MovieChat Forums > I Love Lucy (1951) Discussion > Ethel and Fred,,,,,why?

Ethel and Fred,,,,,why?


whose odea was it to have a strange couple like Ethel and Fred to be Lucys best friends? Jeeze Fred id old enough to be the other 3 father.

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William Frawley was 20 years older than Vivian Vance and she HATED that. It really is a part of I Love Lucy lore.

As to the casting, Desi Arnaz pretty much called the shots (I think), and despite the age difference, and Frawley's rep as a difficult, grumpy, heavy drinker, it worked! Well I guess not everyone thinks so :)

Supposedly Vance made a cutting remark about him that got back to him, and he never forgave her.

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William Frawley was hired first when they expecting Ethel to be cast with an older actress. When they couldn't get the one they wanted, they hired Vivian Vance. She tried to get Fred recast but Desi Arnaz stood his ground and honored his contract.

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I always thought they were close in age. 😳

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They were perfect. For one, they looked like "normal" people. And Ethel is a legend.

Seriously, it would have not been the same if Betty Ramsey had been the neighbor.

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The chemistry between the two couples is undeniable despite Frawley's age.

Vivian Vance's ego took a beating at the thought of being cast as Fred's wife. She was a lot younger and she hated for people to think she was Bill Frawley's age. But still, their chemistry as a couple was great.

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I have a gay online friend from IMDb whose poster name was always "EthelMertz ..."

Vivian Vance is a bit of an icon in the gay community. Lol.

I just think the Mertz's came off as real people, like the older couple we all know who live in the apartment upstairs. It was perfect casting and they helped make that show.

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I can understand Cher or Streisand or Garland, but I never imagined Vivian Vance as a gay icon. What was it about her? The frumpy housedresses? The flat shoes? lol


I think Lucille Ball initially wanted Bea Benaderet as Ethel. But Vivian Vance turned out to have that magical chemistry with Lucy.

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Bea Bernadette lol. Yeah, she could have pulled it off but she's more aggressive as an actress. Vivian Vance as very understated.

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Lucille Ball did want Bea Benaderet, her real life best friend, but couldn't get her out of her current contract. So, they hired Vivan Vance instead.

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You should stop talking to those kinds of people online. Its bad for your health

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Nah, Ethel was a good guy. And a riot.

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Oh, well if Ethel identifies as a male, then all is cool. I just love inclusion

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Pfffffffft. It has nothing to do with some phony concept of "inclusion". People are just people. Don't judge them by arbitrary criteria.

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Ethel identifying as male makes the show better and shows that despite our preconceptions the 50's were very inclusive and progressive. That's ultimately what's the most important.

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Agreed. Now if only there was a neighbor who was a trans

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Eh Mrs Trumbull I think was a biological male.

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I hate to to use the term "biological male" because it doesn't exist. You identify what you want to as.

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Good point, if Mrs. Trumbull says she's a man then she literally is. Thanks for correcting me, if I used that term in public I would be arrested for violence.

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Bullshit! Biological male/female is what populated the world. Doesn't matter where things are going nowdays true females will always be the mothers of mankind.

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Because she looks like a drag queen lol?

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Actually Ethel is too dowdy to be a drag queen.

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In the Lucy/Desi Comedy Hour episode which re-imagines the first time Lucy and Ricky first met when Lucy took a cruise to Cuba with her friend Ann Sothern, there's a line of narration by Ricky that also on the cruise were the Mertzes on their honeymoom. Ethel is referred to as Fred's "child bride," which suggests that she was much younger than Fred.

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It was a great idea because they were hilarious. The episode where they are fighting over train tickets especially, William Frawley owned that episode.

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Call me crazy but I always thought Ethel and Fred looked close to the same age, particularly with the black and white- I assumed she had white hair a la Mr and Mrs Wilson. While yes they are older than the Ricardos it helps to keep all the characters separate from each other with their own distinct personalities; the show imo wouldn't have worked with another couple the same age as Lucy and Ricky as the third and fourth lead. Imagine Ricky's agent Jerry and Carolyn Applebee as Fred and Ethel and it just doesn't work. Because Ricky is Cuban and Fred is old, and Ethel is dumpy and Lucy is insane, the show is without a stereotypical stock male and female 'type' if that makes sense, to its benefit. Everyone has such particular and idiosyncratic personalities, which is why Seinfeld worked also and would not have had it been say the more traditional friends from Friends in the roles.

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