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Actors talking about their characters just didn't work for me

posted 15 years ago by SusanHampson
20 replies | jump to latest

I was a bit shocked when, in the middle of the film, a snippet of an interview took place about what the actor thought of their character. In a way, it was helpful to me because it put into words what I was tring to work out but in another way, it was so unnecessary and really unorthodox. Surely, we are meant to be drawing our own conclusions about the characters and not 'spoon fed' like this?

I am new to Ingmar's work - this is only the second one I have watched and the first one was 'Shame'. It is clear he is a master of the camera, his techniques are really effective and I love the end of 'The Passion' when the image of Andreas stalking the landscape just fades away into a grainy white - I don't think I've ever seen that before. Does anyone know what that technique is called?

So both 'The Passion' and 'Shame' are artistic in their way but the characters are so miserable, I found it tiresome to watch. And the location depressed me too. Anyone else feel like this?

[–] jamasian_man 15 years ago

It definitely threw me for a loop at first. I guess Bergman was experimenting. I read your post and this is only your second film.

I have seen many Bergman films, my first being Wild Strawberries. It is one of my absolute favourites.

Bergman films usually are a bit depressing and somber. Its the way its filmed and the actors.

If you're still interested in Bergman, check out Wild Strawberries, Seventh Seal, and the Virgin Spring.

[–] SusanHampson 15 years ago

Thanks for the tip - it's always great to get a bit of guidance. I'll definitely check out Wild Strawberries.

Kind regards.

[–] jlent 15 years ago

It was definitely odd. Some of the actors in the movie didn't much care for it, particularly Josephson. It was an experiment that may not have worked but I don't mind it. It's part of the experience and "A Passion" is one of my favorites.
BTW, Von Sydow and Josephson had no idea what to say during their little speeches so Bergman wrote out their lines for them. But both Ullmann and Andersson took to it and spoke their own lines. Andersson's seems a little disjointed which always makes me smile, which is an odd response in the middle of what might be Bergman's most hopeless film.
I don't know what the technique is called that Bergman uses for the end of the film, but it isn't a zoom as the DVD commentator calls it, at least not a zoom by the original camera. What Bergman does is film the entire scene at one distance at a high ASA, probably well over 1,000. He then films the film itself and zooms into into that, which, as it gets closer to von Sydow, magnifies the film grain that was always there. It is a great technique.

[–] djebel714 15 years ago

i am agreeing with the above poster that the late 60's output by bergman is a frightening place to start. the EARLY 60's and popularly, the late 50's is a normal entrance for new film fans ATTEMPTING to 'get into' bergman.

wild strawberries was seen later by me in my bergman career. persona (my first exposure to this director) is a short film but wildly dense meditation on identity and, like most bergman films, living near the water (usually the atlantic).

another good starting point is backwards! go from his 1982 magnum opus fanny and alexander (watch the tv version at 312 minutes) and stop at the seventh seal, THEN decide if you truly ARE a bergman-ite!

i have to re iterate that i am worried that you might watch night of the wolf next (loosely in a trilogy with shame and passion of anna) and freak out thinking that all that bergman did was pave the way for david lynch!

[–] jlent 15 years ago

I agree and disagree at the same time. The first film of Bergman's I ever saw was "Cries and Whispers." Fell hook, line and sinker for Liv Ulmann and went back and saw all the late 60's films she was in.
Yes, it's a frightening period, 1966-69, the so-called "Faro" pictures, named after the island he lived on - "Persona," "Hour of the Wolf," "Shame" and "A Passion."
But I think they represent the peak of his career and shouldn't be avoided for too long. In them, I think, Bergman finds an even more individual voice than he had already exhibited in the more formal brilliance of his 1950s films.
But there is a lot to be said for that formal brilliance, too

[–] SusanHampson 15 years ago

Thanks to everybody for all your input and advice about Bergman. I saw a clip of Wild Strawberries on YouTube and found it fascinating.

I don't know if I'm right in saying this but I think he might be the celluloid version of Elliott Smith - melancholy yet haunting and beautiful - a lonely troubled soul. I saw an interview with him in his old age - alone and living as a recluse on an island - I found that very sad.

He is obviously one to avoid if you feel a black cloud descending but in cheerier spirits, he's a must see who is obviously in a class of his own. And he's obviously got a lot of fans on this site.

Thanks everyone.

[–] fentress 14 years ago

Well, if you thought those actor interviews were distracting, wait till you see Persona (if you haven’t by now). Persona doesn’t have actor interviews mixed in. But it does a have a number of visual effects that step outside the narrative fictional flow of the movie and remind you that you are in fact watching a movie (e.g. brief shots of actual celluloid film breaking). There are other even more overt effects than that, but I won’t spoil the movie for you.

I saw Passion of Anna recently of the THIS TV digital network. (Not the best way to view a film, I know.) I think it has much to recommend it as does much else of Bergman films that I’ve seen. But my opinion of the interviews is that it comes across as a distracting gimmick. At the time the movie was made, it probably seemed like a ground-breaking innovative thing to do. They probably thought something like: Here within this single work of the art form we call film, we will call attention to the viewer that he/she is in fact watching a film. Won’t that be profound?

But for me, if there was ever any novelty to that, it has worn off. I like movies that might be call “arty” movies. But when I see one of these self-referential film effects, I want to say to the filmmaker: OK, I get it. Yeah, this is a film. Please just stick to simply making a basic good movie.

I have seen several Bergman films. I‘ve seen Seventh Seal, Wild Strawberries, and Fanny and Alexander. Like them all very much. I didn’t care for Persona at all. Passion of Anna is somewhere in the middle for me. It had a lot to recommend it, but had some flaws too.

Fanny and Alexander I saw pretty recently. I was quite surprised that it was not as singularly cerebral as most other Bergman movies. Much of his work to me feels very cerebral, as though he worked out a bunch of concepts all in his head and the actors are just there to be the mouthpiece. Fanny & Alexander though had much more full blooded characters.

[–] silverkid 14 years ago

It was brilliant and interesting and different.

http://most-underrated-movies.blogspot.com/

[–] 14 years ago

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[–] jamesmurphybb 14 years ago

Au contraire, I thought Bibi Andersson's in particular was, even if as said by somebody above "disjointed", quite insightful and made total sense. How her character had no self-esteem and was an invention of others. How she'll probably end up committing suicide thus freeing herself.

Sensitive and discerning observations.
Plus I liked her, the way she talked, her mannerisms. I thought she was stunning.

[–] 14 years ago

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[–] William_Hunt 13 years ago

I actually liked those actors talking about their characters a lot in this film, somehow it fitted in the movie and I doubt any other director would have gotten away with it.

[–] Stirchley 13 years ago

the characters are so miserable.....the location depressed me too.

Make a note never to watch Bergman's masterpiece Through a Glass Darkly.

[–] prasaddhamdhere 13 years ago

Yes.He was a master.You should see his other classics like Wild Strawberries,persona.Height of film making has been achieved in these films.Bergman,You was great!