MovieChat Forums > Terror Train (1980) Discussion > Something I didn't understand (SPOILERS)...

Something I didn't understand (SPOILERS)

posted 17 years ago by Devanney2003
26 replies | jump to latest

Ok, so I get that Kenny dressed up as the magician's assistant. But this leaves a few things unexplained.

1. What happened to the REAL assistant? She was definitely there in the beginning of the movie, when the train is being boarded, and we see her again later after the train has been evacuated, talking to Ken. I'm POSITIVE that isn't Kenny...the hair is different, and so is the voice. It's definitely a woman...but I don't see this character listed in this movie's credits.

2. How did the magician not know that was an impostor? There are a few times when Kenny (dressed up as the assistant) and the magician interact, during their magic acts, and there are no signs that Ken notices anything is wrong.

[–] kjwilson110 17 years ago

No; The same actor played the assistant the whole movie. The real actor is a drag queen in real life so I am assuming that he knows all to well how to play a convincing women. I agree with you that the wig changes (it was really curly in the beginning and straight towards the end of the movie). However; it was definitely only one actor playing both roles.

If you look up the actor (Derek MacKinnon) you will see that he did another movie called "Pancake on a Hot Tin Roof". In this movie, he also played a women and you can see where him dressed as a women and the "assistant" in this movie are identical.

[–] Devanney2003 17 years ago

But again, I don't get it.
Are the magician and the assistant co-conspirators in the murder? Does Ken really not know his assistant is actually a man?? Sorry, still not understanding that whole dynamic.

[–] kjwilson110 17 years ago

No; the character of the magician (David Copperfield) does not realize that his assistant is really a man. No one does actually, that is the whole point.. No one on that train thought that the assistant was really a man, let alone Kenny.....

The directors of the movie probably were very eager to get a real drag person because they know how to portray themselves in such a way as to be more convincing than your average male that is asked to portray a woman.

[–] pallisrs 17 years ago

i havent seen the movie for a few weeks now, but i kinda see what the original poster is talking about.
im sure there is a scene about halfway through when the magician and the assistant are talking backstage (?) and it definitely is not the actor playing kenny in drag, but an actually female actor.... in fact the one scene with kenny dressed up in drag (the part that is replayed very quickly when the reveal happens) i said "she looks like a man" yet still somehow didnt think that it was the killer. once i knew the twist i was then confused as to how the magician didnt notice that his "real" assistant had gone so thought he may have been in on it.

who knows, maybe im just talking out of my arse, but i definitely left the film with the same feeling the original poster had.

any ideas?

[–] kjwilson110 17 years ago

No; I know what scene you are referring to. You are talking about the scene where David Cooperfield is complaining about the crowd of kids and the assistant is reassuring him and telling him that he should go do some warm up tricks.

If you have a DVD, freeze that frame and you will that the assistant is still played by the male actor. If you freeze the frame, you will see his features. I guess I am just puzzled as to why people are thinking that is a female when it is clearly the same actor. You can see his facial features even with the make up and the wig on. The thing is, the actor himself has unique features and even with the make-up and the wig, you can still tell that it is him......

The "reveal" at the end where you find out that Kenny is the assistant is drag, is just showing you the same scene only showing you Kenny close up.

Watch the other scene where the assistant is walking with the head conductor and the conductor is asking him where the magician is... You can clearly see that is the actor playing the assistant due again to the facial features of the actor. Another thing is, the actor has a very noticable long neck. You can see this in the scene where the "Kenny" is on the bed about to be pranked. You can see a close up of Kenny's face and neck. The female assistant has the same exact super long neck.

I have the DVD and I have seen the film numerous times and I can tell you that I am 100% sure that the actor is one in the same. I will say that he was pretty convincing with his voice because he does sound like a female if you do not pay too close attention. However; if you listen to his "male" voice at the end of the film, you can tell that it was the same person playing the female voice.

I know that I probably seem like a nerd with all of this information but I just really like the film and I have the DVD and watched it numerous times.

[–] pallisrs 17 years ago

i'll have to watch it again soon then.. i couldv'e sworn it was a woman in that one scene.
If it is the killer in that scene then i agree with you, he played a very convincing woman!

[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Squonkamatic 17 years ago

I have a better answer: The whole movie was a dream or nightmare composed by Alana (Jamie Lee) as a revenge fantasy to get back at the guys and Doc in particular for involving her in the prank that drove Kenny over the edge. Because it is a dream/nightmare there are inconsitencies in how the narrative evolves, including allowing Kenny to apparently be in more than one place at a time and assuming more than one identity at a time.

The tipoff is the scene where Jamie Lee is wrapped up in the blanket alone in the car sort of leaning against the window. We see Kenny OUTSIDE of the train, and not only that but apparently defying gravity as he revolves around the window -- How could he have done THAT? The answer is that he didn't, it was part of a dream, just like her kicking him off the train just before it. Another example is the mirror that he smashes Jackson's head into. How DID he fix it?? Did he make sure he had additional mirrors handy in case he chose that as a method to kill someone? Ben Johnson himself asks "Now how did he fix that mirror?" A pretty good question, and the only possible answer is that it was never broken in the first place.

The only "waking moments" in the movie is the opening section. Everything from the moment we see the train coming out of the tunnel at the beginning until it recedes into the distance at the end is a fantasy. That's why the recurring themes of magic and people changing identities is important: they represent the illogic of dreams where people can be more than one person and there is a bending or outright breaking of basic laws of reality.

[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] rrw28 16 years ago

I think they might have dubbed Kenny's (as the assistant) voice a few times when they showed his interaction with David Copperfield. It seemed like a slightly different voice when he was with Copperfield than when he was with Jamie Lee. It sounds more like a real woman's voice in those early scenes (especially when the assistant and Copperfield are talking backstage). I think the directors did that to keep us fooled, though I too could tell that the assistant looked rather manly.

And Hart Bochner was HOT!

[–] kjwilson110 16 years ago

No; As I explained before the actor used in the role is a professional drag queen. He still is to this day.... He would know how to sound like woman because that is his art. There was no woman dubbed in those scenes. If you hear the actor talk normal (at the end) it does not sound that far off from the woman's voice in the beginning parts.

[–] matt_snyder1970 16 years ago

back to the voice though
it is very noticeable that the voice was dubbed
it just stands out from all the other audio..whether it was Mkinnons voice or not there was audio post production going on to tweak the assistants voice.

All in all
I love this film despite the hokey long scenes of magic/and that terrible band crime

this is one of my all time favorite slasher's. Especially the prank scene in the beginning..That to me is the highlight of this film.

[–] Squonkamatic 14 years ago

They definitely were messing with perceptions when depicting Kenny. I agree that there is a point when the feminine nature of the assistant was likely augmented by a voice dub, though it's definitely McKinnon onscreen in the whole film.

The dream ends figuratively as the train disappears down the track with no real world scene to establish the dream idea. David Lynch did more or less the same thing with Mullholland Dr., which also featured little touches done to mess with perceptions. There's also no establishment scene with someone waking up in bed, just a parade of irrational inconsistencies that cannot be explained via the physics which define our real world reality.

When that reality has been suspended you need to look beyond it for answers -- either the scene with Kenny revolving around the outside window was a mistake by the filmmakers that somehow made it past the editing stage (unlikely), Kenny was a ghost or specter who could perform superhuman tasks, (an alternative I would accept as well), or it was meant to signal that the laws of our physical reality are being temporarily suspended until the movie is over. I opt for the latter, and think that Kenny's depiction in the film changes from scene to scene based on the need of Alana's mind to fulfill its fantasy of revenge.

[–] 14 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Shorty53077 16 years ago

Ben Johnson himself asks "Now how did he fix that mirror?"

actually ben johnson says how did he bust that mirror? with a hammer?

---------------
Hey Laser Lips Yo Momma Was A Snow Blower - Johnny 5

[–] memphisjose 15 years ago

what a stupid theory

[–] SlickySlixta 9 years ago

I have a better answer: The whole movie was a dream or nightmare composed by Alana (Jamie Lee) as a revenge fantasy to get back at the guys and Doc in particular for involving her in the prank that drove Kenny over the edge. Because it is a dream/nightmare there are inconsitencies in how the narrative evolves, including allowing Kenny to apparently be in more than one place at a time and assuming more than one identity at a time.

The tipoff is the scene where Jamie Lee is wrapped up in the blanket alone in the car sort of leaning against the window. We see Kenny OUTSIDE of the train, and not only that but apparently defying gravity as he revolves around the window -- How could he have done THAT? The answer is that he didn't, it was part of a dream, just like her kicking him off the train just before it. Another example is the mirror that he smashes Jackson's head into. How DID he fix it?? Did he make sure he had additional mirrors handy in case he chose that as a method to kill someone? Ben Johnson himself asks "Now how did he fix that mirror?" A pretty good question, and the only possible answer is that it was never broken in the first place.

The only "waking moments" in the movie is the opening section. Everything from the moment we see the train coming out of the tunnel at the beginning until it recedes into the distance at the end is a fantasy. That's why the recurring themes of magic and people changing identities is important: they represent the illogic of dreams where people can be more than one person and there is a bending or outright breaking of basic laws of reality.

I don't buy that at all, and I'd be hard pressed to say that it's a "better answer". A better answer to me is that the producers wanted to ride the coattails of Halloween and drum up a script as quick as they possibly could. Said script was not fine tuned very well and left many holes in the plot/story open.

Don't put the devil in the picture, cause' the religious groups won't wanna see it.

[–] miriamwebster 16 years ago

Don't have any proof but strongly get the impression that Kenny's female voice was dubbed by a real woman. (They did that to Anthony Perkins "mother" voice in Psycho and several other killer-in-drag thrillers like Homicidal and Dressed to Kill.) Actually, makes a lot of sense--would have been easy to do and really helped throw viewers off the track (nyuk! nyuk!) of killer's true gender.

Another question: During one of the murders before Kenny is exposed, closeup of killer's hand has long red fingernails. Later they're gone. In the midst of all of this bloodshed, when did he have time to remove fake nails and all the gummy residue?

[–] Shorty53077 16 years ago

well i was gonna say i remember at the revealing his pulls something out of his mouth i always wondered if it was some tool to help cover his voice but i doubt something like that even exists but heys its a movie lol

---------------
Hey Laser Lips Yo Momma Was A Snow Blower - Johnny 5

[–] 16 years ago

[deleted]

[–] chasman99 15 years ago

Kenny was always the assistant, hence there is no need to confuse the magician. He/She is always the same.

*** I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?" ***

[–] miriamwebster 15 years ago

You're understandably confused. This was a slasher movie, a genre where all logic goes out the window. For a few moments, eveyone is even convinced the killer is the magician, even though he looks nothing like the classmate they terrorized just a few years ago. Nothing makes much sense in any of these movies.

[–] robotrix 15 years ago

I was certain that the killer was the assistant - the person in the Groucho mask before Lizard boy dies looking back at the kids was definitely female (or the eyes were made up to be) and the body was slight.

However, I was convinced the whole movie that the Magician and the assistant were the brother and sister of the Kenny wanting revenge.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last night, I was lying back looking at the stars and I thought...where the *beep* is my ceiling???