It doesn't hold up today


I saw this movie for the first time today after missing it when it came out in '74, and I just don't see anything to it. It's a disjointed mess, and far too long to boot. Besides some beautiful scenery, the whole chase scene in the first half-hour of the movie was pointless. In general the car chase scenes were too numerous and pedestrian.

A lot of people here talk about the movie showing the pointlessness of society, turning convention upside down, etc. but while those elements may be there, it's almost like Eastwood and his buddies got together one weekend and decided to make a movie. Not much art to it.

I generally like Eastwood movies, especially from this time in his career. What am I missing? Maybe this movie was a pioneer of many of these themes, and since then many movies copied them with a lot more style?

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this is one of the finest movies of clint, so underrated

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Just watched it again last night.first time to see the un-cut version in many years...Still one of my top fave movies!...The funny thing I remember was this was the first and maybe only R-rated movie I snuck into under age! LOL...The things one remembers when getting older!

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[deleted]

I don't know how many times I've seen this movie since its debut in '74, but I never tire of it. I've always considered it a minor classic, especially in the heist movie genre; and the classics never go out of style. The cast, from the protagonists to the supporting characters, is as good as it gets. Each and every performance in this serio-comic classic is spot on and the direction of this stalwart film could not have been pulled off with any greater aplomb. I like the way the relationship between the veteran criminal and the wayfaring bad boy develops over the course of the movie from a grudging partnership to a genuine friendship imbued with mutual admiration and respect. If the Thunderbolt and Lightfoot characters had been played by actors less appealing and talented than Eastwood and Bridges, the ending would not have been anywhere near as poignant. Like most of the viewers who love this movie, I hated to see the demise of Lightfoot in the end, but the movie would have been less indelible had the producers opted for a more light-hearted conclusion. Few, if any of the movies of this genre made in the past decade or two will wear as well as this one. They are completely disposable by comparison. Thunderbolt is surely still out there somewhere and Lightfoot lives on.

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As others have pointed out, it's a bit slow and meandering. People these days are more used to quick cuts. The movie could easily be tightened by 10-15 minutes with some sharper editing.

There's also a directorial lack of focus. I think the director wanted to make a statement about the absurdity of life and show comedy in surreal situations, but without wanting to turn the movie into an all-out comedy. Just watch how many one-liners are tossed aside without landing as punchlines and potentially comic situations fizzle out.

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Quicker cuts would RUIN this film. If you want the absurd, choppy cuts of Transformers or Quantum of Solace, then watch THOSE GARBAGE MOVIES. This is a FILM, whose sweeping and majestic Montana back drop should be left alone and NOT CUT.



"I don't want your watch, man. I want your friendship!" - Lightfoot

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I agree with you. To re-edit this movie would ruin it. But I don't think that the Montana back drop would necessarily be the victim. There are tangential vignettes that "could be" cut and shorten the movie with only minor damage, BUT damage none-the-less. It therefore should left alone.

I have seen a version "edited to fit in the time allotted" and it is a worthless piece-o-crap. Leave the movie as-is.

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Quicker cuts would RUIN this film. If you want the absurd, choppy cuts of Transformers or Quantum of Solace, then watch THOSE GARBAGE MOVIES. This is a FILM, whose sweeping and majestic Montana back drop should be left alone and NOT CUT.


... precisely. A film should possess a life of its own, and the editing should be in accordance with that life (and landscape). Thunderbolt and Lightfoot was never supposed to be some quick-cut genre piece, quite the opposite.

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Just watch how many one-liners are tossed aside without landing as punchlines and potentially comic situations fizzle out.


Yeah, that's the point. In this film, one-liners are often supposed to not land punches, and potentially comic situations are supposed to fizzle. Thunderbolt and Lightfoot is more of a commentary on genre than a redeployment of genre, constituting an exercise in irony. Folks believing that a film only works if it plays conventionally won't be able to understand it.

As others have pointed out, it's a bit slow and meandering. People these days are more used to quick cuts. The movie could easily be tightened by 10-15 minutes with some sharper editing.


Why would anyone want it "tightened"? Thunderbolt and Lightfoot is only a heist film, or a chase film, in a nominal sense. It's actually a whimsically meditative study in time and space, the sense of time naturally elongated to mirror the wide open spaces of the Montana backdrop.

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(SPOILERS) So, it is February 2014, and I just finished watching this movie for the first time. I should say I agree with dwarol in that "it's a disjointed mess". Disjointed is key here. Disjointed in plot (the first half and the second half could easily be different movies). Disjointed in tone (it can't decide whether it should be funny or serious. George Kennedy's character is a perfect example of this indecisiveness. He starts off trying to shoot Thunderbolt. Twice. Pretty serious. Then they fight. He falls down panting explaining that he's got asthma. Funny. He kicks unconscious Lightfoot in the head. Three times. Pretty serious and sick stuff. He turns up in that store with dogs. Ends up with a funny death). Furthermore, a lot of random stuff is happening. A crazy guy picks them up, sends his car rolling over, a trunkful of white rabbits, the guy starts shooting at them. And what was up with that scene with Gloria shouting "Rape!", and the stark-naked lady in the window, and Lightfoot borrowing a car from Gary Busey, and that ugly as plague tourist lady in the end with her mumbling husband.
Such a shame when you think that by browsing through a back catalogue of classics, in this case Eastwood's, you have a chance to come across a gem, and what you end up with is a bland flat mess, a waste of time, nothing to take away from.
Then again, it's jusy my opinion.

--- TOUT IRA BIEN ---

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Well at least you had the good sense to say it was just your opinion and not declare it as a statement of fact.

The first half of the film is purely character development and the building of the close relationship of Thunderbolt and Lightfoot. Remember, Thunderbolt is a criminal and Lightfoot a young, long haired drifter. Not the typical characters one would "root for". Their time together is short, yet the story gives us a slice of "events" they share together, from the funny (hitch-hiking scene) to the serious (running for their lives from Red Leary scene). This is by design from writer/director Michael Cimino as life is not all serious and not all fun and games, it is a mix of everything. Cimino doesn't have a lifetime to show this growing bond through shared expierence, he has about an hour of screen time (the first half of the film). Without this first, very different half of the film, why would any viewer care what happens to a couple of off beat criminals in the end? The viewer needs the first half of the film to gain a liking of the characters and understand how two very different misfits of society could become very close friends. We owe it to the story to not "just like these characters" because they happen to be played by Eastwood and Bridges. We NEED that first half of fun/serious experiences. That is what makes the ending (the death of Lightfoot) meaningful and POIGNANT. Otherwise it's just a busted heist where one of the two men dies.

I understand you did not get this out of the film. That's fine. Many people DO however see this, like it and enjoy the performances too. Bridges was nominated for the Academy Award (probably should have won it) and it is widley known that Eastwood felt completely snubbed by the Academy for his performance.



"I don't want your watch, man. I want your friendship!" - Lightfoot

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I completely agree with you about the first half being purely character development, and that Bridges' performance was nothing short of amazing (not so sure about Clint's as he yet again was just playing himself). My major lamentation concerns the way the whole movie was put together. Something was off. The focus was constantly shifting. I was constantly distracted by numerous off-the-cuff happenings. I, personally, failed to find the film easily enjoyable. And, as I see it, all those shortcomings were due to poor script (which should have been better streamlined) and misguided direction (I could never bring myself to enjoy Cimino's films (even The Deer Hunter). Apart from occassional bursts of brilliance they are just overlong and incoherent. No wonder you can hardly ever hear about any of them now. I know I may incur the wrath of many by saying that the same goes for Francis Ford Coppola and Ridley Scott. It just seems that it was a fluke that those two directors made a couple of brilliant films (Godfathers and Conversation/Alien and Bladerunner). If we look at the bulk of their output you just can't help but wonder how the heck they continue to enjoy such respect.
Anyway, all I'm saying, one should never take someone's word that some film is classic and beyond criticism, but check it out for themselves and honestly say what they think.

P.S. As for that "I don't want your watch, man. I want your friendship!" line, in my view, it was just too early in their relationship to say that, just as it is too early to propose to a girl on your second date.
And, again, this is just my one man's humble opinion.


--- TOUT IRA BIEN ---

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I'm not a big Cimino fan either... except for Thunderbolt and Lightfoot.

"I don't want your watch, man. I want your friendship!" - Lightfoot

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(not so sure about Clint's as he yet again was just playing himself)


Eastwood never simply "played himself," and his character here is quite different from, say, Dirty Harry Callahan or his Stranger in High Plains Drifter. His performance as John "Thunderbolt" Lightfoot is wonderfully nuanced and adept, but again, it's subtle, and subtle acting doesn't sell well with some people. Rather, many folks tend to rave over flamboyance in acting.

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"Subtle acting doesn't sell well with some people"

LOL. It was just wooden acting not subtle.

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"it is widely known that Eastwood felt completely snubbed by the Academy for his performance"

That just shows he has an ego. It doesn't mean he actually gave a great performance. What exactly did he do to flex his acting muscles here?

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Furthermore, a lot of random stuff is happening. A crazy guy picks them up, sends his car rolling over, a trunkful of white rabbits, the guy starts shooting at them. And what was up with that scene with Gloria shouting "Rape!", and the stark-naked lady in the window, and Lightfoot borrowing a car from Gary Busey, and that ugly as plague tourist lady in the end with her mumbling husband.


Yeah, it's supposed to be 'random,' or seemingly random, except that all those little incidents and anecdotes become part of a larger, richly ironic vision. If you try to analyze Thunderbolt and Lightfoot in terms of conventional logic, it will never work, for that's not what the film is about.

Given that the movie gave you a sort of a culture shock (whether you admit it or not), I would strongly advise you to see the film two or three times before passing judgment.

I also feel that Thunderbolt and Lightfoot is completely consistent, tonally, but it represents an ironic blend of comic and psychotic elements, much like recent movies such as Django Unchained, Nebraska, and Inside Llewyn Davis.

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I saw this movie for the first time today after missing it when it came out in '74, and I just don't see anything to it. It's a disjointed mess, and far too long to boot. Besides some beautiful scenery, the whole chase scene in the first half-hour of the movie was pointless. In general the car chase scenes were too numerous and pedestrian.

A lot of people here talk about the movie showing the pointlessness of society, turning convention upside down, etc. but while those elements may be there, it's almost like Eastwood and his buddies got together one weekend and decided to make a movie. Not much art to it.

I generally like Eastwood movies, especially from this time in his career. What am I missing? Maybe this movie was a pioneer of many of these themes, and since then many movies copied them with a lot more style?


Maybe you should see it again before passing judgment. Thunderbolt and Lightfoot is a highly ironic film, a movie that's about a lot by seemingly being about nothing. It's not a classically structured film with conventional, obvious social commentary, yet there is a ton of social commentary just the same. It's a movie about feel and mood and mentality.

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Showed Thunderbolt and Lightfoot to a 32 year old friend of mine last week, so she was born 8 years after the film came out. She loved it and thought it was very good. I heard no complaints about it not holding up today from her.

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I hate when people say a movie made 45 years ago "doesnt hold up". Is it supposed to look like it was made in 2015???? enjoy it for what it is...a movie from 1974. Which in many ways is better than a movie made today.

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True!

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It's hard for some people to imagine a world without INSTANT information at the palm of their hands. The world of 1974 is the stone age compared to today in that regard. They are probabaly applying a 2015 world to a 1974 released film (actually filmed in the summer of 73).

Why didn't they just get on the cell phone and blah, blah, blah.



"I don't want your watch, man. I want your friendship!" - Lightfoot

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I totally disagree.

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I think that it holds up just fine.

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Agree with the OP to a certain extent, first half is a mess. No cohesion, tonally inconsistent and void of any plot progression. The second half is immensely better but unfortunately doesn't erase the memory of the first.

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I was a teenager in the 70's and watched it back in the day. Re-watching it now it still stands up. The first half of the film is devoted to character development it's not a mess to me.I purchased the Kino Lober DVD and it will be part of my DVD collection. I guess I'm an old fogey but I love these type of buddy movies. Another movie from the same decade that is good is Scarecrow starring Gene Hackman and Al Pacino.

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The first half of the film is character development, the friendship between TB and Lightfoot, as poster SunCanyonRoad has already said. It makes you care about the two men and what ultimately happens.

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Character development can still occur while progressing the story. In fact I'd say that is a hallmark of a well structured movie.

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