we are connected to a bunch of savages that brutalized their fellow man, as well as raping their natural environment that gives them food, shelter, clothing and your basic needs. The topic of Racism is a moot point in my opinion; but I know will continue for it reminds us of the good old days when we were still honest with ourselves in terms of our savage needs. PEACE my brothers.

[–] Blacktrack 19 years ago

Anything ring a bell in your primitive little brains

Allright you could of gone without saying that. I am not racist but i am asking for trouble when i type this. Most crimes aganist man on a major scale was started by whites. Look at what they did to the Native americans (they are not indians thats what columbus gave that name to them) They wiped almost all the Native American population. Same with the Jews u didnt see any black people killing them did u? no and look what they have done to blacks. They changed the bible to say obey your master and you will go to heaven. They split people away from their families lynched babies and slaughter us. Now I have white friends and not all white people are bad but you can agree with me on this,more crimes have been commited by anglo saxons then any other race in the world.

And by they Way
black people can be racist whovever posted that wasnt doing very good research

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] indigentsoul 19 years ago

My point was not to commend racism; i don't, let's get that straight; the point of my post, was for us to understand the reasons why, to dispel distinctions between fellow 'races', and to first put it in a rational context.
We can play the cause and effect game till we're blue in the face; yes the muslims killed the jews, and the whites killed the blacks, and the whites enslaved a great portion of the world; must we DEFINE ourselves in this light?; and still, ironically, even talking about this subject furthers the divide between these groups. So really it is a moot point. People seem to miss the point; you learn from history, you do not forget it; but you learn to forgive; you preserve it as a lesson. A LESSON; not a justification for black supremacy over whites, or jewish supremacy over muslims or germans, or asian supremacy over whites; the list goes on really. Maybe this is just utopian air i'm just infecting everyone with, could be. But hey, utopian ideals, ideals period, are what keep us together, and fighting for the things that matter in life: truth, justice, freedom; pretty much the pillars of the U.S, Canada, and every other western nation. Don't get me wrong, they are not utopias; they are flawed, but with these ideals, there's hope, and that's what people need right now.

"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" Mahatma Gandhi.

[–] naughty_gurl14 19 years ago

simply: racism = bad

no matter how you look at it. no matter if you are against agreeing with what anybody else says. this movie did contain a great deal of cliche yes but there all based on something arnt they.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] t1380 19 years ago

yeah sion6 is right. Don't forget Idi Amin of Uganda (the black man) who expelled Indians from his country or Kim Il Song of North Korea imprisoning millions of people who disagreed with him.

[–] RedGuitar81 19 years ago

That's why I like 'X' (American History X) better because it goes more into depth on how an open minded white kid can suddenly become a Slobodan Milosevic after seeing his people crowded in and abused by other hostile ethnic groups (not to mention the senseless murder of his father).

So dwendt, does that mean that Native Americans should start to form a secret organization that starts killing white people OFF one by one?

WE NEED TO STOP MAKING EXCUSES FOR WHY PEOPLE HATE EACH OTHER BECAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY WE ALL HAVE A RIGHT TO BE ANGRY AT SOME POINT IN OUR HISTORY!!

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] jamaltsr 19 years ago

Looking back on it now, I have to admit that the "Fudge" character with the fro seemed to be a black racist because of all the stuff he was saying including the foolishness about the american flag. The ironic thing is that the rapper who plays "Fudge" in the movie is a racist in real life. He's said controversial things about the police and some crazy crap about white women.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] loveglow101 19 years ago

Dont confuse black "racism" with black "paranoia" and fear of white people. I think that selfconciously most black people are afraid fo white people. Afraid of the unknown, of what kind of person they are. B/c its hard to FORGET like most people think blacks should do when most live with racism everyday, even unknowingly. I feel that the hostility white's feel blacks have is a reaction from pent up frustration that black people live with, especially since we have to daily make the transition to the "white" world.

"Chumon! Chumon Lee!"Chris Tucker-RushHour2

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Legend_Killa 19 years ago

As a black person myself I do think it is possible for black people to be racist, in fact I think it happens a lot.
Omar Epps was very racist. He may have been provoked into those racist views but never the less he suffered no more than Ghandi or Martin Luther King. They didn't resort to racist views.
I believe nowadays we should all just get on with it. Forget about what previous generations did because we are not them.
I wouldn't expect a to see a white person wearing a Nazi t-shirt, and if I did I'd kick the s**t out of him. I also however wouldn't expect to see a black person wearing a Black Panthers t-shirt (Omar Epps) because how can that black person then criticise the white person for wearing a Nazi t-shirt.
Fair enough let's appreciate that the Black Panthers had their part in equality for our generation but to keep promoting it now is pointless as the cause that they were fighting for has been resolved (nearly anyway).
The Germans were a nasty bunch back in the 40's and it's good that Britain & America fought together and defeated them. However, if British people still dwelled on it and had bad feelings towards all Germans of this generation, that would be stupid as what did the Germans alive today have to do with World War II (move on).
When Omar Epps said I need to be with my own people (when his white room mate was being supportive), that was a little narrow minded and in theory, racist. If the white boy had moved out and said to Omar Epps that he wanted to live with a white room mate instead, it would have been a disgusting act of racism.
So yes, the skin heads were obviously racist and pointlessly racist at that, but everybody acknowledges that they were racist and the world hates them for it. Omar Epps and the other black students, although nowhere near as racist as the skin heads, they do display racist tendancies which seems to be overlooked or justified.
So yeah the blacks in this film are racist as well, but they don't go around shooting innocent people because of their racist beliefs so they get away with it, I guess.

[–] t1380 19 years ago

I agree with you Legend Killa, 100%. You know what happens today, there is a man named Leonard Jeffries, who is a professor at City University of New York and he teaches that black people are racially superior biologically, because they have melanin. That's racist, plain and simple, but he is allowed to teach that. Suppose, a white professor taught that have fair skin, blonde hair, and blue eyes was superior, he or she would get in trouble. I guess our system is going backwards.

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"I agree with you Legend Killa, 100%. You know what happens today, there is a man named Leonard Jeffries, who is a professor at City University of New York and he teaches that black people are racially superior biologically, because they have melanin. That's racist, plain and simple, but he is allowed to teach that. Suppose, a white professor taught that have fair skin, blonde hair, and blue eyes was superior, he or she would get in trouble. I guess our system is going backwards."

While I disagree with Professor Jeffries, I understand his arguement. He's saying on a pure biological level, having melanin is an advantage because it protects you from skin damage and disease from the sun.

If a white professor had scientific reasoning as to why being white was superior, than I wouldn't be against that. But if his reasoning was crime statistics or other bull like that, then I would call that racist.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] t1380 19 years ago

Professor Jeffries is racist by saying the black race is superior to white race not because of the issue of melanin. Besides melanin, he was talking about other things such as that blacks are better athletes than whites, blacks are more talented in art and music than whites, so they are superior. According to Webster's definition, if anybody says that any race is superior that is racism. Problems come along when people use other events in order to prove anybody's inferiority. By using crime statistics, no one argues that blacks are inferior but proves that blacks are not satisfied with the laws of this country, which has been said a lot of times by black civil rights leaders, like Jesse Jackson. Speaking of melanin, it has been proven by scientist that besides protecting skin from solar radiation it also increases blood vessels, which leads to high blood pressure and the production of sickle cell. So, everything has pluses and minuses

[–] Legend_Killa 19 years ago

My main point was that Omar Epps was racist, along with the white men that he was accusing of racism.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] t1380 19 years ago

Legend Killa, do you consider anybody advocating seclusion, like prefering clinging to your own group, as racist?

[–] Legend_Killa 19 years ago

Yes tl380, that is very racist. That's like me bringing a white girl home and my parents telling me that blacks should stick with blacks. That is very racist.
However, although we are all human beings, we do have different cultures which lead to us to associate more with people of our own race, that's simply because you're more likely to have more in common straight away with people of the same culture. When u're getting to know people of a different culture u have to adapt to each others different cultures so it may take longer to do so.
However, if u completely cut yourself off and don't even allow urself to let other races into your circle just for the sake of keeping with ur own race, that is ignorant and racist (that's what the Skinheads & Omar Epps were doing. Even though Omar Epps didn't do it as blatently).

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

"Black people are always complaining that the system is only here to keep them down. Like Ice Cube in the movie. He hates all whites without even knowing them."

I think the system is made to keep poor people down. And alot of blacks either live below the poverty line, or live in poor neighborhoods.

[–] Cheena71 19 years ago

Did anyone happen to notice that after such a turn of events, Omar Epps (or the character he played) came to a revelation that his way of thinking hasn't always been correct? He could've walked away from the white girl (Kristen) after she stepped up to the statue but he went as far as to touch her. They may not ever be girlfriend/boyfriend but he may not rule her out as a friend.

The one thing the prof said that was so true..."without struggle, there can be no progress." Omar showed progress and the end foreshadowed that that behavior could be contagious, if allowed.

[–] t1380 18 years ago

Actally Wendy, the impression I got from this movie that Malik always believed his way was the right way. This is what I think the director wanted everybody to see, in terms of opposite to Dr. Phips. Remember, when he said that you have earned my utmost respect. The idea I got that Dr. Phips wanted to apologize to Malik for indoctrinating him with his right-wing conservatism.

[–] quinn_larkins 19 years ago

Ken, can you please tell me which of my posts your class felt was racist and/or facist. I'd really like to know the particular ones you're referring to, maybe it's just a miscommunication.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Legend_Killa 19 years ago

Listen creoltein, I don't know who the hell that outburst was aimed at.
U know full well that I acknowledged the black people in Higher Learning being racist towards the white people. U just wanted to let everybody know that u've read a couple of psychology books.

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]